Coach

[ZanMan]

He is firmly on the hot seat, I was about to start a thread on this topic. For all the people out to bash Norm and rightfully so, what has Lavin done better other than take Norm's guys to the dance once?

What has Lavin done better than Norm? How about recruit in the top 100 from the get go, including an NBA first round pick, and more recently the 17th best player in the nation. Do you think Norm recruited talent at that level?

Also, with Norm, we were a perennial 150+ in the RPI.

Lavin's RPI on average has been better than that.

 

[dee]

I'd like anyone here to name one signature win with this current group of Juniors over the past 3 years. Just one.

2/25/12 61-58 over ND
1/25/12 78-62 over WV
1/15/13 67-63 over ND
2/6/13 71-65 over UCONN

Not great, but wins over decent teams at least.

NONE would be considered "signature wins"! If Syracuse or Louisville was in that group then that would have been "signature" within the Big East but outside the conference we beat only cupcakes. Many of us firmly believed that by this 4th season we would have been positioned for a sweet 16 but players like Pelle never materialized, Nurideen turned into one big PR gamble, Mo went pro, Polee went home and Jakarr seems back to square one. The only original survivor with talent is D'Lo and a bunch of role players without a script.
What is so scary and sad is that the most successful team Lavin may have coached was a team not of his choosing and the recruiting mojo has frozen in time.

What is scary is that he has had his best success only when Dunlap was here. We need a good x and o guy period.

 

[gman]

I'd like anyone here to name one signature win with this current group of Juniors over the past 3 years. Just one.

2/25/12 61-58 over ND
1/25/12 78-62 over WV
1/15/13 67-63 over ND
2/6/13 71-65 over UCONN

Not great, but wins over decent teams at least.

NONE would be considered "signature wins"! If Syracuse or Louisville was in that group then that would have been "signature" within the Big East but outside the conference we beat only cupcakes. Many of us firmly believed that by this 4th season we would have been positioned for a sweet 16 but players like Pelle never materialized, Nurideen turned into one big PR gamble, Mo went pro, Polee went home and Jakarr seems back to square one. The only original survivor with talent is D'Lo and a bunch of role players without a script.
What is so scary and sad is that the most successful team Lavin may have coached was a team not of his choosing and the recruiting mojo has frozen in time.

What is scary is that he has had his best success only when Dunlap was here. We need a good x and o guy period.

He is available.

 

[Moose]

I'd like anyone here to name one signature win with this current group of Juniors over the past 3 years. Just one.

2/25/12 61-58 over ND
1/25/12 78-62 over WV
1/15/13 67-63 over ND
2/6/13 71-65 over UCONN

Not great, but wins over decent teams at least.

NONE would be considered "signature wins"! If Syracuse or Louisville was in that group then that would have been "signature" within the Big East but outside the conference we beat only cupcakes. Many of us firmly believed that by this 4th season we would have been positioned for a sweet 16 but players like Pelle never materialized, Nurideen turned into one big PR gamble, Mo went pro, Polee went home and Jakarr seems back to square one. The only original survivor with talent is D'Lo and a bunch of role players without a script.
What is so scary and sad is that the most successful team Lavin may have coached was a team not of his choosing and the recruiting mojo has frozen in time.

What is scary is that he has had his best success only when Dunlap was here. We need a good x and o guy period.

He is available.

He's never coming back.

 

[monte]

I'd like anyone here to name one signature win with this current group of Juniors over the past 3 years. Just one.

2/25/12 61-58 over ND
1/25/12 78-62 over WV
1/15/13 67-63 over ND
2/6/13 71-65 over UCONN

Not great, but wins over decent teams at least.

NONE would be considered "signature wins"! If Syracuse or Louisville was in that group then that would have been "signature" within the Big East but outside the conference we beat only cupcakes. Many of us firmly believed that by this 4th season we would have been positioned for a sweet 16 but players like Pelle never materialized, Nurideen turned into one big PR gamble, Mo went pro, Polee went home and Jakarr seems back to square one. The only original survivor with talent is D'Lo and a bunch of role players without a script.
What is so scary and sad is that the most successful team Lavin may have coached was a team not of his choosing and the recruiting mojo has frozen in time.

What is scary is that he has had his best success only when Dunlap was here. We need a good x and o guy period.

Dunlap certainly helped, but Dwight Hardy helped a whole lot more.

 

[JohnnyFan]

What is scary is that he has had his best success only when Dunlap was here. We need a good x and o guy period.

So true.

 

[westchesterjoe]

My impression of Lavin's UCLA teams were that the teams were less than the sum of their parts. With the brief exception of his first STJ team before DJ got hurt, his teams here have not changed that impression. However, this is the first year since then that the sum has been great enough to really notice and we are not yet at the end.

UCLA may have been less than the sum of their parts, but with 5 sweet sixteens, Lavin is exceptional at assembling parts. Wouldn't you rather have a stock room of Jaguar parts than Hyundai? As the Jaguar unofficial slogan goes, "Ah, but when it runs...."

Those UCLA parts were considered by many to be Final 4 parts. So while he was exceptional at acquiring those parts, his assembling left a lot to be desired.

. However we are seeing that he's not replicating that UCLA success here so back to square one.

Come on Moose. Throw out the year he had the seniors, and this is only season three of a roster starting from scratch. Just remind yourself that he restocked us with high level talent from recruit #1, even if he was forced to be less discriminating because of all the roster slots he had to fill. We are far better off right now than we thought we'd be, and we have to be a little more patient before calling his regime a failure. We are far from square one, but none of us will be happy until we secure an NCAA bid. Then we won't be happy until to go deep into the tourney. Then we won't be happy until we make the Final Four. Then we won't be happy when we lose in the final four in the semis... Let's face it, we just aren't a hppy bunch, and never have been.

I have to disagree Beast. I said when Lavin was hired our fans would still not be happy with 10 straight years of 20 wins. Case in point me and a few others saying 11-7 in conference, 21 wins and people are pissy about that. We are getting set up for 1 run ever 4 years. That's scary. The vaunted first recruiting class has 3 guys that will see their Sr year next year. The quotes of being good by February might be too little too late. Then next year if all goes well we have the whole team except Sanchez and Gift return, and thats a big IF and then we are looking at a veteran team with the youngest team in America returning in 2015 yet again and the cycle begins yet again.

I'm not a psychic. I can't see into the future. But I do look at the big picture more than whats right in front of me. And it doesn't look so bright to me.

I think we are good enough to get an at large bid. I think we are one-two players away from being a solid team ranked 13-18. You weren't around in the so-called heyday. BAck then we would reel in a TOP player about once every 4 years. In those days it might be a George Johnson, a Mel Davis, a Reggie Carter (who wasn't as good as billed, but good enough, and a transfer at that), then a Mullin. We got lucky enough that Mullin's senior year intersected Walter Berry's transfer from Juco. I think back then we got the best of the rest in the city, and that was good enough to be ranked most years. Back then there weren't all these conferences, so SJU had an edge in getting ranked basedo n our name, and there wasn't all that TV exposure. Maybe that is why we went out early way too often to lower ranked teams. I am pretty certain that Lavin has brought in more nationally ranked talent in 3 years of recruiting than Looie or anyone else ever did. Be a little more patient. It WILL happen if we are.

PS IMO the reason we usually exited the tourney earlier than expected is because we were usually out-coached, not because we were over-rated.

I agree with you, Monte.. Louie lost a lot of NCAA games he should have won.. Beating Rutgers then losing to a mediocre Penn team with the Final 4 spot on the line. Losing to Auburn in 86 when Berry got in foul trouble..
And, in the 85 semis against G'town, he had no adjustment to the box and 1 on Mullin when he had Berry to score downlow.And, playing Moses instead of Jackson was a big mistake ..

But, he did win some NCAA games usually early on in the tourney.. Louie's teams always used the same plays, regardless of personnel and were not difficult to figure out. The more cerebral Coaches could usually outcoach him but, still you can't knock his HOF stats.

Lavin could borrow a lot of Louie but, it's doubtful he will..And, Louie usually got the best local talent, with certain exceptions.. Lavin doesn't seem interested in many local kids from the PSAL OR CHSAA. Most of these players are out of towners..

 

[westchesterjoe]

He is firmly on the hot seat, I was about to start a thread on this topic. For all the people out to bash Norm and rightfully so, what has Lavin done better other than take Norm's guys to the dance once?

What has Lavin done better than Norm? How about recruit in the top 100 from the get go, including an NBA first round pick, and more recently the 17th best player in the nation. Do you think Norm recruited talent at that level?

Also, with Norm, we were a perennial 150+ in the RPI.

I don't think comparisons between Lavin's and Norm's records were the objective when Lavin was hired.. Expectations were much higher because Norm's Record was so poor.. While Lavin has done better, the results to date are not at the level expected with his rep and stature.. And, Compensation.

If Mid Pack of the new BE is acceptable then we've got that.. I doubt most fans, alums, etc are happy with a mid tier program after 100 plus years of quality Basketball, excluding the last 10-12 yeas, which was institutional mismanagement.




Lavin's RPI on average has been better than that.

 

[fuchsia]

Coaches have strengths and weaknesses. The late Lou Rossini at NYU went to the Final Four in 1960. Hap Hairston and Satch Sanders had incredibly long careers in the NBA despite limited offense capability. Rossini (a Lapchick protege') was a great coach of big man fundamentals and rebounding. However, in 1964 NYU's (SI Cover curse) preseason SI #1 team finished 17-10 after their only real point guard (Neil O'Neill) was declared ineligible the day before the season. With smart (gym rat) point guards on the roster to take advantage of his finely trained big men, Rossini was a star, without those point guards, a disappointment.

Lavin clearly has strengths and weaknesses and in writing this it strikes me that we have two point guards of different types, Branch a pass first point guard who I suspect can make both three and mid-range J's when needed and Rysheed whose playmaking comes off of his offensive scoring prowess both as slasher and shooter. PGIV is not a point guard. I prefer pass first point guards and would like to see some sets with Rysheed as a wing with Branch at point and D'Lo at the two and then rotations where any one of them can get some rest as long as either Branch or Jordan are on the floor. This can be solved and perhaps Lavs' Feb March timetable is accurate given the number of interchangeable parts.

 

[bobre45]

I'd like anyone here to name one signature win with this current group of Juniors over the past 3 years. Just one.

2/25/12 61-58 over ND
1/25/12 78-62 over WV
1/15/13 67-63 over ND
2/6/13 71-65 over UCONN

Not great, but wins over decent teams at least.

NONE would be considered "signature wins"! If Syracuse or Louisville was in that group then that would have been "signature" within the Big East but outside the conference we beat only cupcakes. Many of us firmly believed that by this 4th season we would have been positioned for a sweet 16 but players like Pelle never materialized, Nurideen turned into one big PR gamble, Mo went pro, Polee went home and Jakarr seems back to square one. The only original survivor with talent is D'Lo and a bunch of role players without a script.
What is so scary and sad is that the most successful team Lavin may have coached was a team not of his choosing and the recruiting mojo has frozen in time.

Too true. We have no signees coming and one frosh who's headed for the league ASAP. I see Lavin heading for the hills before long. Only problem is where he would go. I don't see the NBA or another program opening up after his performance at SJU. I also think his credibility has taken a big recent hit. I think Fraschilla knows more and works harder so TV might be a problem too.

 

[MBoutchatski]

Coaches have strengths and weaknesses.

Lavin clearly has strengths and weaknesses

what exactly are lavin's strengths when it comes to coaching? He's a good recruiter, that's it.

 

[sirvoo]

Too soon to say I was right? Get a hungry young coach who may not have all the connections but will make every single player that wears our uniform better.

This guy is the turd not Norm. For everyone here who insulted Norm and called me inbalanced for comparing the two, you should know you're dead wrong. Both coaches stink but this one is a new low.

 

[beast of the east]

Too soon to say I was right? Get a hungry young coach who may not have all the connections but will make every single player that wears our uniform better.

This guy is the turd not Norm. For everyone here who insulted Norm and called me inbalanced for comparing the two, you should know you're dead wrong. Both coaches stink but this one is a new low.

I love how imbalanced you STILL are. A good percentage of us felt we had a good chance to win today. That NEVER happened when Norm coached.

I think we should get off of Lavin, and blame Mike Repole. The world isn't vitamin water, and he shouldn't have been allowed to hire the coach.

Bobre was right - we should have hired Mark Jackson.

 

[dee]

Too soon to say I was right? Get a hungry young coach who may not have all the connections but will make every single player that wears our uniform better.

This guy is the turd not Norm. For everyone here who insulted Norm and called me inbalanced for comparing the two, you should know you're dead wrong. Both coaches stink but this one is a new low.

I am sorry but I still believe Norm was lower than Lavin for whatever that is worth. And dont forget the powers that be gave Norm 7 yrs and it got worse year after year with his coaching. He was absolutely awful. As time goes by people tend to forget, well dont. Norm was worse.

 

[dee]

Too soon to say I was right? Get a hungry young coach who may not have all the connections but will make every single player that wears our uniform better.

This guy is the turd not Norm. For everyone here who insulted Norm and called me inbalanced for comparing the two, you should know you're dead wrong. Both coaches stink but this one is a new low.

I love how imbalanced you STILL are. A good percentage of us felt we had a good chance to win today. That NEVER happened when Norm coached.

I think we should get off of Lavin, and blame Mike Repole. The world isn't vitamin water, and he shouldn't have been allowed to hire the coach.

Bobre was right - we should have hired Mark Jackson.

Jackson was looking for a pro job which he got. Lavin is a great choice once he brings back an x and o coach. Obviously Keady doesnt want to spend the time helping him with that and the people who he hired are not up to the task. Time to change assistant coaches. We need Lavin for recruiting and PR. The real game coach will be the assistant

 

[beast of the east]

Too soon to say I was right? Get a hungry young coach who may not have all the connections but will make every single player that wears our uniform better.

This guy is the turd not Norm. For everyone here who insulted Norm and called me inbalanced for comparing the two, you should know you're dead wrong. Both coaches stink but this one is a new low.

I love how imbalanced you STILL are. A good percentage of us felt we had a good chance to win today. That NEVER happened when Norm coached.

I think we should get off of Lavin, and blame Mike Repole. The world isn't vitamin water, and he shouldn't have been allowed to hire the coach.

Bobre was right - we should have hired Mark Jackson.

Jackson was looking for a pro job which he got. Lavin is a great choice once he brings back an x and o coach. Obviously Keady doesnt want to spend the time helping him with that and the people who he hired are not up to the task. Time to change assistant coaches. We need Lavin for recruiting and PR. The real game coach will be the assistant

I'm being dramatic and sarcastic. Thank God they can only get one loss for this game.

 

[bobo]

Too soon to say I was right? Get a hungry young coach who may not have all the connections but will make every single player that wears our uniform better.

This guy is the turd not Norm. For everyone here who insulted Norm and called me inbalanced for comparing the two, you should know you're dead wrong. Both coaches stink but this one is a new low.

I love how imbalanced you STILL are. A good percentage of us felt we had a good chance to win today. That NEVER happened when Norm coached.

I think we should get off of Lavin, and blame Mike Repole. The world isn't vitamin water, and he shouldn't have been allowed to hire the coach.

Bobre was right - we should have hired Mark Jackson.

Jackson was looking for a pro job which he got. Lavin is a great choice once he brings back an x and o coach. Obviously Keady doesnt want to spend the time helping him with that and the people who he hired are not up to the task. Time to change assistant coaches. We need Lavin for recruiting and PR. The real game coach will be the assistant

provided Lavin's ego allows that to happen.

 

[frank]

How could they play together, when they don't know who is .in the lineup with them.Did Lavin read any of our posts on the starting lineup this week. The starting lineup today just took the heart out me,I just can imagine what it did to the team.lWhat is his thinking?????????????

 

[1and1sju]

Too soon to say I was right? Get a hungry young coach who may not have all the connections but will make every single player that wears our uniform better.

This guy is the turd not Norm. For everyone here who insulted Norm and called me inbalanced for comparing the two, you should know you're dead wrong. Both coaches stink but this one is a new low.

I love how imbalanced you STILL are. A good percentage of us felt we had a good chance to win today. That NEVER happened when Norm coached.

I think we should get off of Lavin, and blame Mike Repole. The world isn't vitamin water, and he shouldn't have been allowed to hire the coach.

Bobre was right - we should have hired Mark Jackson.

Stop with the big names! Many good coaches rise through the ranks, they aren't anointed because they have a big name.
Who the f was Jim Calhoun when he was at Northeastern? Bill Self proved himself at Tulsa. Not long ago Gus Malzahn was a HS football coach in texas.

Find a guy with a brain who is hungry.

 

[sirvoo]

Too soon to say I was right? Get a hungry young coach who may not have all the connections but will make every single player that wears our uniform better.

This guy is the turd not Norm. For everyone here who insulted Norm and called me inbalanced for comparing the two, you should know you're dead wrong. Both coaches stink but this one is a new low.

I love how imbalanced you STILL are. A good percentage of us felt we had a good chance to win today. That NEVER happened when Norm coached.

I think we should get off of Lavin, and blame Mike Repole. The world isn't vitamin water, and he shouldn't have been allowed to hire the coach.

Bobre was right - we should have hired Mark Jackson.

Excuse me but what does it matter what we thought the result would be? Because we thought we had a chance you think that means Lavin is a respectable coach? Again you and the intangibles. All you care about is the recruiting rankings and expectations. Have you seen the halftime score? Start putting more stake in the things that matter like being down 30 at halftime to a bitter rival.