Coach Anderson

[quote="Jack Williams" post=376399][quote="Room112" post=376397]So we were picked to finish 9th in the Big East, and we're currently in 9th, and people are upset? What was expected?[/quote]

The non conf wins over Arizona and West Virginia screwed a ton of fans on here because they thought this was gonna be a special season.

For me, I certainly hoped that but as soon as we lost to butler the way we did on New Year’s Eve I had a feeling the season was over. And once we lost that game @Georgetown the season was confirmed over.

I like Mike A and he deserves time like Logen said to build the program the way he wants and then we will see what happens.

I can understand the frustration but we do have to be patient. We are like kids in an ice cream parlor who got handed a huge sundae, got to take two licks (WVU and Zona) and then the ice cream was promptly taken away from us. It sucks, but us doing big things this year wasn’t realistic.

As for the talk about recruiting, I wouldn’t complain about it just because the rankings are what they are. If these recruits come in and stink it up then you have a right to complain about the recruiting. But Mike A got Champagnie already who’s been one of my favorite players to watch. While our “highly rated guys” like mustapha have been a let down. So don’t get hung up on rankings they don’t tell the whole story. Let’s get these guys on campus and out on the floor and then see what we have[/quote]

I will only speak for me but I never once mentioned our record (in fact I was candid about my criticism not being about losing per se). Nor did I say anything resembling expectations of “big things” or a “special season.” My only mentioning of the WVU and Arizona wins and our lost opportunities was in the context of “lack of talent” which not one poster has even attempted to address.
 
[quote="Moose" post=376401][quote="Room112" post=376397]So we were picked to finish 9th in the Big East, and we're currently in 9th, and people are upset? What was expected?[/quote]

The 9th thing was odd to me. But youre right maybe they were right. Being picked 9th with 2 players picked 2nd team BE in Heron and LJ seemed odd to me. But we're 9th with them being mehhh for most of the year. So its a wash I guess.[/quote]

The problem is after those 2 it was all question marks. I got excited too. But this season is playing out as predicted. Frustrating because we could have easily won a few more.
 
Rankings absolutely matter IMO...for the most part, you need 4 star kids on a regular basis to be able to be a consistent top 25 level team that makes noise in tourneys. You also need good scouts to get the occasional 3 star kid or low major transfer and turn them into stars. Think Gonzaga, Villanova, etc. There are exceptions of course, but look at the rest of our conference. They all have tons of 4 star kids. We technically have 0 right now for 2020. Posh is a 3 not a 4 anymore. We seem to make excuses as if a coach first getting to a new program can't possibly recruit well nationally. That's simply not true. I was begging for Hsu and we did not hire him. He casually brought #59 4* C Ongenda over with him for 2020, and just got #32 4* Keon Edwards and #93 4* Ahamad Bynum for 2021. Hsu got THREE four star recruits while we have zero. Letaio is not a good coach and DePaul is as bad a program as it gets in major hoops. I forgot what's it's like because it's been about 4-5 years since getting a consensus 4 star HS kid.
 
[quote="Logen" post=376403][quote="Jack Williams" post=376399][quote="Room112" post=376397]So we were picked to finish 9th in the Big East, and we're currently in 9th, and people are upset? What was expected?[/quote]

The non conf wins over Arizona and West Virginia screwed a ton of fans on here because they thought this was gonna be a special season.

For me, I certainly hoped that but as soon as we lost to butler the way we did on New Year’s Eve I had a feeling the season was over. And once we lost that game @Georgetown the season was confirmed over.

I like Mike A and he deserves time like Logen said to build the program the way he wants and then we will see what happens.

I can understand the frustration but we do have to be patient. We are like kids in an ice cream parlor who got handed a huge sundae, got to take two licks (WVU and Zona) and then the ice cream was promptly taken away from us. It sucks, but us doing big things this year wasn’t realistic.

As for the talk about recruiting, I wouldn’t complain about it just because the rankings are what they are. If these recruits come in and stink it up then you have a right to complain about the recruiting. But Mike A got Champagnie already who’s been one of my favorite players to watch. While our “highly rated guys” like mustapha have been a let down. So don’t get hung up on rankings they don’t tell the whole story. Let’s get these guys on campus and out on the floor and then see what we have[/quote]

I will only speak for me but I never once mentioned our record (in fact I was candid about my criticism not being about losing per se). Nor did I say anything resembling expectations of “big things” or a “special season.” My only mentioning of the WVU and Arizona wins and our lost opportunities was in the context of “lack of talent” which not one poster has even attempted to address.[/quote]

I mean, our talent is what it is. We do not have many shot creators. We have won big games and stayed close in others but I think it is clear where we lack talent when watching. LJ and Heron were supposed to be better this year, without them playing or shooting well there just is not much Mike A can do here.

We have a couple big wins but to put a full season together that is NCAA tournament worthy you need guys who are somewhat reliable to get buckets and create offense. Dunn tries his best but we need more. I look forward to getting Posh and Cole while continuing to keep an eye on the development of Greg/Champagnie. I believe the future is bright but i think saying talent is lacking currently is fair
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=376410]Rankings absolutely matter IMO...for the most part, you need 4 star kids on a regular basis to be able to be a consistent top 25 level team that makes noise in tourneys. You also need good scouts to get the occasional 3 star kid or low major transfer and turn them into stars. Think Gonzaga, Villanova, etc. There are exceptions of course, but look at the rest of our conference. They all have tons of 4 star kids. We technically have 0 right now for 2020. Posh is a 3 not a 4 anymore. We seem to make excuses as if a coach first getting to a new program can't possibly recruit well nationally. That's simply not true. I was begging for Hsu and we did not hire him. He casually brought #59 4* C Ongenda over with him for 2020, and just got #32 4* Keon Edwards and #93 4* Ahamad Bynum for 2021. Hsu got THREE four star recruits while we have zero. Letaio is not a good coach and DePaul is as bad a program as it gets in major hoops. I forgot what's it's like because it's been about 4-5 years since getting a consensus 4 star HS kid.[/quote]

Wasn't Hsu known for shady tactics?
 
Coaching in a major conference certainly pays well. The new Arkansas football coach bought Anderson's mansion. I wonder if his new Long Island home is this luxurious?

The housing market in Arkansas is less expensive compared to NY. 2.5 million is a lot in my state. I suspect a 8,400-square-foot property, almost 4 acres on Long Island must be 5 times that or more?

https://twitter.com/KATVNews/status/1226987958147796992?s=20
According to Washington County property records, Pittman and his wife Jamie paid $2.5 million for the 8,400-square-foot property on Horse Meadow Drive. The deal closed Jan. 30. The 3.84-acre property had been on the market since May 28, 2019, with a list price of $2.8 million. The purchase price equals $297.62 per square foot.
 
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If anything Big East play proved to the staff how far away we really are. We have an excellent staff with experience and success on their resumes.

They didn’t come here to fail. They’ll regroup after the season and rebuild this piece by piece. They see first hand what it’s going to take to succeed out here. It was never going to be easy and they’re invested in the school, community and the kids. Don’t think otherwise.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=376336][quote="Paultzman" post=376335]Zach B


“With every loss, St. John’s fans seem to grow more skeptical of first-year coach Mike Anderson.

I get emails, text-messages and tweets about it. My message: Breathe. This was never going to be a quick fix, not after Justin Simon and Shamorie Ponds left early for the professional ranks.

This team, now 2-9 in the Big East and 13-11 overall, was picked ninth in the Big East by the league’s coaches because of a shortage of talent. Many of the players on this roster don’t fit Anderson’s pressing, up-tempo style. It’s his first year in the Big East and he’s learning the league.

I frequently hear a common refrain from St. John’s fans, that they’re tired of the losing. It’s been 20 years since the Johnnies last won an NCAA Tournament game. That’s not Anderson’s fault. He just got here.

Give him time, let him recruit. It’s not a coincidence he’s never had a losing season before in 17 previous seasons as a head coach, and I still don’t think he will wind up with one this year, either.“

https://nypost.com/2020/02/09/seton-hall-is-final-four-caliber-team-weve-waited-21-years-for/[/quote]

It's reasonable but at the same time you have to take into account that SJ fans have been hearing the same stuff for 20+ years. If you keep telling fans to have hope and just wait and maybe next year but nothing good ever happens, they're going to roll their eyes. I realize being a fan of our college program is a hobby and it's not life or death...it's a way to escape life. But even in the time I've been a big fan since 2011, we've gone from looking like we might just be waking up and started getting back in the national spotlight, great recruiting, and clearly better than PC, SHU, DePaul, etc. to clearly worse than PC, SHU, and the only team as bad as us is DePaul but even they recruit way better shady or not. We are not just mediocre in 6th. We are literally at the bottom and it has begun to feel normal which is dangerous. Every game, teams like PC have a real shot to win regardless of which conference team they play. And they're far from a juggernaut. Creighton and Butler find these shooters like they're hunting fish in a barrel. They're making 3's from almost half court, making 3's with hands in their face, making 3's without even touching the net. And yet, the best we can do is find a JUCO who maybe has a shot of making a 3 but no one else? In today's game that ain't gunna fly.[/quote]

Enough! The guy has been on the job less than a year
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=376410]Rankings absolutely matter IMO...for the most part, you need 4 star kids on a regular basis to be able to be a consistent top 25 level team that makes noise in tourneys. You also need good scouts to get the occasional 3 star kid or low major transfer and turn them into stars. Think Gonzaga, Villanova, etc. There are exceptions of course, but look at the rest of our conference. They all have tons of 4 star kids. We technically have 0 right now for 2020. Posh is a 3 not a 4 anymore. We seem to make excuses as if a coach first getting to a new program can't possibly recruit well nationally. That's simply not true. I was begging for Hsu and we did not hire him. He casually brought #59 4* C Ongenda over with him for 2020, and just got #32 4* Keon Edwards and #93 4* Ahamad Bynum for 2021. Hsu got THREE four star recruits while we have zero. Letaio is not a good coach and DePaul is as bad a program as it gets in major hoops. I forgot what's it's like because it's been about 4-5 years since getting a consensus 4 star HS kid.[/quote]


Mike, I love your passion but rankings aren’t he be all end all. Look at Baylor’s roster. They’re the #1 team in the country. Out of the 15 players on their roster, only 3 are top 100 kids and one of them doesn’t even start and another is transfer who didn’t cut it at his first school. The other 10 scholarship players are all transfers from small schools, JUCO’s or 3 star kids. Don’t get caught up in rankings. These kids on Baylor all fit their system and accept their roles. They all like each other and play with great chemistry.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=376341]I think it's healthy to allow fans to vent their frustration instead of holding it in for others. That's the main point where we differ. No reason we should be 2-9 right now with LJ and Heron on this team even if it's a rebuilding year overall. Through our first 10-11 games in conference play the past 5 years we have to be something like 6-44. Not mediocre. I'll tell you what I would do...fire Oliva and get fresh blood. I also wouldn't have alienated Repole who would've helped upgrade our facilities single-handedly. I would've let him buy all the influence he wanted, because we aren't raising money any other way. We all want the best for this team and I'll continue to root for the program, but I also think fan dissatisfaction should not be dismissed as if it's unwarranted.[/quote]
your missals are dismissed because they are repetitive and long winded and, in many cases, gross oversimplifications.
 
Let's face it. We hired a coach that another school fired because they weren't happy with the job he was doing. We didnt hire someone who was an upcoming successful coach who would want to come here because it is an upgrade for him. So we got what we got. 40 minutes of hell. Hell for the fans that is
 
Mike Zaun wrote: Mike Zaun wrote: Rankings absolutely matter IMO...for the most part, you need 4 star kids on a regular basis to be able to be a consistent top 25 level team that makes noise in tourneys. You also need good scouts to get the occasional 3 star kid or low major transfer and turn them into stars. Think Gonzaga, Villanova, etc. There are exceptions of course, but look at the rest of our conference. They all have tons of 4 star kids. We technically have 0 right now for 2020. Posh is a 3 not a 4 anymore. We seem to make excuses as if a coach first getting to a new program can't possibly recruit well nationally. That's simply not true. I was begging for Hsu and we did not hire him. He casually brought #59 4* C Ongenda over with him for 2020, and just got #32 4* Keon Edwards and #93 4* Ahamad Bynum for 2021. Hsu got THREE four star recruits while we have zero. Letaio is not a good coach and DePaul is as bad a program as it gets in major hoops. I forgot what's it's like because it's been about 4-5 years since getting a consensus 4 star HS kid.

Just repeating the same thing over and over doesn't make it true. Take a look at the roster of Baylor & Gonzaga, the top two teams in the country for the past month. They are not full of top HS recruits; in fact Baylor has 3 of its top 6 guys from transfer and JUCO ranks. In addition, this idea that top JUCOs are question marks in DIV I is nonsense. Much of coach's success at Arkansas involved mining the JUCO market successfully. Wait until you get a look at how the 2020 class performs before judging it
 
If he is mining next yr sure hopes he mines for players and can shoot and create their own shots. Otherwise next yr will look like this yr Oh and just maybe they can scour the country and oversees for a talented big so that we are not the smallest against every team we play
 
Exactly ,we are what we are,we are not going to wave a magic wand and make Heron and LJ be top players or we all of a sudden are going to play like a contender? Look Heron and LJ would not start on some teams in the Big East
Most likely providence beats us and we can very easily not win another game in conf but based on where the program is at presently I am ok with that provided we play each remaining came tough and earn respect Hoping for good class next yet with some more talent that pushes us out of the basement
 
[quote="usguard" post=376440]Exactly ,we are what we are,we are not going to wave a magic wand and make Heron and LJ be top players or we all of a sudden are going to play like a contender? Look Heron and LJ would not start on some teams in the Big East
Most likely providence beats us and we can very easily not win another game in conf but based on where the program is at presently I am ok with that provided we play each remaining came tough and earn respect Hoping for good class next yet with some more talent that pushes us out of the basement[/quote]

USG I respect you as a poster, but until you figure out how to use the quote function, you’re gonna continue to come across as a nut case who walks around talking to himself. Not that following this program can’t turn anyone in to a nut case.
 
[quote="Monte" post=376445][quote="usguard" post=376440]Exactly ,we are what we are,we are not going to wave a magic wand and make Heron and LJ be top players or we all of a sudden are going to play like a contender? Look Heron and LJ would not start on some teams in the Big East
Most likely providence beats us and we can very easily not win another game in conf but based on where the program is at presently I am ok with that provided we play each remaining came tough and earn respect Hoping for good class next yet with some more talent that pushes us out of the basement[/quote]

USG I respect you as a poster, but until you figure out how to use the quote function, you’re gonna continue to come across as a nut case who walks around talking to himself. Not that following this program can’t turn anyone in to a nut case.[/quote]

Yep, everytime I read him I try figuring out who he's talking to. lol
 
Whether anyone would like to admit it or not, the simple fact is that yes overall recruiting definitely matters. There will always be the Curry 3 star types who get noticed by great scouts and turn out to be 5 star caliber. But those are rare. The rule is that top 25 teams are loaded with 4 star kids. It's not the end all be all...you still need good scouting like I said. Of course fit matters, but if the players aren't talented enough, big enough, strong enough, or fast enough, you will still be at a disadvantage vs. many teams. I still think CMA and the rest of the staff put the effort in and come across as very professional with a clear plan. I'm rooting for them, believe me. But the recruiting to date doesn't suggest we will be jumping to the top half of the Big East anytime soon until we get a big recruiting class again. Next year likely won't be good either, but I don't see any major studs that are taking us to the next level. 2021 class is make or break.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=376456]Whether anyone would like to admit it or not, the simple fact is that yes overall recruiting definitely matters. There will always be the Curry 3 star types who get noticed by great scouts and turn out to be 5 star caliber. But those are rare. The rule is that top 25 teams are loaded with 4 star kids. It's not the end all be all...you still need good scouting like I said. Of course fit matters, but if the players aren't talented enough, big enough, strong enough, or fast enough, you will still be at a disadvantage vs. many teams. I still think CMA and the rest of the staff put the effort in and come across as very professional with a clear plan. I'm rooting for them, believe me. But the recruiting to date doesn't suggest we will be jumping to the top half of the Big East anytime soon until we get a big recruiting class again. Next year likely won't be good either, but I don't see any major studs that are taking us to the next level. 2021 class is make or break.[/quote]

Mike, this staff just got here. When you talk about recruiting, these coaches who have been at programs for a while are on kids and have been recruiting them for three or four years. It's hard to compete against that when you just take over a program. Plus, kids that he recruited for Arkansas might not want to come to NYC. It's a different type of kid. You mention Hsu at DePaul but Leitao has been there a few years now and maybe he was on these kids also but with combination of him and Hsu they were able to close the deal. CMA is also recruiting in a different regional area to some extent and has to build relationships. Hopefully Macon and DeMeo can help with that. I'm not disappointed in the recruiting so for as CMA hasn't been here long. He's made some local inroads with Champagnie, Posh and Wusu. He's continued his JUCO route with Cole and Moore , two good JUCO's. Like I said, he will sign two maybe three more players before all is said and done. There are still quality JUCO kids out there and he's on Gray and couple of other high school kids who he thinks fit his system. Like it or not we have to give this a couple of years.
 
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