Butler, Wed. Feb. 28, 9pm, CBS SN / Radio TBD

First off I've handed out by far more thank-you's in this thread than any other because of many good posts. Secondly, sense more than a few posters are getting a little tired of a particular posters proselytizing about a certain subject as it comes off a bit holier than thou and seems to paint him as some paragon of virtue. Other than this one particular line of subject matter he is one of our better posters IMO and I really enjoy many of his informative posts. Just hope he can cut back on preaching the same message. JMHO
 
[quote="Class of 72" post=274441][quote="austour" post=274432]FWIW iyeah, I'm stunned and disappointed so far. But wait'll next year![/quote]

Perhaps you are joking but I would not use the word "stunned". Without much of a bench I was on record as thinking we were capable of an NIT bid. Had we won 2 or 3 games we should have we would be right on track if we had 17 or 18 wins to date.
Then LoVett chose to Leave it and it changed everything. Unfortunately, it also influenced our perception of the staff but only next year will we have a good sense of if they can deliver the players and the wins. 15 wins with the shortest bench in the conference is an accomplishment in and of itself. The team consisted of 3 returning 2nd year players in Ponds, Lovett and Owens and two new players who had a year of rust. They have consistently played hard and, as evidenced by last night, cannot be counted out against any competition. Duke, Villanova and now Butler, all NCAA Tourney teams, learned that. Mullin and St. Jean have worked well holding these kids together. My hope is that Mitch Richmond gets more involved in recruiting where he could be very influential.[/quote]

I wrote a follow up post to the one above but I guess I didn't post it correctly. My comment was about the entire Mullin era so far and the OPs point that he was stunned that the program has 12 conference wins over 3 years. The only time the program had accomplished that dubious feat before was for every 3 year stretch that ended in a Norm Roberts coached year. I am not so stunned at how the season played out, more disappointed, especially after Lovett went down, though there was no excuse whatsoever for losing 11 in a row. I was stunned when the program hired a totally inexperienced leader. I'm really not so stunned at how it has played out so far. I know it's a much more competitive landscape then when I was young but I still don't see how it's acceptable for the program to be in the position that it is in.
 
[quote="Mean Gene" post=274351]Great win!! So happy for this gritty team. Amazing the amount of minutes these guys played last night. Clark , Simon and Ponds will be beasts next year. Let's hope Ponds stays. I think he will. Onward and upward.[/quote]

Predicting it right now.
If Ponds, stays, we'll go to the elite8 next year. With how these starters are playing, just imagine how good we'd be if we only had a bench.
 
[quote="L J S A" post=274376][quote="redken" post=274359][quote="JackofVirginia" post=274326]And to think we have Simon another two years. Not bad stats tonight - 24 points, 10 rebounds, 5 assists and 4 steals.[/quote]

Not if he continues to play like that.[/quote]

Simon's here for two years if Ponds comes back and dominates the spotlight. If Simon is the man next season, he definitely attracts a lot of scouts' attention.[/quote]

What if Simon doesn't want to take a back seat to Ponds.
Averages say 15-18pnts, 7boards, 5assists, 3steals next year.
That would be a great 1-2 combo. If one is off on a day, the other could take that game over.
 
[quote="mjmaherjr" post=274439][quote="Logen" post=274430][quote="Manhattan1" post=274394]Win or lose adults going after kids who are not being paid is wrong. Do I get mad and get frustrated players? Yes, but I keep that to myself because they are kids and it is creepy to go personally after kids when you are an adult.

However, Coaches are getting paid so they are fair game. They have not done the greatest job as our 4-13 Big East record illustrates. I think when we hired Mullin if you thought he would only have 12 regular season Big East victories in his career at end of year 3 everyone would be stunned. Coaches deserve to be criticized they have ultimately not got the job done yet. And as the previous poster said it is New York, if you can't take the heat this place is probably not for you.[/quote]

Stunned? Really, stunned? Some perspective, not exact science for sure, but perspective. For the argument I discount Mullin’s first year as they had to scramble in the spring just to get warm bodies for that year. So in what I consider his first two seasons, Mullin has won 29 games. Jay Wright at Nova won 34, Coach K at Duke 27. Calhoun at Uconn won 29 and went 7-25 in the BE. The only thing I find stunning is the complete lack of understanding many “fans” have of the challenge Mullin and co. took on. Or maybe it is just easier to bitch and moan and criticize.
Full disclosure, I posted before the year began I thought this team would win 20 games and I was wrong. Maybe they would have had LoVett not quit on the team but s##t happens and that is all part of it. So I am disappointed, but no one can deny these kids play hard and have no quit in them and that comes from the coaches on down and is a very solid foundation to build on. Let’s hope that is the case.[/quote] In all fairness you have been a long time poster and I totally respect ups but you disappeared during the losing streak

Ao it's kind of not fair to call out others when we win a few games[/quote]

Nonsense, you have no idea why I "disappeared" and it had nothing to do with our losing. I have posted through all of the turmoil of the last decade + and have never shied away from posting my feelings and accepting heat from those that disagreed with me. If you feel the need to go there, ask me privately before you are arrogant enough to assume why I didn't post. Unfortunately, sometimes real life gets in the way of a message board or basketball games.
 
[quote="MJDinkins" post=274448][quote="mjmaherjr" post=274439][quote="Logen" post=274430][quote="Manhattan1" post=274394]Win or lose adults going after kids who are not being paid is wrong. Do I get mad and get frustrated players? Yes, but I keep that to myself because they are kids and it is creepy to go personally after kids when you are an adult.

However, Coaches are getting paid so they are fair game. They have not done the greatest job as our 4-13 Big East record illustrates. I think when we hired Mullin if you thought he would only have 12 regular season Big East victories in his career at end of year 3 everyone would be stunned. Coaches deserve to be criticized they have ultimately not got the job done yet. And as the previous poster said it is New York, if you can't take the heat this place is probably not for you.[/quote]

Stunned? Really, stunned? Some perspective, not exact science for sure, but perspective. For the argument I discount Mullin’s first year as they had to scramble in the spring just to get warm bodies for that year. So in what I consider his first two seasons, Mullin has won 29 games. Jay Wright at Nova won 34, Coach K at Duke 27. Calhoun at Uconn won 29 and went 7-25 in the BE. The only thing I find stunning is the complete lack of understanding many “fans” have of the challenge Mullin and co. took on. Or maybe it is just easier to bitch and moan and criticize.
Full disclosure, I posted before the year began I thought this team would win 20 games and I was wrong. Maybe they would have had LoVett not quit on the team but s##t happens and that is all part of it. So I am disappointed, but no one can deny these kids play hard and have no quit in them and that comes from the coaches on down and is a very solid foundation to build on. Let’s hope that is the case.[/quote] In all fairness you have been a long time poster and I totally respect ups but you disappeared during the losing streak

Ao it's kind of not fair to call out others when we win a few games[/quote]

He's one of the posters I was referring to a day or two ago in my post on the "Zags" thread.[/quote]

Then be a man and call me out, don't "refer" to me - as least I have the seeds to put my cards on the table.
 
[quote="austour" post=274432]FWIW iyeah, I'm stunned and disappointed so far. But wait'll next year![/quote]

Sorry for that but there is a real world and fantasyland and I guess I know which one many of you live in; at least as far as SJU basketball is concerned.
 
[quote="Logen" post=274489][quote="MJDinkins" post=274448][quote="mjmaherjr" post=274439][quote="Logen" post=274430][quote="Manhattan1" post=274394]Win or lose adults going after kids who are not being paid is wrong. Do I get mad and get frustrated players? Yes, but I keep that to myself because they are kids and it is creepy to go personally after kids when you are an adult.

However, Coaches are getting paid so they are fair game. They have not done the greatest job as our 4-13 Big East record illustrates. I think when we hired Mullin if you thought he would only have 12 regular season Big East victories in his career at end of year 3 everyone would be stunned. Coaches deserve to be criticized they have ultimately not got the job done yet. And as the previous poster said it is New York, if you can't take the heat this place is probably not for you.[/quote]

Stunned? Really, stunned? Some perspective, not exact science for sure, but perspective. For the argument I discount Mullin’s first year as they had to scramble in the spring just to get warm bodies for that year. So in what I consider his first two seasons, Mullin has won 29 games. Jay Wright at Nova won 34, Coach K at Duke 27. Calhoun at Uconn won 29 and went 7-25 in the BE. The only thing I find stunning is the complete lack of understanding many “fans” have of the challenge Mullin and co. took on. Or maybe it is just easier to bitch and moan and criticize.
Full disclosure, I posted before the year began I thought this team would win 20 games and I was wrong. Maybe they would have had LoVett not quit on the team but s##t happens and that is all part of it. So I am disappointed, but no one can deny these kids play hard and have no quit in them and that comes from the coaches on down and is a very solid foundation to build on. Let’s hope that is the case.[/quote] In all fairness you have been a long time poster and I totally respect ups but you disappeared during the losing streak

Ao it's kind of not fair to call out others when we win a few games[/quote]

He's one of the posters I was referring to a day or two ago in my post on the "Zags" thread.[/quote]

Then be a man and call me out, don't "refer" to me - as least I have the seeds to put my cards on the table.[/quote]

I've called your silly, punk ass out numerous times before. I just didn't want to create any issues on the forum, so I didn't mention any names.

You're also the same person who wrote a long, soliloquy about leaving the board for good. How about you "be a man" of your word, clown?
 
[quote="Logen" post=274490][quote="austour" post=274432]FWIW iyeah, I'm stunned and disappointed so far. But wait'll next year![/quote]

Sorry for that but there is a real world and fantasyland and I guess I know which one many of you live in; at least as far as SJU basketball is concerned.[/quote]

There is your real world and there is our real world so stop thinking it is only your real world!

 
[quote="Logen" post=274489][quote="MJDinkins" post=274448][quote="mjmaherjr" post=274439][quote="Logen" post=274430][quote="Manhattan1" post=274394]Win or lose adults going after kids who are not being paid is wrong. Do I get mad and get frustrated players? Yes, but I keep that to myself because they are kids and it is creepy to go personally after kids when you are an adult.

However, Coaches are getting paid so they are fair game. They have not done the greatest job as our 4-13 Big East record illustrates. I think when we hired Mullin if you thought he would only have 12 regular season Big East victories in his career at end of year 3 everyone would be stunned. Coaches deserve to be criticized they have ultimately not got the job done yet. And as the previous poster said it is New York, if you can't take the heat this place is probably not for you.[/quote]

Stunned? Really, stunned? Some perspective, not exact science for sure, but perspective. For the argument I discount Mullin’s first year as they had to scramble in the spring just to get warm bodies for that year. So in what I consider his first two seasons, Mullin has won 29 games. Jay Wright at Nova won 34, Coach K at Duke 27. Calhoun at Uconn won 29 and went 7-25 in the BE. The only thing I find stunning is the complete lack of understanding many “fans” have of the challenge Mullin and co. took on. Or maybe it is just easier to bitch and moan and criticize.
Full disclosure, I posted before the year began I thought this team would win 20 games and I was wrong. Maybe they would have had LoVett not quit on the team but s##t happens and that is all part of it. So I am disappointed, but no one can deny these kids play hard and have no quit in them and that comes from the coaches on down and is a very solid foundation to build on. Let’s hope that is the case.[/quote] In all fairness you have been a long time poster and I totally respect ups but you disappeared during the losing streak

Ao it's kind of not fair to call out others when we win a few games[/quote]

He's one of the posters I was referring to a day or two ago in my post on the "Zags" thread.[/quote]

Then be a man and call me out, don't "refer" to me - as least I have the seeds to put my cards on the table.[/quote]

I've called out your silly ass before. That's not a problem for me, per calling you out.

You're the same person who wrote a long, soliloquy about leaving the board for good. How about you "be a man" and stick to your word?
 
[quote="Logen" post=274488][quote="mjmaherjr" post=274439][quote="Logen" post=274430][quote="Manhattan1" post=274394]Win or lose adults going after kids who are not being paid is wrong. Do I get mad and get frustrated players? Yes, but I keep that to myself because they are kids and it is creepy to go personally after kids when you are an adult.

However, Coaches are getting paid so they are fair game. They have not done the greatest job as our 4-13 Big East record illustrates. I think when we hired Mullin if you thought he would only have 12 regular season Big East victories in his career at end of year 3 everyone would be stunned. Coaches deserve to be criticized they have ultimately not got the job done yet. And as the previous poster said it is New York, if you can't take the heat this place is probably not for you.[/quote]

Stunned? Really, stunned? Some perspective, not exact science for sure, but perspective. For the argument I discount Mullin’s first year as they had to scramble in the spring just to get warm bodies for that year. So in what I consider his first two seasons, Mullin has won 29 games. Jay Wright at Nova won 34, Coach K at Duke 27. Calhoun at Uconn won 29 and went 7-25 in the BE. The only thing I find stunning is the complete lack of understanding many “fans” have of the challenge Mullin and co. took on. Or maybe it is just easier to bitch and moan and criticize.
Full disclosure, I posted before the year began I thought this team would win 20 games and I was wrong. Maybe they would have had LoVett not quit on the team but s##t happens and that is all part of it. So I am disappointed, but no one can deny these kids play hard and have no quit in them and that comes from the coaches on down and is a very solid foundation to build on. Let’s hope that is the case.[/quote] In all fairness you have been a long time poster and I totally respect ups but you disappeared during the losing streak

Ao it's kind of not fair to call out others when we win a few games[/quote]

Nonsense, you have no idea why I "disappeared" and it had nothing to do with our losing. I have posted through all of the turmoil of the last decade + and have never shied away from posting my feelings and accepting heat from those that disagreed with me. If you feel the need to go there, ask me privately before you are arrogant enough to assume why I didn't post. Unfortunately, sometimes real life gets in the way of a message board or basketball games.[/quote] I didnt go anywhere other than making a reasonable assumption which other people noticed too.

It's not like we were all calling you out when you weren't posting and if you weren't posting because of something else than I hope everything is ok. But you did come back guns blazing at people after a few wins and the tone was extra arrogant and for someone like yourself who is knowledgeable and someone who does post good stuff basketball related you didnt really need to go there either with other posters None of us are right all the time when it comes to our opinions
 
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Jumping from where we are now to the Elite 8 in 1 year is extremely difficult if not impossible, especially since this crew would have no NCAA experience.
 
[quote="kred" post=274560]Jumping from where we are now to the Elite 8 in 1 year is extremely difficult if not impossible, especially since this crew would have no NCAA experience.[/quote]

With the way the starters are playing, if they get a capable bench to give starters a chance to catch their breath, with losing alot like this years bench, then why not?
Of course all of this is only if Ponds return, he's a special player at the college level. I him and Simon would give us a crazy elite backcourt. If Keita comes in and just concentates on being a rim protecter and rebounding, theh forget scoring. Dixon just needs to come in and play his game, nothing extra.
Just my gut feeling, but I think this team can be a special next year, we'll see.
Here's praying Ponds stays.
 
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Not expecting to make the Elite 8 next year. Might happen. I believe a few teams like Butler, George Mason, even the Zags (way back when) made deep runs without much of a previous year’s pedigree. But yes, long odds.
But if Ponds returns. no major exits happen, and we get a legitimate BE-caliber Big Man, I do expect to make a lot of noise in the BEC next year and a run-of-sorts (nobody knows how ‘deep’) in the NCAAs.
Let’s go Johnnies.
 
[quote="kred" post=274560]Jumping from where we are now to the Elite 8 in 1 year is extremely difficult if not impossible, especially since this crew would have no NCAA experience.[/quote]

Don't worry. If we lose tomorrow and in the first round of the BET, we will be back to Armageddon.
 
Oh OK preacher man, thanks for your input.
Whether they win or lose tomorrow doesn't change the fact that they'll have a much better bench then this year's bench.
 
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