Bucknell game

[pobee10]

I was at the game last night and I couldn't keep from thinking to myself constantly is how Sampson can fathom leaving college after this year.

 

[southernjohnny2]

If you are watching the other games, it is obvious there is not a single player ready to be drafted at this time..Not sure about Jordan in the future, but Sampson will not be drafted this year...The draft is way too deep..

 

[SJU1512]

Our best lineup right now includes both Pointer and Obekpa. It's great that they finished, but Bucknell was able to gain confidence and momentum in the first 10 possessions by making it look like we didn't have defenders on the court. If Pointer's length was bothering Kaspar, and Obekpa was shoving everything right back in their face, from the start the game takes a different tenor. The team just goes when those two are out there and it starts, exclusively, on the defensive end of the floor.

Whether a team executes against it (as Wisconsin and Bucknell did) or not (as Wagner couldn't) our man defense isn't anywhere close. It's not about effort, it's not about athleticism. The technique just isn't there. Ayers, Kaspar, and Fitzpatrick could get any angle they wanted off the dribble, whenever they wanted it. Bucknell ran two plays for the first 27 minutes when we were in man, which have the same features - ball screen and dribble hand-off. We had no answer for it even though we knew it was coming. They probably ran 40 ball screens and I don't know that we had one textbook hard hedge and recover.

The switch to the zone was phenomenal, albeit late, and won us the game. I'm not in favor of exclusively playing zone but rather mixing the defenses. We also need to get better at man and the only way you do that is by playing it. But Wisconsin and now Bucknell have shown us in pointed fashion that we are not at this moment a 40 minute man team.

Great offensive adjustment in the second half. Most every team from now until New Years is going to zone us, and if we settle for the jumpshots they are begging for us to take like we did in the first half last night some of those games will be far more adventurous than they should be. Obekpa didn't get the ball on the block until deep into the second half and treated the defender like a middle-schooler on that dropstep. That is something we could give some outside thought to trying earlier in the game.

Excellent post. Spot on about the defense.

I thought Obekpa and Sanchez played well together, and I think you will see more of that, especially against bigger teams. The problem is that if you do that then you have to choose between Sampson and Pointer, and it makes a big difference in your game.

Dom changed our defensive intensity for the better but one man cannot make up for the other four lacking in fundamentals.

The issue early was that we started 3 guards, which we seem to do all the time. I don't like it. i would start Sanchez, Sampson and Pointer up front, Harrison and Jordan in the backcourt, and take it from there. Phil and Obekpa should get significant minutes off of the bench, and you can go big or small as the game demands along the way.

When you start 3 guards you end up leaving Dom on the bench. When you do that there just isn't enough defense on the floor. You could get there by starting Obekpa over Sanchez, but I wouldn't do that because Sanchez gives you much more all around than Obekpa does on both ends of the floor.

Agreed completely. I think the 3-guard set is a great option to have, but since we have the personnel I don't know why we go small to start. Especially because Sampson/Sanchez is not a traditional frontcourt. It's a good one, but average-ish size as far as 4/5 goes. Supplementing them with the physical presence of a Pointer at the 3 is a big difference from the 3-guard set.

Obekpa would be the starter left out, but you can't start everybody. He's been very effective off the bench for his entire tenure here, so as long as he gets big minutes that appears to be working. I like Greene off the bench because of the scoring pop he brings, as we saw last night. If we can get last night's scoring from Greene and Friday's facilitating from Branch, these 3 create a very effective bench.

This is just my own theory, but I think we bring Obekpa and Sir'Dom off the bench is because their defensive aggressiveness is a foul risk. I think Lavin likes to bring them in to add defensive intensity first and foremost, and so they can have the energy down the stretch as well as not having foul trouble before the end of the game. While I don't love starting with 3 guards, I think it is more because we haven't yet learned good chemistry on the court with 3 guards. I don't mind guys like Obekpa and Dom off the bench though. I think it is a good idea to save fouls.

I could see that angle for sure. In that event it might be time to hedge a little by starting one and bringing the other off the bench. I like the idea of saving fouls, but I don't like the defensive makeup of our current starting lineup. Small sample size, but the first 8 minutes against Wisco and the Bison put us in holes and it was because of our inability to get any stops. Jordan (who is still adjusting to defending at this level without fouling) and Sanchez (who can only do so much) are the only plus defenders in the group.

I think Pointer for Greene could transform that, and that swap only further highlights Greene's talents as well; he seems to do most of his damage once the game gets going, not out of the gates. Beyond the defensive element, the game always speeds up when Dom is in. Would help us establish the tempo we want to play at early. We got there eventually with Wisco/Bucknell, but only after slugging out the first 10-20 minutes at their pace.

 

[Class of 72]

If you are watching the other games, it is obvious there is not a single player ready to be drafted at this time..Not sure about Jordan in the future, but Sampson will not be drafted this year...The draft is way too deep..

I would rather have the SIX NBA players someone fantasized about on this board than none but there has been very s l o w development and Jakarr is likely the furthest behind the curve at present. Does not have the one on one skills yet and is not a consistent shooter. His defense is atrocious and his handle is weak. Not the attributes of a small forward in the NBA.
Jordan is a mystery thus far and may have the Nurdeen Philly curse that needs excorcizing.
If any leave this year it will be to play in Europe.

 

[westchesterjoe]

Phil Greene 3 games 72 minutes 19 FGAs 4 assists and 0 turnovers
Jamal Branch 3 games 40 minutes 9 FGAs 2 assists and 5 turnovers


I'll take Greene

I think we need to distinguish between Greene the PG and Greene the SG.. They are 2 different players. Put different numbers on them to identify which GREENE IS IN THE GAME.

As the stats show Greene the PG, in nearly twice as many minutes as Branch has only 2 more assists. Etc.

I like Greene the SG not so much Greene the PG. Agree Branch hasn't shown much.. I'm not sure why? Jordan needs to be the PG in all lineups.. He will find Greene the SG.
Lavin did a good job recognizing DLO didn't have the touch last night and made the adjustments. DLO will have the poor shooting night from time to time. His career stats show that. And, since he's not that great a defender one on one, Greene may have the hotter hand some nights.

Sampson didn't have a great game either, IMHO.. Sanchez and CO did play very well.

It's not that early to ask, why no PT for Hooper or Marco? Shooters on the bench aren't contributing..3 point shooters need to be part of every team's game. Even if only 10 minutes a game.

 

[pobee10]

If you are watching the other games, it is obvious there is not a single player ready to be drafted at this time..Not sure about Jordan in the future, but Sampson will not be drafted this year...The draft is way too deep..

I would rather have the SIX NBA players someone fantasized about on this board than none but there has been very s l o w development and Jakarr is likely the furthest behind the curve at present. Does not have the one on one skills yet and is not a consistent shooter. His defense is atrocious and his handle is weak. Not the attributes of a small forward in the NBA.
Jordan is a mystery thus far and may have the Nurdeen Philly curse that needs excorcizing.
If any leave this year it will be to play in Europe.

Agreed, I am not knocking Samp at all because obviously it helps us if his draft stock is low.

 

[ccnobz]

The other thing about Greene is he just doesn't turn the ball over. He may not be a great playmaker but when so many of our other guys seem to rush things he's always under control and just doesn't turn it over. That's what bother's me about Branch, too many careless turnovers. That last play before the half was a perfect example. Cant have our PG making high risk passes in a situation that calls for holding for the last shot.

Greene doesn't turn the ball over because he doesn't pass.
When he has it, it's going up.

Totally disagree. He runs the offense and sends the ball where it is supposed to go. If he has an open look he takes it, and when everybody is sitting on their hands and passing the ball back and forth and eventually somebody has to take the damn shot, he does what he has to do.

I have no problem with his shot selection. I'll give you that he's not a pass-first point guard, but that's not his job. That's supposed to be Branch's job.

Agree here. Greene isn't a point guard. When he is asked to play pg, it was because in the past we didn't have other options. Yesterday, he played shooting guard and did so very well. I think he will be a better player when he isn't in charge or running the offense and being a distributor. I too love Sanchez and Obekpa in there together. Both compliment each other well, especially on defense. I'd like to see us go to Sanchez more in the post on offense. Yesterday was the first time we saw it. The steal by Jordan, no-look to Sanchez was a thing of beauty. Sanchez has a nice hook inside as well. Sanchez played with fire and he will be a huge piece of our puzzle. Hes getting better and more comfortable every game. It doesn't matter that Dom comes off the bench. He's havoc off the bench and is great in that role. In addition, Sampson is more offense-minded.

When STJ made its run in the second half and took the lead Greene was at Pg, Harrison the 2 , Dom/ Sanchez/ CO up front. Greene was playing Pg. Lavin changing the defense, CO's blocks, and Greene getting hot won STJ this one. Great win lets bury Monmouth and Longwood.

 

[Class of 72]

Maybe I missed something. Everyone is asking why we didn't pound the ball inside. CO and, to a lesser extent, Orlando both tried to post up but Bucknell's zone collapsed inside and really took away any interior scoring. They gave us open jumpers that we consistently missed until Phil caught fire. If we tried to force the ball inside, it would have reaulted in turnovers. Teams know that we are not a good shooting team and Bucknell did a good job taking away the inside post up game and clogging the driving lanes.

So you are basically saying that we are doomed against the Syracuse zone which is the best in the nation and to sell our tickets to Cuse fans.
Do you really think that a post up move is the only offenseive play against a zone as an interior play? We lack spacing and ball movement. Sampson, Greene, Harrison and Pointer are three years out of high school and Sanchez is going on 25. We need to play with smarts and we are not. I suggest you watch a tape of the Syracuse-St. Francis game to see how Braicca prepared for the "zone".

 

[MCNPA]

If you are watching the other games, it is obvious there is not a single player ready to be drafted at this time..Not sure about Jordan in the future, but Sampson will not be drafted this year...The draft is way too deep..

I would rather have the SIX NBA players someone fantasized about on this board than none but there has been very s l o w development and Jakarr is likely the furthest behind the curve at present. Does not have the one on one skills yet and is not a consistent shooter. His defense is atrocious and his handle is weak. Not the attributes of a small forward in the NBA.
Jordan is a mystery thus far and may have the Nurdeen Philly curse that needs excorcizing.
If any leave this year it will be to play in Europe.

Jordan still has quite a few things to learn, but we also saw some flashes of brilliance last night. That steal, then no-look to Sanchez off the break was incredible. He makes some mistakes, but he also has the vision, athleticism and ability to be really, really good at both ends. He isn't going anywhere after this season, but the kid is going to be tremendous. He just needs minutes. Lavin trying to bring him along slowly is fine. He will only get better with more minutes though. I'm not worried about him at all. Mo Harkless looked real green his first few games and ended up single-handedly destroyinng Duke by mid-season. The learning curve is going to be great for Rysheed, especially as a point guard, but that's why we brought him in. If we are going to be as good as wed like to this season, we are going to need him to grow into the role. I don't have confidence that Branch can do that and offer as great of a weapon potentially.

 

[Marillac]

I think the biggest takeaway from last night was that Sampson and Obekpa are in no way ready to even be considered for the draft. If I was an NBA GM, I wouldn’t even invite Sampson to the summer league--forget about spending a second rounder on him. Obekpa is probably 2-4 years away from being of any use to an NBA team.

I thought Greene won us the game. He’s such a valuable player because he can literally get off an open look at will. That step back jumper is a pro move, and it has to be respected because he has that nice floater he can counter with if they don’t bite. When was the last time he’s had his shot blocked? Harrison gets like two shots blocked a game. He’s as much of a rhythm shooter as you’ll ever see.

The switch to the zone was well timed and the guys were flying around…great to see. Most of the threes Bucknell did make were contested or long enough shots were you don’t mind.

Mixed feelings about the interior defense. We had a ton of blocked shots which I love, but the bigs were very slow rotating and Bucknell seemed very comfortable in the paint in spite of all those blocks. Every team does and it is clearly something most coaches highlight in film sessions. Probably something like: “They are going to block your shots…get over it. But their positioning is awful and we have to take it to them all game inside.”

Bucknell literally gave Pointer 5-10 feet to shoot and he didn’t. That makes it tough on the inside. I really don’t like when he takes shots when we are making runs late in the game. He does a lot of good stuff off the ball on defense and things just happen when he’s in the game.

I really liked how they finally tried to establish the post. Obekpa had a great post DEEP and slammed it home emphatically. I thought it was Sampson. Sanchez showed good skill and a soft touch inside. We really need him in there more and he needs to get touches. He’s got good enough vision and passing ability to run the offense through inside-out for stretches. Sampson had a few nice moves inside.

I thought for sure we were going to lose in the first half. Nice comeback and nice win with a couple of guys off their game.

 

[ras]

Good game, and a good win. There were some encouraging signs, and there are some glaring developmental needs.

Our man defense was atrocious. It wasn't as though we were getting killed by backdoor cuts, either (though there were a few of those). Basically we just failed to stop the ball. There is work to be done there.

Jordan looked better. He needed to have a game where he did some good things, and I think he will take off from here. Branch was very solid. Harrison's shot has gone AWOL, and if it doesn't come back then our 3 point percentage is going to be woeful all year. Sanchez was solid, and Obekpa played one of his better all around games. His man defense is still a work in progress and so is his offensive game, but he played a much more complete game on both ends of the floor. Dom was Dom. Sampson still seems to be having trouble finding where he fits in, to me.

Phil was the player of the game, and if it wasn't for him this is a 10 point loss. Yes, that is a LMF "I told you so."

Most importantly, I thought Lavin did an excellent job coaching the game. He stayed with the man to man, as bad as it was, as long as the game was in reach. Then he switched to the 2-3 zone late and it shut Bucknell down at a key stretch. Putting Obekpa on the same corner as Ayres when they went to the zone was very effective. Really a good move, playing the zone late and just enough that Bucknell did not have time to analyze and attack it before it was too late.

I also thought that he had an excellent feel for who to play and when to ride the hot hand. The substitutions all made sense.

There is still a long way to go to translate the encouraging signs from this game into something consistent so that we can be competitive with, say Syracuse. But this was definitely a step in the right direction.

Agreed on everything but especially your point in subs. A lot of posters wondered why Rysheed didn't see the floor in the second half, but your out of your mind if you take Greene out of the game the way he was playing, and you needed Sir Dom on the defensive end. Well coached game by Lavin, great win

Re. Jordan: He was benched not because of Phil Greene's shooting but because he began the second half with a foul and two turnovers. Lavin saw enough and went with more experience.
There was nothing special about the subbing since both Branch and Jordan were not penetrating and dishing efficiently and not involving the bigs (Jordan at least tried). In fact, Sanchez needed to be out there more considering how small Buckell played with 4 guards!
One week folks complain about our lousy zone defense and now we complain about our lousy man defense. Last night the fact of the matter was lousy ONE man defense! Ayers was allowed a career game because Lavin failed to stick a player to him like glue. As well coached and mature as Bucknell is, they are basically a two man offense. We played lazy man in the first half and the man-to-man needed adjustments which never happened.
As for coaching, I would give Lavin a B- since most of the game we had guys 6'9 on the front line and never ONCE took advantage of it on offense. There were very few feeds or drives inside with Sampson, Sanchez and Pointer all settling for jumpers.
This was a good win against a well coached team picked 4th in the Patriot behind Army. We have a long long way to go to match the discipline St. Francis showed against Syracuse at the Carrier Dome.
Lou was in the house as was the Maven.

Good analysis and good win. I agree w your point about going inside more, especially since we are a poor shooting team. Phil and CO looked very good. Cant see Gift getting much burn this year. I still say Lavin shouldn't have redshirted him last year. This is not a knock on Gift, but Sanchez,CO and Sampson are much better and will get plenty of PT at the 4 and 5. Of course we are such a bad 3 pt shooting team, the opponents will challenge us to take the 3 and pack the inside.

 

[fun]

Jordan still has quite a few things to learn, but we also saw some flashes of b̶r̶i̶l̶l̶i̶a̶n̶c̶e̶ competence last night. .

IFYPFY

 

[ccnobz]

I think the biggest takeaway from last night was that Sampson and Obekpa are in no way ready to even be considered for the draft. If I was an NBA GM, I wouldn’t even invite Sampson to the summer league--forget about spending a second rounder on him. Obekpa is probably 2-4 years away from being of any use to an NBA team.

I thought Greene won us the game. He’s such a valuable player because he can literally get off an open look at will. That step back jumper is a pro move, and it has to be respected because he has that nice floater he can counter with if they don’t bite. When was the last time he’s had his shot blocked? Harrison gets like two shots blocked a game. He’s as much of a rhythm shooter as you’ll ever see.

The switch to the zone was well timed and the guys were flying around…great to see. Most of the threes Bucknell did make were contested or long enough shots were you don’t mind.

Mixed feelings about the interior defense. We had a ton of blocked shots which I love, but the bigs were very slow rotating and Bucknell seemed very comfortable in the paint in spite of all those blocks. Every team does and it is clearly something most coaches highlight in film sessions. Probably something like: “They are going to block your shots…get over it. But their positioning is awful and we have to take it to them all game inside.”

Bucknell literally gave Pointer 5-10 feet to shoot and he didn’t. That makes it tough on the inside. I really don’t like when he takes shots when we are making runs late in the game. He does a lot of good stuff off the ball on defense and things just happen when he’s in the game.

I really liked how they finally tried to establish the post. Obekpa had a great post DEEP and slammed it home emphatically. I thought it was Sampson. Sanchez showed good skill and a soft touch inside. We really need him in there more and he needs to get touches. He’s got good enough vision and passing ability to run the offense through inside-out for stretches. Sampson had a few nice moves inside.

I thought for sure we were going to lose in the first half. Nice comeback and nice win with a couple of guys off their game.

I agree with you that CO is nowhere near and probably will not ever get drafted or play in the NBA. But I thought he was awesome last night, and the key to our win. Sure Greene got hot, but somebody was due to hit a few in a row. He made a bunch of blocks, had a nice tip in, plus the dunk you mentioned. His blocks got the energy going in the team. Great game for CO.

 

[paultzman]

I think the biggest takeaway from last night was that Sampson and Obekpa are in no way ready to even be considered for the draft. If I was an NBA GM, I wouldn’t even invite Sampson to the summer league--forget about spending a second rounder on him. Obekpa is probably 2-4 years away from being of any use to an NBA team.

I thought Greene won us the game. He’s such a valuable player because he can literally get off an open look at will. That step back jumper is a pro move, and it has to be respected because he has that nice floater he can counter with if they don’t bite. When was the last time he’s had his shot blocked? Harrison gets like two shots blocked a game. He’s as much of a rhythm shooter as you’ll ever see.

The switch to the zone was well timed and the guys were flying around…great to see. Most of the threes Bucknell did make were contested or long enough shots were you don’t mind.

Mixed feelings about the interior defense. We had a ton of blocked shots which I love, but the bigs were very slow rotating and Bucknell seemed very comfortable in the paint in spite of all those blocks. Every team does and it is clearly something most coaches highlight in film sessions. Probably something like: “They are going to block your shots…get over it. But their positioning is awful and we have to take it to them all game inside.”

Bucknell literally gave Pointer 5-10 feet to shoot and he didn’t. That makes it tough on the inside. I really don’t like when he takes shots when we are making runs late in the game. He does a lot of good stuff off the ball on defense and things just happen when he’s in the game.

I really liked how they finally tried to establish the post. Obekpa had a great post DEEP and slammed it home emphatically. I thought it was Sampson. Sanchez showed good skill and a soft touch inside. We really need him in there more and he needs to get touches. He’s got good enough vision and passing ability to run the offense through inside-out for stretches. Sampson had a few nice moves inside.

I thought for sure we were going to lose in the first half. Nice comeback and nice win with a couple of guys off their game.

Great points, especially about Pointer.

 

[gman]

I think the biggest takeaway from last night was that Sampson and Obekpa are in no way ready to even be considered for the draft. If I was an NBA GM, I wouldn’t even invite Sampson to the summer league--forget about spending a second rounder on him. Obekpa is probably 2-4 years away from being of any use to an NBA team.

I thought Greene won us the game. He’s such a valuable player because he can literally get off an open look at will. That step back jumper is a pro move, and it has to be respected because he has that nice floater he can counter with if they don’t bite. When was the last time he’s had his shot blocked? Harrison gets like two shots blocked a game. He’s as much of a rhythm shooter as you’ll ever see.

The switch to the zone was well timed and the guys were flying around…great to see. Most of the threes Bucknell did make were contested or long enough shots were you don’t mind.

Mixed feelings about the interior defense. We had a ton of blocked shots which I love, but the bigs were very slow rotating and Bucknell seemed very comfortable in the paint in spite of all those blocks. Every team does and it is clearly something most coaches highlight in film sessions. Probably something like: “They are going to block your shots…get over it. But their positioning is awful and we have to take it to them all game inside.”

Bucknell literally gave Pointer 5-10 feet to shoot and he didn’t. That makes it tough on the inside. I really don’t like when he takes shots when we are making runs late in the game. He does a lot of good stuff off the ball on defense and things just happen when he’s in the game.

I really liked how they finally tried to establish the post. Obekpa had a great post DEEP and slammed it home emphatically. I thought it was Sampson. Sanchez showed good skill and a soft touch inside. We really need him in there more and he needs to get touches. He’s got good enough vision and passing ability to run the offense through inside-out for stretches. Sampson had a few nice moves inside.

I thought for sure we were going to lose in the first half. Nice comeback and nice win with a couple of guys off their game.

I think the staff has the same feeings about Jakarr and Chris which is why they aren't too worried about get kids in 14.

 

[MainMan]

Any theories out there as to why our ultra-athletic players continue to be broken down via the dribble by seemingly slower players?

 

[westchesterjoe]

Still wondering about Marco and Max? There will be some games this year, Syracuse certainly,where a 3 pt threat needs to be in the lineup for some period of time..Even as a decoy.

We clearly need that for the BE schedule too.. I'm thinking Lavin doesn't have a plan for these 2 guys, except maybe from desperation or blow outs.

One way or the other...Nobody who has played so far will strike fear into any opponent with their 3 pt range.. Jordan has a good stroke but, if he's distributing, he'll be looking for the 3 pt shooter, not taking it himself but, rarely.

I think many of us were hoping this season that Steve would build a 3 pt rotation somewhere..Well, it's been invisible ..

 

[MJDinkins]

Any theories out there as to why our ultra-athletic players continue to be broken down via the dribble by seemingly slower players?

They weren't consistently moving their feet or just getting lost altogether in man defense. Defense is also a mindset. Just because one is athletic doesn't necessarily make them a good defender. Not to mention, quite a few of these kids aren't properly taught how to play sound man defense in high school and AAU (AAU is where they tend to pick up poor habits).

We also made runs in the first and second half while playing man. They just didn't play it consistently enough, hence the switch to zone. I also believe the switch to zone was to see how Bucknell would react to it. They seemed befuddled, as they were being funneled to the basket to have their shots swatted or altered.

 

[MJDinkins]

I think many of us were hoping this season that Steve would build a 3 pt rotation somewhere..Well, it's been invisible ..

This season is also only 3 games old.

 

[ccnobz]

Any theories out there as to why our ultra-athletic players continue to be broken down via the dribble by seemingly slower players?

Our weak side help while playing man needs work also. I remember saying " where is the help" a few times in the first half last night.