Yup. Big 12 is trying to market themselves as the best basketball conference. Arguably they already are. They are our primary competitors in this realignment battle. But they are fighting it on multiple fronts and we have one mission.
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- Thread starter paultzman
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Yup. Big 12 is trying to market themselves as the best basketball conference. Arguably they already are. They are our primary competitors in this realignment battle. But they are fighting it on multiple fronts and we have one mission.
Your %'s are correct but you doubled the number of games since there are two teams in every game.
Ah yeah good catch, but as you said the percent stays the same. Going from 10 -> 11 teams (+10%), and from 90 -> 110 BE games (+22%).
room112- 1. Yes adding Gonzaga would increase our payout per school, especially because they'd also open up a late time slot for the BE. The main reason the Pac 12 died is because they were only in one timezone (or maybe two with Colorado?). Not good for TV inventory for instance if Fox wanted to have a 12PM EST game on Saturday but that'd be 9AM PST.
2. I think Gonzaga is too big to pass on, especially because losing UConn would mean losing the 18 game BE schedule and replacing those with mostly mediocre OOC games rather than staying at 20 and everyone playing Gonzaga 2X. ACC would be nice if some of them want to join eventually, but adding Gonzaga wouldn't prevent that. If anything they'd help encourage teams to join.
If I have to wait till 2036 to see the ACC implode I'll be eligible for medicare
If Yormark really wants the NY market and MSG for the basketball tournament, the only way it works for the B12 is to take St. John’s, Villanova and Georgetown for basketball only and UConn for both basketball and Football. That was the rumor ADORAZ put out there a while ago. It wouldn’t be ideal for us but if these football power conferences are intent on controlling everything then in the end it might be our only play in order to stay relevant.
Mike Zaun Returns
Well-known member
This is my prediction & it’s likely IMO the way things are going. Even the UConn board admits they don’t really have the NYC market. We do when relevant. Yormark has made it very clear he wants NYC, remember he pushed the Rucker Park idea for B12 & wants Eastern market. I’d rather a Big East-ACC merger where they create their own new football conf for FBS teams which solves UConn’s issue. But somehow I think B12 takes us with Nova, G’Town hoops only & UConn for all.
That would be step 1. Step 2 would be dropping St. John’s, Villanova, and Georgetown the first chance they had and keeping MSG.
Our best chance at surviving is to retain Uconn and add Gonzaga for now. That gives us a top 4 basketball conference with a reasonable chance to be #1 any given year.
When the ACC inevitably breaks up, we can merge with them and maybe pick up some stranded football schools like Washington State, Oregon State, Cal, or Memphis.
Second rate football and the #1 basketball conference with its own Network across 3 time zones.
Unless if the Big 12 adds basically the entire NE ACC (Syracuse, Pitt, BC, Louisville, Notre Dame) + UConn then I couldn't see St. John's being at risk losing MSG. None of the current Big 12 schools are anywhere close to MSG, and by far the most important thing for attendance in these conference tournaments is proximity. St. John's and Nova are two of the best for that, and unless some schools plan on moving to NY then that won't change. The Big 12 won't get MSG unless they add (and keep) St. John's.
ACC merger wouldn't shock me, but I have a feeling they'll prioritize crappy football programs first. More likely than a full merger is they'd just try to add Nova, St. John's and Georgetown and then play at MSG.
Notre Dame will have to go to the Big 10 eventually. The better football schools like Miami, Pitt, Clemson, UNC, Va Tech, and Louisville will be taken by the Big 12, SEC, or Big 10.
So I really think we’ll just be talking about Duke, Ga Tech, Wake, BC, and maybe Syracuse. I don’t l know how much leverage that group has.
It’d be nice if the Big East was able to build itself into something that would have more leverage than that group of leftovers. Let them keep all the football money. Make a network and add other leftovers.
But that is all down the road. The next step is obvious…add Gonzaga. Try to keep UConn but replace them with Dayton if they do leave. We can’t stick at 11 (or 10 if Uconn leaves). Doing nothing is how the PAC-12 died.
CaliRedfan
Active member
If we’re seriously considering Gonzaga and becoming a coast to coast conf like the B10, then BE agents should already discreetly be reaching out to Wash St, Oregon St, and Memphis.
The former two will soon have an existential choice to make, similar to Yukon in the aac. Be an all sports member of the greatest mid-major conf in history (the new PAC-12 with San Diego st, SMU, & the best of the Mountain West. With maybe St. Mary’s as b-ball only), or maintain their major conference cache by joining the BE and hoping their football can land somewhere in FBS
I agree. We should be talking to networks to see what they’d want and kicking tires of a bunch of schools.
The pac-12 leftovers will be likely be looking to add Memphis, Boise State, Nevada, SDSU, SMU, UConn, and some other football schools. They will probably be going after Gonzaga and some basketball only schools as well.
Gonzaga needs to be added next week.
A basketball conference with UConn, Gonzaga, Memphis, SMU, Stanford, Wichita State, and San Diego State would be better that the Big East.
I know Big East can't rush but can't sit on sidelines either.
Need to cement leadership position as the best BB Conf in country (not East).
Need to cement leadership position as the best BB Conf in country (not East).
The P12 is dead. they can't afford to add the Mountain West conference teams at $30 mill per team. More likely the leftovers will either join the Mountain West for now if they don't get P3 invites or go independent and merge with the ACC after whatever happens in the courts with their rights issues. Those teams are not giving up football so no other options for them at this point. MWC conference is not attractive option but it may be the only option for now. And Cal and Stanford are very likely to go independent due to their pride about academic profile of their conference brethren. Where that leaves their non football teams I'm not sure.
The PAC 12 name is way too valuable to leave behind, plus they still have a seat at the table for the college football playoffs.
The MWC could vote to dissolve with 9 votes out of 12. PAC 12 could take those 9 and try to add Gonzaga, Memphis, UConn, SMU, etc. Maybe vote out the weakest 2-3 teams down the line.
SDSU, Boise State, Air Force, New Mexico, UNLV, Colorado St., Fresno State, Nevada are a solid 8…it gets merky after that.
That conference could own Wednesday night football.
I'm pretty sure the PAC-12 is done.
Unfortunately, I'm beginning to think the days of the Big East being the hunter vs hunted are also done. We should've nabbed Gonzaga and St. Mary's five years ago with UCONN, but we let logistics get in the way. I can't help but think if we're adding schools at this point, it would be Dayton/St. Louis as more of a defensive mechanism than anything else.
Yormark's idea with focusing on basketball is smart. If he gets the elite brands in basketball (Arizona, Kansas), then the Big 12 will be guaranteed a seat at the table for March Madness discussions. That's why I think he covets UCONN, covets us/Georgetown/Villanova/Gonzaga and MSG. The Big 12 won't dump any of us, we would be there for the long term.
That said, maybe the ACC sees potential in the idea as well. If Florida State/Clemson/Miami/ND leave, I can very well see the ACC's pivot being two-fold:
1) Adding four football schools: UCONN, SMU, USF, Tulane
2) Adding four basketball schools: St. John's, Georgetown, Villanova, Xavier (? maybe someone else)
Unless the schools are determined to vote to dissolve the conference (which would be a majority), it is only going to be the most $$$/attractive that would go down such an aggressive route. That would fit the football-centric Florida State/Clemson/Miami crowd. ND's contract with NBC is up next year. NBC just got into a deal with the Big Ten -- I'd be shocked if NBC isn't telling them to begin a new football scheduling agreement with the Big Ten instead...
I can see these additions being attractive. ESPN gets to poke a stick in the eye of Fox Sports by destroying the Big East; the ACC blocks the Big 12 from being the basketball conference/NYC dreams; the conference builds on their academic reputation + new time zones for TV.
Unfortunately, I'm beginning to think the days of the Big East being the hunter vs hunted are also done. We should've nabbed Gonzaga and St. Mary's five years ago with UCONN, but we let logistics get in the way. I can't help but think if we're adding schools at this point, it would be Dayton/St. Louis as more of a defensive mechanism than anything else.
Yormark's idea with focusing on basketball is smart. If he gets the elite brands in basketball (Arizona, Kansas), then the Big 12 will be guaranteed a seat at the table for March Madness discussions. That's why I think he covets UCONN, covets us/Georgetown/Villanova/Gonzaga and MSG. The Big 12 won't dump any of us, we would be there for the long term.
That said, maybe the ACC sees potential in the idea as well. If Florida State/Clemson/Miami/ND leave, I can very well see the ACC's pivot being two-fold:
1) Adding four football schools: UCONN, SMU, USF, Tulane
2) Adding four basketball schools: St. John's, Georgetown, Villanova, Xavier (? maybe someone else)
Unless the schools are determined to vote to dissolve the conference (which would be a majority), it is only going to be the most $$$/attractive that would go down such an aggressive route. That would fit the football-centric Florida State/Clemson/Miami crowd. ND's contract with NBC is up next year. NBC just got into a deal with the Big Ten -- I'd be shocked if NBC isn't telling them to begin a new football scheduling agreement with the Big Ten instead...
I can see these additions being attractive. ESPN gets to poke a stick in the eye of Fox Sports by destroying the Big East; the ACC blocks the Big 12 from being the basketball conference/NYC dreams; the conference builds on their academic reputation + new time zones for TV.
passitback
Well-known member
I can't see a situation where the majority of teams don't leave the ACC. The following teams will end up in the B!G, SEC, or BIG 12:
Miami
FSU
Clemson
ND
UNC
NC State
UVA
VT
Louisville
GT
In the long-run, I agree with the first 8 (maybe even GT if Big Ten wants Atlanta). I think the first tier is going to leave as soon as next year or the year after. Any team with an invite to the SEC/Big Ten is leaving -- whenever its available to them.
But I do think they can avoid a sudden collapse in the short-term, especially since I'm not sure that 2nd tier is valuable enough to the networks (re: SEC + Big Ten media deals) to aggressively pursue before GOR is over.
The key would be placating that third group. If the ACC acts first and takes UCONN + the Big East, I am not convinced Louisville/Pittsburgh/Syracuse/Wake Forest/Boston College would leave to go to the Big 12. I'm sure Duke = Stanford/Cal, and wants no part of the Big 12 no matter what.
If I'm the ACC, I am calling up those Pac-4 teams yesterday + Gonzaga + UCONN + Villanova/St. John's/Georgetown. Get ahead of the Big 12 on basketball expansion. You have Duke, you have UNC (for now), you have UVA (for now). I think this is why BY wants UCONN now, and not later.