Anderson - is he really the guy ?

[paultzman]

For those noting the integration of transfers is challenging, Providence had five playing today. They seem to identify the right ones as clearly does Seton Hall

 

[monte]

For those noting the integration of transfers is challenging, Providence had five playing today. They seem to identify the right ones as clearly does Seton Hall

Yeah, but keep in mind that CMA has this really difficult scientific system that, if/when mastered, will reward us with an NIT bid. Patience! 

 

[Section3]

For those noting the integration of transfers is challenging, Providence had five playing today. They seem to identify the right ones as clearly does Seton Hall

I agree 100% re:SH and Providence did well with Durham but unless ESPN app is wrong, they played 7 of which 5 were returnees. I believe this is their sole advantage at this point. Many have pointed to our turnover as an issue and are probably right.

 

[paultzman]

For those noting the integration of transfers is challenging, Providence had five playing today. They seem to identify the right ones as clearly does Seton Hall

I agree 100% re:SH and Providence did well with Durham but unless ESPN app is wrong, they played 7 of which 5 were returnees. I believe this is their sole advantage at this point. Many have pointed to our turnover as an issue and are probably right.

Durham and Manaya new with three transfer returnees, Horchler, Bynum
amd Crosswell who have all produced

 

[Section3]

For those noting the integration of transfers is challenging, Providence had five playing today. They seem to identify the right ones as clearly does Seton Hall

I agree 100% re:SH and Providence did well with Durham but unless ESPN app is wrong, they played 7 of which 5 were returnees. I believe this is their sole advantage at this point. Many have pointed to our turnover as an issue and are probably right.

Durham and Manaya new with three transfer returnees, Horchler, Bynum
amd Crosswell who have all produced

Yes, 5 returnees plus Minaya and Durham.

 

[Mean Gene]

For those noting the integration of transfers is challenging, Providence had five playing today. They seem to identify the right ones as clearly does Seton Hall

As does Iowa St. , as does Texas, as does Texas A&M , as does Narquette etc.

 

[otis]

Apparently The Honorable Monte was correct.

 

[Mean Gene]

For those noting the integration of transfers is challenging, Providence had five playing today. They seem to identify the right ones as clearly does Seton Hall

Yeah, but keep in mind that CMA has this really difficult scientific system that, if/when mastered, will reward us with an NIT bid. Patience! 

You have to start to think that maybe the game is passing CMA by. With the new transfer rule and one and dones etc. With so much roster turnover every year his system doesn’t work. It did for years when you would recruit kids have a stable roster and keep kids for four years. You would always have at least 8 kids who been in the system and knew it. That’s no longer the case. So, you either have to change the system or modify it in such a way where kids pick it up fairly quickly. If you can’t do that then you will not succeed as a coach. There are plenty of other coaches out there doing this. Then there’s the issue with knowing how to relate to today’s type of kids. Just maybe, if he’s that rigid with his system and the way he runs his program, the game is passing him by.

 

[otis]

…….. if he’s (CMA is) that rigid with his system and the way he runs his program, the game is passing him by.

 

—-
i not sure that CMA has a “system” other than on offense to have his team run up and down the court, to try to beat your man down.

if they do not beat the other team down the court then without any set plays the St. John’s players seemingly  merely pass the ball around the perimeter and as the shot clock winds down either chuck up a shot or drive to the basket and hope.

On defense, CMA’s team more less religiously plays man to man but does occasionally put up token full court defense.  
(question: with the depth the StJ’s team was said to have this season why doesn’t CMA seriously press more often during each game, if for no other reason to wear the other team down?)

The overall talent on the St. John’s roster is far less than other BE teams.  
(second question: has CMA’s nephew Coach Cleveland ever successfully recruited a player to St.John’s?  If not, what are Mr. Cleveland’s duties if he does not recruit ?

regards.

.

 

[PharmDJohnnie11]

At this point I don’t know how the school could keep Anderson next year and say they are actually trying to be relevant. 

It’s getting real ugly real quick. 

 

[room112]

I'm as disappointed as everyone else here, but I have to shake my head at some of these posts. We just lost to a ranked team on the road. Sure it was a winnable game, but our star has a terrible game. 

Regardless, it's starting to look like we have a limited ceiling with CMA. Hope to be proven wrong. 

 

[SJU Double Alumn]

For those noting the integration of transfers is challenging, Providence had five playing today. They seem to identify the right ones as clearly does Seton Hall

Yeah, but keep in mind that CMA has this really difficult scientific system that, if/when mastered, will reward us with an NIT bid. Patience! 

You have to start to think that maybe the game is passing CMA by. With the new transfer rule and one and dones etc. With so much roster turnover every year his system doesn’t work. It did for years when you would recruit kids have a stable roster and keep kids for four years. You would always have at least 8 kids who been in the system and knew it. That’s no longer the case. So, you either have to change the system or modify it in such a way where kids pick it up fairly quickly. If you can’t do that then you will not succeed as a coach. There are plenty of other coaches out there doing this. Then there’s the issue with knowing how to relate to today’s type of kids. Just maybe, if he’s that rigid with his system and the way he runs his program, the game is passing him by.

The system isn’t the problem. The talent level is the problem. When our two best players have lousy games we aren’t going to beat a ranked team on the road. Champ had plenty of open looks and he shot terribly. The transfers aren’t at the top Big East level we hoped they would be. They aren’t bad players but not as good as we needed. 

 

[WillyDilly]

For those noting the integration of transfers is challenging, Providence had five playing today. They seem to identify the right ones as clearly does Seton Hall

Yeah, but keep in mind that CMA has this really difficult scientific system that, if/when mastered, will reward us with an NIT bid. Patience! 

You have to start to think that maybe the game is passing CMA by. With the new transfer rule and one and dones etc. With so much roster turnover every year his system doesn’t work. It did for years when you would recruit kids have a stable roster and keep kids for four years. You would always have at least 8 kids who been in the system and knew it. That’s no longer the case. So, you either have to change the system or modify it in such a way where kids pick it up fairly quickly. If you can’t do that then you will not succeed as a coach. There are plenty of other coaches out there doing this. Then there’s the issue with knowing how to relate to today’s type of kids. Just maybe, if he’s that rigid with his system and the way he runs his program, the game is passing him by.

The system isn’t the problem. The talent level is the problem. When our two best players have lousy games we aren’t going to beat a ranked team on the road. Champ had plenty of open looks and he shot terribly. The transfers aren’t at the top Big East level we hoped they would be. They aren’t bad players but not as good as we needed. 

But this team is pretty much what the fans wanted.  Anderson did exactly what was requested/expected/demanded of him: which is recruit locally and get the local kids to stay home, and have the majority of your team made up of NY kids (because thats what we did in the 80's). And he's succeeded in that request. The problem is that the local talent isn't as good as it used to be. And until the coaching staff and fans realize that, this is going to be the result.

 

[boo haarvey]

For those noting the integration of transfers is challenging, Providence had five playing today. They seem to identify the right ones as clearly does Seton Hall

Yeah, but keep in mind that CMA has this really difficult scientific system that, if/when mastered, will reward us with an NIT bid. Patience! 

You have to start to think that maybe the game is passing CMA by. With the new transfer rule and one and dones etc. With so much roster turnover every year his system doesn’t work. It did for years when you would recruit kids have a stable roster and keep kids for four years. You would always have at least 8 kids who been in the system and knew it. That’s no longer the case. So, you either have to change the system or modify it in such a way where kids pick it up fairly quickly. If you can’t do that then you will not succeed as a coach. There are plenty of other coaches out there doing this. Then there’s the issue with knowing how to relate to today’s type of kids. Just maybe, if he’s that rigid with his system and the way he runs his program, the game is passing him by.

The system isn’t the problem. The talent level is the problem. When our two best players have lousy games we aren’t going to beat a ranked team on the road. Champ had plenty of open looks and he shot terribly. The transfers aren’t at the top Big East level we hoped they would be. They aren’t bad players but not as good as we needed. 

But this team is pretty much what the fans wanted.  Anderson did exactly what was requested/expected/demanded of him: which is recruit locally and get the local kids to stay home, and have the majority of your team made up of NY kids (because thats what we did in the 80's). And he's succeeded in that request. The problem is that the local talent isn't as good as it used to be. And until the coaching staff and fans realize that, this is going to be the result.

I disagree with the suggestion that this is what the fans wanted.  Most fans were disappointed with the mass transfers and most fans have criticized CMA for his failure to recruit at a high level.  Unless things really go south, I would give CMA this year and next year to make the tournament and fire him if he doesn’t.  Candidly, I don’t see any hope for next year’s team and I hope Posh is not inclined to transfer out if we struggle in conference play this year like I expect we will. In the transfer market, anything is possible so we’ll see what happens.

 

 

[monte]

I'm as disappointed as everyone else here, but I have to shake my head at some of these posts. We just lost to a ranked team on the road. Sure it was a winnable game, but our star has a terrible game. 

Regardless, it's starting to look like we have a limited ceiling with CMA. Hope to be proven wrong. 

Completely agree on the ceiling 112, but then again I've always felt that we were going to have a limited/low ceiling under CMA. IE NIT most years, dance every 3-4 years. I'm just concerned now that his ceiling is even lower then I had expected. 

 

[redmannorth]

For those noting the integration of transfers is challenging, Providence had five playing today. They seem to identify the right ones as clearly does Seton Hall

Yeah, but keep in mind that CMA has this really difficult scientific system that, if/when mastered, will reward us with an NIT bid. Patience! 

You have to start to think that maybe the game is passing CMA by. With the new transfer rule and one and dones etc. With so much roster turnover every year his system doesn’t work. It did for years when you would recruit kids have a stable roster and keep kids for four years. You would always have at least 8 kids who been in the system and knew it. That’s no longer the case. So, you either have to change the system or modify it in such a way where kids pick it up fairly quickly. If you can’t do that then you will not succeed as a coach. There are plenty of other coaches out there doing this. Then there’s the issue with knowing how to relate to today’s type of kids. Just maybe, if he’s that rigid with his system and the way he runs his program, the game is passing him by.

The system isn’t the problem. The talent level is the problem. When our two best players have lousy games we aren’t going to beat a ranked team on the road. Champ had plenty of open looks and he shot terribly. The transfers aren’t at the top Big East level we hoped they would be. They aren’t bad players but not as good as we needed. 

But this team is pretty much what the fans wanted.  Anderson did exactly what was requested/expected/demanded of him: which is recruit locally and get the local kids to stay home, and have the majority of your team made up of NY kids (because thats what we did in the 80's). And he's succeeded in that request. The problem is that the local talent isn't as good as it used to be. And until the coaching staff and fans realize that, this is going to be the result.

The fans want one thing and one thing only from CMA and that is to win and dance, no more no less. To the extent that players are local that is a bonus, but a secondary bonus. To the extent we can play an up tempo brand of  Bball while exerting a ton of defensive pressure that too is great, but again it is secondary. 
It has been said on this board repeatedly no one cares where the players come from, just win. 
there is no one on this board who will say CMA should take a 3* local player over a 4* out of state or country player, no one. 

 

[Knight]

Much of the problem is the inflexibility of CMA’s coaching.  He keeps trying to push his schemes when he doesn’t have the players to execute his plans.  He needs to adjust his game plan to fit his personnel.  Sometimes it looks like he doesn’t call a needed timeout because he doesn’t want the opponents to regain their wind.

 

[Ray Morgan]

This thread, like every other "we need a new coach" thread, reminds me of the movie "National Treasure". Nicholas Cage spent a lifetime  following clues looking for the treasure of all treasures, only to find another clue. Instead of clues, we search for another coach. Then another, and another. Instead of accepting reality that the game hasn't passed the coach by, but passed the university by. Hollywood has happy endings. This basketball program doesn't.

The next coach may have a more offensive sets  and more creative defenses to play than CMA. But he will have the same barriers to recruiting top 100 recruits that CMA has. I am of the belief that St. John's plays by a set of rules that most programs find laughable. Where is my evidence?  A roster of 3 star recruits, year after year. One top 100 recruit (97th on the list of top 100) in 4 CMA recruiting cycles. And  he works hard at it. Does anyone believe there is an attainable coach out there that can recruit better, having the same facilities and same antiquated approach to recruiting that exists now?  Does anyone think that any coach alive can consistently win in a major conference with 3 star recruits playing against 4 and the occasional 5 star recruits? Especially with liberal transfer rules?  If so, please offer some examples. Then maybe I would have some confidence that all of our problems can be solved with a coaching change, just like we have all believed for the past 20 years.

 

[Section3]

For those noting the integration of transfers is challenging, Providence had five playing today. They seem to identify the right ones as clearly does Seton Hall

Yeah, but keep in mind that CMA has this really difficult scientific system that, if/when mastered, will reward us with an NIT bid. Patience! 

You have to start to think that maybe the game is passing CMA by. With the new transfer rule and one and dones etc. With so much roster turnover every year his system doesn’t work. It did for years when you would recruit kids have a stable roster and keep kids for four years. You would always have at least 8 kids who been in the system and knew it. That’s no longer the case. So, you either have to change the system or modify it in such a way where kids pick it up fairly quickly. If you can’t do that then you will not succeed as a coach. There are plenty of other coaches out there doing this. Then there’s the issue with knowing how to relate to today’s type of kids. Just maybe, if he’s that rigid with his system and the way he runs his program, the game is passing him by.

The system isn’t the problem. The talent level is the problem. When our two best players have lousy games we aren’t going to beat a ranked team on the road. Champ had plenty of open looks and he shot terribly. The transfers aren’t at the top Big East level we hoped they would be. They aren’t bad players but not as good as we needed. 

But this team is pretty much what the fans wanted.  Anderson did exactly what was requested/expected/demanded of him: which is recruit locally and get the local kids to stay home, and have the majority of your team made up of NY kids (because thats what we did in the 80's). And he's succeeded in that request. The problem is that the local talent isn't as good as it used to be. And until the coaching staff and fans realize that, this is going to be the result.

I am not a believer in recruiting NYC exclusively since many of the top NYC players prep elsewhere. Also, many NYC kids naturally want to get away from home. Conversely, kids from outside the area also want to get away and there is still a cache to NYC - as Lavin proved. Important to note that it does seem like many of our recent offers are to kids attending schools in the south. Guess we’ll see what happens.

Bottom line, it is important to have balanced recruiting - and to adjust to the new rules which have created more volatile roster management.

All that said, CMA’s recruiting NYC has been an advantage, not a disadvantage. Those are our best players most or all of whom are BE talent, tough and confident - Champ, Posh, Wusu, Pinzon. Give me more of those types - regardless of locale.

 

[PharmDJohnnie11]

If we do get rid of CMA whether it be this year or next I think that unless the school shells out a ton of money to the next coach then we are going to be looking at hiring an up and comer or at least someone pretty unproven. 

Cragg and Father Shanley talk a big game about the goal being “winning national titles”. So I’m pretty curious to see how much they’d be willing to spend to get us a coach who at least has a shot to deliver on their goal.