All Realignment Talk Here

why doesn't the lousy NCAA control their members ? it's disgusting right in the middle of college football and the start of basketball we have to read about all the realignment crap. Have we forgotten theres games to be played, do we have to be distracted like this ?
If St. John's gets cast aside I'm never watching college sports ever again and for the rest of my life I'll hate football with all my heart.
 
I haven't read all of the prior posts, so I may be essentially repeating someone. I'd love to join the ACC, but I don't think that is likely. I think the next best option is to have the remaining 7 BE schools with no D1 football join with 7 of the A-10 schools to form what seems like a pretty decent basketball league.

St. John’s
Georgetown
Villanova
Marquette
Seton Hall
Providence
Depaul
Xavier
VCU
UMass
Butler
Dayton
St. Joseph’s
Richmond
Click to expand...
Why not stop with the top eight you list. You got the markets covered, and your not chopping up the tv money. You want a 9th team to get to 16 league games take a hard look for the one that brings the most.
 
I sincerely doubt that the ACC will take any school that does not have a FBS football program.
Click to expand...

They took Notre Dame without a football commitment other than 5 games per year and no share of ND's football profits.
Click to expand...

'72.... please sit down because I have some bad news for you...... St.John's is not Notre Dame; St.John's lacks the star and media appeal which Notre Dame has.
Click to expand...

ND's move to the ACC is baffling. The ACC is still in a state of flux, even with the $50 million exit fee. If they lose Florida State and Clemson to the best football conference in America, the SEC, ND will be left in a very weak football conference....are you sitting James? Yes, even weaker than the Big East! Especially in the money media markets.
ND, has BILLIONS to buy out of the ACC at any time but moving to the ACC is a head-scratcher because the ACC will NOT be one of the 4 football super-conferences that control BCS.

That said, ND's media appeal will do zero for ACC football since they will not be ACC football members and can move their football to the BIG at any time and ND screwed all the NY area alums by abandoning the Big East.

F*ck the Irish!
Click to expand...

Actually they can't move to the BIG at anytime. It was a shrewd move by the ACC.
By signing Notre Dame to play 5 ACC teams every year they essentially guaranteed that ND won't join any of the rival conferences. Not enough room on the schedule.

Couple that with the 5 games, which will bolster ACC football appeal, and it makes sense to me.
Plus, you have a large chunk of the ND alumni base which lives on the eastern seaboard. (Including Florida, don't kid yourself - plenty of ND snowbirds). ND has been playing "neutral" site games in NY and DC for years... they wouldn't have done that if they didn't have fans in those cities. ACC move makes a lot of sense.
Click to expand...

"They can't move to the Big anytime"???? They are not even out of the Big East until 2014 at the earliest! LOL!!!
Shall I play you a replay of the TCU news conference when they decided to leave the Big East before even playing one game?
SEC and Florida State may be next. Maryland will challenge the exit clause. ACC sues Maryland. SOUND FAMILIAR?? It should! The ACC will reap what it has sowed. A Syracuse Orange friend is livid at what is now going on in the ACC. They hoped for years for an invitation to the Big and Rutgers, a school soon to be a bottom dweller in the Big, get the bid! LMAO!
I think that the whores that were once in the Big East will eventually get "screwed" by just becoming a regurgitated BIG ACC EAST.......without the Big East Tourney, without MSG, and with mediocre football. SOUND FAMILIAR again????

They can't move to the Big anytime? ND is in Indiana and a fart away from Chicago!! They may never get to the ACC!
 
We really need to disband the BE...with all the garbage coming in (Tulane/SMU/UCF/ECU) we become a joke in basketball. IMO if we got the basketball schools all together to start our own conference and name it the Big East (current big east would have to be renamed), we could remain a major conference. Xavier, SJ, SH, Prov, G'Town, Nova, Temple, Memphis, Butler, VCU, etc. is a very strong conference and I think most of us would be very satisfied with that. At the very least we get 4 bids per year and some years as many as 5 might be ranked. Really not that drastically different than the old Big East in terms of NCAA bids and ranked teams. What we lose are the top 10 types of teams, but we can still have the 17-25's in that conference. Why is this not being done? I know we have no leverage in this, but if I were SJ I would go to the ACC, say "Look, I know you are busy with all these football schools, but are you willing to take us or not?" if they say no then we go and start that basketball conference and if they say yes hopefully we get an invite. It's time to do something instead of just sitting there thrown around by currents like seaweed. If we make this hypothetical conference for basketball, I know it sounds nuts, but it might end up being almost as successful as the old Big East.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't exactly call Tulane and SMU garbage . Tulane was 12-0 one year in the late 1990's and went to a bowl. But I hate football teams . I wouldn't mind Memphis or Temple for a while till we get back on our feet. Xaviier and Butler are a must and we'd have a fine league.
The ACC just got Loiusiville and their already upset with Louisvilles academics . I visited Clemsons football forum and Louisville fans were coming on thanking Clemson and Florida for helping them get into the ACC and in the same discussion the Clemson fans were ripping Louisvilles academics, so you know what we'd face if St. John's joined the ACC.
I just hope the ACC blows up and they all go scrambling around for a spot. Wouldn't it be funny if the ACC lost 6 teams just like that and it was Duke, Louisville, Wake Forest, Boston College, Syracuse and Pitt all by themselves ?

The ACC won't be a major football conference, that should make us all happy.
Click to expand...

The whole ACC academics thing is overrated. You really think there is a major difference in student quality between say Clemson and SJ? Is there really that big a difference in quality of students between Virginia Tech and Fairfield? The answer is no. It's just an elitist kind of thing they want to revel in over at the ACC. Academic rankings are to be taken with a grain of salt unless you are hardcore about doing research because that's what most of those schools are for. Put a UMiami student, a Marist student, a Georgia Tech student, a SJ student, a Virginia Tech student, and a Fairfield student, and you won't be able to tell the difference.
Click to expand...

This is highly questionable
Click to expand...

How so? The truth is that there is not a significant difference in students who attend those schools in terms of IQ or GPA. If it was comparing Ivy to the A10 maybe I could see. For many of the schools listed such as UMiami and Georgia Tech, it's much easier to get in those schools if you live in state. It's really only crazy competitive outside their states. So tell me, how would you be able to tell from all those students from different colleges all together in 1 room? Name brand schools don't necessarily mean they are smarter or more competitive. It's like buying CVS brand bandaids vs. Johnson&Johnson bandaids...is there really a big difference? No. Would you be able to tell the difference if both were out of packaging? No. It's all stupid elitist garbage. The ACC schools are obviously very good don't get me wrong, but there are tons of schools who have academically strong students who don't choose name brand schools. You do also realize that many schools pay these ranking companies and bribe them to climb rankings right?
Click to expand...

Just out of curiosity, what schools are "bribing" U.S.News ???
Click to expand...

If you are referring to the US News and World report regarding college rankings., the president of Stanford University wrote a letter to the editor criticizing their report as highly tainted.
Click to expand...

Fair enough. His 1996 letter took exception to the methodology, which is a legitimate point of view.

There was no mention of bribery as Joe3 explicitly stated in his original post as far as I can tell.

http://www.stanford.edu/dept/pres-provost/president/speeches/961206gcfallow.html
Click to expand...

My entire point was that rankings are elitist and involves connections between administrations and the people who make the rankings. Geneseo, Stony Brook, Marist, Williams College, Vassar, Binghamton, etc. are all very good academic schools full of students just as smart as students at most ACC schools (save for Duke, UNC, etc.). Just because a school is not in the ACC or not well-known doesn't mean its academics aren't top notch. As for SJ, even at 154 or whatever we are ranked, that's out of how many thousands of schools nationally? IMO to even be in those books of the top 350 colleges is an accomplishment in itself. No one will mistake SJ for Harvard, but it's a solid school.
Click to expand...

Think you are grossly UNDER rating Williams which is the #1 ranked liberal arts school in the country..

In NO WAY should it be mentionedin the same sentence as Stony Brook, Marist, or Geneseo.

The AVERAGE SAT scores for the entering class is 1410 (math and reading) and an acceptance rate of 17%.

Williams IS on a par with Duke.

For those with half a brain, Williams is a very well known school (nation wide), as I hope you would agree.
Click to expand...

Absolutely correct in regards to how crazy hard it is to get in there. I was by no means saying that Williams is in the same conversation as Marist/SB/Geneseo/etc. my point was that Williams is not nearly as well known as Georgia Tech, FSU, Clemson, Miami, Cuse, Pitt, etc. I totally disagree that it's well known nationally to anyone with half a brain. The first time I heard of it in my life was a few years ago and I am very involved in the whole college process as well as what schools are out there at this stage in my life. I saw they were ranked above Harvard and I literally asked a friend next to me "Who the hell is Williams College?" he didn't know either. I bet if you asked 100 random people in the street, 80 or more would not know. My point is that the ACC is packed full of name brand schools. Just because they are name brand and popular does not mean they have smarter students or tougher acceptance rates.
 
... my point was that Williams is not nearly as well known as Georgia Tech, FSU, Clemson, Miami, Cuse, Pitt, etc. I totally disagree that it's well known nationally to anyone with half a brain. The first time I heard of it in my life was a few years ago and I am very involved in the whole college process as well as what schools are out there at this stage in my life. I saw they were ranked above Harvard and I literally asked a friend next to me "Who the hell is Williams College?" he didn't know either. I bet if you asked 100 random people in the street, 80 or more would not know. ...
Click to expand...

Be assured that hundreds of thousands -- if not millions -- of people who are older, wiser, more experienced, better educated, and better informed than you are familiar with Williams College. And tens of thousands -- if not more -- of Yankee fans know Williams College as George Steinbrenner's alma mater. The fact that you and your friend never heard of this prestigious school says more about you and your friend than it does about Williams College. As for 80 out of 100 random people never having heard of it: depending on where you are and who you're asking (non-sports fans, for example), 80 out of a 100 probably have never heard of Clemson either.
 
... my point was that Williams is not nearly as well known as Georgia Tech, FSU, Clemson, Miami, Cuse, Pitt, etc. I totally disagree that it's well known nationally to anyone with half a brain. The first time I heard of it in my life was a few years ago and I am very involved in the whole college process as well as what schools are out there at this stage in my life. I saw they were ranked above Harvard and I literally asked a friend next to me "Who the hell is Williams College?" he didn't know either. I bet if you asked 100 random people in the street, 80 or more would not know. ...
Click to expand...

Be assured that hundreds of thousands -- if not millions -- of people who are older, wiser, more experienced, better educated, and better informed than you are familiar with Williams College. And tens of thousands -- if not more -- of Yankee fans know Williams College as George Steinbrenner's alma mater. The fact that you and your friend never heard of this prestigious school says more about you and your friend than it does about Williams College. As for 80 out of 100 random people never having heard of it: depending on where you are and who you're asking (non-sports fans, for example), 80 out of a 100 probably have never heard of Clemson either.
Click to expand...

I would bet my car right now that the overwhelming majority of Americans do not know of Williams. Not that any of you would want a Honda Civic anyway ;)
 
I've been up there. Beautiful campus in a very small town. The mose exciting thing seemed to be the ice cream shop on the street with a strip of shops just off campus.
 
... my point was that Williams is not nearly as well known as Georgia Tech, FSU, Clemson, Miami, Cuse, Pitt, etc. I totally disagree that it's well known nationally to anyone with half a brain. The first time I heard of it in my life was a few years ago and I am very involved in the whole college process as well as what schools are out there at this stage in my life. I saw they were ranked above Harvard and I literally asked a friend next to me "Who the hell is Williams College?" he didn't know either. I bet if you asked 100 random people in the street, 80 or more would not know. ...
Click to expand...

Be assured that hundreds of thousands -- if not millions -- of people who are older, wiser, more experienced, better educated, and better informed than you are familiar with Williams College. And tens of thousands -- if not more -- of Yankee fans know Williams College as George Steinbrenner's alma mater. The fact that you and your friend never heard of this prestigious school says more about you and your friend than it does about Williams College. As for 80 out of 100 random people never having heard of it: depending on where you are and who you're asking (non-sports fans, for example), 80 out of a 100 probably have never heard of Clemson either.
Click to expand...

I would bet my car right now that the overwhelming majority of Americans do not know of Williams. Not that any of you would want a Honda Civic anyway ;)
Click to expand...

I didn't say 80% of Americans know about Williams College -- hell, 80% of Americans can't name all 50 states. I said I have no doubt that millions of knowledgeable people have heard of it. If five million Americans have heard of it, that's still less than 2% of the population, but a sizable number nevertheless. Getting back to my point (which perhaps wasn't clear): it's WHO you ask,not how many you ask.

P.S, Joe, do you ever turn off your computer? You're young, it's Saturday night, get out!
 
... my point was that Williams is not nearly as well known as Georgia Tech, FSU, Clemson, Miami, Cuse, Pitt, etc. I totally disagree that it's well known nationally to anyone with half a brain. The first time I heard of it in my life was a few years ago and I am very involved in the whole college process as well as what schools are out there at this stage in my life. I saw they were ranked above Harvard and I literally asked a friend next to me "Who the hell is Williams College?" he didn't know either. I bet if you asked 100 random people in the street, 80 or more would not know. ...
Click to expand...

Be assured that hundreds of thousands -- if not millions -- of people who are older, wiser, more experienced, better educated, and better informed than you are familiar with Williams College. And tens of thousands -- if not more -- of Yankee fans know Williams College as George Steinbrenner's alma mater. The fact that you and your friend never heard of this prestigious school says more about you and your friend than it does about Williams College. As for 80 out of 100 random people never having heard of it: depending on where you are and who you're asking (non-sports fans, for example), 80 out of a 100 probably have never heard of Clemson either.
Click to expand...

I would bet my car right now that the overwhelming majority of Americans do not know of Williams. Not that any of you would want a Honda Civic anyway ;)
Click to expand...

I didn't say 80% of Americans know about Williams College -- hell, 80% of Americans can't name all 50 states. I said I have no doubt that millions of knowledgeable people have heard of it. If five million Americans have heard of it, that's still less than 2% of the population, but a sizable number nevertheless. Getting back to my point (which perhaps wasn't clear): it's WHO you ask,not how many you ask.

P.S, Joe, do you ever turn off your computer? You're young, it's Saturday night, get out!
Click to expand...

DAMN you guys can stray from a topic like alley cats in heat!
When realignment decisions are made to bolster a schools' academics, I expect Pomona College in the PAC 12, Davidson in the ACC and St. John's in the SEC. Alas, it is about greedy college presidents and AD's chasing TV deals that will (1) improve the moving schools' academics via osmosis and (2) destroy their football competitiveness (see Boston College.....and soon....Rutgers, Maryland and a host of others.
 
I just hope the Big East survives this football insanity . I wish it was 1985 again when we were #1 in the country.
Man, it was great being on campus then seeing Chris Mullen in your class , Walter Berry walking into Marillac hall or seeing Bill Wennington eating lunch in the old SJU cafeteria.. I remember President Reagan came to St. John's in the Spring of 1986 and gave a rousing speech in Alumni Hall. He mentioned the MulBerry tree growing on campus refering to Mullin/Berry. You can read a transcript of Reagans speech at SJU online.
 
For those who care: There is a Board of Trustees meeting in a couple of weeks.

If you are so inclined, and have the time, you may want to consider writing to them about your thoughts and what course of action you think the university should take as it pertains to the "Big East"
 
Ga Tech approved by Big Ten: http://www.landgrantholyland.com/20...tech-approved-by-big-ten-conference-expansion

If G-Tech heads to Big Ten that could open the door for ACC disbanding and the BE basketball schools joining forces with the remaining
ex-ACC schoools.
Click to expand...

means yukon to ACC
Click to expand...

I'm not sure if the ACC will be there, Tom. FSU, Clemson, Va Tech, and Miami are heading out of town. Virginia is probably heading up to the Big Ten. If the ACC wants to survive they need to add Uconn, Georgetown, St. John's, and Villanova--probably Temple as well.
 
I just hope the Big East survives this football insanity . I wish it was 1985 again when we were #1 in the country.
Man, it was great being on campus then seeing Chris Mullen in your class , Walter Berry walking into Marillac hall or seeing Bill Wennington eating lunch in the old SJU cafeteria.. I remember President Reagan came to St. John's in the Spring of 1986 and gave a rousing speech in Alumni Hall. He mentioned the MulBerry tree growing on campus refering to Mullin/Berry. You can read a transcript of Reagans speech at SJU online.
Click to expand...
Oh yeah, it was a wonderful time! For the younger posters...there was an energy on campus that was incredible. I was a January 1985 grad....St. John's had just defeated Georgetown the previous Saturday, and my graduation ceremony was interupted with the announcement..."St. John's is now #1 in the AP poll". I can still hear the roar in Alumni Hall at that moment...
Another thing....even though the players were all well known, they really acted like regular guys on campus. I had classes with several, (Wennington used to bum rides off of me down to Hilside Ave to catch his bus home to Long Island!), and it was nothing for them to just chat, in a classroom, in the Marillac cafeteria or in the gym.
I hope that this has not changed with the current players.
 
The current players are a fantastic group of young men. They are warm and very friendly and seem to embrace Coach Lavin's personality.
 
Ga Tech approved by Big Ten: http://www.landgrantholyland.com/20...tech-approved-by-big-ten-conference-expansion

If G-Tech heads to Big Ten that could open the door for ACC disbanding and the BE basketball schools joining forces with the remaining
ex-ACC schoools.
Click to expand...

means yukon to ACC
Click to expand...

I'm not sure if the ACC will be there, Tom. FSU, Clemson, Va Tech, and Miami are heading out of town. Virginia is probably heading up to the Big Ten. If the ACC wants to survive they need to add Uconn, Georgetown, St. John's, and Villanova--probably Temple as well.
Click to expand...

As usual marillac, we agree for the most part.
The ACC will end up being Wake, bc, pitt, syracuse, yukon, louisville.
BE will be STJ, PC, DePaul, G'Town, Marquette, nova, seton hall.
USF, Memphis, Temple, cincy will be up for the taking.
Would be an interesting merger.
 
I just hope the Big East survives this football insanity . I wish it was 1985 again when we were #1 in the country.
Man, it was great being on campus then seeing Chris Mullen in your class , Walter Berry walking into Marillac hall or seeing Bill Wennington eating lunch in the old SJU cafeteria.. I remember President Reagan came to St. John's in the Spring of 1986 and gave a rousing speech in Alumni Hall. He mentioned the MulBerry tree growing on campus refering to Mullin/Berry. You can read a transcript of Reagans speech at SJU online.
Click to expand...
Oh yeah, it was a wonderful time! For the younger posters...there was an energy on campus that was incredible. I was a January 1985 grad....St. John's had just defeated Georgetown the previous Saturday, and my graduation ceremony was interupted with the announcement..."St. John's is now #1 in the AP poll". I can still hear the roar in Alumni Hall at that moment...
Another thing....even though the players were all well known, they really acted like regular guys on campus. I had classes with several, (Wennington used to bum rides off of me down to Hilside Ave to catch his bus home to Long Island!), and it was nothing for them to just chat, in a classroom, in the Marillac cafeteria or in the gym.
I hope that this has not changed with the current players.
Click to expand...

Those days sound awesome...cherish them forever! Unfortunately that is not true today. The more materialistic and status hungry people have become, the more separation there is between major athletes and fans. Even at Marist I had classes with some basketball players and they wouldn't talk the entire time. They would either skip class or sit through it falling asleep. They only hung out with other basketball players at bars and clubs unless of course they were looking for women. I have seen Hooper, Sanchez, Sampson, etc. on the Queens campus in their practice gear at Starbucks in D'Angelo. I didn't approach them because they looked like they were in a rush and didn't want to bother them. Out of all the players who would likely be down to earth with other students I'd probably say Sampson. He is a free spirit kind of kid.
 
We really need to disband the BE...with all the garbage coming in (Tulane/SMU/UCF/ECU) we become a joke in basketball. IMO if we got the basketball schools all together to start our own conference and name it the Big East (current big east would have to be renamed), we could remain a major conference. Xavier, SJ, SH, Prov, G'Town, Nova, Temple, Memphis, Butler, VCU, etc. is a very strong conference and I think most of us would be very satisfied with that. At the very least we get 4 bids per year and some years as many as 5 might be ranked. Really not that drastically different than the old Big East in terms of NCAA bids and ranked teams. What we lose are the top 10 types of teams, but we can still have the 17-25's in that conference. Why is this not being done? I know we have no leverage in this, but if I were SJ I would go to the ACC, say "Look, I know you are busy with all these football schools, but are you willing to take us or not?" if they say no then we go and start that basketball conference and if they say yes hopefully we get an invite. It's time to do something instead of just sitting there thrown around by currents like seaweed. If we make this hypothetical conference for basketball, I know it sounds nuts, but it might end up being almost as successful as the old Big East.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't exactly call Tulane and SMU garbage . Tulane was 12-0 one year in the late 1990's and went to a bowl. But I hate football teams . I wouldn't mind Memphis or Temple for a while till we get back on our feet. Xaviier and Butler are a must and we'd have a fine league.
The ACC just got Loiusiville and their already upset with Louisvilles academics . I visited Clemsons football forum and Louisville fans were coming on thanking Clemson and Florida for helping them get into the ACC and in the same discussion the Clemson fans were ripping Louisvilles academics, so you know what we'd face if St. John's joined the ACC.
I just hope the ACC blows up and they all go scrambling around for a spot. Wouldn't it be funny if the ACC lost 6 teams just like that and it was Duke, Louisville, Wake Forest, Boston College, Syracuse and Pitt all by themselves ?

The ACC won't be a major football conference, that should make us all happy.
Click to expand...

The whole ACC academics thing is overrated. You really think there is a major difference in student quality between say Clemson and SJ? Is there really that big a difference in quality of students between Virginia Tech and Fairfield? The answer is no. It's just an elitist kind of thing they want to revel in over at the ACC. Academic rankings are to be taken with a grain of salt unless you are hardcore about doing research because that's what most of those schools are for. Put a UMiami student, a Marist student, a Georgia Tech student, a SJ student, a Virginia Tech student, and a Fairfield student, and you won't be able to tell the difference.
Click to expand...

SJU grads on average make more money then many ACC grads do . SJU grads make more money then Fordham Grads do and their listed around #30 in the College rankings
SJU is ranked 147 and that's pretty good considering how many universities America has. Louisville was ranked 167 . Foreign students hurt SJU more then they hurt ACC schools.
Click to expand...

Correct. SJ has a major foreign population that definitely brings rankings down. Many students are the first in their family to attend college and affirmative action brings in students who wouldn't otherwise be accepted. Other schools are more homogeneous and have more standard requirements across the board. These are just suggestions by the way, I can't say I have any data to back it up but it seems to make sense. When you have such a diverse school, the requirements are lowered to appeal to a much larger demographic. When it comes down to it though, if you take the median Clemson student and the median Fairfield/Marist/Seton Hall/SJ student, you will not see any difference.
Click to expand...


www.forbes.com/2010/08/27/college-gradua...0-rich_slide_16.html

Surprisingly, this was in Forbes a couple of years ago. Say what you want but if St. John's started "trimming the fat" and got a bit more selective,rather than allowing some of these students to simply enroll then leave after a year, then this school could shoot up any set of rankings.

oops…sorry missed the quote
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top