Good article from Jeff Borzello
[URL]https://www.espn.com/mens-coll...me-serious-options-elite-basketball-prospects[/URL]
[URL]https://www.espn.com/mens-coll...me-serious-options-elite-basketball-prospects[/URL]
Why HBCUs could again become serious options for elite basketball prospects
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Would be great to see a 4/5 star make that commitment. I don't remember Dick Barnett or Sam Jones as college players but certainly remember Earl the Pearl at Winston Salem and Willis at Grambling. I do have great memories of all 4 as super NBA players through.
JohnnyFever
Active member
I was thinking...the way things are going would any of us really be surprised if some started demanding that the Big East, B1G, ACC, etc. start taking some HBCU's in their leagues to raise their platforms? May have sounded crazy a year ago but not now.
Class of 72
Active member
[quote="NCJohnnie" post=390984]Would be great to see a 4/5 star make that commitment. I don't remember Dick Barnett or Sam Jones as college players but certainly remember Earl the Pearl at Winston Salem and Willis at Grambling. I do have great memories of all 4 as super NBA players through.[/quote]
HBCU's were NEVER a serious option for elite prospects after southern State universities opened up their rosters to black players. Racism in southern schools was the only reason why elite athletes stayed close to home at black colleges. Now, people are suggesting that players apply separatist and segregationist thinking in deciding where to play their sport.
"It shouldn't be a crime that I want to go support my own." This is a quote from one of the athletes.
If he is going to receive the same or better training and academic benefit then fine. If he is making his decision in 2020 to be with own then that thinking reeks of racism based upon the separation of the races.
This line of thinking points to the phenomenon that people prefer to be with those that share their values, culture and religion. If you are NOT BLACK it would lend itself to racial reasoning and the reason why there are Chinatowns, Little Italy's, Jewish Crown Heights, Spanish Harlem, and so forth.
HBCU's were NEVER a serious option for elite prospects after southern State universities opened up their rosters to black players. Racism in southern schools was the only reason why elite athletes stayed close to home at black colleges. Now, people are suggesting that players apply separatist and segregationist thinking in deciding where to play their sport.
"It shouldn't be a crime that I want to go support my own." This is a quote from one of the athletes.
If he is going to receive the same or better training and academic benefit then fine. If he is making his decision in 2020 to be with own then that thinking reeks of racism based upon the separation of the races.
This line of thinking points to the phenomenon that people prefer to be with those that share their values, culture and religion. If you are NOT BLACK it would lend itself to racial reasoning and the reason why there are Chinatowns, Little Italy's, Jewish Crown Heights, Spanish Harlem, and so forth.
L J S A
Well-known member
[quote="Class of 72" post=391004]
"It shouldn't be a crime that I want to go support my own." This is a quote from one of the athletes.
If he is going to receive the same or better training and academic benefit then fine. If he is making his decision in 2020 to be with own then that thinking reeks of racism based upon the separation of the races.[/quote]
You are calling a black kid racist if he decides to be with his own?
"It shouldn't be a crime that I want to go support my own." This is a quote from one of the athletes.
If he is going to receive the same or better training and academic benefit then fine. If he is making his decision in 2020 to be with own then that thinking reeks of racism based upon the separation of the races.[/quote]
You are calling a black kid racist if he decides to be with his own?
Class of 72
Active member
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=391003]I was thinking...the way things are going would any of us really be surprised if some started demanding that the Big East, B1G, ACC, etc. start taking some HBCU's in their leagues to raise their platforms? May have sounded crazy a year ago but not now.[/quote]
Um, yeah, I would be surprised.
While you are at it, let's throw in the Ivy league. What "platforms" are you referring to? Academic standards?
I'm not sure what racial point you are trying to get extra credit for but it seems to me that a sport played in colleges overwhelmingly by one race needs a different type of integration if skill level, academic reputation, research and broad educational perspectives are not going to play a role in why certain college conferences align versus your flavor of the month speculation.
It sounds just as crazy now and your racial pandering gets you no extra points.
Um, yeah, I would be surprised.
While you are at it, let's throw in the Ivy league. What "platforms" are you referring to? Academic standards?
I'm not sure what racial point you are trying to get extra credit for but it seems to me that a sport played in colleges overwhelmingly by one race needs a different type of integration if skill level, academic reputation, research and broad educational perspectives are not going to play a role in why certain college conferences align versus your flavor of the month speculation.
It sounds just as crazy now and your racial pandering gets you no extra points.
Class of 72
Active member
[quote="L J S A" post=391006][quote="Class of 72" post=391004]
"It shouldn't be a crime that I want to go support my own." This is a quote from one of the athletes.
If he is going to receive the same or better training and academic benefit then fine. If he is making his decision in 2020 to be with own then that thinking reeks of racism based upon the separation of the races.[/quote]
You are calling a black kid racist if he decides to be with his own?[/quote]
I don't give a crap if he is black, brown, yellow or a rainbow but would you sound shockingly outraged if a white kid says "I would rather play only with other white kids, in school that has no blacks and only for a white coach"?
What pandering whites say these days to sound politically correct borders on the ridiculous.
You sound like you are living in Lexington, Kentucky in 1955.
"It shouldn't be a crime that I want to go support my own." This is a quote from one of the athletes.
If he is going to receive the same or better training and academic benefit then fine. If he is making his decision in 2020 to be with own then that thinking reeks of racism based upon the separation of the races.[/quote]
You are calling a black kid racist if he decides to be with his own?[/quote]
I don't give a crap if he is black, brown, yellow or a rainbow but would you sound shockingly outraged if a white kid says "I would rather play only with other white kids, in school that has no blacks and only for a white coach"?
What pandering whites say these days to sound politically correct borders on the ridiculous.
You sound like you are living in Lexington, Kentucky in 1955.
L J S A
Well-known member
[quote="Class of 72" post=391010][quote="L J S A" post=391006][quote="Class of 72" post=391004]
"It shouldn't be a crime that I want to go support my own." This is a quote from one of the athletes.
If he is going to receive the same or better training and academic benefit then fine. If he is making his decision in 2020 to be with own then that thinking reeks of racism based upon the separation of the races.[/quote]
You are calling a black kid racist if he decides to be with his own?[/quote]
I don't give a crap if he is black, brown, yellow or a rainbow but would you sound shockingly outraged if a white kid says "I would rather play only with other white kids, in school that has no blacks and only for a white coach"?
What pandering whites say these days to sound politically correct borders on the ridiculous.
You sound like you are living in Lexington, Kentucky in 1955.[/quote]
Point to where any of these kids have said "I would rather play only with other black kids, in school that has no whites and only for a black coach"
"It shouldn't be a crime that I want to go support my own." This is a quote from one of the athletes.
If he is going to receive the same or better training and academic benefit then fine. If he is making his decision in 2020 to be with own then that thinking reeks of racism based upon the separation of the races.[/quote]
You are calling a black kid racist if he decides to be with his own?[/quote]
I don't give a crap if he is black, brown, yellow or a rainbow but would you sound shockingly outraged if a white kid says "I would rather play only with other white kids, in school that has no blacks and only for a white coach"?
What pandering whites say these days to sound politically correct borders on the ridiculous.
You sound like you are living in Lexington, Kentucky in 1955.[/quote]
Point to where any of these kids have said "I would rather play only with other black kids, in school that has no whites and only for a black coach"
[quote="Class of 72" post=391010][quote="L J S A" post=391006][quote="Class of 72" post=391004]
"It shouldn't be a crime that I want to go support my own." This is a quote from one of the athletes.
If he is going to receive the same or better training and academic benefit then fine. If he is making his decision in 2020 to be with own then that thinking reeks of racism based upon the separation of the races.[/quote]
You are calling a black kid racist if he decides to be with his own?[/quote]
I don't give a crap if he is black, brown, yellow or a rainbow but would you sound shockingly outraged if a white kid says "I would rather play only with other white kids, in school that has no blacks and only for a white coach"?
What pandering whites say these days to sound politically correct borders on the ridiculous.
You sound like you are living in Lexington, Kentucky in 1955.[/quote]
Except your theory would be incorrect as HBCU’s have plenty of White athletes. Actually fun fact, if a white kid wanted to go to an all white school with a white staff and no black players there’s an HBCU called Bluefield State in West Virginia that would be an option for him (97 percent white).
"It shouldn't be a crime that I want to go support my own." This is a quote from one of the athletes.
If he is going to receive the same or better training and academic benefit then fine. If he is making his decision in 2020 to be with own then that thinking reeks of racism based upon the separation of the races.[/quote]
You are calling a black kid racist if he decides to be with his own?[/quote]
I don't give a crap if he is black, brown, yellow or a rainbow but would you sound shockingly outraged if a white kid says "I would rather play only with other white kids, in school that has no blacks and only for a white coach"?
What pandering whites say these days to sound politically correct borders on the ridiculous.
You sound like you are living in Lexington, Kentucky in 1955.[/quote]
Except your theory would be incorrect as HBCU’s have plenty of White athletes. Actually fun fact, if a white kid wanted to go to an all white school with a white staff and no black players there’s an HBCU called Bluefield State in West Virginia that would be an option for him (97 percent white).
There has been some good back and forth here . First , Colleges paying Athletes ? We have lost the true definition of Student Athlete . It’s not Athlete Student . And , what are we talking about , paying all kids who play a Sport or just ones in the Revenue Sports ? And , who determines what money a kid gets ? Does the Top 5 FB or BB player get a flat sum that is the same as the 10 th Man who only plays on the Practice squad ? I mean no one who advocates paying College Athletes has come up with how a Pay Scale would work , have they ? The reality for Pro Level Talents is the NFL and NBA have heretofore limited the Kid coming out of HS and going directly Pro . Many Kids with Pro Talent should have the opportunity to go direct and not play the 1 and Done game like the NBA or , the NFL Rule of 2 College seasons before opting Pro . At least , I think the NFL requires 2 College Years ? Baseball allows kids to be drafted right out of HS and they get the appropriate Signing Bonuses , etc . They then usually embark on a Minor League internship to see if they can get to a Major League level . They do get paid for being in the Minors and the amount isn’t really relevant , if they want to go that route. So, in my mind a better solution is to have the NBA and NFL amend their rules , rather than have the Colleges function as a Minor League . In Baseball today , drafting a 17-18 year old kid in any of their draft rounds is a high risk and the MLB Scouts have to be pretty sure these players are almost guaranteed Major League Players . I think most agree the 1 and done rule makes a mockery of College Basketball under the Student Athlete guise . College Baseball is more and more becoming the Training ground for Major League Players but , I don’t see a groundswell for paying them . Next , Historic Black Colleges and Elite BB players . I think any HS kid who is Interested in a Black College should do what he wants and thinks what is best for him / her . The problem may arise however , if the Elite Player is interested in only the 1 and done scenario . I think that would not be in the best interests of the Black College . I think the Howard Coach Blakney has it right . Do these Elite Players want to come to Howard for the Academics that the school exemplifies or , is just that the Player feels he wants to be in a School with a high majority of Black Students ? And , then leaves after the 1 year. . How does that benefit Howard ? And , would Howard be expected to pay that Athlete ? They can’t finance Scholarships like Duke , Kentucky , Michigan State , LSU , Alabama , Ga., can ., As for Conferences being compelled to add the Black College to the Big 10 or BE, I think is unreasonable and again does little for the Black School . It would consign some of them to habitual second division or league basement status . I think a better option for States that have a number of Public Black College is to devote more of the Tax Dollars to these Schools , which is something that Trump has Championed and received little credit for ! He wants more Federal money to go to these Colleges and that is a good thing . I have another question that is more Student oriented than Athlete oriented . That is , why don’t some of these Elite Schools , Duke , Yale , Harvard , etc create a Program that encourages the allegedly better Professors to spend a year or 2 Teaching at a Howard or Grambling or Morehouse ? Let these Professors put their skills to work with a Majority of Black Students in a Academic Capacity .
JohnnyFever
Active member
72...I'm not pandering to anyone lol...I said "would anyone be surprised if power conferences were forced via pressure to admit HBCU's to give them a bigger platform?". What I meant was that if they go that route it will be silly and just a sign of the times. And players can choose to go wherever they want, but all the peer pressure by ESPN to have the top players go to HBCU's does seem to be awfully similar to black separatism and segregation. This is the odd thing the far left has done in the last 10 yrs or so...years ago they want everyone living together and said we need to interact with each other to help understand each other and you were racist if you didn't want that. Now they're saying separating is good if you're black. You see this with the "black house" zone in DC, universities having separate graduations for black students, BLM style groups including black student unions providing spaces where they say only black students can go as a safe space, Killer Mike saying to only buy black products, black owned, and now this talk of wanting top kids to play at HBCU's strongly encouraged if not pushed by liberal sports media and liberal stars like LeBron.
All I want is some consistency. You cannot have different standards for different races and expect anything close to harmony. What we see now is black nationalism due to religious levels of identity politics. If that's what people want, that's fine with me I won't force anyone to believe anything and I won't stop them from associating with who they want to associate with or live where they want to live. I'm strongly opposed to any tribalism or identity politics because they lead to more tension and "us vs. them" mentality...but what the far left does not seem to understand is that if you become obsessed with nationalism and identity with certain minority groups, you will encourage fringe white nationalists to seek the same. If it's wrong and racist for one group to do, it must also be for the other. We also currently have a culture where some racial groups are said to be "incapable" of being racist and that only whites can be. If that seems insane, it's because it is. Racism is simply hating people for their race. But the far left tried changing the definition to include "while also having power" to make it seem like only whites can be racist. I'm all for free association...if you want to live in a diverse area then great. If you want to live in a homogenous area then great. But the wild double standards are only going to bring more racial tension. If a white celebrity said to only shop at white owned stores, commit to white colleges, have white identity patches, they would rightfully be called racist and that would be the tip of the iceberg in terms of consequences for that. We need to move away from tribalism and back to individualism and seeing ourselves as Americans.
All I want is some consistency. You cannot have different standards for different races and expect anything close to harmony. What we see now is black nationalism due to religious levels of identity politics. If that's what people want, that's fine with me I won't force anyone to believe anything and I won't stop them from associating with who they want to associate with or live where they want to live. I'm strongly opposed to any tribalism or identity politics because they lead to more tension and "us vs. them" mentality...but what the far left does not seem to understand is that if you become obsessed with nationalism and identity with certain minority groups, you will encourage fringe white nationalists to seek the same. If it's wrong and racist for one group to do, it must also be for the other. We also currently have a culture where some racial groups are said to be "incapable" of being racist and that only whites can be. If that seems insane, it's because it is. Racism is simply hating people for their race. But the far left tried changing the definition to include "while also having power" to make it seem like only whites can be racist. I'm all for free association...if you want to live in a diverse area then great. If you want to live in a homogenous area then great. But the wild double standards are only going to bring more racial tension. If a white celebrity said to only shop at white owned stores, commit to white colleges, have white identity patches, they would rightfully be called racist and that would be the tip of the iceberg in terms of consequences for that. We need to move away from tribalism and back to individualism and seeing ourselves as Americans.
Class of 72
Active member
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=391053]72...I'm not pandering to anyone lol...I said "would anyone be surprised if power conferences were forced via pressure to admit HBCU's to give them a bigger platform?". What I meant was that if they go that route it will be silly and just a sign of the times. And players can choose to go wherever they want, but all the peer pressure by ESPN to have the top players go to HBCU's does seem to be awfully similar to black separatism and segregation. This is the odd thing the far left has done in the last 10 yrs or so...years ago they want everyone living together and said we need to interact with each other to help understand each other and you were racist if you didn't want that. Now they're saying separating is good if you're black. You see this with the "black house" zone in DC, universities having separate graduations for black students, BLM style groups including black student unions providing spaces where they say only black students can go as a safe space, Killer Mike saying to only buy black products, black owned, and now this talk of wanting top kids to play at HBCU's strongly encouraged if not pushed by liberal sports media and liberal stars like LeBron.
All I want is some consistency. You cannot have different standards for different races and expect anything close to harmony. What we see now is black nationalism due to religious levels of identity politics. If that's what people want, that's fine with me I won't force anyone to believe anything and I won't stop them from associating with who they want to associate with or live where they want to live. I'm strongly opposed to any tribalism or identity politics because they lead to more tension and "us vs. them" mentality...but what the far left does not seem to understand is that if you become obsessed with nationalism and identity with certain minority groups, you will encourage fringe white nationalists to seek the same. If it's wrong and racist for one group to do, it must also be for the other. We also currently have a culture where some racial groups are said to be "incapable" of being racist and that only whites can be. If that seems insane, it's because it is. Racism is simply hating people for their race. But the far left tried changing the definition to include "while also having power" to make it seem like only whites can be racist. I'm all for free association...if you want to live in a diverse area then great. If you want to live in a homogenous area then great. But the wild double standards are only going to bring more racial tension. If a white celebrity said to only shop at white owned stores, commit to white colleges, have white identity patches, they would rightfully be called racist and that would be the tip of the iceberg in terms of consequences for that. We need to move away from tribalism and back to individualism and seeing ourselves as Americans.[/quote]
I understand what you are saying and I know that racism transcends just one color code and includes Blacks of different hues, Asians and Hispanics.
I used to have spirited discussions about the "whites only can be racist " with a former SJ great to point where I said something to the effect of why did he marry a white European girl then. Because if love has no color then neither does hate.
All I want is some consistency. You cannot have different standards for different races and expect anything close to harmony. What we see now is black nationalism due to religious levels of identity politics. If that's what people want, that's fine with me I won't force anyone to believe anything and I won't stop them from associating with who they want to associate with or live where they want to live. I'm strongly opposed to any tribalism or identity politics because they lead to more tension and "us vs. them" mentality...but what the far left does not seem to understand is that if you become obsessed with nationalism and identity with certain minority groups, you will encourage fringe white nationalists to seek the same. If it's wrong and racist for one group to do, it must also be for the other. We also currently have a culture where some racial groups are said to be "incapable" of being racist and that only whites can be. If that seems insane, it's because it is. Racism is simply hating people for their race. But the far left tried changing the definition to include "while also having power" to make it seem like only whites can be racist. I'm all for free association...if you want to live in a diverse area then great. If you want to live in a homogenous area then great. But the wild double standards are only going to bring more racial tension. If a white celebrity said to only shop at white owned stores, commit to white colleges, have white identity patches, they would rightfully be called racist and that would be the tip of the iceberg in terms of consequences for that. We need to move away from tribalism and back to individualism and seeing ourselves as Americans.[/quote]
I understand what you are saying and I know that racism transcends just one color code and includes Blacks of different hues, Asians and Hispanics.
I used to have spirited discussions about the "whites only can be racist " with a former SJ great to point where I said something to the effect of why did he marry a white European girl then. Because if love has no color then neither does hate.
[quote="Sju grad 13" post=391898]Well our theory is about to be tested. Makur Maker (5 star prospect) younger brother of Thon Maker just chose Howard University over Kentucky, UCLA, Memphis and Kansas.[/quote]
Wonderful news, I hope this is the first of many and for many a year to come. It may prove to be a game changer for the HBCU schools. If Kamala Harris is selected by Biden to be his running mate it would also be very positive publicity for Howard University of which she is a graduate. Anxiously awaiting the shift in sports power to the HBCUs and the money that comes with it, which is long overdue.
Wonderful news, I hope this is the first of many and for many a year to come. It may prove to be a game changer for the HBCU schools. If Kamala Harris is selected by Biden to be his running mate it would also be very positive publicity for Howard University of which she is a graduate. Anxiously awaiting the shift in sports power to the HBCUs and the money that comes with it, which is long overdue.
Moose
Well-known member
[quote="Sju grad 13" post=391898]Well our theory is about to be tested. Makur Maker (5 star prospect) younger brother of Thon Maker just chose Howard University over Kentucky, UCLA, Memphis and Kansas.[/quote]
TBF Makur was talking about Howard for a long time.
Great get for my buddy Kenny Blakeney
TBF Makur was talking about Howard for a long time.
Great get for my buddy Kenny Blakeney
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