Top Ten Reasons SJU Struggles With Mid-Majors

The reality is that we have played poorly to date
We have struggled in virtually every game we have played - wins as well as losses
The 8-4 record is very misleading IMHO
To barely eke out wins against Holy Cross, Florida Gulf Coast, etc, etc was suprising and very disappointing
I believe that we miss Dunlap a lot
We don't seem to be getting better fundamentally from game to game - same types of mistakes, problems, etc
However, I do believe that we have a lot of talent on this team and that we will improve as the season goes on
 
Another mid to low major i think we would have trouble with is Stoney Brook. Lost by 7 at Maryland today and have been doing pretty well.
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I think the biggest thing is this: if you had major expectations for this team, kiss them goodbye. To be 8-4 at this point is inexcusable. Murray State and Baylor are understandable, but being blown off the map by SF who is not good vs. any other teams and now blowing huge leads to UNC Asheville, it's definitely time to say this team just isn't that good. I would be absolutely shocked if we finish near .500 more less at it. To make the NCAA tourney at this point is a miracle, and to make the NIT even seems laughable.

This team just cannot beat the teams it needs to and should. We seem to be one of the few major conference teams in the Big East that REALLY struggles every game against mid majors. Nova will blow mid majors out for the most part, as will Marquette, Cincy, Cuse, UConn, Pitt, ND, and Seton Hall and Providence may not blow their mid majors out, but they go out and win the games they should. At this point I don't care if we play a high school team...it's 50/50 now for our chance of winning against anyone. I understand that in the full scope of things, SF and Asheville are pretty good mid majors, but compared to a Big East team, they should prove no contest at least beyond the 1st period. By the way, some of you have it completely backwards regarding attendance. You WIN first, THEN you get the crowds, not vice versa. We haven't won crap in 12 years. Feels more like 80 right now.

We will still get our typical 2 or 3 upsets, some may even come against ranked teams, but overall this team is very bad for a major level team and the ridiculous amount of talent or supposed talent we recruited. When is this team going to be a real factor again nationally? My hair might be gray by then if it ever happens at all.
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I hope this team does extremely well. Everyone on this board just puts them down when they have every chance in the world to make a name for themselves. This is a young team that will put your collective feet in your mouths. You don't write a team off this early in the year and if you have a problem with that then you are not a true fan of the game or this team.

This fan base has a losing attitude and this team will do better then expected. Before years end St Johns will have a new season blocks leader, and he could be a big difference maker. I think he can shut down the lane and their full court pressure will help them.

Let's all be honest nobody knows what will happen and we should just wait and see.
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"This is a young team". How many times am I going to hear that? That phrase is uttered so much that you can create a drinking game for it. Every time someone says it take a drink. At some point the excuses need to be put to bed and reality becomes reality. This team just is not that good. They will upset a few teams, miss the NCAA's and NIT, and head into the offseason. What an inopportune time to be playing like garbage too with Lawrence and Jordan watching. We simply cannot effectively run our offense and consistently score. We score in spurts, and we cannot put teams away. That's a recipe for disaster. We get killed on the boards and it seems like it doesn't even matter if the opponents are 5'7 at this point. We have zero inside presence.

"This fanbase has a losing attitude". Same can be said for the Pittsburgh Pirates...wonder why. You reap what you sow. If you are a great team and do great things, great crowds will come and support you. Conversely, if you play like trash and lose to bottom of the barrel teams as a power conference team with countless top 100 recruits, your fanbase will ignore you because you aren't worth their time. Stop living in this fantasy where we pack out every game and suddenly we learn how to rebound, shoot 3's, defend 3's, run plays, and get an inside game going. That's not due to fans, that's skill and pure talent. If we were a good team, we would be beating SF's and Asheville's by 15+. This was supposed to be a very weak OOC for us this year. Some on here even complained it might hurt us it's so weak. Well, we managed to lose 4 games before conference play, 2 coming vs. cupcakes who aren't even dominant in their own divisions, and 2 where we totally blew games we should have won. This loss was like a big punch to the gut and if they don't really get going in their next few games, it will be the KO punch to the season. If we can't beat the DePaul's, SH's, Prov's, Rutgers', etc. of our conference, we may do worse than last year.
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Young team means they will only get better guys. Plenty of time for improvement. And its still early. Don't forget that.. just wait and watch before you count this team out. They still have to play the games. I will start to doubt this team when they are under .500. You guys make it sound like we have a 1-11 record. It doesn't matter what happens in any other games but the one they are going into next. Every game is a different animal. Just watch and let's see what happens.
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Greene, Dlo, Dom, and Amir got a ton of minutes last year. Jakarr prepped and is playing fine. Marco is a JUCO. The youth excuse only applies to CO and Felix who have been better than expected. The GG/Sanchez thing is just ridiculous and it all reverts back to coaching. Guys are getting beat off the dribble and known shooters are being ignored at an alarming rate. Rebounding is pathetic and overall defense just stinks. Hate to say it but even Norm's teams hustled more. I don't have any answers for this bunch but apparently neither does Lavs.
 
I just don't get redshirting GG if they were not sure what was happening with Sanchez. That seems like a big miscalculation. And, the NCAA's continuing vendetta against SJU is ridiculous. There should be recourse for that kind of thing.
 
I just don't get redshirting GG if they were not sure what was happening with Sanchez. That seems like a big miscalculation. And, the NCAA's continuing vendetta against SJU is ridiculous. There should be recourse for that kind of thing.
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I am sure that they redshirted GG because they thought Sanchez's eligibility was a slam dunk
I don't believe that the NCAA has a "vendetta" against St John's
I believe that they are just a poorly managed outfit with no sympathy for anyone
I am sure that Texas has the same feelings, given their situation with their PG
 
I just don't get redshirting GG if they were not sure what was happening with Sanchez. That seems like a big miscalculation. And, the NCAA's continuing vendetta against SJU is ridiculous. There should be recourse for that kind of thing.
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I am sure that they redshirted GG because they thought Sanchez's eligibility was a slam dunk
I don't believe that the NCAA has a "vendetta" against St John's
I believe that they are just a poorly managed outfit with no sympathy for anyone
I am sure that Texas has the same feelings, given their situation with their PG
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They never felt Sanchez eligibility was a slam dunk. Its been an uphill fight the entire way and they knew it. Its a calculated risk by Lavin
 
Well in light of the news in Texas I dont feel too hopeful about Sanchez. Would give needed Rebounding, some post scoring, and he would help in the post during the Big East
 
Let's also look at another team as a comparison playing the cupcake part of their schedule: Seton Hall. This team is supposed to be god awful after losing all of its studs and no Carr yet if ever. First game vs. UMKC they win by 40. Second game vs. Norfolk State they win by 13. Third game they lose to Washington who is a dangerous power conference team, so not a bad loss. Against URI, they win by 5...a close game but still win. Against Maine they win by 30. Against St. Peters they win by 15. Against LSU they lose by 5...another tight game but not totally unexpected loss...another loss that isn't bad. Against NJIT they win by 9 playing them close but still win. Against Wake they win a close one as expected since it's an ACC opponent. Then they beat Longwood by about 20. Then they beat LIU by 30. They are now 10-2 headed into Big East play.

20+ pt wins: 4
Bad losses: 0

This my friends, is what it's supposed to look like at this stage in the season. A few losses against comparable teams, but dominating bad teams for the most part and grinding out a few wins against scrappy teams. That's 4 games they won by 20+ in blowouts vs. mid majors with 3 of those 4 margins by 30 or MORE! This is what is supposed to happen when a Big East team has cupcakes before conference play.

Now let's look at what we did. We BARELY win by 4 vs. Detroit in the opener in a major nail-biter. Then we knock off Charleston by 11. We dominate Murray State for most of the game only to lose by 5 in the end. We then play Baylor and shoot lights out appearing to control the game until the last 7 minutes or so and end up losing by 20! We then play Holy Cross who gives us a lot more than we wanted in a 12 pt win even though it felt more like a 5 pt win. FGCU played us VERY hard and we were dominated early and barely pulled it out in the end. We then beat SC by 24, a very solid all around victory and the only one of the season we truly look like a Big East team. Then we play NJIT who dominates us early and ends up nearly beating us. We then play SF and get blown off the map losing by almost 20 even though it seemed more like 30. Fordham is next, and yet another game they play with us right down to the end making it way too close for comfort. St. Francis we get a solid 17 pt win. And finally, we lose to Asheville after being up by nearly 20 at one point. We are now 8-4 headed into Big East play.

20+ pt wins: 1
Bad losses: 2

Make of this what you will, but what Seton Hall is doing right now is exactly what I expected of this team given the talent level, and Seton Hall is supposed to be vastly inferior to us talent wise. These teams should be in opposite places. I don't understand why Seton Hall is able to take care of business and get 4 laughers while we only manage 1 and might not have been a laugher if their best player didn't get carried off the court. We can't dominate the bad teams and now we play some of the best. Strap yourselves in because it's about to get real ugly. We will pull out some surprising wins but it won't be enough to get us anywhere in the postseason.
 
Let's also look at another team as a comparison playing the cupcake part of their schedule: Seton Hall. This team is supposed to be god awful after losing all of its studs and no Carr yet if ever. First game vs. UMKC they win by 40. Second game vs. Norfolk State they win by 13. Third game they lose to Washington who is a dangerous power conference team, so not a bad loss. Against URI, they win by 5...a close game but still win. Against Maine they win by 30. Against St. Peters they win by 15. Against LSU they lose by 5...another tight game but not totally unexpected loss...another loss that isn't bad. Against NJIT they win by 9 playing them close but still win. Against Wake they win a close one as expected since it's an ACC opponent. Then they beat Longwood by about 20. Then they beat LIU by 30. They are now 10-2 headed into Big East play.

20+ pt wins: 4
Bad losses: 0

This my friends, is what it's supposed to look like at this stage in the season. A few losses against comparable teams, but dominating bad teams for the most part and grinding out a few wins against scrappy teams. That's 4 games they won by 20+ in blowouts vs. mid majors with 3 of those 4 margins by 30 or MORE! This is what is supposed to happen when a Big East team has cupcakes before conference play.

Now let's look at what we did. We BARELY win by 4 vs. Detroit in the opener in a major nail-biter. Then we knock off Charleston by 11. We dominate Murray State for most of the game only to lose by 5 in the end. We then play Baylor and shoot lights out appearing to control the game until the last 7 minutes or so and end up losing by 20! We then play Holy Cross who gives us a lot more than we wanted in a 12 pt win even though it felt more like a 5 pt win. FGCU played us VERY hard and we were dominated early and barely pulled it out in the end. We then beat SC by 24, a very solid all around victory and the only one of the season we truly look like a Big East team. Then we play NJIT who dominates us early and ends up nearly beating us. We then play SF and get blown off the map losing by almost 20 even though it seemed more like 30. Fordham is next, and yet another game they play with us right down to the end making it way too close for comfort. St. Francis we get a solid 17 pt win. And finally, we lose to Asheville after being up by nearly 20 at one point. We are now 8-4 headed into Big East play.

20+ pt wins: 1
Bad losses: 2

Make of this what you will, but what Seton Hall is doing right now is exactly what I expected of this team given the talent level, and Seton Hall is supposed to be vastly inferior to us talent wise. These teams should be in opposite places. I don't understand why Seton Hall is able to take care of business and get 4 laughers while we only manage 1 and might not have been a laugher if their best player didn't get carried off the court. We can't dominate the bad teams and now we play some of the best. Strap yourselves in because it's about to get real ugly. We will pull out some surprising wins but it won't be enough to get us anywhere in the postseason.
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So what do you think Joe? You will be sitting around in a bar many years from now , reminiscing about this season to some young SJU fans, when you have the urge to say: "I used to be a fan of St.John's basketball. It's a tough racket"
 
Let's also look at another team as a comparison playing the cupcake part of their schedule: Seton Hall. This team is supposed to be god awful after losing all of its studs and no Carr yet if ever. First game vs. UMKC they win by 40. Second game vs. Norfolk State they win by 13. Third game they lose to Washington who is a dangerous power conference team, so not a bad loss. Against URI, they win by 5...a close game but still win. Against Maine they win by 30. Against St. Peters they win by 15. Against LSU they lose by 5...another tight game but not totally unexpected loss...another loss that isn't bad. Against NJIT they win by 9 playing them close but still win. Against Wake they win a close one as expected since it's an ACC opponent. Then they beat Longwood by about 20. Then they beat LIU by 30. They are now 10-2 headed into Big East play.

20+ pt wins: 4
Bad losses: 0

This my friends, is what it's supposed to look like at this stage in the season. A few losses against comparable teams, but dominating bad teams for the most part and grinding out a few wins against scrappy teams. That's 4 games they won by 20+ in blowouts vs. mid majors with 3 of those 4 margins by 30 or MORE! This is what is supposed to happen when a Big East team has cupcakes before conference play.

Now let's look at what we did. We BARELY win by 4 vs. Detroit in the opener in a major nail-biter. Then we knock off Charleston by 11. We dominate Murray State for most of the game only to lose by 5 in the end. We then play Baylor and shoot lights out appearing to control the game until the last 7 minutes or so and end up losing by 20! We then play Holy Cross who gives us a lot more than we wanted in a 12 pt win even though it felt more like a 5 pt win. FGCU played us VERY hard and we were dominated early and barely pulled it out in the end. We then beat SC by 24, a very solid all around victory and the only one of the season we truly look like a Big East team. Then we play NJIT who dominates us early and ends up nearly beating us. We then play SF and get blown off the map losing by almost 20 even though it seemed more like 30. Fordham is next, and yet another game they play with us right down to the end making it way too close for comfort. St. Francis we get a solid 17 pt win. And finally, we lose to Asheville after being up by nearly 20 at one point. We are now 8-4 headed into Big East play.

20+ pt wins: 1
Bad losses: 2

Make of this what you will, but what Seton Hall is doing right now is exactly what I expected of this team given the talent level, and Seton Hall is supposed to be vastly inferior to us talent wise. These teams should be in opposite places. I don't understand why Seton Hall is able to take care of business and get 4 laughers while we only manage 1 and might not have been a laugher if their best player didn't get carried off the court. We can't dominate the bad teams and now we play some of the best. Strap yourselves in because it's about to get real ugly. We will pull out some surprising wins but it won't be enough to get us anywhere in the postseason.
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The problem is that we think we are better than Seton Hall. We think we are better than Villanova. We think we are better than DePaul.

Reality says we will probably lose a game to all 3 of those teams.

From the coaches down to the players, there is a mentality that we can just step onto the court and beat teams. I think that translates into being poorly prepared for games.

Most people on here hate to see posters knock the coaching staff. But how else do you explain a team not running offensive sets or plays for 12 consecutive games? How do you explain getting outrebounded in pretty much every single game played thus far?

This team has a lot of individual talent but lacks collective execution. That comes from preparation.

I for one do not want to watch AAU ball. But that's the product on display right now.

The coaching staff has to become more accountable.

Lavin said when he was hired that Louie told him, "Get some horses and you will win".

Well, he got the horses but even the best thoroughbred has to be prodded to get the desired results.

Stop selling us dreams of NCAA tourney bids and start putting these talented players through some repetitive drills until they can't take it any longer. Put that shiny clipboard to use and draw up some plays to put your players in the best position on the court to maximize their abilities.

But please stop thinking that we are better than we actually are.

We haven't lost a game on a last second shot. We've been methodically out worked, out hustled, out executed and out coached. The numbers don't lie so let's stop lying to ourselves.
 
I blame the coaching staff for the lack of offensive sets and for our 3-pt. defense. The lack of rebounding is on the players. They also make too many mental mistakes. An example is when Obekpa was going after a loose ball near mid-court. As he's about to retrieve it, he turns his head to look for someone to pass it to. A UNCA player hustles in, grabs the ball and races down for a layup. If he had remained focused on getting the ball, we don't give up those points at a crucual point in the game.
 
Joe, for what it's worth, let's fine tune our "facts" a little. Seton Hall didn't beat Longwood by 20. Second, their SOS is 241 vs. 103 for us, so what do you get by comparing their records? Beating them on the court is all that matters, and I think we'll do that this year.

You and '98 can continue with the doom and gloom and unfortunately there are no words to say right now to change your perspective. I for one am looking forward to conference play so the team can prove that it is turning a corner. There have been stretches of really good play mixed in with the mind-numbing mistakes and lapses of intensity. I believe they'll get more consistent for longer stretches which will lead to more wins.
 
Joe, for what it's worth, let's fine tune our "facts" a little. Seton Hall didn't beat Longwood by 20. Second, their SOS is 241 vs. 103 for us, so what do you get by comparing their records? Beating them on the court is all that matters, and I think we'll do that this year.

You and '98 can continue with the doom and gloom and unfortunately there are no words to say right now to change your perspective. I for one am looking forward to conference play so the team can prove that it is turning a corner. There have been stretches of really good play mixed in with the mind-numbing mistakes and lapses of intensity. I believe they'll get more consistent for longer stretches which will lead to more wins.
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Doom & gloom because I want us to run some plays like any D1 school?

Strength of Schedule is your excuse?
They lost to a UNCA team while not even calling a timeout.
They got out worked by a Fordham team without its best player.
They gave up a career night to a USF PG that probably couldn't even be a walk-on on this squad.

You can label something as mind-numbing mistakes. I'll call them a lack of preparation.

We're trying to "out-athletic" teams (my non-word of the day). That is not going to cut it.

I want you to tell me what you have seen so far that shows you that this team is well-prepared offensively. I'll wait.
 
Joe, for what it's worth, let's fine tune our "facts" a little. Seton Hall didn't beat Longwood by 20. Second, their SOS is 241 vs. 103 for us, so what do you get by comparing their records? Beating them on the court is all that matters, and I think we'll do that this year.

You and '98 can continue with the doom and gloom and unfortunately there are no words to say right now to change your perspective. I for one am looking forward to conference play so the team can prove that it is turning a corner. There have been stretches of really good play mixed in with the mind-numbing mistakes and lapses of intensity. I believe they'll get more consistent for longer stretches which will lead to more wins.
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Sorry, 18...I forgot that last bucket really matters. If you are going to split hairs that tells me you are missing the point. Seton Hall, Providence, Nova, etc. have been able to dominate the cupcakes for the most part while losing to a few of the better mid majors (minus Hall who only lost to major teams). The other Big East teams did what they were supposed to for the most part and even overachieved. Providence is doing much better than expected, Seton Hall is doing much better than expected, and DePaul even looks solid. We are the major disappointment thus far in our conference. We play mid majors like we belong with them while the other Big East teams seem to show a separation and another level of talent which is expected. Show me one game other than SC (lost their best player when getting back in the game mind you) where we clearly dominated the opponent beyond any shadow of a doubt. Even St. Francis was fairly close for most of the game if I remember correctly. First we had the cardiac Mets, then we had the cardiac Jets, now it's the cardiac Red Storm.

They just cannot step on the throats of teams much weaker than them. I expect tons and tons of fast break dunks and layups due to our athleticism and talent, yet those never occur or when they do, we either let the defense catch up to neutralize our numbers advantage, or we pass it out of bounds. The games I have watched so far remind me more of watching Marist games vs. the NJIT's, Fordham's, FGCU, etc. and keeping it very close. I don't see that clear distinction of being a major conference team with us. For those of you who expect a .500 or better conference record, please let me get a hit of whatever it is you are smoking. If we turn the season around, then great. But until then I will remain realistic based on our performance thus far. If this team really can make things happen, then let them prove it. If I see no evidence (i.e. win vs. L'Ville, Cuse, Cincy, ND, etc.) of being a team with tons of potential, then I see no reason to daydream. Call me Scrooge, but I have drastically cut back my expectations of this team after seeing cupcakes scare the daylights out of us and even dominate us.
 
It's over now. We can discuss it until we are blue in the face, but the fact is St. John's has lost to San Francisco and UNC Asheville. They can either pack up and call it a season or they can go out against Villanova and Cincinnati and play a better brand of basketball. The choice is up to them.

Whether it's a mid-major or a big conference team, you need to come out prepared to play and never take your foot off the gas pedal. The Johnnies did that against UNC Asheville and lost the game as a result. Now, it is time to find out whether there are actual leaders on this team that won't allow that to happen again. Whether that is Harrison or Pointer or Branch or Sampson, you need people to step up in those quicksand moments (which are bound to happen in any sport) and regain control of the game. Against the Bulldogs, no player stepped up and took that role. There is a lot of season left to play and plenty of time for somebody to show that they have it in them. So before we all write this season off, let's see how the team bounces back in conference play. If they start off 0-5, then we know there are issues and maybe the personnel is flawed. But until the games are played, we just don't know.
 
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