Thoughts after 4 games

[doodyny33]

I disagree on your Jones assessment. I don't think he considered him anything besides an athletic freak who can get up and down the court. I think Jones is just finding his way since the offense benefits the guards. He's pretty much out there knowing he's not going to get touches which has got to be frustrating.

I also disagree about Obekpa. He should be starting. He is what Lavin has never been able to recruit. I say give him the keys and watch him blossom. He allows you to play man and if he sags off to help, he has the instincts, length and ability to catch up for a block.

I feel so fortunate to have him. If he was in a Cincy uniform, I'd throw up.

Well said.

Let's not fall into our old trap of hammering on freshmen four games into their college careers. The talent on this team is unlike anything we've seen in years.

Going to be some ups and downs, but I'm excited to watch this group play and develop.

Agree 100%

Listen, STJ was beaten by 2 teams who at this point in time are flat out better than they are. Even though Baylor is equally as young, both them and Murray State are battle tested at this stage and STJ is not. I'm glad our team saw some legitimate talent in the beginning stages of this season. They now know that they need to put in the work to get better because it is not enough to just be athletic.

It's important to never take an opponent too lightly, but it is important over the next few games that this team plays better together. The unit definitely needs to work on playing together and utilizing each others strengths on the court. And first and foremost, let's hit the boards. Yes, the team is undersized, but if you expect to win any games this season you need to be better on the boards than they were this past tournament.

 

[Class of 72]

Sampson could be one and done by the end of the season, depending on who else declares.

He's got a long way to go before he's a one-and-done player

Long, long way!
He does not yet have the explosive 1 on 1 moves that Harkless has and he needs to improve his shooting. A two year player at minimum and maybe even three.

 

[Joe]

Baylor is not young-at least not those who played-started 2 srs, 2 jrs, and a frosh.
2 frosh got minutes for Baylor
SJU has one Jr. on the team as of now-Marco-who started because Dlo was late for the bus. SJu played 4 sophs, 4 frosh-and Marco.
Murray St - started 4 srs and a jr.
Tough for a team as young as SJU to go against quality upper-classmen at this early stage of the year.
I was disappointed in our inability to stop the Heslip 3's or to rebound. I do feel that as the players get experience those weaknesses will abate somewhat (I sure hope so).
They are a fun group to watch and I believe will be even more fun come January-Feb. Given our extreme youth I expect us to be up and down-both as a team and the play of individual players. Will look very good at times and pretty poor at others-I expect the good play to increase as the poor play decreases over time.

 

[Lopez_13]

I'm extremely excited about this team's prospects. I thought we were better than Murray state but not Baylor. Said this a few times but once we get Branch we can play more man to man defense because he is a terrific on the ball defender. Playing man against guards like Jackson and canaan would have gotten us blown out by the 15 minute mark in the second half because we didn't have the personal to keep those guys from inside the paint. Only time I thought the zone was effective was with Dom at the top of it. Player by Player:
D-LO: I love his intensity and heart! Doesn't shy away from competition. Extremely savvy scorer, was very efficient vs Baylor. Against Murray state he took more shots but the drives, the pump fakes and jumping into the opponent to get to the line, those are veteran moves. Once he starts taking responsibility for his off the court antics, nothing could stop him.
Greene: Clearly the most improved player. Very smooth, doesn't force the issue much. His mid range and floater are deadly. Next year I expect him to come in and have a 3 point a shot. He can hit the occasional 3 but that is not in his arsenal yet. Very effective off the pick and roll.
Sampson: This kid is extremely athletic, doesn't shy away from contact. Can block shots, rebound, displayed a mid range when in the flow of the offense. he is young so sometimes he forces the issue but his upside is scary good!
Obepka: He should be starting! High defensive basketball IQ, more polished than I thought he would be on the offfensive end, he is not a liabilty there so he should be in the lineup for the majority of the game. Lavin was probably watching his minutes without sanchez being active.
Dom: I don't think he gets a fair shake. We don't need him to score much, He was great at the top of the Zone, has a high motor. He does a lot of the dirty work, that can be overlooked.
Amir: didn't have a good game the last night but he has definitely improved. His shot is better, can still slash to the hole and finish. He was forced to play out of position vs baylor because we were in foul trouble early but if we get sanchez he can play his normal position consistently.
Jones: should be coming off the bench. He is still raw, can hit the mid range, solid passer but he needs to rebound better with that size and leaping ability. He can give us very productive minutes.
Balamou: I am so Happy we didn't redshirt this kid! This kid is going to be a baller for us in the future! This year he is going to give us a solid 10 minutes off the bench, maybe more if he is playing like he was vs Murray State. Showed great poise, a nice touch from the outside, extremely athletic guard who can play defense, try to block a shot and rebound. Like moose said a better version of paris horne.
Marco: TBD
Branch: TBD
Sanchez: TBD

 

[MJDinkins]

If I'm not mistaken, Lopez and Co. raced out to 6-0 as freshmen while the 98 team lost early to Stanford and Purdue but looked like they could compete.

You're correct about the Lopez/Hamilton freshmen season. They also started out 2-0 in the Big East. The '98'-'99 'Elite 8' team lost to Stanford and Purdue after having double-digit leads, in the 2nd half, against both teams. Still plenty of basketball to be played.

 

[guru]

Love verifying about this team and with branch who we desperately need and our best all around player Sanchez, we are a much different team! But 2 things that really stand out are that Lav is no offensive guru, we did not run one play te last 10 minutes vs Baylor...., we really miss Dunlop! And 2, we need to play more man.... We have such great athletes!

 

[ras]

Guru: Have you heard anything about Sanchez. Is he going to be reenstated as a sr? Or could he never wear a SJU uniform?

 

[doodyny33]

I'm sorry, but I think we need to temper our expectations for Branch. I know he was a highly regarded recruit and played ok for Texas A&M, but sometimes I get the feeling people are expecting Kyrie Irving to step on the court for St. John's. I'm sure he is going to be an important piece to the puzzle, but let's not make him out to be the savior of this team.

 

[MJDinkins]

I'm sorry, but I think we need to temper our expectations for Branch. I know he was a highly regarded recruit and played ok for Texas A&M, but sometimes I get the feeling people are expecting Kyrie Irving to step on the court for St. John's. I'm sure he is going to be an important piece to the puzzle, but let's not make him out to be the savior of this team.

He doesn't have to be a savior, in order to be valuable to the team. Efficiently run the team; consistently, get players good looks at the basket (whether, from afar or close in); and play sound defense; and, hopefully, be a leader on the floor. I don't ever think he'll be a (big) scorer, but I think he's capable of doing the things I've mentioned above.

 

[Lopez_13]

Kyrie Irving lmao. I don't think anybody on this board is expecting that, if they are they should never speak about basketball again. All I expect is a great on the ball defender that can gives us flexibilty defensively, in regards to the defenses we can throw at teams. Also a player with solid ball handeling and a pass first mentality, that can get good shots for his teammates. Kyrie Irving is one of the top 3 point guards in the NBA.

 

[ccnobz]

All I know is after four games we have two losses to mid majors. This isnt good

Losing to a team receiving votes that went 31-2 last yr and a Top 15 team is really catastrophic. Should we start looking for a new coach now?[/
quote]


And we played Baylor toe to toe for about 35 mins.

 

[Della9250]

Sampson could be one and done by the end of the season, depending on who else declares.

He's got a long way to go before he's a one-and-done player

Long, long way!
He does not yet have the explosive 1 on 1 moves that Harkless has and he needs to improve his shooting. A two year player at minimum and maybe even three.

Hence the word 'could.' He had a bad first game. In the last three he's shooting 52 percent from the field. He's made 80 percent of his free throws. He's averaging 10.5 points, 6.5 rebounds, two blocks and an assist per game. He's 6-8 and has a good mid-range jumper.

Are there issues? Yeah. He's apprently not going to be a three-point threat, having attempted just one. And he's barely over 200 pounds. But the potential is certainly there that BY THE END OF THE SEASON, Sampson is being talked about as an NBA first-rounder, again depending on who else decides to leave early.

 

[JackofVirginia]

Bottom line is defense and rebounding win; we are doing neither very well. Mix that with a seriously guard oriented offense and we right now do not have a team geared for the big time. We have talent but I thought three or four times against Baylor that we looked like a playground team that was just going to outscore the other team by showing up. Where were the screens to free Harrison from Walton's face guarding? Any attempt at an inside game? Knowing and matching up with shooters? Fighting over screeens? Boxing out? We have talent but so do a lot of teams; we need to develop chemistry , which takes time, and a committment to defense and rebounding, which is primarily attitude and committment.

As I mentioned in the game post Lavin did nothing to help Harrison get free; he was running around with Walton in his jock strap. Where were the picks; don't have to be a genius to have team set them.

 

[dff6]

Can't get over how improved Phil Greene is.
D'Lo is D'Lo-I'll take him on my team any game.
Jakarr is the goods.
Bad tourney for Amir, but it's a long season.
Dom is what he is.
Jones is not what Lav thought he was.
Just don't see Marco logging a lot of minutes with our style of play.
Really like Felix.
Obekpa is a 20 mpg game center at tops.
Sanchez could make us a top 20 team.
Branch will give us a tough rotation come BE play.
Wish Lav had decided to let Gift play this year-need some inside help desperately.
Happy with 2-2-we lost to 2 better teams.
Really looking forward to the rest of the season.

Nice assessment, but I'd temper expectations with Sanchez. I don't think he's the big physical body down low that will grab us the tough rebounds and provide the tough defensive presence in the paint, but he will certainly help with our front court depth. Ultimately, however, I think Branch could have a bigger impact on this team's success than Sanchez.

 

[Amaseinyourface]

I disagree on your Jones assessment. I don't think he considered him anything besides an athletic freak who can get up and down the court. I think Jones is just finding his way since the offense benefits the guards. He's pretty much out there knowing he's not going to get touches which has got to be frustrating.

I also disagree about Obekpa. He should be starting. He is what Lavin has never been able to recruit. I say give him the keys and watch him blossom. He allows you to play man and if he sags off to help, he has the instincts, length and ability to catch up for a block.

I feel so fortunate to have him. If he was in a Cincy uniform, I'd throw up.

Jones is a liability and he looked like he didn't belong on the court tonight. What good is a kid built like that if he doesn't rebound or get 50/50 balls? Who cares if he can pop an open jump shot and make an acrobatic dunk? He rebounds like a girl and doesn't cover any ground at all.

Did your main man Amir out play him in either of our losses? And fwiw im a big fan of both players

 

[doodyny33]

Kyrie Irving lmao. I don't think anybody on this board is expecting that, if they are they should never speak about basketball again. All I expect is a great on the ball defender that can gives us flexibilty defensively, in regards to the defenses we can throw at teams. Also a player with solid ball handeling and a pass first mentality, that can get good shots for his teammates. Kyrie Irving is one of the top 3 point guards in the NBA.

I'm not saying that's what I expect. I've just seen some posters say how all we need to do is hold out until late December and Branch will be ready. It's not like he's going to come in and start at PG for St. John's from day one. He'll be the backup to Greene when he becomes eligible.

 

[Amaseinyourface]

My thoughts after 4 games

The teams has looked really good for about 5 of 8 halves so far. I think the main correlation to that is our ability to rebound. Similar to the 10-11 team who had so much success our guys are most effective with a defensive rebound and our forwards able to push the ball djay/brownlee and amir/Jakarr. IF we dont rebound, we dont push the ball, and our offense struggles. I would like to see more man to man D and some 2-3 (think Jakarr, dom, and Obekpa can be a really effective back line of a zone. We need to pray that either Sanchez gets cleared or Gift doesnt red shirt because Jakarr can not play the center position.
Individuals:
Phil- Looks much more poised and stronger than last year. Has a hell of a mid range game but sometimes dribbles the ball to much (maybe offenses fault). Passing needs to become more of a drive and kick. Defense is solid.
D'lo- His offense is great, needs to find a happy medium of when to be ultra agressive and when not to force the issue. Like to see him set up his interior teammates more often. Hes not as bad a defensive player as he gets a rep for.
Amir- Played strong out of the gate but has to focus on staying part of the offense. He floats for stretches and I think he needs to stay in attack mode. Defense and rebounding should be strong.
Jakarr- Jumper has looked great. Needs to attack the offensive boards more and would like to see him attempt to drive to the basket. Defense can be great with work.
Obekpa- Obviously a great shot blocker. Needs to work on his strength with the ball and his form on his shot (fades away) but it looks better than I thought. His objective should be to develop a back to the basket game.
Jones- Strong with the ball, good passer, solid spot up mid range game. Needs to rebound much better and to use his strength down low.
Dom- Needs to slow down. I'd love for him to move his game inside and be more a physical presence. He has strength and athleticism that should be used to his advantage and hes just not doing it at the top of the key. D is overrated, needs to not overextend and gamble as much.
Felix- Has looked great in limited time. Quick, strong, explosive, and has been able to finish. Dom hasnt warranted getting minutes over him
Marco- need to see more but loved what I saw at MCC. Need his passing and shooting to keep defense honest

 

[Marillac]

I disagree on your Jones assessment. I don't think he considered him anything besides an athletic freak who can get up and down the court. I think Jones is just finding his way since the offense benefits the guards. He's pretty much out there knowing he's not going to get touches which has got to be frustrating.

I also disagree about Obekpa. He should be starting. He is what Lavin has never been able to recruit. I say give him the keys and watch him blossom. He allows you to play man and if he sags off to help, he has the instincts, length and ability to catch up for a block.

I feel so fortunate to have him. If he was in a Cincy uniform, I'd throw up.

Jones is a liability and he looked like he didn't belong on the court tonight. What good is a kid built like that if he doesn't rebound or get 50/50 balls? Who cares if he can pop an open jump shot and make an acrobatic dunk? He rebounds like a girl and doesn't cover any ground at all.

Did your main man Amir out play him in either of our losses? And fwiw im a big fan of both players

Amir didn't have two good games, but their names don't belong in the sentence at this point. Garret is a 6'5 soph 2/3 that was locked up with a 6'9 senior big man. It was probably the best thing that could have happened to Garrett this early in the season to get exposed to that type of a talent. Getting dunked on like that off a rebound will be something that makes him dig deeper all year. He got owned, but he busts his hump out there. He either gets the board or he fights his way to be in the area of everything. I don't see that out of Jones. He's terrible with 50/50 balls and he doesn't cover any area. Almost all of his rebounds have been off of uncontested missed free throws. Sampson and Obekpa have had moment where you're like "man they are sloppy," but Jones has had moments like "does this kid belong on the court at this level?"

I expect Amir to be terrific this season, but I thought it would take some time like last year. The kid played professional baseball all summer.

I know Moose called Jones my whipping boy, but there is no excuse for not going and getting the damn ball. The guys is built like a tank. He should be be around 7-8 boards every game. Those woeful rebound #'s in high school make sense after watching him play. 5 boards a game in high school? Some guys (Sampson, Horne, Ced) go get the ball and some don't.

 

[Sherman Sheridan & Grant]

All I know is after four games we have two losses to mid majors. This isnt good

Am I forgetting something or did we endure two decades of crappy (discouraging, futile, low-quality etc.) basketball and now have begun to flourish with staffing, recruiting and playing - all in a few short years under Coach Lavin. It is good.http://redmen.com/1x/components/com_kunena/template/ja_social/images/emoticons/wink.png

all the best.

(how the hell do I get the wink-face/smile face inserted here?)

 

[mjmaherjr]

Honestly talking about rebounding I think Marillac has a very valid point in regards to Jones especially when you look at his high school numbers also.

I do like other aspects of what I have seen from him in glimpses though