Rutgers Again

Amazing that she could still be working with such dirt in her past. Of course, the Star-Ledger will spend a small forune and do whatever it takes to sully everything Rutgers. Funny, these players were so traumatized it only took a couple of decades to come to light. One question, I understand the Rice tapes aren't pretty, especially in this politically correct world, but don't you find it a little odd that not one player talked against Rice and in fact, several transferred AFTER he was let go, not before. Rice was wrong, no one would argue that, but did anyone ask the question if any of those tapes were AFTER he received counseling? Or is the idea that Pernetti actually HELPED someone become a better person so repugnant that it doesn't matter? No doubt an unpopular questions on this board which can be so proud of the pristine pure SJU program and university.
 
They have become the theatre of the macabre. I can't help but laugh and say a pox on you (Rutgers) and all your ancestors. Enjoy your regularly scheduled beatings in the Big whatever it is called conference.
 
Amazing that she could still be working with such dirt in her past. Of course, the Star-Ledger will spend a small forune and do whatever it takes to sully everything Rutgers. Funny, these players were so traumatized it only took a couple of decades to come to light. One question, I understand the Rice tapes aren't pretty, especially in this politically correct world, but don't you find it a little odd that not one player talked against Rice and in fact, several transferred AFTER he was let go, not before. Rice was wrong, no one would argue that, but did anyone ask the question if any of those tapes were AFTER he received counseling? Or is the idea that Pernetti actually HELPED someone become a better person so repugnant that it doesn't matter? No doubt an unpopular questions on this board which can be so proud of the pristine pure SJU program and university.
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Not sure why you ask your last line about STJ vs. this thread.

Yes the tapes were before his counseling. It was made pretty clear that the tapes were older and Murdoch had them and was trying to get $ out of Rutgers and only when they finally said no he made them public. By that time Rice was disciplined and went to counseling already.

Do you feel that Rice shouldn't have been let go?
 
This school is beyond dumb as all this info was available when they were doing due diligence.
She sounds like a complete liar denying so many things.
We will see how this turns out for them.
 
This school is beyond dumb as all this info was available when they were doing due diligence.
She sounds like a complete liar denying so many things.
We will see how this turns out for them.
 
Amazing that she could still be working with such dirt in her past. Of course, the Star-Ledger will spend a small forune and do whatever it takes to sully everything Rutgers. Funny, these players were so traumatized it only took a couple of decades to come to light. One question, I understand the Rice tapes aren't pretty, especially in this politically correct world, but don't you find it a little odd that not one player talked against Rice and in fact, several transferred AFTER he was let go, not before. Rice was wrong, no one would argue that, but did anyone ask the question if any of those tapes were AFTER he received counseling? Or is the idea that Pernetti actually HELPED someone become a better person so repugnant that it doesn't matter? No doubt an unpopular questions on this board which can be so proud of the pristine pure SJU program and university.
Click to expand...

Not sure why you ask your last line about STJ vs. this thread.

Yes the tapes were before his counseling. It was made pretty clear that the tapes were older and Murdoch had them and was trying to get $ out of Rutgers and only when they finally said no he made them public. By that time Rice was disciplined and went to counseling already.


Do you feel that Rice shouldn't have been let go?
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No, I don't think Rice or Pernetti should have been let go. Rice went to counseling and was being closely monitored and IMO Pernetti handled the situation maturely and effectively. Yes, Rice was over the top but a lot of coaches are. He was wrong although I come from a different generation and I don't believe I played for a coach in my life that would not have been fired by today's "standards." And that includes both High School (3 sports) and college (basketball). IMO, there is a bigger picture here and that is that the Star-Ledger has gone after Rutgers at every opportunity. They tried to get Schiano and failed. They have gone after Stringer and failed. They went after Rice and with the help of ESPN got him. But again, and I know those tapes are damning and I leave myself wide open here, IMO they are still taken out of context. My grandfather always told me that if you lay out the worst 10 things any human being has done over a lifetime heaven would be a lonely place; I never forgot that and think it is a good "smell" test when judging others. Murdock went after Rutgers for money pure and simple and he found willing bed fellows in the Ledger and ESPN, both of which have proven to be less than ethical institutions. Now, that doesn't excuse Rice but in talking to the several RU players I know, he is a good man with a horrible temper and there are a lot of them around. All three of them told me they thought his only motivation was to make them better players so they never took personal offense to his tactics. They didn't always like them but they also told me there was a very positive side to his personality which obviously wasn't going to sell papers or raise Sportscenter ratings so, well that's life in this world. Again, maybe I would feel differently had just ONE player come out against him but they didn't and I think that speaks volumes. As for the AD, I don't put much stock in things that happened 20 years ago and then come out of the woodwork. Finally, the SJU comment; it was meant as a "glass house" type comment but frankly it was not germane and very lame and you are on the money calling me on it - my bad.
 
I have to agree with Logen on this one. When I was a kid, I played for coaches who would have been fired under today's standards, as well. Our politically correct society has produced what my wife, a teacher, calls a "weak breed". As soon as they "feel offended" they run crying to momma. I say, buck up and be adults. Everyone has their crosses to bear in life and no one's lot is easy. It's part of living.
If something is not right in your life, try to fix it yourself. If you can't live with a certain situation, then leave. You have choices. Don't try to make someone else do what you can't or won't do for yourself. That's just being lazy and lacking courage. As my daughter, another teacher, likes to say, "Life's tough. Wear a helmet!"
 
I have to agree with Logen on this one. When I was a kid, I played for coaches who would have been fired under today's standards, as well. Our politically correct society has produced what my wife, a teacher, calls a "weak breed". As soon as they "feel offended" they run crying to momma. I say, buck up and be adults. Everyone has their crosses to bear in life and no one's lot is easy. It's part of living.
If something is not right in your life, try to fix it yourself. If you can't live with a certain situation, then leave. You have choices. Don't try to make someone else do what you can't or won't do for yourself. That's just being lazy and lacking courage. As my daughter, another teacher, likes to say, "Life's tough. Wear a helmet!"
 
It's more than just a case of a soft generation when all 15 women on Tennessee's volleyball team sign a letter that catalogues the arbitrary and mean-spirited abuses of their coach and announce that "It has been unanimously decided that this is an irreconcilable issue."

Julie Hermann read that letter sixteen years ago in front of her players and in the presence of the UT Athletic Director. She quit on the spot, walked away, and was never to coach again.

If this ever happened to you -- could you possibly forget it?

Julie Hermann said she did and is either a liar or an accomplished amnesiac.
 
Also tend to agree All my coaches were tough they made us stronger You always have a choice to remain on the team or choose another Sexual predators is are totally another story and should be proseuted
 
Amazing that she could still be working with such dirt in her past. Of course, the Star-Ledger will spend a small forune and do whatever it takes to sully everything Rutgers. Funny, these players were so traumatized it only took a couple of decades to come to light. One question, I understand the Rice tapes aren't pretty, especially in this politically correct world, but don't you find it a little odd that not one player talked against Rice and in fact, several transferred AFTER he was let go, not before. Rice was wrong, no one would argue that, but did anyone ask the question if any of those tapes were AFTER he received counseling? Or is the idea that Pernetti actually HELPED someone become a better person so repugnant that it doesn't matter? No doubt an unpopular questions on this board which can be so proud of the pristine pure SJU program and university.
Click to expand...

Not sure why you ask your last line about STJ vs. this thread.

Yes the tapes were before his counseling. It was made pretty clear that the tapes were older and Murdoch had them and was trying to get $ out of Rutgers and only when they finally said no he made them public. By that time Rice was disciplined and went to counseling already.


Do you feel that Rice shouldn't have been let go?
Click to expand...

No, I don't think Rice or Pernetti should have been let go. Rice went to counseling and was being closely monitored and IMO Pernetti handled the situation maturely and effectively. Yes, Rice was over the top but a lot of coaches are. He was wrong although I come from a different generation and I don't believe I played for a coach in my life that would not have been fired by today's "standards." And that includes both High School (3 sports) and college (basketball). IMO, there is a bigger picture here and that is that the Star-Ledger has gone after Rutgers at every opportunity. They tried to get Schiano and failed. They have gone after Stringer and failed. They went after Rice and with the help of ESPN got him. But again, and I know those tapes are damning and I leave myself wide open here, IMO they are still taken out of context. My grandfather always told me that if you lay out the worst 10 things any human being has done over a lifetime heaven would be a lonely place; I never forgot that and think it is a good "smell" test when judging others. Murdock went after Rutgers for money pure and simple and he found willing bed fellows in the Ledger and ESPN, both of which have proven to be less than ethical institutions. Now, that doesn't excuse Rice but in talking to the several RU players I know, he is a good man with a horrible temper and there are a lot of them around. All three of them told me they thought his only motivation was to make them better players so they never took personal offense to his tactics. They didn't always like them but they also told me there was a very positive side to his personality which obviously wasn't going to sell papers or raise Sportscenter ratings so, well that's life in this world. Again, maybe I would feel differently had just ONE player come out against him but they didn't and I think that speaks volumes. As for the AD, I don't put much stock in things that happened 20 years ago and then come out of the woodwork. Finally, the SJU comment; it was meant as a "glass house" type comment but frankly it was not germane and very lame and you are on the money calling me on it - my bad.
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Appreciate your response. I personally feel the Pernetti was unjustly fired. I think the reason Rice was primarily let go was the things he said not the actions he did on those tapes. Rutgers reeling from the death of the student who jumped from the GW Bridge after being called those same names and such was what I felt put it over the top.

As for why players did not come out? I feel players won't come out for fear of being blackballed. They would look soft then.

Lastly for this string of events. Everything they have done in this case has been bad. Not coming full clean on what happened in the first place, then the staggered firings. Then touting the graduate Eddie Jordan coming home, now hiring an AD who wasn't on the list of over 40 targets they were given and also the fact that she herself has a Mike Rice incident on her record, regardless of how long ago. If they didn't just fire people for the same actions then fine go ahead and hire her. But by firing one for another its hypocritical and ass backwards to a T.
 
There is a difference between being tough and being abusive. There are plenty of tough coaches out there and Rice went over the line.

I hate ru but always said if they ever got a clue they would be dangerous and the fact is they still have no idea what they are doing. They have botched this from the original investigation into Rice, the subsequent tape release, the hiring of a coach who they announced had a degree from ru when he didn't graduate and then hire a AD who has a history of behavior at the very least similar to Rice's.

Rice should have been fired from the start however once they didn't fire him and he complied with the terms of his suspension. You can argue that go back and fire him on the original behavior is like "double jeopardy".
 
Amazing that she could still be working with such dirt in her past. Of course, the Star-Ledger will spend a small forune and do whatever it takes to sully everything Rutgers. Funny, these players were so traumatized it only took a couple of decades to come to light. One question, I understand the Rice tapes aren't pretty, especially in this politically correct world, but don't you find it a little odd that not one player talked against Rice and in fact, several transferred AFTER he was let go, not before. Rice was wrong, no one would argue that, but did anyone ask the question if any of those tapes were AFTER he received counseling? Or is the idea that Pernetti actually HELPED someone become a better person so repugnant that it doesn't matter? No doubt an unpopular questions on this board which can be so proud of the pristine pure SJU program and university.
Click to expand...

Not sure why you ask your last line about STJ vs. this thread.

Yes the tapes were before his counseling. It was made pretty clear that the tapes were older and Murdoch had them and was trying to get $ out of Rutgers and only when they finally said no he made them public. By that time Rice was disciplined and went to counseling already.


Do you feel that Rice shouldn't have been let go?
Click to expand...

No, I don't think Rice or Pernetti should have been let go. Rice went to counseling and was being closely monitored and IMO Pernetti handled the situation maturely and effectively. Yes, Rice was over the top but a lot of coaches are. He was wrong although I come from a different generation and I don't believe I played for a coach in my life that would not have been fired by today's "standards." And that includes both High School (3 sports) and college (basketball). IMO, there is a bigger picture here and that is that the Star-Ledger has gone after Rutgers at every opportunity. They tried to get Schiano and failed. They have gone after Stringer and failed. They went after Rice and with the help of ESPN got him. But again, and I know those tapes are damning and I leave myself wide open here, IMO they are still taken out of context. My grandfather always told me that if you lay out the worst 10 things any human being has done over a lifetime heaven would be a lonely place; I never forgot that and think it is a good "smell" test when judging others. Murdock went after Rutgers for money pure and simple and he found willing bed fellows in the Ledger and ESPN, both of which have proven to be less than ethical institutions. Now, that doesn't excuse Rice but in talking to the several RU players I know, he is a good man with a horrible temper and there are a lot of them around. All three of them told me they thought his only motivation was to make them better players so they never took personal offense to his tactics. They didn't always like them but they also told me there was a very positive side to his personality which obviously wasn't going to sell papers or raise Sportscenter ratings so, well that's life in this world. Again, maybe I would feel differently had just ONE player come out against him but they didn't and I think that speaks volumes. As for the AD, I don't put much stock in things that happened 20 years ago and then come out of the woodwork. Finally, the SJU comment; it was meant as a "glass house" type comment but frankly it was not germane and very lame and you are on the money calling me on it - my bad.
Click to expand...

Bingo
 
Amazing that she could still be working with such dirt in her past. Of course, the Star-Ledger will spend a small forune and do whatever it takes to sully everything Rutgers. Funny, these players were so traumatized it only took a couple of decades to come to light. One question, I understand the Rice tapes aren't pretty, especially in this politically correct world, but don't you find it a little odd that not one player talked against Rice and in fact, several transferred AFTER he was let go, not before. Rice was wrong, no one would argue that, but did anyone ask the question if any of those tapes were AFTER he received counseling? Or is the idea that Pernetti actually HELPED someone become a better person so repugnant that it doesn't matter? No doubt an unpopular questions on this board which can be so proud of the pristine pure SJU program and university.
Click to expand...

Not sure why you ask your last line about STJ vs. this thread.

Yes the tapes were before his counseling. It was made pretty clear that the tapes were older and Murdoch had them and was trying to get $ out of Rutgers and only when they finally said no he made them public. By that time Rice was disciplined and went to counseling already.


Do you feel that Rice shouldn't have been let go?
Click to expand...

No, I don't think Rice or Pernetti should have been let go. Rice went to counseling and was being closely monitored and IMO Pernetti handled the situation maturely and effectively. Yes, Rice was over the top but a lot of coaches are. He was wrong although I come from a different generation and I don't believe I played for a coach in my life that would not have been fired by today's "standards." And that includes both High School (3 sports) and college (basketball). IMO, there is a bigger picture here and that is that the Star-Ledger has gone after Rutgers at every opportunity. They tried to get Schiano and failed. They have gone after Stringer and failed. They went after Rice and with the help of ESPN got him. But again, and I know those tapes are damning and I leave myself wide open here, IMO they are still taken out of context. My grandfather always told me that if you lay out the worst 10 things any human being has done over a lifetime heaven would be a lonely place; I never forgot that and think it is a good "smell" test when judging others. Murdock went after Rutgers for money pure and simple and he found willing bed fellows in the Ledger and ESPN, both of which have proven to be less than ethical institutions. Now, that doesn't excuse Rice but in talking to the several RU players I know, he is a good man with a horrible temper and there are a lot of them around. All three of them told me they thought his only motivation was to make them better players so they never took personal offense to his tactics. They didn't always like them but they also told me there was a very positive side to his personality which obviously wasn't going to sell papers or raise Sportscenter ratings so, well that's life in this world. Again, maybe I would feel differently had just ONE player come out against him but they didn't and I think that speaks volumes. As for the AD, I don't put much stock in things that happened 20 years ago and then come out of the woodwork. Finally, the SJU comment; it was meant as a "glass house" type comment but frankly it was not germane and very lame and you are on the money calling me on it - my bad.
Click to expand...

Appreciate your response. I personally feel the Pernetti was unjustly fired. I think the reason Rice was primarily let go was the things he said not the actions he did on those tapes. Rutgers reeling from the death of the student who jumped from the GW Bridge after being called those same names and such was what I felt put it over the top.

As for why players did not come out? I feel players won't come out for fear of being blackballed. They would look soft then.

Lastly for this string of events. Everything they have done in this case has been bad. Not coming full clean on what happened in the first place, then the staggered firings. Then touting the graduate Eddie Jordan coming home, now hiring an AD who wasn't on the list of over 40 targets they were given and also the fact that she herself has a Mike Rice incident on her record, regardless of how long ago. If they didn't just fire people for the same actions then fine go ahead and hire her. But by firing one for another its hypocritical and ass backwards to a T.
Click to expand...

As someone stated, Rice was investigated, disciplined, and that should have been end of story. Funny, ESPN or the Ledger both neglected to mention the only reason the tapes were made public is because Murdock wasn't successful in blackmailing Rutgers. Regarding the players, like I said, I talked to several that I have known for a couple of years and none of them spoke poorly of Rice. Finally, the string of events; I am not trying to say RU is well run and this is all smoke and mirrors but to me it does not warrant the coverage it has been given. After Rice, Jordan doesn't have a degree, well you don't need one to coach. RU had literature that had him down as a graduate and that is lame , but front page news? Worthy of ticker time on ESPN? I am surprised that Hermann has that much baggage and I think it stupid RU made the decision they made but again I don't see anything really there. It is all much ado about very little IMO.
 
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