Robbins - Ugliness Oozes from Red Zone
- Thread starter ctstorm
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Class of 72
Active member
For those of us that use mobile devices and do not subscribe to the NYP could you paste the relevant paragraphs? Thanks.
He expressed his disgust at some of the low brow chants coming from our student section at games this week and so far this season and called for the school to deal with the issue swiftly and forcefully.
Can't say that I disagree with him.
"...I didn’t find anything clever about the St. John’s fans in the student section that were chanting “U of Gay” as a mocking retort to Arizona fans’ chant of “U of A” at the Garden yesterday for the 2K Sports Classic."
and...
"...But then some fans in the “Redzone” came up with this clever refrain: “Suck my Johnnies!” In the next section over, I see a few kids with their parents who are listening to this. Not good."
rawdognyc
Well-known member
I must be getting old. Or losing my sense of humor. Or wit.
Because I didn’t find anything clever about the St. John’s fans in the student section that were chanting “U of Gay” as a mocking retort to Arizona fans’ chant of “U of A” at the Garden yesterday for the 2K Sports Classic.
I’m looking at these young, energetic, supposed future leaders crammed into the “Redzone” section behind the basket and I think, “What if one of their friends who is gay is sitting in that section, listening to this homophobic venting?”
Maybe that young man or woman is wondering: “Is the university I attend, which is located in the most socially diverse city in the world, the right place for me?”
And then, a really alarming thought: “If New York isn’t the right place for me — a safe place — then maybe there’s no place in the world a gay or lesbian college student can be embraced.”
Maybe New York can be as hostile as Laramie, Wyoming. ... No, there must have been something witty I missed.
But then some fans in the “Redzone” came up with this clever refrain: “Suck my Johnnies!” In the next section over, I see a few kids with their parents who are listening to this. Not good.
Once again, those St. John’s students have left me wondering what kind of education they’re getting at home or at school. Why is there so much ignorance and hate running through their heads?
They have a basketball program that’s on the rise, and are the only collegiate fans who can call The World’s Most Famous Arena home. Yet instead of coming up with something clever, something TV would show over and over, something that would reaffirm to the world fans in New York are smarter, edgier, more creative than anywhere else, the St. John’s students behind the basket open their mouths and you cringe.
I know these students are capable of original, witty material. When rugged forward God’sgift Achiuwa makes a good play, he’s rewarded with chants of “God’s On Our Side!”
Yet more often, they think hostility, profanity and insensitivity are better. It’s not. It’s just easier.
“It was brought to our attention,’’ St. John’s athletic director Chris Monasch told The Post. “There are mechanisms in place to address fan behavior at games through different leaderships groups on campus.’’
So address it, St. John’s. Address it hard.
The next time a similar cheer emanates from the student section, toss them all. Give them the bum’s rush to the door. Confiscate their student IDs and force them to attend a sensitivity workshop.
“After the chanting that occurred at Carnesecca earlier this week, my team coordinated with Athletics to get the email addresses of the student season ticket-holders so that the Redzone Rights and Responsibilities statement could be reissued,’’ Kathryn T. Hutchinson, St. John’s vice president for student affairs, said in a statement.
Hutchinson said the university would create and distribute a flier reminding those in the “Redzone” what is proper behavior. An announcement will be made before games and a video will be shown on the scoreboard. It’s a start.
The “Redzone” sections at Carnesecca are now elevated and behind the baskets. There are some cool customers for sure. The ones who hold up the “Lavinwood” signs, an homage to coach Steve “West Coast” Lavin, come to mind.
So here’s the challenge for those fans that have lost their way: Your team is loaded with talented, respectful players that should only get better as they mature. Follow their lead.
Because I didn’t find anything clever about the St. John’s fans in the student section that were chanting “U of Gay” as a mocking retort to Arizona fans’ chant of “U of A” at the Garden yesterday for the 2K Sports Classic.
I’m looking at these young, energetic, supposed future leaders crammed into the “Redzone” section behind the basket and I think, “What if one of their friends who is gay is sitting in that section, listening to this homophobic venting?”
Maybe that young man or woman is wondering: “Is the university I attend, which is located in the most socially diverse city in the world, the right place for me?”
And then, a really alarming thought: “If New York isn’t the right place for me — a safe place — then maybe there’s no place in the world a gay or lesbian college student can be embraced.”
Maybe New York can be as hostile as Laramie, Wyoming. ... No, there must have been something witty I missed.
But then some fans in the “Redzone” came up with this clever refrain: “Suck my Johnnies!” In the next section over, I see a few kids with their parents who are listening to this. Not good.
Once again, those St. John’s students have left me wondering what kind of education they’re getting at home or at school. Why is there so much ignorance and hate running through their heads?
They have a basketball program that’s on the rise, and are the only collegiate fans who can call The World’s Most Famous Arena home. Yet instead of coming up with something clever, something TV would show over and over, something that would reaffirm to the world fans in New York are smarter, edgier, more creative than anywhere else, the St. John’s students behind the basket open their mouths and you cringe.
I know these students are capable of original, witty material. When rugged forward God’sgift Achiuwa makes a good play, he’s rewarded with chants of “God’s On Our Side!”
Yet more often, they think hostility, profanity and insensitivity are better. It’s not. It’s just easier.
“It was brought to our attention,’’ St. John’s athletic director Chris Monasch told The Post. “There are mechanisms in place to address fan behavior at games through different leaderships groups on campus.’’
So address it, St. John’s. Address it hard.
The next time a similar cheer emanates from the student section, toss them all. Give them the bum’s rush to the door. Confiscate their student IDs and force them to attend a sensitivity workshop.
“After the chanting that occurred at Carnesecca earlier this week, my team coordinated with Athletics to get the email addresses of the student season ticket-holders so that the Redzone Rights and Responsibilities statement could be reissued,’’ Kathryn T. Hutchinson, St. John’s vice president for student affairs, said in a statement.
Hutchinson said the university would create and distribute a flier reminding those in the “Redzone” what is proper behavior. An announcement will be made before games and a video will be shown on the scoreboard. It’s a start.
The “Redzone” sections at Carnesecca are now elevated and behind the baskets. There are some cool customers for sure. The ones who hold up the “Lavinwood” signs, an homage to coach Steve “West Coast” Lavin, come to mind.
So here’s the challenge for those fans that have lost their way: Your team is loaded with talented, respectful players that should only get better as they mature. Follow their lead.
tom in salem
Well-known member
Ugliness oozes from Redzone
Lenn Robbins
I must be getting old. Or losing my sense of humor. Or wit.
Because I didn’t find anything clever about the St. John’s fans in the student section that were chanting “U of Gay” as a mocking retort to Arizona fans’ chant of “U of A” at the Garden yesterday for the 2K Sports Classic.
I’m looking at these young, energetic, supposed future leaders crammed into the “Redzone” section behind the basket and I think, “What if one of their friends who is gay is sitting in that section, listening to this homophobic venting?”
Maybe that young man or woman is wondering: “Is the university I attend, which is located in the most socially diverse city in the world, the right place for me?”
And then, a really alarming thought: “If New York isn’t the right place for me — a safe place — then maybe there’s no place in the world a gay or lesbian college student can be embraced.”
Maybe New York can be as hostile as Laramie, Wyoming. ... No, there must have been something witty I missed.
But then some fans in the “Redzone” came up with this clever refrain: “Suck my Johnnies!” In the next section over, I see a few kids with their parents who are listening to this. Not good.
Once again, those St. John’s students have left me wondering what kind of education they’re getting at home or at school. Why is there so much ignorance and hate running through their heads?
They have a basketball program that’s on the rise, and are the only collegiate fans who can call The World’s Most Famous Arena home. Yet instead of coming up with something clever, something TV would show over and over, something that would reaffirm to the world fans in New York are smarter, edgier, more creative than anywhere else, the St. John’s students behind the basket open their mouths and you cringe.
I know these students are capable of original, witty material. When rugged forward God’sgift Achiuwa makes a good play, he’s rewarded with chants of “God’s On Our Side!”
Yet more often, they think hostility, profanity and insensitivity are better. It’s not. It’s just easier.
“It was brought to our attention,’’ St. John’s athletic director Chris Monasch told The Post. “There are mechanisms in place to address fan behavior at games through different leaderships groups on campus.’’
So address it, St. John’s. Address it hard.
The next time a similar cheer emanates from the student section, toss them all. Give them the bum’s rush to the door. Confiscate their student IDs and force them to attend a sensitivity workshop.
“After the chanting that occurred at Carnesecca earlier this week, my team coordinated with Athletics to get the email addresses of the student season ticket-holders so that the Redzone Rights and Responsibilities statement could be reissued,’’ Kathryn T. Hutchinson, St. John’s vice president for student affairs, said in a statement.
Hutchinson said the university would create and distribute a flier reminding those in the “Redzone” what is proper behavior. An announcement will be made before games and a video will be shown on the scoreboard. It’s a start.
The “Redzone” sections at Carnesecca are now elevated and behind the baskets. There are some cool customers for sure. The ones who hold up the “Lavinwood” signs, an homage to coach Steve “West Coast” Lavin, come to mind.
So here’s the challenge for those fans that have lost their way: Your team is loaded with talented, respectful players that should only get better as they mature. Follow their lead.
lenn.robbins@nypost.com
Read more:http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/coll..._redzone_kiJ1or9sJn0nuMGlODiNkI#ixzz1eAkydvne
beast of the east
Active member
Ehh, I think our student section isn't going to change, so we may as well live with it.
I was worried they woould finish the "U of A" chant by adding "holes" to the "A-"
Great turnout by our students - they are pumped and in the game.
I was worried they woould finish the "U of A" chant by adding "holes" to the "A-"
Great turnout by our students - they are pumped and in the game.
Class of 72
Active member
My hearing is not what it used to be! I thoughts the students were chanting U R Gay! Big deal!
Suck my Johnny? I have been hearing U Suck for 40 years at basketball games.
Suck my Johnny? I have been hearing U Suck for 40 years at basketball games.
TRabinowitz
Member
Let me first say that all in all, I agree with Robbins. While I don't believe in getting completely hissy and upset about JOKES, the fact is that there are children killing themselves over the types of things they're hearing (including jokes) from their peers, religious leaders, politicians and now at things like sporting events. I think it doesn't give a school, especially in a place like NYC that thrives off of diversity, a good name.
However, Robbins' language and anecdotes in this article are a bit extreme. Comparing a joke by a student section to Laramie, WY (where Matthew Shepard was murdered for being gay) is wayyyyy extreme. His other language is very overdramatic as well (in typical Robbins fashion).
It should also be noted that St. John's doesn't allow an LGBT group to be formed on campus, so I don't want to see the school pretend to get upset about this when the fact is that they basically enable this by telling LGBT kids that they don't have the right to start a group up to help raise awareness about these exact types of things.
However, Robbins' language and anecdotes in this article are a bit extreme. Comparing a joke by a student section to Laramie, WY (where Matthew Shepard was murdered for being gay) is wayyyyy extreme. His other language is very overdramatic as well (in typical Robbins fashion).
It should also be noted that St. John's doesn't allow an LGBT group to be formed on campus, so I don't want to see the school pretend to get upset about this when the fact is that they basically enable this by telling LGBT kids that they don't have the right to start a group up to help raise awareness about these exact types of things.
rawdognyc
Well-known member
It's a flippin catholic university....why would they allow a group to be formed that goes against their teachings, or the teachings of the bible?? people just look for anything to b*tch about nowadays. This country is becoming a bunch of sissies and its pathetic. Children are being raised to be hypersensitive, hence the reason they are hurting themselves over words.Pathetic
upstate redman
Member
I happen to disagree with Len as usual. First off, he went way over the top, and made it seem like St. John's and the student section are intolerable people, and made them out to be villains. Lets get real, its 930 on a Thursday night, first game at MSG, playing nationally ranked Zona. You expect our student section to sit on their hands all game? I was sitting in the 100 level near out students and to be honest I laughed. I didn't think it was the right thing to say, but I also was not offended and was happy they at least did something to combat the U of A chant. I was with my dad, whose 58 and generally against stupid chants, he asked me what they were saying and when I told him he chuckled. My friend, a cuse grad actually turned to be and said "great chant by Johnies students." I think the point was to get back at the Zona fans in jest, they were not actually being derogatory. I have heard much worse from going to games of all sports around the country at various schools. I would however, like the student section to do some things I have caught on from other schools, and I thought there chant added to Zona's presence bc it was hard to decipher the 2 unless you were close by. While I think it is inappropriate in public and might make our fans look ignorant, I am not going to lose sleep over it, but I think as a whole the student section has energy, they just need to focus it more and come up with some chants that are consistent, and try to get the older people in the stands going. How about, when the band plays the hey song instead of hey,u suck, maybe do an S, then J, then U, then after everyone yells SJU? Or when the band plays the uptempo one, don't really know the name of the song after everyone says lets go storm or something? I don't know I just wish there was more consistent chants, where we don't need to resolve to mocking others chants.
Why?
Because calling someone an A-hole is somehow worse than calling them gay or telling them to suck your johnnie?
Bottomline is that Its a classless thing to do.
If you are comfortable with people representing your institution in that fashion...so be it. There are plenty of classless people in the world.
I understand that kids will be kids but adults need to be adults and point out to them that their behavior makes the team, the staff, and the school look bad.
TRabinowitz
Member
So if we go your route, there shouldn't be a barber or allow someone to cut hair on campus (Leviticus 19:27), serve pork on campus (Leviticus 11:7), not plant more than one kind of greenery on campus (Leviticus 19:19), or serve shellfish on campus (Leviticus 11:11). Children aren't being raised to be hypersensitive, children by nature ARE sensitive and insecure (go read a book by a child psychologist if you don't believe this), and having people of power constantly railing against them takes a toll. This is nothing new in society so don't say "nowadays" because children have been running away from home and killing themselves for decades now because of this.
Lets not go down this road. First of all, the R&P forum has been closed for very good reasons, and secondly, you are going to end up having to defend an indefensible position with regards to the Catholic church's public stance on this issue and its private actions.
Let's keep the religion and politics to PM's.
TRabinowitz
Member
It's been going on for DECADES. It has nothing to do with "nowadays". The difference now is that there is more public outrage over the issue because society has progressed (with exception of some institutions *cough cough*).
Yes!
Because there is absolutely NO difference between telling someone "u stink" and telling them "you should preform oral sex on me"...
inch: Again, something tells me that Lavin isn't as big a supporter of the image those actions display on NATIONAL television.
Its one thing to be a jackass/racist/bigot/homophobe/whatever in the comfort of one's own home. Its an ENTIRELY different thing when you act that way in public or when representing a business or institution.
beast of the east
Active member
I railed against profane based chants last year, and got into it with a bunch of students. I'm not in favor of it, and wouldn't be too upset if the school stepped on it a little, but I'm not going to the wall against it anymore.
What bothers me about this thread is that some of those inflamed by the student chants are pointedly more upset with "U of Gay" as a sign of intolerance.
I would heartily disagree as to what that chant symbolizes. Yea, when someone is called gay, it STILL has a negative connotation. A guy wears a pink tie or something alittle flamboyant to work, and he will get some not so subtle reference to his sexuality. Do something a little feminine, and your friends will joke about the same. Does it equate to the full charge of homophobic behavior? THAT'S A STRETCH.
Listen, without calling a kid out who might not even be gay, we have a GREAT dancer on the SJU dance team, who is cat-called by NOONE, and appreciated by many. He is perhaps the best dancer on the team, the only guy on the team, and I'VE NEVER HEARD A SINGLE CHANT OR SHOUT against him.
In street vernacular, even pimrary school kids will rant "That's so gay, Mom!" without having a clue to sexuality. I don't think our students were making any threats or veiled references - it just rhymed with U of A, and there's that ever present negative connotation - the stuff of which makes people roar on "Modern Family" - the top comedy on TV.
Now, if we had player American University, commonly and with a large shred of truth, called Gay U. instead of A.U. for it's large gay population, I'd say these posts have more validity.
What bothers me about this thread is that some of those inflamed by the student chants are pointedly more upset with "U of Gay" as a sign of intolerance.
I would heartily disagree as to what that chant symbolizes. Yea, when someone is called gay, it STILL has a negative connotation. A guy wears a pink tie or something alittle flamboyant to work, and he will get some not so subtle reference to his sexuality. Do something a little feminine, and your friends will joke about the same. Does it equate to the full charge of homophobic behavior? THAT'S A STRETCH.
Listen, without calling a kid out who might not even be gay, we have a GREAT dancer on the SJU dance team, who is cat-called by NOONE, and appreciated by many. He is perhaps the best dancer on the team, the only guy on the team, and I'VE NEVER HEARD A SINGLE CHANT OR SHOUT against him.
In street vernacular, even pimrary school kids will rant "That's so gay, Mom!" without having a clue to sexuality. I don't think our students were making any threats or veiled references - it just rhymed with U of A, and there's that ever present negative connotation - the stuff of which makes people roar on "Modern Family" - the top comedy on TV.
Now, if we had player American University, commonly and with a large shred of truth, called Gay U. instead of A.U. for it's large gay population, I'd say these posts have more validity.
TR, I agree with you for the most part on this issue but SJU has the right as a private institution to keep its head in the sand on this issue if it chooses to.
If students don't think the school's position on their lifestlye/sexuality is appropriate they are free to go to another school.
But at the end of the day, that has little if anything to do with Robbins article.