Questions On Our Previous Coaches

[RedmanMike]

Gents - the two main takeaways from the Jarvis/Norm years are these…

1. If Jarvis had taken the Wizards job in 2000 and not jerked Jordan around over salary, then Jay Wright (then at Hofstra) was ready and wiling to take the job. We’d have been a perennial top 20 team

2. When Jarvis was fired, Bob McKillop had finished his 10th year at Davidson. He would have walked to Queens to take the job. Had St. John’s done their smart thing and hired him then instead of Norm, we would have been a perennial to 20 team.

Instead, neither of those two things happened, and we spent twenty years wandering in the wilderness.

 

[SJU85]

Does anyone know the name of this strip club and if it still exists? I'm in Pittsburgh a lot and would like to go visit it. For historical research purposes of course.

The problem with Lavin had less to do with the actual numbers and whether he made us somewhat relevant again(he did, somewhat), and more to do with the fact that the success levels never matched the level of talent he had(except for his first year), and there always seemed to be turmoil surrounding the team. Those are 2 signs of a not so good coach.

As much as I hate to admit this, I agree with most of LMF's assessment of him, and expressed those same concerns about him when he was hired.

I expressed my concerns on his lack of coaching ability here. We had a poster (I forgot who, it might have been Doc Butler) who sang his praises and said he could coach. I eventually warmed up to it but was very skeptical. My concerns were justfied and proved to be on the mark.

Nice and personable guy, just not a head coach and after Dunlap, there really wasn’t much help for him on the bench as Kesey was limited in what he was allowed to do.

He deserves credit for getting us at least back on the map and in the conversation. Remember how giddy this board was with his first recruiting class. We kept getting players.

 

[Beasts of the East]

Gents - the two main takeaways from the Jarvis/Norm years are these…

1. If Jarvis had taken the Wizards job in 2000 and not jerked Jordan around over salary, then Jay Wright (then at Hofstra) was ready and wiling to take the job. We’d have been a perennial top 20 team

2. When Jarvis was fired, Bob McKillop had finished his 10th year at Davidson. He would have walked to Queens to take the job. Had St. John’s done their smart thing and hired him then instead of Norm, we would have been a perennial to 20 team.

Instead, neither of those two things happened, and we spent twenty years wandering in the wilderness.

If Joe Lapchick wasn't forced to retire, we'd have signed Alcindor, Walton, Shaq, Kobe, and Erving. Lapchick would still be our coach and Carnesecca would be ready to step in when he retired. If Gordon Thomas didn't muff a 5 foot shot, we'd have been in the Final Four. If Artest didn't sleepwalk through the first half vs Ohio State, we'd have another. If Pitino was 35, he'd be gone next season.

 

[paultzman]

If Joe Lapchick wasn't forced to retire, we'd have signed Alcindor, Walton, Shaq, Kobe, and Erving. Lapchick would still be our coach and Carnesecca would be ready to step in when he retired. If Gordon Thomas didn't muff a 5 foot shot, we'd have been in the Final Four. If Artest didn't sleepwalk through the first half vs Ohio State, we'd have another. If Pitino was 35, he'd be gone next season.

“We are woulda, coulda, shoulda University”

 

[kranmars]

I expressed my concerns on his lack of coaching ability here. We had a poster (I forgot who, it might have been Doc Butler) who sang his praises and said he could coach. I eventually warmed up to it but was very skeptical. My concerns were justfied and proved to be on the mark.

Nice and personable guy, just not a head coach and after Dunlap, there really wasn’t much help for him on the bench as Kesey was limited in what he was allowed to do.

He deserves credit for getting us at least back on the map and in the conversation. Remember how giddy this board was with his first recruiting class. We kept getting players.

While Lavin was recovering from cancer, he was unable to be on the bench. He instead sat in one of the boxes, observed while also invited HS players to sit with him during the games as a recruiting tool. Lavin was able to chat them up, and no one can argue that he did that superbly.

I remember he told reporters that he is more “GM-ing” at the moment (yes, he used that exact word).

I bring this up because he was the first to ever mention a role of GM in college sports. People found it strange at the time, and the University was not thrilled with paying him to be a “GM” either.

But even if it was unintentional, Lavin created a position that fit his skill set perfectly. I think he would make a great college basketball GM in today’s NIL environment.

 

[Knight]

If Jay W. was signed, the environment was not conducive to him having the same success that he enjoyed at Nova.

 

[MainMan]

A woman from a Pittsburgh strip club was brought back to a players hotel room. It was agreed that the woman would have sex with multiple players for money. After the players ran a train on her, they refused to pay her. The woman threatened if they did not pay, she would call the cops and say she was raped. A quick thinking Ingram recorded or videod this on his cell phone and saved the day.

Memorieeeeeeees light the corners of my mind.
Misty, watercolored memoriiiieessss of the way we were!

 

[espken]

If Joe Lapchick wasn't forced to retire, we'd have signed Alcindor, Walton, Shaq, Kobe, and Erving. Lapchick would still be our coach and Carnesecca would be ready to step in when he retired. If Gordon Thomas didn't muff a 5 foot shot, we'd have been in the Final Four. If Artest didn't sleepwalk through the first half vs Ohio State, we'd have another. If Pitino was 35, he'd be gone next season.

Decades late, always short

 

[Beasts of the East]

“We are woulda, coulda, shoulda University”

Even in the midst of one of the brightest seasons in our experience, we still are compelled to re-live the garbage years. Sick bunch we are. It's like a rich guy lamenting that he went hungry growing up.

 

[Beasts of the East]

I remember the first game after the Pittsburgh incident at the Garden against BC. They had like 6-7 players dressed and they asked Rutledge to unretire to assist the rest of the season.

That was the lowest of all lows. For the first time I feared for the future of the program because they were not just bad, they now crossed over into the dark and made the university a national punch line.

You could just imagine the salacious headlines that wrote themselves about the largest Catholic university in the country.

Plus, Fr. Harrington did not care about the program very much and did not invest in its infrastructure. That was what caused the original rift between Jarvis and the university. He felt they went back on their word.

Cannot believe it will be almost 21 years.

The lowest of the lows is reserved for the woman who hooked up with a bunch of our players and didn't get paid. Slice did less for a few million.

 

[mjmaherjr]

If Jay W. was signed, the environment was not conducive to him having the same success that he enjoyed at Nova.

Not true because he would have gotten those same early recruits. That’s not even speculation. One of our own here knows them all

 

[paultzman]

Not true because he would have gotten those same early recruits. That’s not even speculation. One of our own here knows them all

LI Panthers had a slew of great ones & Gary Charles was lucky to have such a popular, respected number two guy for many years.

 

[lawmanfan]

Not true because he would have gotten those same early recruits. That’s not even speculation. One of our own here knows them all

As MJM knows, my historical advice (some good, some bad) to the SJU AD was:

1. Hire Jay Wright. (They hired He Who Shall Not Be Named instead).
2. Hire Seth Greenberg. (They hired Lavin).
3. Hire a Hurley. Any Hurley. Or maybe Archie Miller. (They hired Mullin).
4. Don't hire Porter Moser. Beyond that I had no advice, nobody wanted the job. I was OK with Anderson as the equivalent of buying a Buick.

I had my concerns about the Pitino hire (not from a coaching standpoint, that is and always has been beyond criticism) and to some extent still do, but it has certainly gone wonderfully well from program-building and court success standpoint up until now, and I expect it will continue for the next few years until he retires. We will cross that bridge when we get there, and probably in a much stronger position than when he arrived.

 

[mjmaherjr]

As MJM knows, my historical advice (some good, some bad) to the SJU AD was:

1. Hire Jay Wright. (They hired He Who Shall Not Be Named instead).
2. Hire Seth Greenberg. (They hired Lavin).
3. Hire a Hurley. Any Hurley. Or maybe Archie Miller. (They hired Mullin).
4. Don't hire Porter Moser. Beyond that I had no advice, nobody wanted the job. I was OK with Anderson as the equivalent of buying a Buick.

I had my concerns about the Pitino hire (not from a coaching standpoint, that is and always has been beyond criticism) and to some extent still do, but it has certainly gone wonderfully well from program-building and court success standpoint up until now, and I expect it will continue for the next few years until he retires. We will cross that bridge when we get there, and probably in a much stronger position than when he arrived.

I agree with everything you said except Kranmars said Pitino is working here till he’s 80 and we all know how smart Kranmars is so im going with him on the till 80 part

 

[kranmars]

I agree with everything you said except Kranmars said Pitino is working here till he’s 80 and we all know how smart Kranmars is so im going with him on the till 80 part

Well I am anything but smart, which is of course, is a nice way of calling myself dumb.

Despite my intellectual shortcomings (another flowery example of calling myself dumb), I am sticking to my prediction of 80, which is the new Pitino 65 anyway.

 

[panther2]

Not true because he would have gotten those same early recruits. That’s not even speculation. One of our own here knows them all

Jay Wright would definitely have been successful here. The problem was that Mike Jarvis was hired in the spring of 1998. At that time, Jay Wright was not "Jay Wright". During the two seasons prior to Mike Jarvis' hiring, his record at Hofstra was 12-15 and 19-12 in Speedy Claxton's freshman and sophmore years. The following two years, Hofstra won over 20 games.

In the spring of 1998, no one could have predicted that Jay Wright would end up being a Hall of Fame coach. Fun fact, Jay Wright told me that when he was at Hofstra, St John's was his Dream Job.

As far as him being successful at St John's, that would not have been a problem. While Gary Charles and I disagreed of some things, we both respected Jay Wright. Jay Wright was hired at Villanova in 2000 and his first recruiting class included Jason Fraser and Curtis Sumpter, who played for the Panthers throughout their high school careers, and Allen Ray who played in a few tournaments with us. Daryll Hill, Tim Doyle, and Charlie Villaneuva were also ion that our team that won every Adidas tournament throughout the summer of 2001. All of them would have signed with St Johns if Jay Wright was our coach. The next year we had Sammy Mejia, Lamont Hamilton, and Charlie was also in the class of 2002. Eric King was aalready at St John having graduated in 2000. Barring injury, the players mentioned would have had St John's in the Top 10 throughout their college careers.

Unfortunately, in 2000 Villanova fired Steve Lappas and hired Jay Wright. The rest is history.

 

[SJU85]

Jay Wright would definitely have been successful here. The problem was that Mike Jarvis was hired in the spring of 1998. At that time, Jay Wright was not "Jay Wright". During the two seasons prior to Mike Jarvis' hiring, his record at Hofstra was 12-15 and 19-12 in Speedy Claxton's freshman and sophmore years. The following two years, Hofstra won over 20 games.

In the spring of 1998, no one could have predicted that Jay Wright would end up being a Hall of Fame coach. Fun fact, Jay Wright told me that when he was at Hofstra, St John's was his Dream Job.

As far as him being successful at St John's, that would not have been a problem. While Gary Charles and I disagreed of some things, we both respected Jay Wright. Jay Wright was hired at Villanova in 2000 and his first recruiting class included Jason Fraser and Curtis Sumpter, who played for the Panthers throughout their high school careers, and Allen Ray who played in a few tournaments with us. Daryll Hill, Tim Doyle, and Charlie Villaneuva were also ion that our team that won every Adidas tournament throughout the summer of 2001. All of them would have signed with St Johns if Jay Wright was our coach. The next year we had Sammy Mejia, Lamont Hamilton, and Charlie was also in the class of 2002. Eric King was aalready at St John having graduated in 2000. Barring injury, the players mentioned would have had St John's in the Top 10 throughout their college careers.

Unfortunately, in 2000 Villanova fired Steve Lappas and hired Jay Wright. The rest is history.

I told you I needed a drink before reading what players we were talking about but now

 

[paultzman]

I suspect if we even win a national championship, we would still dredge up Lapchick getting forced to retire, Fran getting canned, Jarvis era, Norm’s hire, Mulzoff getting the gig, et al. ENOUGH

 

[Delaware]

Jay Wright would definitely have been successful here. The problem was that Mike Jarvis was hired in the spring of 1998. At that time, Jay Wright was not "Jay Wright". During the two seasons prior to Mike Jarvis' hiring, his record at Hofstra was 12-15 and 19-12 in Speedy Claxton's freshman and sophmore years. The following two years, Hofstra won over 20 games.

In the spring of 1998, no one could have predicted that Jay Wright would end up being a Hall of Fame coach. Fun fact, Jay Wright told me that when he was at Hofstra, St John's was his Dream Job.

As far as him being successful at St John's, that would not have been a problem. While Gary Charles and I disagreed of some things, we both respected Jay Wright. Jay Wright was hired at Villanova in 2000 and his first recruiting class included Jason Fraser and Curtis Sumpter, who played for the Panthers throughout their high school careers, and Allen Ray who played in a few tournaments with us. Daryll Hill, Tim Doyle, and Charlie Villaneuva were also ion that our team that won every Adidas tournament throughout the summer of 2001. All of them would have signed with St Johns if Jay Wright was our coach. The next year we had Sammy Mejia, Lamont Hamilton, and Charlie was also in the class of 2002. Eric King was aalready at St John having graduated in 2000. Barring injury, the players mentioned would have had St John's in the Top 10 throughout their college careers.

Unfortunately, in 2000 Villanova fired Steve Lappas and hired Jay Wright. The rest is history.

Twice in our history, first with Joe Lapchick, and then with Jay Wright. Oh my, what could have been....

 

[mjmaherjr]

My

Jay Wright would definitely have been successful here. The problem was that Mike Jarvis was hired in the spring of 1998. At that time, Jay Wright was not "Jay Wright". During the two seasons prior to Mike Jarvis' hiring, his record at Hofstra was 12-15 and 19-12 in Speedy Claxton's freshman and sophmore years. The following two years, Hofstra won over 20 games.

In the spring of 1998, no one could have predicted that Jay Wright would end up being a Hall of Fame coach. Fun fact, Jay Wright told me that when he was at Hofstra, St John's was his Dream Job.

As far as him being successful at St John's, that would not have been a problem. While Gary Charles and I disagreed of some things, we both respected Jay Wright. Jay Wright was hired at Villanova in 2000 and his first recruiting class included Jason Fraser and Curtis Sumpter, who played for the Panthers throughout their high school careers, and Allen Ray who played in a few tournaments with us. Daryll Hill, Tim Doyle, and Charlie Villaneuva were also ion that our team that won every Adidas tournament throughout the summer of 2001. All of them would have signed with St Johns if Jay Wright was our coach. The next year we had Sammy Mejia, Lamont Hamilton, and Charlie was also in the class of 2002. Eric King was aalready at St John having graduated in 2000. Barring injury, the players mentioned would have had St John's in the Top 10 throughout their college careers.

Unfortunately, in 2000 Villanova fired Steve Lappas and hired Jay Wright. The rest is history.

My liver might not survive tonight after reading this