(POST GAME) @Marquette, Tues. Jan. 21, 9pm, FS-1 / 970AM WNYM

[quote="MJDinkins" post=373763][quote="Beast of the East" post=373757][quote="usguard" post=373753]Yes and practice shooting as should the whole team I could be wrong but it looks like we are the worst shooting team in the league and we still are in most games until we fall apart with 5 mins to go[/quote]

Do you really think that college players don't practice shooting?[/quote]

He's trolling.

By the way, Zaun.... Why do you continue to over exaggerate Alexander's injury? He broke his arm, if I'm not mistaken. He didn't tear any ligaments in his lower extremities. I've played sports with quite a few folks who had either broken a finger, hand, arm or leg, and most of 'em never had a recurring issue to my knowledge.

I haven't heard anything about Alexander's injury being serious. He's played almost a full season of high school basketball and there hasn't been not one mention of his injury. You're painting a false narrative as it falls in line with your Eeyore scenario.

Be honest..... Have you ever seen Posh play an entire game? How many times have you witnessed him play? I'll say it again, based on reports, Alexander seems more fit to play PG or be a floor general more so than Dunn. If so, then that means there's a difference in overall play and it better suits the team, whether Posh's shot is flawed or not.

I also still suspect an additional scholarship or two (or three) will open up after the season.[/quote]

I've seen lots of Posh videos. I've also seen his stats. Somewhere in the 20% range from 3 so clearly not a shooter. He's undersized and his slashing style is similar to Dunn and his size. I think Posh is more explosive but other than that, not sure how much more he brings than Dunn. He was a solid get, but I highly doubt he's a program changer. I've always said CMA will likely fail without routinely getting 4 star talent here. I just don't think he can really compete with 2-3 star kids in this conference. He still has time but he really needs to get some legit high major studs for the next class. He can patch holes with grad transfers hopefully but I hate relying on those.
 
[quote="NCJohnnie" post=373752]Mike Zaun wrote: If we're able to somehow miraculously get an NIT bid I'd consider this year a success overall. But the way things are trending at 1-6 and the rock bottom of the league again (beginning to feel normal to be there), how do you see 4 more wins?

Mike, to answer your question, I think we need to beat Depaul Saturday at their place. If we do that we have 6 of our last 10 at home and I can definitely see us winning 3 of those.[/quote]

"I think we need to beat Depaul Saturday at their place."
I don't see us winning @ DePaul. I see our next win being vs. Georgetown. I think we're going winless on the road. Hope I'm wrong.
 
There is a difference taking 50 shot S
and 250 shots Also there is a right way to practice shooting with supervision making sure a staff member is watching to keep pointing out what you can do better not just having you go take a bunch of shots. It’s like practicing the piano
Practice an hour a day and you can play some songs practice much more and if you have talent you become really good
A
Chris Mullin was a gym rat and it paid off
Guess what I am saying if you want to be very good at something you need to put in the time and hard work to achieve it
 
[quote="MJDinkins" post=373711][quote="Mike Zaun" post=373703]I knew this season was over several games ago. I just don't see all the hope next year and beyond. Posh coming off major injury and is a 4 star recruit, but he basically slashes like Dunn. He can't shoot. Wusu also not a shooter. Heron and LJ (likely) gone which removes 2 guys who can make occasional 3's. How on earth are we going to be better than this year losing those 2 guys and pinning our hopes on 1 player (Cole) to maybe make 3's regularly? Also doubt our bigs problem is addressed. I think there's a very good chance we do worse next year losing 2 of our best players and replacing them with whom? CMA has not really impressed recruiting wise yet. So many keep implying or flat out saying we have big upgrades coming but that's not true...at least I highly doubt it. We've now been a laughing stock for the better part of another decade and I'll be honest, my interest is waning.[/quote]

No offense, but maybe you'll stop repeating the same stuff--nearly verbatim--twice a week being your interest is waning. Honestly, I've been trying to give you the benefit of the doubt as you've been okay till the past few months.

The difference between Posh and Dunn is I believe Alexander is more of PG/floor general than Dunn. That can make difference, whether he's a flawed shooter or not.[/quote]

I agree Dink, plus we add McGriff as back up but both are pure point guards which should be a big help. Also, I don't believe that this staff is done recruiting. I think some more guys will out of here as they don't really fit CMA's system and if they can get more talented players then they will. I can see Caraher , Steere and Sears being gone after this year. Especially if they can get McMillan and Gray. I think there's a chance the roster could look very different next year.
 
[quote="Mean Gene" post=373771][quote="MJDinkins" post=373711][quote="Mike Zaun" post=373703]I knew this season was over several games ago. I just don't see all the hope next year and beyond. Posh coming off major injury and is a 4 star recruit, but he basically slashes like Dunn. He can't shoot. Wusu also not a shooter. Heron and LJ (likely) gone which removes 2 guys who can make occasional 3's. How on earth are we going to be better than this year losing those 2 guys and pinning our hopes on 1 player (Cole) to maybe make 3's regularly? Also doubt our bigs problem is addressed. I think there's a very good chance we do worse next year losing 2 of our best players and replacing them with whom? CMA has not really impressed recruiting wise yet. So many keep implying or flat out saying we have big upgrades coming but that's not true...at least I highly doubt it. We've now been a laughing stock for the better part of another decade and I'll be honest, my interest is waning.[/quote]

No offense, but maybe you'll stop repeating the same stuff--nearly verbatim--twice a week being your interest is waning. Honestly, I've been trying to give you the benefit of the doubt as you've been okay till the past few months.

The difference between Posh and Dunn is I believe Alexander is more of PG/floor general than Dunn. That can make difference, whether he's a flawed shooter or not.[/quote]

I agree Dink, plus we add McGriff as back up but both are pure point guards which should be a big help. Also, I don't believe that this staff is done recruiting. I think some more guys will out of here as they don't really fit CMA's system and if they can get more talented players then they will. I can see Caraher , Steere and Sears being gone after this year. Especially if they can get McMillan and Gray. I think there's a chance the roster could look very different next year.[/quote]

"I agree Dink, plus we add McGriff as back up but both are pure point guards which should be a big help."
Yes a pure PG, but I believe was a 2star recruit. I can't count on him next year to be a big help, but could be as a Jr & Sr.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=373760]We haven't had UConn here for a while and they would still take some of our recruits. We always lose out on the Kofi/Diallo/Briscoe/Lecque/Curbelo/Key type players with or without UConn. It's not UConn that is forcing us to suck...it's recruits realizing that we are the new DePaul because that's what we have been the last handful of years or so save for 1 year. Under Lavin we were just starting to establish ourselves as at worst a mid pack Big East team getting 10-8 records. We made the tourney a few times but never came close to our ceiling under him. That was the best we were ever getting with him. But feels like centuries ago I'd check my phone and regularly see "St. John's lands big time 4 star ________" and get all excited. Mullin didn't recruit and now we finally try but it might be too late and recruits may see us as a sinking ship. My point is Lavin was not enough for what we wanted. And now that looks like the high water mark. I never thought we would recruit so poorly after him. Bottom line, failure in recruiting is our own doing. That's what happens when you have disgusting conference records every year.[/quote]
I think we get your point. Doubt many here are happy where we are. It just seems sensible to see what CMA can accomplish over next several seasons to judge his potential to get program to very competitive level.

Besides complaining about it over and over, what exactly do you suggest Mike? If your goal is to get posters to all adopt your position, it is unlikely. Everyone’s degree of patience and moderation differ. This coming from a long time, passionate, somewhat impatient SJU fan. :)
 
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[quote="Mean Gene" post=373771][quote="MJDinkins" post=373711][quote="Mike Zaun" post=373703]I knew this season was over several games ago. I just don't see all the hope next year and beyond. Posh coming off major injury and is a 4 star recruit, but he basically slashes like Dunn. He can't shoot. Wusu also not a shooter. Heron and LJ (likely) gone which removes 2 guys who can make occasional 3's. How on earth are we going to be better than this year losing those 2 guys and pinning our hopes on 1 player (Cole) to maybe make 3's regularly? Also doubt our bigs problem is addressed. I think there's a very good chance we do worse next year losing 2 of our best players and replacing them with whom? CMA has not really impressed recruiting wise yet. So many keep implying or flat out saying we have big upgrades coming but that's not true...at least I highly doubt it. We've now been a laughing stock for the better part of another decade and I'll be honest, my interest is waning.[/quote]

No offense, but maybe you'll stop repeating the same stuff--nearly verbatim--twice a week being your interest is waning. Honestly, I've been trying to give you the benefit of the doubt as you've been okay till the past few months.

The difference between Posh and Dunn is I believe Alexander is more of PG/floor general than Dunn. That can make difference, whether he's a flawed shooter or not.[/quote]

I agree Dink, plus we add McGriff as back up but both are pure point guards which should be a big help. Also, I don't believe that this staff is done recruiting. I think some more guys will out of here as they don't really fit CMA's system and if they can get more talented players then they will. I can see Caraher , Steere and Sears being gone after this year. Especially if they can get McMillan and Gray. I think there's a chance the roster could look very different next year.[/quote]
Roster will look different for certain. Then we can judge prognosis going forward better. One step at a time.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=373735]My opinions are correlated with results and evidence. We have been something like 5-26 in conference play the last handful of years. I was very excited with the OOC performance, however it turned out to be obvious fool's gold. Believe me, I wish there were three 4 star guys with 2 being shooters and 1 being a big coming next year. That would give real hope because maybe we have several players who can shoot and perhaps a real big. But we don't have that coming in. We have a former 4 star Posh coming in but again coming off major injury and stats show he cannot shoot well. And he's like 5'9 and that's the highlight of our class. Cole's stats are exciting but we will see what he brings at this level. Wusu is a HS recruit, but he was recruited by schools like Wagner and St. Peter's. That's like MAAC level recruiting. I know you can't totally go off other offers to gauge a player's talent but it's probably a pretty good indicator.

I don't see that 4 star 6'11 260 lb center or a few big time shooters coming in aside from maybe Cole. Let me ask you guys, let's assume Cole shoots 50% from 3 for us next year. Great...who else is shooting? That's my point...no one else will be able to. So we would go from Heron and LJ who can make occasional 3's at least to Cole. That's from 2 to 1 3 PT threat and I see Posh essentially being Dunn. Rather going off emotion, I'm genuinely curious to see real responses to this.[/quote]

A 6'11 260LB back to the basket center wouldn't fit CMA's style anyway even if he was a 5 star kid. We bigs that are athletic and can run the floor.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=373767][quote="MJDinkins" post=373763][quote="Beast of the East" post=373757][quote="usguard" post=373753]Yes and practice shooting as should the whole team I could be wrong but it looks like we are the worst shooting team in the league and we still are in most games until we fall apart with 5 mins to go[/quote]

Do you really think that college players don't practice shooting?[/quote]

He's trolling.

By the way, Zaun.... Why do you continue to over exaggerate Alexander's injury? He broke his arm, if I'm not mistaken. He didn't tear any ligaments in his lower extremities. I've played sports with quite a few folks who had either broken a finger, hand, arm or leg, and most of 'em never had a recurring issue to my knowledge.

I haven't heard anything about Alexander's injury being serious. He's played almost a full season of high school basketball and there hasn't been not one mention of his injury. You're painting a false narrative as it falls in line with your Eeyore scenario.

Be honest..... Have you ever seen Posh play an entire game? How many times have you witnessed him play? I'll say it again, based on reports, Alexander seems more fit to play PG or be a floor general more so than Dunn. If so, then that means there's a difference in overall play and it better suits the team, whether Posh's shot is flawed or not.

I also still suspect an additional scholarship or two (or three) will open up after the season.[/quote]

I've seen lots of Posh videos. I've also seen his stats. Somewhere in the 20% range from 3 so clearly not a shooter. He's undersized and his slashing style is similar to Dunn and his size. I think Posh is more explosive but other than that, not sure how much more he brings than Dunn. He was a solid get, but I highly doubt he's a program changer. I've always said CMA will likely fail without routinely getting 4 star talent here. I just don't think he can really compete with 2-3 star kids in this conference. He still has time but he really needs to get some legit high major studs for the next class. He can patch holes with grad transfers hopefully but I hate relying on those.[/quote]

Videos typically doesn't show any misses. Besides, there's a difference between a point guard versus someone imitating one. That's not a knock on Dunn, but I don't view him as a point guard. He's a combo guard that can't shoot and doesn't particularly see the floor well. He can pretty much get to any spot on the floor, but it's certainly a mixed bag once he gets to the spot.

Frankly, Posh's height isn't a deterrent for me. As long as my point guard can run the show, then I'm not bothered by his height. IMO, his physique, speed, athleticism, and ability to see the floor (which I've heard) supersedes his height. As, far as his shooting is concerned.... Maybe, that'll come along in a couple years (particularly, if he has good form). Jagan Mosely couldn't shoot a lick when he first came to Georgetown. He quickly improved after his first season (slightly took a step back last year), and made a bigger leap this season. So, it can be done.
 
Probably our worst defensive effort thus far. The obvious mistake was leaving our man to help out in the middle thus allowing open three pointers. Just look at their defense last night as they never left Heron in the second half, allowing only one three point attempt. we on the other hand had no one near their three point efforts.
Since Earlington doesn't look like he gets off his feet to score after an offensive rebound it might behoove him to dunk to avoid the many blocks on his put backs.This should cause some fouls.
With all the minutes Williams gets he's going to have to give us more offense and score some points. We don't have enough scorers as it is.
We'll beat Marquette at home.
 
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No doubt it can be done and has been done. Just not by us yet. When we see my fav example of Jay Wright's transformation of Pacshall from not shooting a lick to a big time 3 PT threat here at St. John's, then I will acknowledge there's a real chance. But I haven't seen any players this year shoot much better and some are worse. Yes it's still early, but waiting to see that. To be clear I'm not giving up on CMA completely, but I'm not looking for a FInal Four berth in a rebuilding year and at the same time I'm not looking for 1-6. There's a large middle ground where we can be bad but not that bad. 6-12 is understandable at this juncture but not 1-3 wins all season even in this kind of year.

If we get Gray then that's a great get, but you guys already know one of our biggest issues is never getting those types of players at least in the past. We are 2 pure shooters (assuming Cole shoots well) and 1 real big 7 footer or so from being talented enough to hang. By the way, height is concerning with guards, because if they're under 6 ft they're much more susceptible to getting blocked. This happens to Dunn a lot.
 
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[quote="JackofVirginia" post=373780]Probably our worst defensive effort thus far. The obvious mistake was leaving our man to help out in the middle thus allowing open three pointers. Just look at their defense last night as they never left Heron in the second half, allowing only one three point attempt. we on the other hand had no one near their three point efforts.
Since Earlington doesn't look like he gets off his feet to score after an offensive rebound it might behoove him to dunk to avoid the many blocks on his put backs.This should cause some fouls.
With all the minutes Williams gets he's going to have to give us more offense and score some points. We don't have enough scorers as it is.
We'll beat Marquette at home.[/quote]

Unfortunately, Earlington doesn't have that kind of explosion to dunk the ball after gathering an offensive carom under the basket. He's gonna have to better use his body and use head fakes.

I said last night we'll beat Marquette, Georgetown and Providence at home.
 
My question to Zaun and anyone on here coming with all the doom and gloom, what is your solution?

We hired Mullin who was a failure. We now have a better coach in here who is doing his best with an offensively challenged roster.

There is no quick fix in college basketball, especially when you’re St John’s. There’s no slapping a band aid on our program and making us a successful tournament team all of the sudden.

It’s a process. I like the recruits we have coming in. I like some of the young players we have now who are getting better.

You guys keep getting hung up on the recruits but a lot of the time in college basketball it comes down to existing players making big leaps in between years. I see Greg, Roberts, as candidates to be those kind of guys.

I’m STILL excited for the future of the program. It seems everyone here was a couple weeks ago but are now losing faith. I’m not

The big east is great this year. We aren’t great. But guess what? We’ve blown a couple close games. We could easily be 3-4 right now with wins over two of the best teams in the conference. I understand we lost and your record is what it says you are, but we are CLOSER than the doom and gloomers make it sound.

We don’t need an influx of 5 stars to come in and save us, let Mike A get his guys and I trust we will take a step forward every season.

We WILL be better next season. You can quote me on that
 
[quote="NCJohnnie" post=373746]For those saying the season is over, if by that you mean our chances of dancing, you are probably right. However, when was that ever an expectation? Before the season started, based on our roster at that time, most everyone on this board agreed that a winning record and NIT bid would be a very successful season. We need to go 4-7 the rest of the way to finish 16-15, a good first year from any reasonable fan's expectation. Beating Depaul Saturday on the road is key to getting us there. We have home games left against Georgetown, Xavier, Marquette, Providence, Villanova & Creighton. All of those except the Villanova game are winnable.
I think we're all disappointed at where we are in BE standings, but a winning record and 7th or 8th place BE finish is still very achievable. I'll wait until the end of the year to make a judgment on team's overall performance.
As far as recruiting, I agree we need to add a solid shooter (whether frosh or grad transfer) and big man in 2020 class and a very good 2021 class but I have faith staff will make that happen.[/quote]


I assume we will play Nova at MSG so I have to disagree that game is winnable.
 
[quote="MJDinkins" post=373783][quote="JackofVirginia" post=373780]Probably our worst defensive effort thus far. The obvious mistake was leaving our man to help out in the middle thus allowing open three pointers. Just look at their defense last night as they never left Heron in the second half, allowing only one three point attempt. we on the other hand had no one near their three point efforts.
Since Earlington doesn't look like he gets off his feet to score after an offensive rebound it might behoove him to dunk to avoid the many blocks on his put backs.This should cause some fouls.
With all the minutes Williams gets he's going to have to give us more offense and score some points. We don't have enough scorers as it is.
We'll beat Marquette at home.[/quote]

Unfortunately, Earlington doesn't have that kind of explosion to dunk the ball after gathering an offensive carom under the basket. He's gonna have to better use his body and use head fakes.

I said last night we'll beat Marquette, Georgetown and Providence at home.[/quote]

Add Xavier and Creighton.
 
[quote="dee" post=373756][quote="Mike Zaun" post=373703]I knew this season was over several games ago. I just don't see all the hope next year and beyond. Posh coming off major injury and is a 4 star recruit, but he basically slashes like Dunn. He can't shoot. Wusu also not a shooter. Heron and LJ (likely) gone which removes 2 guys who can make occasional 3's. How on earth are we going to be better than this year losing those 2 guys and pinning our hopes on 1 player (Cole) to maybe make 3's regularly? Also doubt our bigs problem is addressed. I think there's a very good chance we do worse next year losing 2 of our best players and replacing them with whom? CMA has not really impressed recruiting wise yet. So many keep implying or flat out saying we have big upgrades coming but that's not true...at least I highly doubt it. We've now been a laughing stock for the better part of another decade and I'll be honest, my interest is waning.[/quote]

Yes like many of us we are frustrated with the losing for over most of the last 20 years. Wait till UConn comes in next year and competes with us for recruits. We ain't getting nobody. I use the games now as a way to relax laugh at the incompetence of the staff have a beer and hot dog and go home after another loss. Anderson does not appear to be recruiting well. Welcome to the BE Mr Anderson and your first losing season[/quote]

Calling Doh, calling Doh................
 
Oh! For the few who speak about "difference makers" coming in next season..... Don't get me wrong as I would love a team with one or two difference makers or special players. But a veteran-laden team can also accomplish something good or special as well.

Has anyone seen Rutgers play this year? I've watched them on a handful of occasions and they do not have one difference maker or special player on their team. Actually their route of going about business is almost similar to the Johnnies. The difference I've seen is they don't steal the ball as well as we do but they are a terror on the offensive boards. They also play solid defense.

Most of their roster got experience last season and obviously used last season's experience to make the leap this season. You don't know who will be the leading scorer from game to game, similarly to our team. They have those three bigs (2 sophomores, who received valuable experience last season, and a senior) that pound the offensive boards and allows them to get extra possessions.

They don't shoot the ball well, and it seems they prefer to turn the game into a rock fight. Their style of play has worked out for 'em to this juncture. Is it sustainable? We'll eventually find out.
 
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[quote="Jack Williams" post=373785]My question to Zaun and anyone on here coming with all the doom and gloom, what is your solution?

We hired Mullin who was a failure. We now have a better coach in here who is doing his best with an offensively challenged roster.

There is no quick fix in college basketball, especially when you’re St John’s. There’s no slapping a band aid on our program and making us a successful tournament team all of the sudden.

It’s a process. I like the recruits we have coming in. I like some of the young players we have now who are getting better.

You guys keep getting hung up on the recruits but a lot of the time in college basketball it comes down to existing players making big leaps in between years. I see Greg, Roberts, as candidates to be those kind of guys.

I’m STILL excited for the future of the program. It seems everyone here was a couple weeks ago but are now losing faith. I’m not

The big east is great this year. We aren’t great. But guess what? We’ve blown a couple close games. We could easily be 3-4 right now with wins over two of the best teams in the conference. I understand we lost and your record is what it says you are, but we are CLOSER than the doom and gloomers make it sound.

We don’t need an influx of 5 stars to come in and save us, let Mike A get his guys and I trust we will take a step forward every season.

We WILL be better next season. You can quote me on that[/quote]

I don't "come" with the doom and gloom. I'm simply reacting to actual doom and gloom the program is giving off because of its 1-6 Big East record. That's the biggest conflation. No objective SJ fan wants to be negative and no objective SJ fan tries to be negative. If results are very negative, you will see very negative fan reactions. When things were great in OOC, was I negative? No I was very hopeful. But that turned out to be fool's gold. So now I'm re-evaluating. I thought the players were developed a ton already because of OOC but now they all look pretty bad, so I'm re-evaluating. Maybe next year we really are much better and we all breathe a sigh of relief. I hope so.

My solution? If you can't find 3 or 4 star guys who are pure shooters and not a complete liability defensively/athletically, then you go D2 if you have to. But I'm sure we could land some transfers from mid majors who dream of playing at this level. Get a few of those types then design plays to get them open. Once you show teams you can make 3's, they will open the paint more. I'd do the same for a real big. Go D2 if you have to. Plenty of 6'10+ 225+ type guys who would love to be in the Big East. And then you hope our staff coaches them up too. The thing is, these players are out there. They want to come. We just don't try that route. What player would want to stay at some little college in a little conference when they could contribute immediately here? There are better players on mid major teams than our team right now especially shooting wise.
 
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[quote="usguard" post=373770]There is a difference taking 50 shot S
and 250 shots Also there is a right way to practice shooting with supervision making sure a staff member is watching to keep pointing out what you can do better not just having you go take a bunch of shots. It’s like practicing the piano
Practice an hour a day and you can play some songs practice much more and if you have talent you become really good
A
Chris Mullin was a gym rat and it paid off
Guess what I am saying if you want to be very good at something you need to put in the time and hard work to achieve it[/quote]

Aw c'mon. Mullin was a talent before he got here, a natural pure shooter. The guys we've got can't be turned around in a year or two even if you locked 'em in a gym and just gave 'em food and potty breaks.

Your gym rat left the cupboard bare and Anderson had precious little time to cobble a team together with scraps that were available. If you want a fair comparo look at Chris' first season when the tv announcer left him high and dry.

I get the frustration, but this is a very flawed team. Coach needs time to get his players to implement his system, it's not going to be a two year fix by any means.
 
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