(POST GAME) (#8 / #10) Villanova (MSG) Tues. Jan. 28, 6:30p, FS-1 / 570 AM

[quote="Beast of the East" post=374826]I openly wondered about what was it about DePaul win that gave our fans high hopes of beating Villanova. DePaul played so poorly down the stretch, shot so poorly especially from three, that our lead wasn't challenged at all. In that game, LJ played his best offensive game of his career, and after Heron and Dunn the rest shot miserably.

You play games like this to get a measure of where our team is right now. I really don't agree with the assessments that on a top team we have a lot of serviceable parts. I would not be surprised if Figueroa foregoes his senior year to play professionally somewhere - it's a growing trend. Earlington is a strong body who can give a handful or minutes, Roberts too. Dunn would get significant minutes, and Champaignie may also warrant minutes depending on improvement. Not sure about Williams. Basically after LJ and Heron, it's a team of subs.

I thought if we played tough nose to nose basketball the way we turned the Seton Hall game into a war we could play them close, but Villanova is a deep and talented team. They can go after top level talent and as importantly fill a roster with the type of player they want, passing over 4 or 5 star players who may not fit well. They penetrate and dish with a purpose and the guys who station themselves at the three point line can all nail shots. We were only in the game for the first half of the first half, and never challenged at all again.

On a good day we can beat many of the teams in our conference, but we are starting to see how much of a gap there is between top level talent and our guys. On a night where our defense can be disruptive and our offense clicks, we can compete, but clearly last night Villanova had no trouble with our defensive pressure and just carved us up.

Make no mistake about it, Villanova did play well last night, and on a night where our guys play very well and there's not so much, we could give them a game. Last night wasn't it though.[/quote]

"openly wondered about what was it about DePaul win that gave our fans high hopes of beating Villanova."

Hope.
We beat DePaul, 3 of 4 games after Nova are very winnable, if we some how could just beat nova, we could get something going positive. There's always hope.

But yeah, it's always better to go with your brain rather then your heart, go with your heart and you get crushed.
 
[quote="CMA TIME" post=374832][quote="Beast of the East" post=374826]I openly wondered about what was it about DePaul win that gave our fans high hopes of beating Villanova. DePaul played so poorly down the stretch, shot so poorly especially from three, that our lead wasn't challenged at all. In that game, LJ played his best offensive game of his career, and after Heron and Dunn the rest shot miserably.

You play games like this to get a measure of where our team is right now. I really don't agree with the assessments that on a top team we have a lot of serviceable parts. I would not be surprised if Figueroa foregoes his senior year to play professionally somewhere - it's a growing trend. Earlington is a strong body who can give a handful or minutes, Roberts too. Dunn would get significant minutes, and Champaignie may also warrant minutes depending on improvement. Not sure about Williams. Basically after LJ and Heron, it's a team of subs.

I thought if we played tough nose to nose basketball the way we turned the Seton Hall game into a war we could play them close, but Villanova is a deep and talented team. They can go after top level talent and as importantly fill a roster with the type of player they want, passing over 4 or 5 star players who may not fit well. They penetrate and dish with a purpose and the guys who station themselves at the three point line can all nail shots. We were only in the game for the first half of the first half, and never challenged at all again.

On a good day we can beat many of the teams in our conference, but we are starting to see how much of a gap there is between top level talent and our guys. On a night where our defense can be disruptive and our offense clicks, we can compete, but clearly last night Villanova had no trouble with our defensive pressure and just carved us up.

Make no mistake about it, Villanova did play well last night, and on a night where our guys play very well and there's not so much, we could give them a game. Last night wasn't it though.[/quote]

"openly wondered about what was it about DePaul win that gave our fans high hopes of beating Villanova."

Hope.
We beat DePaul, 3 of 4 games after Nova are very winnable, if we some how could just beat nova, we could get something going positive. There's always hope.

But yeah, it's always better to go with your brain rather then your heart, go with your heart and you get crushed.[/quote]

I've learned to reserve high hopes for seasons when we put strong teams on the floor. In seasons like this, I just enjoy the positives (such as a offense that seems to have purpose most of the time and hard work on defense). I don't leave games deflated, even though the winnable ones (Seton Hall, Butler) sting a little.

For this season, I'm mostly enjoying some bright spots and realize we just don't have the horses. Of course we had hope that someone the best bench coach and staff we've had in quite some time was working miracles. That was before reality set in. Still plenty of season left, and hopefully a few good wins to hold on to. Sunday is one of those winnable games where I hope our guys show up playing their A game.
 
[quote="Duke of Earlington" post=374799]Last night really showed how far away we are. I think this team will go into a tailspin now as they realize it to.[/quote]

You said something similarly last week only to come back and make an upset prediction last night. So, I'm guessing this is the end of your "Jimmy the Greek" impersonation, huh? :)
 
[quote="Beast of the East" post=374834]I've learned to reserve high hopes for seasons when we put strong teams on the floor. In seasons like this, I just enjoy the positives (such as a offense that seems to have purpose most of the time and hard work on defense). I don't leave games deflated, even though the winnable ones (Seton Hall, Butler) sting a little.

For this season, I'm mostly enjoying some bright spots and realize we just don't have the horses. Of course we had hope that someone the best bench coach and staff we've had in quite some time was working miracles. That was before reality set in. Still plenty of season left, and hopefully a few good wins to hold on to. Sunday is one of those winnable games where I hope our guys show up playing their A game.[/quote]

Fair points.
 
[quote="Ken Shark" post=374766]No more back door cuts! Please! Aka"I'm going to run toward the basket and you throw the ball to the other team" Good grief.

Love the look of disbelief on Champagnie's face every time he stands there and watches someone drain a three. Yes Julian, he did it, again!

Coach should take some heat on how bad this one was as well. 2-3 zone with Dunn and Williams down low? Where was Roberts in the second half? Maybe change the defense after they run the same play over and over for the easy 3 out of the corner. Maybe bench LJ after he heaves up a 35 footer? Would it have hurt to play Steere the last 5 minutes?

Now to the comedy portion of the show, Sears, on 2 consecutive 5 foot shots, caught all backboard, no rim. Forget bricks, they were concrete blocks, made me yearn for the days of Yakwe and Sima.[/quote]


Surprise, surprise yes once again Sears fouled his man at half court.I am almost convinced he can't make a layup if he was left alone.
 
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[quote="JackofVirginia" post=374839][quote="Ken Shark" post=374766]No more back door cuts! Please! Aka"I'm going to run toward the basket and you throw the ball to the other team" Good grief.

Love the look of disbelief on Champagnie's face every time he stands there and watches someone drain a three. Yes Julian, he did it, again!

Coach should take some heat on how bad this one was as well. 2-3 zone with Dunn and Williams down low? Where was Roberts in the second half? Maybe change the defense after they run the same play over and over for the easy 3 out of the corner. Maybe bench LJ after he heaves up a 35 footer? Would it have hurt to play Steere the last 5 minutes?

Now to the comedy portion of the show, Sears, on 2 consecutive 5 foot shots, caught all backboard, no rim. Forget bricks, they were concrete blocks, made me yearn for the days of Yakwe and Sima.[/quote]


Surprise, surprise yes once again Sears fouled his man at half court.I am almost convinced he can't make a layup if he was left alone.[/quote]

D1 basketball can be a rude awakening for kids with height who didn't face significant defensive pressure when they had the ball in the paint in HS or at a lower level. Sears felt it last night. Way back when we had Tom Weadock, who was huge and not very skilled athletically. I feel for those kids because basketball can be a very hard game at this level for guys who have plenty of height but not developed skills..

BTW, meant to tell you that Matt Galante introduced the late Joe Russo at Coach Russo's HOF induction. Matt was very warm and personal, and is most definitely a regular guy
 
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[quote="Boo Harvey" post=374725]
To go back to Heron for a minute, what the heck? It’s one thing to have an off night or even a disappointing season. But how do you go from being a stud second tram all SEC performer to being a total non-factor. Is he hurt? What’s wrong with him? When Figueroa has a poor game, it looks like he’s forcing things, but still has talent. Heron looks like a one-dimensional spit up shooter on his best nights.

On the positive side, Dunn has really been a please surprise. If he could get himself to be a 33 percent three point shooter next year (not unrealistic), he could have a nice senior season.[/quote]

Couple of things. Heron was never a post season all SEC 2nd teamer, just a preseason 2nd teamer his second year. That's an indication of potential, not accomplishment. That year the other two guards were post team all SEC 2nd team, he wasn't. There were 16 kids on the 1st and 2nd teams FYI. He did get all Frosh team post season the year before and it could be argued his frosh year was his best and it's been a slow regressions ever since.

Playing with two other all SEC guards that 2nd year would have also taken some of the defensive pressure off of Heron and playing with a real PG like Jared Harper would have helped as well. St John's offers neither of those benefits this year. But he clearly doesn't look right.
 
[quote="Beast of the East" post=374834][quote="CMA TIME" post=374832][quote="Beast of the East" post=374826]I openly wondered about what was it about DePaul win that gave our fans high hopes of beating Villanova. DePaul played so poorly down the stretch, shot so poorly especially from three, that our lead wasn't challenged at all. In that game, LJ played his best offensive game of his career, and after Heron and Dunn the rest shot miserably.

You play games like this to get a measure of where our team is right now. I really don't agree with the assessments that on a top team we have a lot of serviceable parts. I would not be surprised if Figueroa foregoes his senior year to play professionally somewhere - it's a growing trend. Earlington is a strong body who can give a handful or minutes, Roberts too. Dunn would get significant minutes, and Champaignie may also warrant minutes depending on improvement. Not sure about Williams. Basically after LJ and Heron, it's a team of subs.

I thought if we played tough nose to nose basketball the way we turned the Seton Hall game into a war we could play them close, but Villanova is a deep and talented team. They can go after top level talent and as importantly fill a roster with the type of player they want, passing over 4 or 5 star players who may not fit well. They penetrate and dish with a purpose and the guys who station themselves at the three point line can all nail shots. We were only in the game for the first half of the first half, and never challenged at all again.

On a good day we can beat many of the teams in our conference, but we are starting to see how much of a gap there is between top level talent and our guys. On a night where our defense can be disruptive and our offense clicks, we can compete, but clearly last night Villanova had no trouble with our defensive pressure and just carved us up.

Make no mistake about it, Villanova did play well last night, and on a night where our guys play very well and there's not so much, we could give them a game. Last night wasn't it though.[/quote]

"openly wondered about what was it about DePaul win that gave our fans high hopes of beating Villanova."

Hope.
We beat DePaul, 3 of 4 games after Nova are very winnable, if we some how could just beat nova, we could get something going positive. There's always hope.

But yeah, it's always better to go with your brain rather then your heart, go with your heart and you get crushed.[/quote]

I've learned to reserve high hopes for seasons when we put strong teams on the floor. In seasons like this, I just enjoy the positives (such as a offense that seems to have purpose most of the time and hard work on defense). I don't leave games deflated, even though the winnable ones (Seton Hall, Butler) sting a little.

For this season, I'm mostly enjoying some bright spots and realize we just don't have the horses. Of course we had hope that someone the best bench coach and staff we've had in quite some time was working miracles. That was before reality set in. Still plenty of season left, and hopefully a few good wins to hold on to. Sunday is one of those winnable games where I hope our guys show up playing their A game.[/quote]

I hear you on that, and it's reality.
I'm just the type of person that's some kind of hope, or why even watch, to watch them lose and once again .say next year like always? Just sit through the season with no hope, sit and wait for next year to begin. I'm beginning to hate waiting.
When.is it ever going to be this year. Some teams have probably 20 ncaa wins, we we got 0, that's sad.

And that's a rant from a frustrated fan. Lol sorry
 
[quote="CMA TIME" post=374843][quote="Beast of the East" post=374834][quote="CMA TIME" post=374832][quote="Beast of the East" post=374826]I openly wondered about what was it about DePaul win that gave our fans high hopes of beating Villanova. DePaul played so poorly down the stretch, shot so poorly especially from three, that our lead wasn't challenged at all. In that game, LJ played his best offensive game of his career, and after Heron and Dunn the rest shot miserably.

You play games like this to get a measure of where our team is right now. I really don't agree with the assessments that on a top team we have a lot of serviceable parts. I would not be surprised if Figueroa foregoes his senior year to play professionally somewhere - it's a growing trend. Earlington is a strong body who can give a handful or minutes, Roberts too. Dunn would get significant minutes, and Champaignie may also warrant minutes depending on improvement. Not sure about Williams. Basically after LJ and Heron, it's a team of subs.

I thought if we played tough nose to nose basketball the way we turned the Seton Hall game into a war we could play them close, but Villanova is a deep and talented team. They can go after top level talent and as importantly fill a roster with the type of player they want, passing over 4 or 5 star players who may not fit well. They penetrate and dish with a purpose and the guys who station themselves at the three point line can all nail shots. We were only in the game for the first half of the first half, and never challenged at all again.

On a good day we can beat many of the teams in our conference, but we are starting to see how much of a gap there is between top level talent and our guys. On a night where our defense can be disruptive and our offense clicks, we can compete, but clearly last night Villanova had no trouble with our defensive pressure and just carved us up.

Make no mistake about it, Villanova did play well last night, and on a night where our guys play very well and there's not so much, we could give them a game. Last night wasn't it though.[/quote]

"openly wondered about what was it about DePaul win that gave our fans high hopes of beating Villanova."

Hope.
We beat DePaul, 3 of 4 games after Nova are very winnable, if we some how could just beat nova, we could get something going positive. There's always hope.

But yeah, it's always better to go with your brain rather then your heart, go with your heart and you get crushed.[/quote]

I've learned to reserve high hopes for seasons when we put strong teams on the floor. In seasons like this, I just enjoy the positives (such as a offense that seems to have purpose most of the time and hard work on defense). I don't leave games deflated, even though the winnable ones (Seton Hall, Butler) sting a little.

For this season, I'm mostly enjoying some bright spots and realize we just don't have the horses. Of course we had hope that someone the best bench coach and staff we've had in quite some time was working miracles. That was before reality set in. Still plenty of season left, and hopefully a few good wins to hold on to. Sunday is one of those winnable games where I hope our guys show up playing their A game.[/quote]

I hear you on that, and it's reality.
I'm just the type of person that's some kind of hope, or why even watch, to watch them lose and once again .say next year like always? Just sit through the season with no hope, sit and wait for next year to begin. I'm beginning to hate waiting.
When.is it ever going to be this year. Some teams have probably 20 ncaa wins, we we got 0, that's sad.

And that's a rant from a frustrated fan. Lol sorry[/quote]

In the FWIW category, I certainly understand guys not wanting to spend money on game tickets until our team is better, but last night I looked at all the seats around me occupied by Villanova fans and know that if this game turned into a nail biter the Villanova contingent would be very loud and we'd lose our homecourt advantage.

Best things our fans can do is buy any ticket and show up and cheer regardless. It's actually pretty good basketball even if at times its only the opponent playing it. Even a bad team can get jazzed up by loud fans.
 
[quote="Beast of the East" post=374826]I openly wondered about what was it about DePaul win that gave our fans high hopes of beating Villanova. [/quote]

The Vegas line was only +2.5, so we had roughly 42% odds of winning. Very good odds of at least keeping it close. We've also played every ranked opponent this year super close. WVU, Arizona, Butler and Seton Hall all came down to the final minute. During the past 2-3 years we've done really well vs ranked opponents, such as beating Nova 2X, Marquette 2X and Duke (and obviously WVU and Arizona this year). The only time in recent memory that we were blown out against a ranked opponent was last year at Duke.

I agree that a Nova blowout wasn't extremely unlikely, but it's absolutely outside the norm of how this and previous teams have played. Fans were definitely justified in their optimism.
 
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[quote="MJDinkins" post=374743]I spoke to one of our brethren less than a week ago, and he said he'd rather move on from practically the entire team with the exception of two or three players.[/quote]

I would be surprised if many disagree.
 
Talent infusion will clearly help but my question is whether 40 minutes of hell will work in the Big East where a competent big, one or two deadly wing 3ball shooters, and a smart point are standard equipment for almost every team almost every year with the exception of DePaul and sometimes us. Is the risk/reward ratio of total pressure to the benefit of the defense when the answers to 40 minutes of hell are structured in to Big East player recruitment ?
 
[quote="fuchsia" post=374860]Talent infusion will clearly help but my question is whether 40 minutes of hell will work in the Big East where a competent big, one or two deadly wing 3ball shooters, and a smart point are standard equipment for almost every team almost every year with the exception of DePaul and sometimes us. Is the risk/reward ratio of total pressure to the benefit of the defense when the answers to 40 minutes of hell are structured in to Big East player recruitment ?[/quote]

These are great concerns. Does a big time player want to play in a system thats not used in the pros.

And yes, any good team is going to want to be pressed. If you can break it, you can get easy scores all day long.

Its like a good qb. He wants to be blitzed cause he knows he will have guys open.
 
I hope a big part of practice this week will include rebounding importance and how to set and use picks.
 
[quote="Duke of Earlington" post=374861][quote="fuchsia" post=374860]Talent infusion will clearly help but my question is whether 40 minutes of hell will work in the Big East where a competent big, one or two deadly wing 3ball shooters, and a smart point are standard equipment for almost every team almost every year with the exception of DePaul and sometimes us. Is the risk/reward ratio of total pressure to the benefit of the defense when the answers to 40 minutes of hell are structured in to Big East player recruitment ?[/quote]

These are great concerns. Does a big time player want to play in a system thats not used in the pros.

And yes, any good team is going to want to be pressed. If you can break it, you can get easy scores all day long.

Its like a good qb. He wants to be blitzed cause he knows he will have guys open.[/quote]

Anderson is almost up to 400 wins and has put guys in the NBA. We really don’t play “40 minutes of hell” but we certainly play pressure defense. Defense always translates to the next level. Anybody who has seen Patrick Beverley play defense can tell you it works in the NBA too. In addition, we lost simply because we can’t shoot and every Nova player can. It’s not a mystery and no we won’t be hamstrung by our style. We are hamstrung because of lack of talent.
 
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[quote="Duke of Earlington" post=374861][quote="fuchsia" post=374860]Talent infusion will clearly help but my question is whether 40 minutes of hell will work in the Big East where a competent big, one or two deadly wing 3ball shooters, and a smart point are standard equipment for almost every team almost every year with the exception of DePaul and sometimes us. Is the risk/reward ratio of total pressure to the benefit of the defense when the answers to 40 minutes of hell are structured in to Big East player recruitment ?[/quote]

These are great concerns. Does a big time player want to play in a system thats not used in the pros.

And yes, any good team is going to want to be pressed. If you can break it, you can get easy scores all day long.

Its like a good qb. He wants to be blitzed cause he knows he will have guys open.[/quote]

40 minutes of hell works and has worked well enough to win a Natl Championship. You need to recruit a certain type of player for this system. It won't work with players that are given to the coach. He needs to recruit his type of players. UVA's defense was stifling and they just won the whole thing. Syracuse's zone has been a thorn in many schools side for 40 years of Boeheim. West VA plays killer defense and they have won at the highest level and have had many high seeds. The point is MA needs to get his players in and practice it before we get it to where it needs to be. We all knew this when we started the year. Once we win it will be easier to recruit studs. Unfortunately we have been pissed on for 20 years and we have to wash the stink off. Hope MA stays at least 10 years.
 
[quote="Redmen88" post=374866][quote="Duke of Earlington" post=374861][quote="fuchsia" post=374860]Talent infusion will clearly help but my question is whether 40 minutes of hell will work in the Big East where a competent big, one or two deadly wing 3ball shooters, and a smart point are standard equipment for almost every team almost every year with the exception of DePaul and sometimes us. Is the risk/reward ratio of total pressure to the benefit of the defense when the answers to 40 minutes of hell are structured in to Big East player recruitment ?[/quote]

These are great concerns. Does a big time player want to play in a system thats not used in the pros.

And yes, any good team is going to want to be pressed. If you can break it, you can get easy scores all day long.

Its like a good qb. He wants to be blitzed cause he knows he will have guys open.[/quote]

40 minutes of hell works and has worked well enough to win a Natl Championship. You need to recruit a certain type of player for this system. It won't work with players that are given to the coach. He needs to recruit his type of players. UVA's defense was stifling and they just won the whole thing. Syracuse's zone has been a thorn in many schools side for 40 years of Boeheim. West VA plays killer defense and they have won at the highest level and have had many high seeds. The point is MA needs to get his players in and practice it before we get it to where it needs to be. We all knew this when we started the year. Once we win it will be easier to recruit studs. Unfortunately we have been pissed on for 20 years and we have to wash the stink off. Hope MA stays at least 10 years.[/quote]

One misnomer.... Boeheim didn't start playing zone exclusively until about 23 years ago. They had at one point played their share of man-to-man defense.
 
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