Ponds and LoVett

What I'm really sick of is the negative posts about the negativity of fans, the posts that call other users idiots because they think they know more than the coaches, the ones that criticize fickle fans, the ones that criticize the accumen of posters.

It's a forum guys! Of course there will be some negativity when things aren't going right.

For me, I complain enough, but have seen enough progress with the roster and the coaches to think the ship is headed in the right direction. I see the school slowly being transformed into a very good academic institution. I see talented administrators be hired, and the school strengthening its Catholic identity. I see an athletic department and coaching staff that wants to win badly. It's enough for me, but I understand the frustration.
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I agree entirely. We are all fans here. Some of us (myself included) may get too emotional at times and write things that are silly. But I believe it comes from a good place.

I think a good adage to follow is that if you disagree with an argument, attack the argument or ignore the post. Don't impugn somebody's character or question whether they are truly a fan of the program. That smacks of bullying and does nothing to support the alternative argument.
 
My guess is that the longer Mr. Lovett’s stay out because of injury the more likely that he returns to StJohns next season.

I do not believe that there is much demand in the NBA or top Euro leagues for a “6 foot” guard who may have only played In one of the past three seasons with the last season being sidelined for injury.
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Quite the opposite! While I agree Marcus will never ever sniff an NBA team he and his dad have a goal to have Marcus earn a living as long as possible playing basketball. He is a great kid and teammate and is very talented. He will, imo, easily find a place in the overseas market, especially China where professional basketball is growing at a faster rate than Europe. This injury is a wake up call for the Lovett family and if anything expedites his departure. Chris Mullin is a player's coach and will not risk Marcus's future for an extra win or two. While that may frustrate us as fans who schlep into NYC and the Garden or our glorified high school gym we call an arena on campus, I agree with CM as the player's well being is the number one priority. Mullin and Matt have already recruited his replacement. Pond's injury is minor and he should be able to play shortly. It is HIS departure that will hurt if he decides to leave early because non of the new recruits in the backcourt match his natural talent and potential for improvement. He has not scratched the surface of his potential yet and could be a pro anywhere in a year or two. Marcus, on the other hand, has reached his potential on the team and any of the 4 guards coming back will easily offset his departure. They would include Dixon, Simon, the freshmen and hopefully Shamorie Ponds. The front court will be set and solid. The only wild card left is will Shamorie stay and will we lose a player to the transfer market. I am hoping no with Slick and would not mind a surprise addition in the Spring that could project our team into a favorite to win the Big East next year.
 
I was taking my son to school this morning and he said hey look and there was a huge ad on an MTA bus with Shamorie Ponds on it. If you are going to advertise players on city buses then maybe there should be a little more clarity when those players get injured.
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:D :p :D
I'm not sure where some of our fans live but I can tell you that those MTA bus ads are ubiquitous here in NYC and Shamorie loves seeing them in his hood!:D
 
My guess is that the longer Mr. Lovett’s stay out because of injury the more likely that he returns to StJohns next season.

I do not believe that there is much demand in the NBA or top Euro leagues for a “6 foot” guard who may have only played In one of the past three seasons with the last season being sidelined for injury.
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Quite the opposite! While I agree Marcus will never ever sniff an NBA team he and his dad have a goal to have Marcus earn a living as long as possible playing basketball. He is a great kid and teammate and is very talented. He will, imo, easily find a place in the overseas market, especially China where professional basketball is growing at a faster rate than Europe. This injury is a wake up call for the Lovett family and if anything expedites his departure. Chris Mullin is a player's coach and will not risk Marcus's future for an extra win or two. While that may frustrate us as fans who schlep into NYC and the Garden or our glorified high school gym we call an arena on campus, I agree with CM as the player's well being is the number one priority. Mullin and Matt have already recruited his replacement. Pond's injury is minor and he should be able to play shortly. It is HIS departure that will hurt if he decides to leave early because non of the new recruits in the backcourt match his natural talent and potential for improvement. He has not scratched the surface of his potential yet and could be a pro anywhere in a year or two. Marcus, on the other hand, has reached his potential on the team and any of the 4 guards coming back will easily offset his departure. They would include Dixon, Simon, the freshmen and hopefully Shamorie Ponds. The front court will be set and solid. The only wild card left is will Shamorie stay and will we lose a player to the transfer market. I am hoping no with Slick and would not mind a surprise addition in the Spring that could project our team into a favorite to win the Big East next year.
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and who would that player be? Kareem Abdul Jabbar is not walking through that door.
 
I know how some on here who dislike Lovett for some odd reason, and Mullin for some odder reason will respond. But for the few rational people on here, my question is if Lovett misses the rest of the season or at least a big portion of it, will Mullin be judged on falling short of preseason win predictions?
 

Whatever happens that inpacts the results of this team be it whatever, falls on the coach regarding injuries,improvement in wins and losses,making tournaments etc etc
 
I heard Lovett will be gone as early as next week to train for Europe, and Ponds will be following shortly. And Mullin will take up to 10 days after the fact to acknowledge that they have left school. Everyone happy now?
 
Whatever happens that inpacts the results of this team be it whatever, falls on the coach regarding injuries,improvement in wins and losses,making tournaments etc etc
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I can say with a fair degree of confidence that if the wheels fall off because of injury in his 3rd season, Mullin will not take the hit for it. We needed a deeper bench and we have a good mix of HS recruits and transfers overall and we will be deeper next season. Very few teams could lose their top two players and remain competitive. It's just the way it is.
 
Everyone is coming at this from the same ultimate place, a strong desire to see this team turn into a consistent winner. I can understand why folks are frustrated by the injuries, and the Lovett situation could have been handled better. The frustration is compounded by the fact that we are not deep (this should be the last year that is the case), meaning any injury to a key player puts us at a major disadvantage. But it seems to me we are in very good hands with this staff. We have 6 new players coming in next year and lots of activity with key recruits for '19 and beyond. We also play very hard and are building a culture by recruiting the right kind of kid (I think the staff learned its lesson the one time they tried to cut a corner in that regard). We are going to get there on our current course, I am sure of it. I completely understand why it is hard to be patient with no tourney wins since 2000. But I really do think if we stay on this path we will see major success soon - on the way, we can enjoy games like this past Sunday, which while a loss, was honestly one of the most enjoyable games I can remember in quite some time. Looking forward to tonight's game, hope we play well and get a much needed W.
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"We have 6 new players coming in next year and lots of activity with key recruits for '19 and beyond."

So if we aren't that good then I'll bet the excuse will be: "but we have 6 new players, they have to learn the system and learn to play with each other."
There are always excuse with St. John's when we are good, how about screw the excuse and finally have a good freaking season for a change. I know I'll get crapped on for this post, but next year the excuses should stop, but we all know that will be the excuse.
I'll take the beating now.
 
Remember the good old days when it was just me going nuts because Mullin was sitting on the scorers table and St Jean was coaching ? And now I'm probably the mellowest poster on the board. lol
 
Remember the good old days when it was just me going nuts because Mullin was sitting on the scorers table and St Jean was coaching ? And now I'm probably the mellowest poster on the board. lol
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consuming massive quantities of lobster rolls and IPAs will do that to you.;)
 
Oh my........everyone has gone to the dark side.

Geez......we got bit by the injury bug and it sucks. Otherwise, we have a team that is playing hard and a heckuva recruiting class coming in.

C-H-I-L-L
 
Everyone is coming at this from the same ultimate place, a strong desire to see this team turn into a consistent winner. I can understand why folks are frustrated by the injuries, and the Lovett situation could have been handled better. The frustration is compounded by the fact that we are not deep (this should be the last year that is the case), meaning any injury to a key player puts us at a major disadvantage. But it seems to me we are in very good hands with this staff. We have 6 new players coming in next year and lots of activity with key recruits for '19 and beyond. We also play very hard and are building a culture by recruiting the right kind of kid (I think the staff learned its lesson the one time they tried to cut a corner in that regard). We are going to get there on our current course, I am sure of it. I completely understand why it is hard to be patient with no tourney wins since 2000. But I really do think if we stay on this path we will see major success soon - on the way, we can enjoy games like this past Sunday, which while a loss, was honestly one of the most enjoyable games I can remember in quite some time. Looking forward to tonight's game, hope we play well and get a much needed W.
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"We have 6 new players coming in next year and lots of activity with key recruits for '19 and beyond."

So if we aren't that good then I'll bet the excuse will be: "but we have 6 new players, they have to learn the system and learn to play with each other."
There are always excuse with St. John's when we are good, how about screw the excuse and finally have a good freaking season for a change. I know I'll get crapped on for this post, but next year the excuses should stop, but we all know that will be the excuse.
I'll take the beating now.
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I understand your frustration.  Any hard core paying fan has a right to qvetch.  It is programmed into our DNA after many years of optimism followed by disappointment.  To be criticized for that frustration is silly.  It appears that the only acceptable criticisms appear to be those targeted at the players while our novice staff gets a pass.  Ironically after Lavin's first year, with a top 5 recruiting class, his following 4 years this forum became the CNN of college basketball.  Those that dared to defend Lavin were routinely castigated.  It began with his cancer surgery with some questioning why he waited until the start of the season thereby disrupting their expectations and indirectly blaming him for getting cancer.  When his dad passed away he was routinely mocked for taking time off. Even his wife Mary was not off base.  Fast forward to his final month, a former "Mod", no less, who stalked fans off line using  information gleaned on this site,  stalked Lavin on campus the day he met with Bobby G.  He rudely posted picture proof on Twitter and people cheered.  All this for a coach who took St. John's to 2 NCAA Tourney berths and 2 NITs.  In the eleven full seasons as a head coach, Lavin had led teams to ten postseason appearances, highlighted by eight NCAA Tournament berths. So, the next time a fan critiques a coaching move by our Hall of Famer a few folks here should use a little prudence and not jurisprudence until Chris Mullin actually has accomplished something other than incremental improvement in what is rebuilding revolving door of coaches at St. John's.
 
I understand your frustration.  Any hard core paying fan has a right to qvetch.  It is programmed into our DNA after many years of optimism followed by disappointment.  To be criticized for that frustration is silly.  It appears that the only acceptable criticisms appear to be those targeted at the players while our novice staff gets a pass.  Ironically after Lavin's first year, with a top 5 recruiting class, his following 4 years this forum became the CNN of college basketball.  Those that dared to defend Lavin were routinely castigated.  It began with his cancer surgery with some questioning why he waited until the start of the season thereby disrupting their expectations and indirectly blaming him for getting cancer.  When his dad passed away he was routinely mocked for taking time off. Even his wife Mary was not off base.  Fast forward to his final month, a former "Mod", no less, who stalked fans off line using  information gleaned on this site,  stalked Lavin on campus the day he met with Bobby G.  He rudely posted picture proof on Twitter and people cheered.  All this for a coach who took St. John's to 2 NCAA Tourney berths and 2 NITs.  In the eleven full seasons as a head coach, Lavin had led teams to ten postseason appearances, highlighted by eight NCAA Tournament berths. So, the next time a fan critiques a coaching move by our Hall of Famer a few folks here should use a little prudence and not jurisprudence until Chris Mullin actually has accomplished something other than incremental improvement in what is rebuilding revolving door of coaches at St. John's.
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^^^^
Right here! On point, IMO.

Particularly, why I hardly ever post on here any longer (along, with another reason or two). Hypocrisy runs deep with a few folks on here.
 
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