Fools & history

[GardenCity62]

SJU had to drop the Redmen nickname. The mistake they made was the selection Red Storm. They were right in keeping the "Red" but should have added some connection to being NYC's team.
Does the school newspaper name Torch signify the Statue of Liberty?

 

[romiSJU]

I always liked the Express or maybe Red Express. Even though the ladies used it. Thought it would be cool to see a subway car, nyc skyline with semigraffiti fonts for some alternative gear.

Never been a fan of the Red Storm.

Hard for me to let go of the ring of 'the Redmen of St. John's' as a kid.

It is what it is.
Just win.
Excited for our future.

 

[beast of the east]

If we go 35-3 in a few years, the name Red Storm will be really cool. Expect to see kid's clothing to have images of Thunder on it when that happens. A name is just a name, and sounds better and better when winning. I mean Red Storm is better than Pelicans, which is the best an NBA team could come up with.

 

[Las Vegan]

This debate surfaces periodically, like the cicada, and that's because the initial issue was not handled properly. As with many others here, I grew up rooting for the redmen, but times change and I understood why the name no longer was tenable. The name is considered a slur, and it was ill-suited for the women's teams. Quite a few other colleges were in the same position, but is there any other school that has this much difficulty sorting out the nickname, mascot, fight song, jersey color and school letter (SJU - STJ) issues?
It is symptomatic of a school, especially in the past 20 years, which made poor decisions, both in academics and athletics. I hope the new lay president might be able to remediate some of these problems.
The one thing we all liked was Flagboy, and he was banished without explanation.

 

[romiSJU]

This debate surfaces periodically, like the cicada, and that's because the initial issue was not handled properly. As with many others here, I grew up rooting for the redmen, but times change and I understood why the name no longer was tenable. The name is considered a slur, and it was ill-suited for the women's teams. Quite a few other colleges were in the same position, but is there any other school that has this much difficulty sorting out the nickname, mascot, fight song, jersey color and school letter (SJU - STJ) issues?
It is symptomatic of a school, especially in the past 20 years, which made poor decisions, both in academics and athletics. I hope the new lay president might be able to remediate some of these problems.
The one thing we all liked was Flagboy, and he was banished without explanation.

+100 on FlagBoy

 

[we are sju]

This debate surfaces periodically, like the cicada, and that's because the initial issue was not handled properly. As with many others here, I grew up rooting for the redmen, but times change and I understood why the name no longer was tenable. The name is considered a slur, and it was ill-suited for the women's teams. Quite a few other colleges were in the same position, but is there any other school that has this much difficulty sorting out the nickname, mascot, fight song, jersey color and school letter (SJU - STJ) issues?
It is symptomatic of a school, especially in the past 20 years, which made poor decisions, both in academics and athletics. I hope the new lay president might be able to remediate some of these problems.
The one thing we all liked was Flagboy, and he was banished without explanation.

+100 on FlagBoy

He found out how much Abe Keita was getting and quit because he was under paid

 

[redmen1969]

Before I get to the point of this post I want every reader of this post to understand that I have complete knowledge of the St. Johns mascot. I know the source of our former nickname.

With that in mind I want to suggest to everyone who truly loves st. Johns that we bury this stupid Laughing Indian image. Look at the picture below. Honestly people does that represent anything we are about today? Its a tiny piece of out history which there is no reason cling to. I saw that post and I was just creeped out. It hurts us plain and simple. We are st. Johns. We are still and always will be the redmen but we are not a pasciche Redskin cartoon that has no historic connection to this program. And I this era we need to let it go and move on. Again it does more harm than good, kids today are sophisticated, imagery matters, lose it. Lost the laughing Indian it does not matter. Seriously.

where is the picture below?

St johns took a cigar store Indian statute and would sometimes roll it out before home games at alumni hall to the cheers of the students. It was often accompanied by a student in native Indian garb. Just want you to know that as an alum I don't dislike the red storm name, I unequivocally hate it. The colleges around the country were literally forced to change any nickname relating to native Indians due to political correctness. The federal government threatened to withhold federal funds from any college that did not c h age it's nickname. That is the bottom line---money--and why the name was changed. Long live the redmen!!!

I remember the cigar store indian. Does anyone remember his name? Chief something, I think.

I also recall that peridically he would get stolen --by Adelphi, of all people! Go figure.

 

[sean]

This debate surfaces periodically, like the cicada, and that's because the initial issue was not handled properly. As with many others here, I grew up rooting for the redmen, but times change and I understood why the name no longer was tenable. The name is considered a slur, and it was ill-suited for the women's teams. Quite a few other colleges were in the same position, but is there any other school that has this much difficulty sorting out the nickname, mascot, fight song, jersey color and school letter (SJU - STJ) issues?
It is symptomatic of a school, especially in the past 20 years, which made poor decisions, both in academics and athletics. I hope the new lay president might be able to remediate some of these problems.
The one thing we all liked was Flagboy, and he was banished without explanation.

There was an explanation, but it was a lame one. The new coach of the Cheer Leading Squad felt that the flag boy routine was not part of the "sport of cheer leading."

 

[beast of the east]

This debate surfaces periodically, like the cicada, and that's because the initial issue was not handled properly. As with many others here, I grew up rooting for the redmen, but times change and I understood why the name no longer was tenable. The name is considered a slur, and it was ill-suited for the women's teams. Quite a few other colleges were in the same position, but is there any other school that has this much difficulty sorting out the nickname, mascot, fight song, jersey color and school letter (SJU - STJ) issues?
It is symptomatic of a school, especially in the past 20 years, which made poor decisions, both in academics and athletics. I hope the new lay president might be able to remediate some of these problems.
The one thing we all liked was Flagboy, and he was banished without explanation.

I believe, from memory, that the women's team was called "The Express". Can anyone verify that?

 

[Spocky Ramone]

This debate surfaces periodically, like the cicada, and that's because the initial issue was not handled properly. As with many others here, I grew up rooting for the redmen, but times change and I understood why the name no longer was tenable. The name is considered a slur, and it was ill-suited for the women's teams. Quite a few other colleges were in the same position, but is there any other school that has this much difficulty sorting out the nickname, mascot, fight song, jersey color and school letter (SJU - STJ) issues?
It is symptomatic of a school, especially in the past 20 years, which made poor decisions, both in academics and athletics. I hope the new lay president might be able to remediate some of these problems.
The one thing we all liked was Flagboy, and he was banished without explanation.

I believe, from memory, that the women's team was called "The Express". Can anyone verify that?

Correctamundo!

 

[Spocky Ramone]

I always liked the Express or maybe Red Express. Even though the ladies used it. Thought it would be cool to see a subway car, nyc skyline with semigraffiti fonts for some alternative gear.

Never been a fan of the Red Storm.

Hard for me to let go of the ring of 'the Redmen of St. John's' as a kid.

It is what it is.
Just win.
Excited for our future.

I thought Express was the way to go - no need to keep red in the title, just make the logo the 1 train, which has the number one in a red circle.

 

[beast of the east]

This debate surfaces periodically, like the cicada, and that's because the initial issue was not handled properly. As with many others here, I grew up rooting for the redmen, but times change and I understood why the name no longer was tenable. The name is considered a slur, and it was ill-suited for the women's teams. Quite a few other colleges were in the same position, but is there any other school that has this much difficulty sorting out the nickname, mascot, fight song, jersey color and school letter (SJU - STJ) issues?
It is symptomatic of a school, especially in the past 20 years, which made poor decisions, both in academics and athletics. I hope the new lay president might be able to remediate some of these problems.
The one thing we all liked was Flagboy, and he was banished without explanation.

I believe, from memory, that the women's team was called "The Express". Can anyone verify that?

Correctamundo!

When I was in school, pre big time program, their best player may have been a Dottie Giordano?

 

[frank61]

Black Jack

 

[Joeche]

Before I get to the point of this post I want every reader of this post to understand that I have complete knowledge of the St. Johns mascot. I know the source of our former nickname.

With that in mind I want to suggest to everyone who truly loves st. Johns that we bury this stupid Laughing Indian image. Look at the picture below. Honestly people does that represent anything we are about today? Its a tiny piece of out history which there is no reason cling to. I saw that post and I was just creeped out. It hurts us plain and simple. We are st. Johns. We are still and always will be the redmen but we are not a pasciche Redskin cartoon that has no historic connection to this program. And I this era we need to let it go and move on. Again it does more harm than good, kids today are sophisticated, imagery matters, lose it. Lost the laughing Indian it does not matter. Seriously.

where is the picture below?

St johns took a cigar store Indian statute and would sometimes roll it out before home games at alumni hall to the cheers of the students. It was often accompanied by a student in native Indian garb. Just want you to know that as an alum I don't dislike the red storm name, I unequivocally hate it. The colleges around the country were literally forced to change any nickname relating to native Indians due to political correctness. The federal government threatened to withhold federal funds from any college that did not c h age it's nickname. That is the bottom line---money--and why the name was changed. Long live the redmen!!!

I remember the cigar store indian. Does anyone remember his name? Chief something, I think.

I also recall that peridically he would get stolen --by Adelphi, of all people! Go figure.

Manhattan stole him one year while I was there too. His name was Chief Blackjack.

 

[lawmanfan]

OMG, another insane discussion.

St. John's was called the Redmen because they wore Red, not because the mascot was a Native American.

Changing the name to Red Storm was one of the most ignorant decisions ever made regarding team names.

Bring back the Redmen name without the mascot..

Ridiculous assertion on your part. Assign your argument to the Cleveland Browns, and make their mascot a distorted caricature of African Americans. Then remove the mascot and try to use the name Browns again.

As a fan, I was not in favor of changing the name of the team. If you don't have a sense of history, watch a movie such as "Flags of Our Fathers" and see what a Native American had to endure even when coming home as a war hero.

Let me be very clear. Among other ancestries (is that spelled correctly), I am part Native American.

I think I may be a bit more qualified than you are to comment on the Redmen without using the mascot. So my assertion is not ridiculous.......

PS - I hate the Browns (oops, misspelling... the "Clowns")

I always suspected that Ohiofan was in fact Elizabeth Warren. At last, my suspicion is confirmed!

As for the rest: for me the St. John's men's basketball team has always been the Redmen, will always be the Redmen, and that's that. The current moniker is not only atrocious, it borders on blasphemy.

 

[mjmaherjr]

As long as we don't bring back that red tuxedo dude, Thats kind of like Jimmy Carter. You just want to forget about it.

Personally I'd like the Indian back. As long as he doesn't scalp anyone then I'm all for it.

Heck if I were at Notre Dame I'd be all for a drunk irish mascot fighting the other team mascot. Stuff like that doesn't bother me

 

[REDMEN8091]

This letter was sent to Clarence Page of the Chicago Tribune when he called for the Redskins name change.

Dear Mr. Page...
I agree with our Native American population. I am highly insulted by the
racially charged name of the Washington Redskins. One might argue
that to name a professional football team after Native Americans would
exalt them as fine warriors, but nay, nay. We must be careful not to
offend, and in the spirit of political correctness and courtesy, we must
move forward.

Let's ditch the Kansas City Chiefs, the Atlanta Braves and the
Cleveland Indians. If your shorts are in a wad because of the reference
the name Redskins makes to skin color, then we need to get rid of the
Cleveland Browns.

The Carolina Panthers obviously were named to keep the memory of
militant Blacks from the 60's alive. Gone. It's offensive to us white folk.

The New York Yankees offend the Southern population. Do you see a team
named for the Confederacy? No! There is no room for any reference to that
tragic war that cost this country so many young men's lives.

I am also offended by the blatant references to the Catholic religion
among our sports team names. Totally inappropriate to have the New
Orleans Saints, the Los Angeles Angels or the San Diego Padres.

Then there are the team names that glorify criminals who raped and
pillaged. We are talking about the horrible Oakland Raiders, the Minnesota
Vikings, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers and the Pittsburgh Pirates!

Now, let us address those teams that clearly send the wrong message to our
children. The San Diego Chargers promote irresponsible fighting or even
spending habits. Wrong message to our children.

The New York Giants and the San Francisco Giants promote obesity, a growing
childhood epidemic. Wrong message to our children. The Cincinnati Reds
promote downers/barbiturates. Wrong message to our children. The Milwaukee Brewers.
Well that goes without saying. Wrong message to our children.

So, there you go. We need to support any legislation that comes out to
rectify this travesty, because the government will likely become
involved with this issue, as they should. Just the kind of thing the do-nothing
Congress loves.

As a diehard Oregon State fan, my wife and I, with all of this in mind,
suggest it might also make some sense to change the name of the Oregon State
women's athletic teams to something other than "the Beavers (especially when
they play Southern California. Do we really want the Trojans sticking
it to the Beavers???)

I always love your articles and I generally agree with them. As for the
Redskins name I would suggest they change the name to the "Foreskins" to better
represent their community, paying tribute to the dick heads in Congress

Regards,

 

[ctstorm]

Classic!

 

[simplyred]

Stupid letter. The Browns? C'mon! Keep telling other people that they should not be offended by your behavior (collective "your", not directed specifically at the poster) because it is not "intended" to be offensive/ you shouls lighten up/ you should grow thicker skin. Couch it under "political correctness" because that turns the argument in your favor. The little big nosed Indian is not intended to be offensive. In fact, the Redskins logo is that of a strong, brave Indian. The Irish aren't offended. So what if their population hasn't been nearly eradicated or marginalized. If they aren't offended, neither should Native Americans. Bunch of left-wing, tree hugging pinko commies!

 

[Red.Fans]

Stupid letter. The Browns? C'mon! Keep telling other people that they should not be offended by your behavior (collective "your", not directed specifically at the poster) because it is not "intended" to be offensive/ you shouls lighten up/ you should grow thicker skin. Couch it under "political correctness" because that turns the argument in your favor. The little big nosed Indian is not intended to be offensive. In fact, the Redskins logo is that of a strong, brave Indian. The Irish aren't offended. So what if their population hasn't been nearly eradicated or marginalized. If they aren't offended, neither should Native Americans. Bunch of left-wing, tree hugging pinko commies!

I guess you don't know Irish history 101.