Early Observations

lawmanfan

lawmanfan

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Some thoughts off of tonight's tip-off event:

There were at least two NBA players on the floor tonight: Sampson and Jordan. Both will be gone next year. But the most impressive player might have been Sanchez. He can do it all - at 6'9". Hit a three, has a midrange jumper, can get to the rim and dunk, superb passer, plays smart defense. Unlike some of the other players who are more athletes than basketball players, he is a basketball player who also has some athleticism.

Beyond those 3 the other 2 starters (judging from the lineups) were Harrison and Hooper. Harrison, not Sampson was announced last. Guess he is back in Coach's good graces.

With Obekpa suspended it's tough to know whether he would have started. I suspect he would have, in place of Hooper. Not 100% sure whether Sanchez and Obekpa can play together, but I suspect they can. If that's the case then a starting 5 of Sanchez, Obekpa, Sampson, Jordan and Harrison is just scary. 4, maybe 5 NBA players there.

If that's the starting 5 then Jones is the first backup off the bench for the front line. He's lost a lot of weight and has gained quickness. Pointer will find some time. Gift can chip in 5 fouls and a few rebounds, maybe (admittedly I have never been a fan of his).

In the backcourt Greene can back up both spots, Branch will find 10 minutes backing up Jordan.

Everyone else sits. Maybe Hooper will find a few minutes as a situational shooter.

I think Coach has a real challenge with this group. IMHO he should play his starting 5, find limited roles for 3 more guys (Jones, Pointer, Greene) and basically sit everyone else except spot duty for Branch, a few minutes for Gift if somebody is in foul trouble, and Hooper for a 3 now and again.

I don't think he's going to do that, because it's just not who he is. The best alternative (IMHO) would be to put together a second squad or a couple of sub-groups that can play together and go with the Nolan Richardson 40 minutes of hell approach.

I just think that with this number of talented players, he had better find defined roles for people early and stick to it or it's going to become a chemistry problem on and off the floor. Better to break some hearts early and tell them they can play next year after Sanchez, Sampson, Jordan, Gift, Bourgault and maybe Hooper are all gone.

It ought to be an interesting season.
 
5 NBA players? Whoa...settle down. You can't get any real takeaway for the starting lineup from an intrasquad scrimmage, because they split the talent up as evenly as possible. Hooper won't start more than a few games that he earns in practice--if he starts any at all.

We won't see Sampson, Sanchez, and Obekpa on the court much at all and I doubt they ever start a single game together.

We go crazy after every scrimmage...last year it was over Christian Jones.
 
5 NBA players? Whoa...settle down. You can't get any real takeaway for the starting lineup from an intrasquad scrimmage, because they split the talent up as evenly as possible. Hooper won't start more than a few games that he earns in practice--if he starts any at all.

We won't see Sampson, Sanchez, and Obekpa on the court much at all and I doubt they ever start a single game together.

We go crazy after every scrimmage...last year it was over Christian Jones.
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Sampson and Jordan will be gone next year. Very likely Obekpa in a year or two. Not sure about Sanchez projecting to the next level but wouldn't be surprised (wouldn't be surprised if he has a long career in Italy either). I can't predict Harrison but I wouldn't say he has zero chance. 2 definite NBA players, one likely, two possibles.

That's a long way from Dwight Hardy followed by pray for rain.

BTW I'm a pessimist compared to D'Angelo - he says there are six or seven pros on the team: http://nypost.com/2013/10/16/st-johns-picked-5th-in-big-east-jordan-top-rookie/

LOL
 
I don't think he's going to do that, because it's just not who he is. The best alternative (IMHO) would be to put together a second squad or a couple of sub-groups that can play together and go with the Nolan Richardson 40 minutes of hell approach.
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I'd like to see the latter but regardless, good to hear you optimistic.
 
Some thoughts off of tonight's tip-off event:

There were at least two NBA players on the floor tonight: Sampson and Jordan. Both will be gone next year. But the most impressive player might have been Sanchez. He can do it all - at 6'9". Hit a three, has a midrange jumper, can get to the rim and dunk, superb passer, plays smart defense. Unlike some of the other players who are more athletes than basketball players, he is a basketball player who also has some athleticism.

Beyond those 3 the other 2 starters (judging from the lineups) were Harrison and Hooper. Harrison, not Sampson was announced last. Guess he is back in Coach's good graces.

With Obekpa suspended it's tough to know whether he would have started. I suspect he would have, in place of Hooper. Not 100% sure whether Sanchez and Obekpa can play together, but I suspect they can. If that's the case then a starting 5 of Sanchez, Obekpa, Sampson, Jordan and Harrison is just scary. 4, maybe 5 NBA players there.

If that's the starting 5 then Jones is the first backup off the bench for the front line. He's lost a lot of weight and has gained quickness. Pointer will find some time. Gift can chip in 5 fouls and a few rebounds, maybe (admittedly I have never been a fan of his).

In the backcourt Greene can back up both spots, Branch will find 10 minutes backing up Jordan.

Everyone else sits. Maybe Hooper will find a few minutes as a situational shooter.

I think Coach has a real challenge with this group. IMHO he should play his starting 5, find limited roles for 3 more guys (Jones, Pointer, Greene) and basically sit everyone else except spot duty for Branch, a few minutes for Gift if somebody is in foul trouble, and Hooper for a 3 now and again.

I don't think he's going to do that, because it's just not who he is. The best alternative (IMHO) would be to put together a second squad or a couple of sub-groups that can play together and go with the Nolan Richardson 40 minutes of hell approach.

I just think that with this number of talented players, he had better find defined roles for people early and stick to it or it's going to become a chemistry problem on and off the floor. Better to break some hearts early and tell them they can play next year after Sanchez, Sampson, Jordan, Gift, Bourgault and maybe Hooper are all gone.

It ought to be an interesting season.
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Thanks for the report lawman!

I really have to disagree with you on branch not being in the rotation. He is one of our five best players IMO. I do agree with you that coach should plan on settling on a rotation. I think it will be closer to nine though with gift, CJ, felix, and marco getting the least of the minutes. Interesting that you said CJ lost weight this summer, didnt think he had much to lose, he is a real wildcard this year.

Rysheed certainly has pro potential but I dont see him jumping over this many guys to leave after his frosh year. Hes really not on the radar yet.
 
Please keep in mind the next draft is extremely deep. I don't see Jordan and Sampson leaving as locks. That said, kids sometimes make impulsive decisions. All in all, enjoy a potentially great year and we'll cross that bridge in April.
 
Guy hasn't played a game yet and we already having him leaving for the NBA. sigh. Can we just enjoy this season. The odds of any of these guys being a draft pick is slim. Lets hope we have a bunch of Russ Smiths and CJ Fairs.
 
Some thoughts off of tonight's tip-off event:

There were at least two NBA players on the floor tonight: Sampson and Jordan. Both will be gone next year. But the most impressive player might have been Sanchez. He can do it all - at 6'9". Hit a three, has a midrange jumper, can get to the rim and dunk, superb passer, plays smart defense. Unlike some of the other players who are more athletes than basketball players, he is a basketball player who also has some athleticism.

Beyond those 3 the other 2 starters (judging from the lineups) were Harrison and Hooper. Harrison, not Sampson was announced last. Guess he is back in Coach's good graces.

With Obekpa suspended it's tough to know whether he would have started. I suspect he would have, in place of Hooper. Not 100% sure whether Sanchez and Obekpa can play together, but I suspect they can. If that's the case then a starting 5 of Sanchez, Obekpa, Sampson, Jordan and Harrison is just scary. 4, maybe 5 NBA players there.

If that's the starting 5 then Jones is the first backup off the bench for the front line. He's lost a lot of weight and has gained quickness. Pointer will find some time. Gift can chip in 5 fouls and a few rebounds, maybe (admittedly I have never been a fan of his).

In the backcourt Greene can back up both spots, Branch will find 10 minutes backing up Jordan.

Everyone else sits. Maybe Hooper will find a few minutes as a situational shooter.

I think Coach has a real challenge with this group. IMHO he should play his starting 5, find limited roles for 3 more guys (Jones, Pointer, Greene) and basically sit everyone else except spot duty for Branch, a few minutes for Gift if somebody is in foul trouble, and Hooper for a 3 now and again.

I don't think he's going to do that, because it's just not who he is. The best alternative (IMHO) would be to put together a second squad or a couple of sub-groups that can play together and go with the Nolan Richardson 40 minutes of hell approach.

I just think that with this number of talented players, he had better find defined roles for people early and stick to it or it's going to become a chemistry problem on and off the floor. Better to break some hearts early and tell them they can play next year after Sanchez, Sampson, Jordan, Gift, Bourgault and maybe Hooper are all gone.

It ought to be an interesting season.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the report lawman!

I really have to disagree with you on branch not being in the rotation. He is one of our five best players IMO. I do agree with you that coach should plan on settling on a rotation. I think it will be closer to nine though with gift, CJ, felix, and marco getting the least of the minutes. Interesting that you said CJ lost weight this summer, didnt think he had much to lose, he is a real wildcard this year.

Rysheed certainly has pro potential but I dont see him jumping over this many guys to leave after his frosh year. Hes really not on the radar yet.
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Ditto lawman I was unable to watch last night. I think we will see Hooper get more mins Possibly 10 P/G I did not know Obekpa was suspended What was the reason and for how long?
 
The Lawman says Pointer will find some time and nobody but me feels he's better then a guy who can find some time. He plays D, runs the floor, rebounds and busts his ass. If he don't get 23 minutes a game, this gotta be a top ten team. Don't mean to come on to strong, but I really like his game.
 
The Lawman says Pointer will find some time and nobody but me feels he's better then a guy who can find some time. He plays D, runs the floor, rebounds and busts his ass. If he don't get 23 minutes a game, this gotta be a top ten team. Don't mean to come on to strong, but I really like his game.
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Doms great but I think 20 mpg is perfect for him. That leaves twenty minutes to split between 3 guard sets and hooper.
 
5 NBA players? Whoa...settle down. You can't get any real takeaway for the starting lineup from an intrasquad scrimmage, because they split the talent up as evenly as possible. Hooper won't start more than a few games that he earns in practice--if he starts any at all.

We won't see Sampson, Sanchez, and Obekpa on the court much at all and I doubt they ever start a single game together.

We go crazy after every scrimmage...last year it was over Christian Jones.
Click to expand...

Sampson and Jordan will be gone next year. Very likely Obekpa in a year or two. Not sure about Sanchez projecting to the next level but wouldn't be surprised (wouldn't be surprised if he has a long career in Italy either). I can't predict Harrison but I wouldn't say he has zero chance. 2 definite NBA players, one likely, two possibles.

That's a long way from Dwight Hardy followed by pray for rain.

BTW I'm a pessimist compared to D'Angelo - he says there are six or seven pros on the team: http://nypost.com/2013/10/16/st-johns-picked-5th-in-big-east-jordan-top-rookie/

LOL
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If Karr improves his jumper he may project into the first round. Now he is mid-second round in one mock draft. Sanchez will likely play in Europe but Jordan will have to be an impact player who leads this team deep into the tourney to even be noticed by scouts.
Lavin did not sit Gift last year to give him garbage minutes this year! Obekpa had zero competition for playing time last year. This year he will be tested and only his improvement will dictate playing time. Some kids need a kick in the ass to get them motivated as we saw with DH and this year, with depth up front, it is CO's turn.
Never make any assumptions after a scrimmage.
 
I agree with Joe49. Dom will get plenty of minutes. He brings so much to the table. I'm just not sure what it is that I see that so many others don't. Also, I agree with the poster who says that Gift was not sat last year in order to give him garbage minutes this year. Unless the redshirt year was totally wasted, I anticipate enough improvement that he will be rewarded with his share of minutes. CO will be able to stay out of trouble and the front court can go big or small depending on the opponent.
 
Bottom line is with 13 players and guys like Orlando and Rysheed joining the group from last year someone or some guys will get squeezed for minutes. It's inevitable and nobody should pretend it won't be the case. Could be Dom because his aggressiveness on D with new rules could lead to foul problem. Also if he struggles to put the ball in the hoop he could lose time. Same goes for Phil. I think Marco is a safe bet obviously. Where does Gift stand with Chris, Sanchez and long term Jones potential taking up front court minutes.
 
Bottom line is with 13 players and guys like Orlando and Rysheed joining the group from last year someone or some guys will get squeezed for minutes. It's inevitable and nobody should pretend it won't be the case. Could be Dom because his aggressiveness on D with new rules could lead to foul problem. Also if he struggles to put the ball in the hoop he could lose time. Same goes for Phil. I think Marco is a safe bet obviously. Where does Gift stand with Chris, Sanchez and long term Jones potential taking up front court minutes.
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Agree. The reference to potential impact of new rules is on point. Recent reports indicate some D oriented teams have struggled in scrimmages adjusting to modifications to contact allowed. I would think you will see more teams playing zone than ever.

Just saw this, which underscores the impact noted;

“@GoodmanESPN: One scrimmage this morning had 61 fouls and 86 free throws, another had 54 fouls and 68 free throws.”
 
Please keep in mind the next draft is extremely deep. I don't see Jordan and Sampson leaving as locks. That said, kids sometimes make impulsive decisions. All in all, enjoy a potentially great year and we'll cross that bridge in April.
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They will all leave at the end of this year as we will be winning the NCAA championship and as the saying goes you sell high and buy low
 
Dom got a lot of defensive assignments to the opponent's best offensive player. So yeah it will be on him to adjust but short of that I don't see him getting squeezed. He adds something in every category. Offensively he is not as bad as he is made out to be. He had better FG/FT% than most of the team. What he exhibited at times but I think he improved dramatically was decision making. He was forcing but got more mature.
 
I may be by myself in this, however I think 11,12 and 13 on the roster should be PG, CJ and MB. Not a big fan of really any of them. Phil has only seen the PT he has coz of depth. He is too streaky and his distribution leaves a lot to be desired. Christian is a mid major player in my opinion. Great athlete but just a decent player. Marco is a low major player. Hence the reason he was supposed to go to Montana originally. These are my opinions and I'm entitled to them :)
 
Rawdog, I agree that Phil should see fewer minutes. As for Marco, last year he could not get his shot off against quicker opponents than he was used to seeing in JC. When he did get the shot off, he didn't hit much. His time will be very limited, especially since Hooper will be the go to 3-pt man. CJ, imo, will be a contributor in his Jr. and Sr. years. I think Lavin's theory is that he can develop guys that have great athleticism over a 4 year period.

Btw, this discussion is sorely lacking input from Crgreen. Wish he was still with us.
 
Bottom line is with 13 players and guys like Orlando and Rysheed joining the group from last year someone or some guys will get squeezed for minutes. It's inevitable and nobody should pretend it won't be the case. Could be Dom because his aggressiveness on D with new rules could lead to foul problem. Also if he struggles to put the ball in the hoop he could lose time. Same goes for Phil. I think Marco is a safe bet obviously. Where does Gift stand with Chris, Sanchez and long term Jones potential taking up front court minutes.
Click to expand...

Agree. The reference to potential impact of new rules is on point. Recent reports indicate some D oriented teams have struggled in scrimmages adjusting to modifications to contact allowed. I would think you will see more teams playing zone than ever.

Just saw this, which underscores the impact noted;

“@GoodmanESPN: One scrimmage this morning had 61 fouls and 86 free throws, another had 54 fouls and 68 free throws.”
Click to expand...
I hope they call it tight. We still will have 7 players standing down the stretch. Depth will win us games if we hit fouls.
 
Bottom line is with 13 players and guys like Orlando and Rysheed joining the group from last year someone or some guys will get squeezed for minutes. It's inevitable and nobody should pretend it won't be the case. Could be Dom because his aggressiveness on D with new rules could lead to foul problem. Also if he struggles to put the ball in the hoop he could lose time. Same goes for Phil. I think Marco is a safe bet obviously. Where does Gift stand with Chris, Sanchez and long term Jones potential taking up front court minutes.
Click to expand...

Agree. The reference to potential impact of new rules is on point. Recent reports indicate some D oriented teams have struggled in scrimmages adjusting to modifications to contact allowed. I would think you will see more teams playing zone than ever.

Just saw this, which underscores the impact noted;

“@GoodmanESPN: One scrimmage this morning had 61 fouls and 86 free throws, another had 54 fouls and 68 free throws.”
Click to expand...

These new rules are gonna drive me crazy. Cant stand when it because a free throw match, let them play!
 
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