Defensive Shortcomings

Many a poster who believe the loss of Coach Dunlap to this team will be critical.
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Many poster here critical of Coach Dunlaps run the clock out half court offense last year. Genius goes back and forth on if you winning or not. Coaching staff getting feel of how kids can be best utilized, and some of the kids just trying to get a grip. Nothing to knock Coach Steve on, just a matter of time being big factor.
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Last year was a different story. We only had 6 players,so we had to play that way. I have noticed that this team spends a lot of time passing the ball way beyond the 3 point line, which seems to result in eating clock , but not finding the open man and the net result is a forced shot at the end of the shotclock. RE: defense, the team is young and will take time to be comfortable w the systems. 2 years ago w a bunch of Srs. ,we didnt look good preseason, but by the time BE play came around we were much improved.
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Yes, last year was a different story. My point was that even the great Coach Dunlap took heat, but is used by some to rag on Steve. There have been some wise guy remarks when Mike left asking who's gonna coach the team, when the obvious answer was our head coach is back, and of course he will coach the team. I understand this board is for opinions, and to discuss game action, but finding fault with this coach ain't called for at this point. It's like guys are happy about having something to knock. I don't think the Johnnies were ready to beat a team like Baylor. They could take away some stuff, but not all, and a good Baylor team knew where to go with the ball. I got the feeling Baylor was toying with us, but because we were hitting our shots they didn't say bye-bye to late in the game. Does anybody on this board think at this point in the season we are a better team then Baylor? Guys can chirp all they want about mistakes Steve makes, but that sure don't mean it's justified, or even normal. Last year Mike was trying to keep a inexperienced 6 man rotation in games. No doubt if guys hit 3's against us, gotta be Steve's shortcomings as a coach. How did any coach that lost to last years SJU team keep his Job?
 
Pleased to see that you have confidence in the coaching staff. I would love to join you, except that a game like Baylor erodes that confidence for me. It's only an opinion. Allow me the courtesy of having my own, and I would be happy to respect yours.
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I recalled you doing the same a couple of seasons ago, during the early stages, and it came back to bite you in the rear.
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Please elaborate, MJ. Have no idea what you are talking about.
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I recall you not feeling good or being high on the staff after some early season losses from a couple of seasons ago. You ended up retracting some things later in the season. The site has crashed since that particular time, so there isn't any way to view those old posts. I'm almost sure it was you.

Regardless, everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I'd just be careful about stating certain things at this point in the season. I guess we all have to eat crow at some point. Some usually do it more than others (I'm not referring to you, in particular). LOL
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MJ- I believe that what you are referring to, is the criticism I had for the coaching staff after the 20 point collapse at Fordham two years ago. My point was poor clock management...failing to slow tempo, increase possession time and thereby make the game shorter. There was never anything to retract my friend. Subsequently, the coaching staff had success in introducing the match up zone, which once the kids caught on, made a tremendous difference
in the way that team was playing basketball. I was pleased with the result and complemented the staff publicly as was appropriate. Their season's record speaks for itself. You'll have to forgive me, but I don't see anything there that involves eating crow. My observations regarding Fordham were exclusive to that game. It was not a permanent indictment of Steve Lavin's coaching system. So, kindly explain to me...What's your point? We come here to comment on our opinions and observations after watching the game. Why, pray tell, would I want to "be careful about stating certain things at this point"? My Baylor game observations are factually accurate from my perspective. Eating crow doesn't have anything to do with it. If you have something to say regarding any game, I would be more than happy to read it and consider it. I would, however, never consider it appropriate to warn you
about having an idea. I thought that is why we come here?
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If I shall expand further, you went on and on when we were going through a rough patch early in the Big East season, and you ripped the staff in a game versus UCLA during the middle of the same season. Like I said, I don't recall everything verbatim because those posts no longer exists, but I recall you catching some flak because you seemed to display a know-it-all attitude throughout your analysis. Many times it's not what you say, it's how you say it. You were also more verbose after losses.

If you're gonna matter-of-factly and state in absoluteness, then a plate of crow is up for the serving. You have every right to your opinion. I, basically agreed with your first post in this thread. I just commented on another one of your posts in this thread, which I thought sounded like something from a couple years ago during our early season losses; early season conference skid; and, the loss to UCLA.... A bit over-the-top.
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Whatever MJ...Have it your way. I don't really have the time to defend myself against foolish criticism, of posts I apparently put here two years ago. I'm actually flattered that you remember them so well...in ways perhaps, that are better than my own recall. Anyway, I call it as I see it...it is not political, nor do I even remotely feel the need to justify my ideas, nor the way I present them, to someone like you. Are you suggesting that I adapt the way I express myself, to appeal to a style that you find appealing? Goodness, I have heard some arrogance in my time, but that tops the cake. I can only suggest in closing, that you perhaps spend some time providing the board with ideas that illustrate your own expertise...rather than worrying yourself about what you think I said several years ago.
 
Whatever MJ...Have it your way. I don't really have the time to defend myself against foolish criticism, of posts I apparently put here two years ago. I'm actually flattered that you remember them so well...in ways perhaps, that are better than my own recall. Anyway, I call it as I see it...it is not political, nor do I even remotely feel the need to justify my ideas, nor the way I present them, to someone like you. Are you suggesting that I adapt the way I express myself, to appeal to a style that you find appealing? Goodness, I have heard some arrogance in my time, but that tops the cake. I can only suggest in closing, that you perhaps spend some time providing the board with ideas that illustrate your own expertise...rather than worrying yourself about what you think I said several years ago.
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For starters, I agreed with your initial post.

Well.... I'll end it like this, my friend.... Reading is fundamental. If anything, you're the arrogant one, as you pranced in here after every loss with a pompus/arrogant attitude to most of the board. Spare me.

Trust me! I'm not worrying about anything you said a couple of years ago. Just was bringing it to attention.
 
Whatever MJ...Have it your way. I don't really have the time to defend myself against foolish criticism, of posts I apparently put here two years ago. I'm actually flattered that you remember them so well...in ways perhaps, that are better than my own recall. Anyway, I call it as I see it...it is not political, nor do I even remotely feel the need to justify my ideas, nor the way I present them, to someone like you. Are you suggesting that I adapt the way I express myself, to appeal to a style that you find appealing? Goodness, I have heard some arrogance in my time, but that tops the cake. I can only suggest in closing, that you perhaps spend some time providing the board with ideas that illustrate your own expertise...rather than worrying yourself about what you think I said several years ago.
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For starters, I agreed with your initial post.

Well.... I'll end it like this, my friend.... Reading is fundamental. If anything, you're the arrogant one, as you pranced in here after every loss with a pompus/arrogant attitude to most of the board. Spare me.

Trust me! I'm not worrying about anything you said a couple of years ago. Just was bringing it to attention.
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Sorry you feel that way! And for the record....Trust me....I'm far too old to prance! Have a nice day!
 
First of all, Heslip plays for ANY team in college BB... take that to the bank.

And, we defended him poorly, that's a fact. Not getting to a known shooter like him , as we didn't, is a mistake fundamentally, whether by coaching or the players... In game adjustments are expected to be made and weren't.

it's not like he was some unknown kid off the bench. he has a much deserved rep as a gunslinger who lights it up..

and, we couldn't find him? to the tune of 29 points.. that's on somebody. everybody.

Lavin's defense over 3 years has shown to be weak against shooters.. Look it up..
 
First of all, Heslip plays for ANY team in college BB... take that to the bank.

And, we defended him poorly, that's a fact. Not getting to a known shooter like him , as we didn't, is a mistake fundamentally, whether by coaching or the players... In game adjustments are expected to be made and weren't.

it's not like he was some unknown kid off the bench. he has a much deserved rep as a gunslinger who lights it up..

and, we couldn't find him? to the tune of 29 points.. that's on somebody. everybody.

Lavin's defense over 3 years has shown to be weak against shooters.. Look it up..
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Last years team was short players, so if guys were playin 36 min a game, maybe they be a step slow getting to the corner. Year one a group of guys who had no wins against top 10 team in 3 years seemed to turn it around pretty good. Lets see, 4 wins against top ten, 6 wins against top 25. Gotta figure some of those teams could shoot. This year, as you call it, year 3, is 5 games old. I think you a bit off about making a judgment you say is based on a 3 year record. Would you be ok with revisiting this teams D ability's in the second half of the season?
 
On an independent thought about Red Storm defense, I think that it's clear that Lavin's strategy is to apply a lot of pressure up high, create turnover that translates to easy basket. The use of pointer at the top is a perfect example of this - long arms, athletic, and the ability to wreak havoc deflecting passes and tieing up smaller players. Defense is a team sport, and everyone on the court must anticipate, help out, clog the middle, provide weakside help. Unlike offense, where schoolyard moves, jump shots, and ball handling are honed individually, for a team to play tough defense, it must funciton as a unit. Lavin appears more than ready to take his lumps early to establish a stellar defensive unit. Essentially for the third year in a row, he is starting with a new squad to him. I'll bet my money on his methods, because I like that style of play.
 
On an independent thought about Red Storm defense, I think that it's clear that Lavin's strategy is to apply a lot of pressure up high, create turnover that translates to easy basket. The use of pointer at the top is a perfect example of this - long arms, athletic, and the ability to wreak havoc deflecting passes and tieing up smaller players. Defense is a team sport, and everyone on the court must anticipate, help out, clog the middle, provide weakside help. Unlike offense, where schoolyard moves, jump shots, and ball handling are honed individually, for a team to play tough defense, it must funciton as a unit. Lavin appears more than ready to take his lumps early to establish a stellar defensive unit. Essentially for the third year in a row, he is starting with a new squad to him. I'll bet my money on his methods, because I like that style of play.[quote)

I don't know Beast. I hear you and there are many who prefer that style of play. None other than the famous and respected Coach K. is in agreement with you. I prefer the defense used by Few at Gonzaga. I suppose my position, as I stated in opening this thread, was that your defense should be tailored to the strengths and weaknesses of your opponent. I feel Baylor was much too quick and fast out top, to pressure there. Sir Dom plays defense there with an eye on the steal. Against Baylor, I would have preferred an eye on containment. For me, that was a better strategy. But who knows, the outcomes are always going to be in the subjective hands of how the athletes perform. I certainly hope you are right because it appears our fates will rest with how well we play your chosen defense.
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Murray state beat us by consistently hitting the corner 3 in the Charleston Classic.. We never stepped up to challenge the shooter, from either side of the defense. It cost us the game.

Baylor should have been a known quantity, with Heslip, Jones,etc.. Heslip is a spot up shooter who can destroy a team by himself, if allowed to get his shot.. He got his shot at will against us..How come?

Playing team defense should be priority 1 in fundamentally building a solid team.. I share docbutler's view that thru 4 games, the defense is suspect..

Excusing poor defense by claiming inexperience, tiredness, etc doesn't address what should be apparent to us, as fans, and certainly the Coaching staff... Defense is effort as well as strategy, one comes from the coaching staff, the other from the players..

Basketball is not just offense.. Consult Bobby Knight for more information. Both components of the game are important to a winning result.
 
Murray state beat us by consistently hitting the corner 3 in the Charleston Classic.. We never stepped up to challenge the shooter, from either side of the defense. It cost us the game.

Baylor should have been a known quantity, with Heslip, Jones,etc.. Heslip is a spot up shooter who can destroy a team by himself, if allowed to get his shot.. He got his shot at will against us..How come?

Playing team defense should be priority 1 in fundamentally building a solid team.. I share docbutler's view that thru 4 games, the defense is suspect..

Excusing poor defense by claiming inexperience, tiredness, etc doesn't address what should be apparent to us, as fans, and certainly the Coaching staff... Defense is effort as well as strategy, one comes from the coaching staff, the other from the players..

Basketball is not just offense.. Consult Bobby Knight for more information. Both components of the game are important to a winning result.
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Joey, Murry shot 10 for 30 from 3. You think maybe our 2-14 might have cost us? If you wanna beat up Coach Steve, the staff and the kids for not guarding at this point in time, it sure is your call to do so.
 
First of all, Heslip plays for ANY team in college BB... take that to the bank.

And, we defended him poorly, that's a fact. Not getting to a known shooter like him , as we didn't, is a mistake fundamentally, whether by coaching or the players... In game adjustments are expected to be made and weren't.

it's not like he was some unknown kid off the bench. he has a much deserved rep as a gunslinger who lights it up..

and, we couldn't find him? to the tune of 29 points.. that's on somebody. everybody.

Lavin's defense over 3 years has shown to be weak against shooters.. Look it up..
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Perhaps its the players playing it
 
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