Coaching Decision Poll

[jumbo_peanuts]

My opinion is Lavin should not be retained. No surprise there.

Expectations, goals? Despite his own comments,I do not think he achieved what he said he would accomplish when he was hired. We are still the SLEEPING GIANT he proclaimed us to be. No advancement there.

He won 1 BE Tournament game in 5 years. With Norm's players. Did not win a NCAA GAME . Did not get his team's to really contend for a regular season BE Championship. He achieved mediocre results at best in Conference and, if you believe he had great talent from his own Recruits, he under achieved. look it up.

His style of COACHING and they way his teams play, was not conducive to a winning formula in the Big East.
I also believe he was outcoached by nearly every other Coach in the League, except Purnell . The game of Coaching changed from his years at ESPN. He did not adjust.

He is overrated as a Recruiter. He did not get enough or the right kind of player for this league. No Big men with a well rounded game. Obepka was/is a 1 trick pony and, never developed enough offensive skills. And, size wise, he was smaller than most post players he encountered and rarely rebounded well or, on the offensive boards. And, attitude wise was a negative for the team. He should never play again in a St John's uniform and doubt he will or, remain in the school.

The BE Commissioner, Val Ackerman, expressed a rather severe admonishment to our Program as soon as the Obepka suspension occurred . It happened under Steve's watch and he bears responsibility. I think the University will value that as evidence Lavin's Team was out of control at times, in the locker room and, off the COURT.

Lavin had 5 years and did not meet the goals, expectations required of this Program.

And what are the required expectations of this program? I think the biggest problem is that people think we are the same program that we were in the mid 80's. I'm sorry, but we are not. Prior to Lavin coming here, we had one tournament appearance in the previous 10yrs, and only 4 since the 92-93 season, so it's not like we were used to going to the tournament every year and then Lavin screwed everything up. The truth of the matter is that we were an average program at best when Lavin got here.

Have we improved as a program since Lavin got here.....absolutely! Give him an extension!

 

[Redmen88]

I voted for a new coach but would not be disappointed if he was retained. He did some good things but has had a lot of negatives also. I am tired of a black cloud following the program. I would love Archie Miller or someone that can coach the players and run some plays other than the 3 nan weave at the top of the key. Would also like to see some shooters rather than a bunch of athletic slashers.

 

[simplyred]

I'd sign up for Billy Donovan, Bill Self or Coach K. After that, we may as well keep Lavin.

 

[MJDinkins]

I'd sign up for Billy Donovan, Bill Self or Coach K. After that, we may as well keep Lavin.

LOL

Jokes aplenty for you, huh?

 

[MJDinkins]

Suspensions, failed drug tests, ineligibility, players leaving the team unannounced, recruiting suspicious characters,guys refusing to check back into games, hugely overpaid staff, taking years off of recruiting, alienating NYC High school coaches, Robert Morris thumping, deflecting responsibility, star guard blatant disregard for Carnesecca arena, failure to respect SJU tradition( we don't need to hear about John Wooden), 7-18 in March, 2-9 in postseason tournaments, lack of player development etc etc etc.

Where do I sign up?

Go back over to JJ where your trolling is appreciated by one.

 

[lawmanfan]

I'm shocked at how many people have such low expectations for the program. Or how many people see "20 wins" and no farther.

 

[simplyred]

I'd sign up for Billy Donovan, Bill Self or Coach K. After that, we may as well keep Lavin.

LOL

Jokes aplenty for you, huh?

I would have added Pitino but there are too many Italian restaurants in NYC. He wouldn't last.

 

[Avon Barksdale]

Suspensions, failed drug tests, ineligibility, players leaving the team unannounced, recruiting suspicious characters,guys refusing to check back into games, hugely overpaid staff, taking years off of recruiting, alienating NYC High school coaches, Robert Morris thumping, deflecting responsibility, star guard blatant disregard for Carnesecca arena, failure to respect SJU tradition( we don't need to hear about John Wooden), 7-18 in March, 2-9 in postseason tournaments, lack of player development etc etc etc.

Where do I sign up?

Go back over to JJ where your trolling is appreciated by one.

Call it trolling but there isn't one false word written by Ricky Smith in his post.

The negatives outweigh the positives by so much

The problem is many are using Norm Roberts as a barometer which gives Lavin an automatic pass

 

[westchesterjoe]

i do not think HOWLAND would be a good choice for us. My preferences in order:

Billy D, Bobby Hurley, Archie Miller, Danny Hurley, Shaka Smart.

The Hurley's are intriguing. Wonder, if one of the Brothers came here, would Bob Sr come on board as a Assistant COACH?

i think some folks are thinking that many BIG Names would automatically decline the job, are basing that on the former, somewhat disgraced President, FR Harrington.. A well known dictator as a leader.. Harrington bears much of the blame in my mind as negatively impacting the SJU brand. over his 25 years.

 

[Avon Barksdale]

I'm shocked at how many people have such low expectations for the program. Or how many people see "20 wins" and no farther.

20 wins when teams are playing more games than the past and the Big East is not the Big East we all knew for the last 30 years.

20 wins is a given with the OOC cupcakes and half decent talent any year. You don't need Greg Popovich coaching to get that.

 

[Avon Barksdale]

both Hurleys
Miller from Dayton
Marshall from Wichita State

These are my top 4 choices.

I wIll support Masiello 100% but I don't think the admin would sign off even though he is Repoles guy.

Cluess no thanks. He has a fun brand of hoops to watch but he is a question mark as a coach and he has failed more than he has succeeded in the Big Spot.

Smart turned down Illiois and UCLA so he would turn us down and I am not being delusional about Billy D or Pitino.

 

[basketballjones]

I go back and forth mainly because starting over is a big challenge. I voted no finally because I know what I see on the court. An undermanned team that is easy to root for but inconsistent. A coaching staff that can't adjust during games, don't have a coherent offense ( see butler ) and recruit inconsistently.

For all the talk about St John's not being the St John's of 1985, the Big East isn't the same conference with giant state schools, huge budgets, a recruiting edge in facilities and cheating on eligibility etc. We can be a top competitor in the Big east every year. The idea that we should re sign Lav because we're not capable of being a top team again is just settling for mediocrity and admitting Lav isn't that good anyway, but is the best we can do. I do not believe that for a second.

 

[Ricky Smith]

Suspensions, failed drug tests, ineligibility, players leaving the team unannounced, recruiting suspicious characters,guys refusing to check back into games, hugely overpaid staff, taking years off of recruiting, alienating NYC High school coaches, Robert Morris thumping, deflecting responsibility, star guard blatant disregard for Carnesecca arena, failure to respect SJU tradition( we don't need to hear about John Wooden), 7-18 in March, 2-9 in postseason tournaments, lack of player development etc etc etc.

Where do I sign up?

Go back over to JJ where your trolling is appreciated by one.

As usual, nothing brought to the table.

 

[fuchsia]

I cannot stop myself from measuring basketball teams against the ideal in my head from seeing the Bill Russell Celtics under Red Auerbach. Today of all days the closest I have seen to that model in college ball this year was Nova. When Lavin was at UCLA I always thought he recruited mismatched players and despite overwhelming talent always came up short. This was the first year I thought St. John's was headed toward the formula of complementary skills that I thought we needed, with KT and ADR as the bulk that would have structured the court to make our skill and speed guys thrive. We know what happened to that but I thought that Lavin was moving in the right direction under the influence of Keady and Whitesell.
The formula is pretty simple and alluded to in previous posts in this thread:
A long to block shots and rebound and score a little down low.
A strong with good hands and quick feet to clear space for slashers and rebounding.
An orchestrator who gets the ball to where it needs to be and can either slash or hit the jumper, and
Two wings, one of whom has some point guard skills and can either crash the boards or hit jumpers and the other who can shoot the three or hit mid range,
plus competent backups who have combo skills.
Given his people talents and what I saw as growth in his approach (albeit unrealized on the court this year) I voted to keep coach.

 

[westchesterjoe]

Of course, I am delighted to see AVON, Ricky and, others who want more from the Program than we have gotten, express their views . Which are more fact based than what others put forth.

i took Lavin at his word and believed him that this Program would be resurrected and become a contender again in the BE Conference and nationally. He did not meet those goals as a Coach. He has had adequate time to build a Program and, hasn't.

Even, many in the local press are questioning his accomplishments and, rightly so. And, the naysayers here, just continue to bark at anyone and everyone who express a opinion different than their own. Mostly, without any factual evidence that is on the table. NOBLY, expressed by Ricky and Avon.

Lavin's record is mediocre at best.. And, that is being generous with that evaluation.

 

[southernjohnny2]

Ricky, Duke a 1 seed with atleast 3 NBA kids, had more drama than STJ including a serial rapist, failed tests, suspensions, recruiting suspicious characters, they took a thumping last year 1st round from a cinderella. Coach K has alienated all the money grubbing aau, and HS coaches as well. UNC had academic fraud, recruited suspicious kids, kid kicked off the team, kid ruled ineligible, failed drug tests,
Two programs with way more issues than you bash Lavin for, yet nobody on tobacco road are calling for their heads.
Why would ANY coach want to come here? No fan base, a bunch of whiners, and complainers, greedy HS coaches and AAU programs looking to shake down coaches, there is a lack of depth of area talent. Have to deal with agenda area reporters, NYC is a complete nightmare for a coach! I am grateful Lavin came here.

 

[Ricky Smith]

Ricky, Duke a 1 seed with atleast 3 NBA kids, had more drama than STJ including a serial rapist, failed tests, suspensions, recruiting suspicious characters, they took a thumping last year 1st round from a cinderella. Coach K has alienated all the money grubbing aau, and HS coaches as well. UNC had academic fraud, recruited suspicious kids, kid kicked off the team, kid ruled ineligible, failed drug tests,
Two programs with way more issues than you bash Lavin for, yet nobody on tobacco road are calling for their heads.
Why would ANY coach want to come here? No fan base, a bunch of whiners, and complainers, greedy HS coaches and AAU programs looking to shake down coaches, there is a lack of depth of area talent. Have to deal with agenda area reporters, NYC is a complete nightmare for a coach! I am grateful Lavin came here.

Not sure how Lavin and St. John's is even compatible to coach K and Duke

 

[rawdognyc]

Suspensions, failed drug tests, ineligibility, players leaving the team unannounced, recruiting suspicious characters,guys refusing to check back into games, hugely overpaid staff, taking years off of recruiting, alienating NYC High school coaches, Robert Morris thumping, deflecting responsibility, star guard blatant disregard for Carnesecca arena, failure to respect SJU tradition( we don't need to hear about John Wooden), 7-18 in March, 2-9 in postseason tournaments, lack of player development etc etc etc.

Where do I sign up?

Who else failed a drug test? You pluralized that one. Who else refused to check into a game? Plural on that one too. Funny that it's the same person that failed the test and refused to go back into the game. What years (again plural) did he take off from recruiting?
Whether or not i care if he returns or not is irrelevant at this point. However be honest about the situation if you're going to attack someone's work.

 

[MJDinkins]

Suspensions, failed drug tests, ineligibility, players leaving the team unannounced, recruiting suspicious characters,guys refusing to check back into games, hugely overpaid staff, taking years off of recruiting, alienating NYC High school coaches, Robert Morris thumping, deflecting responsibility, star guard blatant disregard for Carnesecca arena, failure to respect SJU tradition( we don't need to hear about John Wooden), 7-18 in March, 2-9 in postseason tournaments, lack of player development etc etc etc.

Where do I sign up?

Go back over to JJ where your trolling is appreciated by one.

Call it trolling but there isn't one false word written by Ricky Smith in his post.

The negatives outweigh the positives by so much

The problem is many are using Norm Roberts as a barometer which gives Lavin an automatic pass

I call him a troll because that's who he is. He should be embarrassed by all the bullcrap he's posted over on the other board.

 

[Ricky Smith]

Suspensions, failed drug tests, ineligibility, players leaving the team unannounced, recruiting suspicious characters,guys refusing to check back into games, hugely overpaid staff, taking years off of recruiting, alienating NYC High school coaches, Robert Morris thumping, deflecting responsibility, star guard blatant disregard for Carnesecca arena, failure to respect SJU tradition( we don't need to hear about John Wooden), 7-18 in March, 2-9 in postseason tournaments, lack of player development etc etc etc.

Where do I sign up?

Who else failed a drug test? You pluralized that one. Who else refused to check into a game? Plural on that one too. Funny that it's the same person that failed the test and refused to go back into the game. What years (again plural) did he take off from recruiting?
Whether or not i care if he returns or not is irrelevant at this point. However be honest about the situation if you're going to attack someone's work.

2 failed drug testS is an automatic 2 week suspension, which it just so happens what Obekpa received.