I do not think Lavin is on the hot seat at this point. He has made strides regarding our identity, as well as recruiting. Fact is that this project of making us revelant again may take longer than we expect. Not all top recruiting classes pan out, and I think the jury is still out on this class. If you think about it, the pressure is on Lavin to make this happen because where does he go from SJU. If he cannot make it happen here his coaching career is over! It means back to ESPN or some similar gig!! Remember he took a group of Norms kids and did some special things with that team. I just do not think that our present group is that good, and I hope they prove me wrong! At this point we could do far worse than Lavin. I know most posters do not want to hear this, but we need to be patient!
Coach
- Thread starter ManhattAn1
- Start date
If Lavin is here for the long haul, then he better learn from his past recruits.
If we have only six scholarship play as of right now, then I guess he`ll atleast get 4 top recruits. It`s ok to get a few athletic players that has a hard time shooting, but you damn well better make sure you get a few top shooters too (not Hooper and Marco types, but shooters that could actually play the game of basketball.). If doesn`t get a few of those then it will be the same crap all over again, a bunch high rated athletes that don`t know how to shoot the ball.
LEARN FROM YOUR MISTAKES, it`s that simple. I`m guessing another Beast wiseass remark is coming.
If we have only six scholarship play as of right now, then I guess he`ll atleast get 4 top recruits. It`s ok to get a few athletic players that has a hard time shooting, but you damn well better make sure you get a few top shooters too (not Hooper and Marco types, but shooters that could actually play the game of basketball.). If doesn`t get a few of those then it will be the same crap all over again, a bunch high rated athletes that don`t know how to shoot the ball.
LEARN FROM YOUR MISTAKES, it`s that simple. I`m guessing another Beast wiseass remark is coming.
beast of the east
Active member
What has Lavin done better than Norm? How about recruit in the top 100 from the get go, including an NBA first round pick, and more recently the 17th best player in the nation. Do you think Norm recruited talent at that level?
Everyone is different in terms of how they view things. You clearly take pride in a one-and-done kid rotting away in Orlando. That's fine. You also seem to think positively of his recruiting prowess.
Unfortunately for you and I, those things you take pride in do nothing for us on the basketball court.
Top 100 recruits mean nothing. Amir Garrett isn't a top 100 quality player yet he was ranked highly. Once you get to 30-100 on those lists nobody truly knows how good a player can be.
You are harping on things that are supposed to build a program's profile. I'm harping on the only things that really matter. Winning and making players better. Lavin has shown he can't do either consistently.
beast of the east
Active member
All in all, Duke, Kentucky, Kansas, and many other schools get their share of top 20. Lavin penetrated the top 100 easily, something Norm failed to do. Clearly Lavin is a better recruiter, which is the one thing Norm was supposed to do. You need players first and foremost. IF we haven't secured a bid by the end of next season, then we can talk about our next coach. If that were to happen, I think Lavin may take flight on his own, and may do so if he has the type of success he had at UCLA
Recruiting is the only thing he can do! If you can't coach players then what good is recruiting? Amir stunk his two years here, Phil Greene makes awful decisions and still doesn't have a clue how to play point, dlo had an attitude adjustment that personally did nothing(he still talks so much crap out there). If these performances came from us last year I think we'd all be satisfied. This year we expected to be a top 20 team and that is just not panning out.
All we have is a guy the media likes and players used to gravitate to. Now that people see his prized recruits all are either borderline d league players and bound for Europe who will want to play here?
beast of the east
Active member
Look at the positive. Not a SINGLE team has been able to blow us out this year. Even in Carnesecca's heyday, we could play a top 5 team and get our doors blown off. What makes the Indiana loss in the holiday festival in 1975 was that we played the eventual national champion to a draw when they could have crushed us. I know this is very frustrating, but there have been signs that this team can play at a very high level, and I think there was a false belief that we had come together after blowing out Fordham. I have a feeling that we will get our share of wins. Before the Xavier game, I predicted 8 to 11 wins. I'd still stand by that prediction.
beast of the east
Active member
Cluess is my man, and maybe our next coach, but I have a feeling you might REALLY kill someone for 2-3 years of Cluess.
So, you're blaming him on Greene's inability to play point. Don't get me wrong.... Lavin should only play Greene at the point when Jordan or Branch has 4 fouls apiece, but it really isn't Lavin's fault that Greene isn't a point guard. Blame Lavin for using Greene at the 1 spot, but don't blame him for Greene not being a point guard.
You're also blaming him on Harrison's attitude? Did you think Harrison was gonna totally stop running his mouth after a year removed? People can change, but they don't usually change that quickly. How about giving Lavin some credit for Harrison returning after his suspension. Most players would've packed their bags and hit the hills right after they were removed from the team for something other than grades.
I seem to hear we're in very, good shape for Diallo and Briscoe. Of course, we shouldn't get excited 'til they sign on the dotted line. But we're certainly in the thick of it. You can't win it, unless you're in it.
I'm not sure it's all lavins coaching but it's more about the types of players he filled our roster with!!! Insane athletes with very little basketball skill or iq!!! Look at when obepka took that 15 ft jumper...that kid should no his role and immediately get back under the hoop!!!! We have 3 great athletes on the floor, only Jordan and dlo have actual skill..... He needs to find guys who play to there strengths and add to a lineups not a bunch of dudes that can jump over cars but can't hit a foul shot
You bet it`s very frustrating. You get games like Syracuse, where you say hey maybe they`re finally getting it. Then you watch that X game.
Yeah they can`t score, but the thing is wtf was the defense? Held X scoreless for 8minutes,THEY GOT ZIPPO. then the next 12 they got 27. I guess all of a sudden they forgot how to play defense.
With this team, they`ll win @ G-Town and Vs. Nova then look like crap and lose by 10 at DePaul.
Yeah they can`t score, but the thing is wtf was the defense? Held X scoreless for 8minutes,THEY GOT ZIPPO. then the next 12 they got 27. I guess all of a sudden they forgot how to play defense.
With this team, they`ll win @ G-Town and Vs. Nova then look like crap and lose by 10 at DePaul.
I've stated that we need a wing player who can shoot and create his own shot. We're missing such a player.
Sanchez could be that player, but he seems too passive nor his jumper seems consistent enough. But I do believe you can add Sanchez into the equation of Harrison and Jordan, in regards to being skillful.
beast of the east
Active member
St. John's like any other basketball team uses big men to set picks on the perimeter, frequently in the high post. If Obekpa found himself wide open from 15 (foul line distance), anyone from CYO up should take that shot. Now if he was hoisting it from 20 feet I'd take exception. As has been said multiple times, Obekpa has to develop other skills than shot blocking, and in the early going it was clear that he has worked hard at improving offensive ability around the hoop. He is now able to put the ball on the floor, has a baby hook, but still cannot do much against top flight competition. I believe Obekpa has made a couple foul line shots, and also keeps his head up when receiving the ball in the high post, and has made some nice passes too. I understand your point, but let's not get too anecdotal here. Any decent big should be used in the offensive schema setting picks up high.
I'm certainly not blaming Greene for stinking. He couldn't dribble into the paint if his life depended on it. I blame Lavin for A) not teaching him the principles of the point and b) playing him massive PG minutes even after 2.5 years of showing he is an awful point guard. I also blame Lavin for Harrison. Anyone who says he is a reformed player is kidding themselves. I like him because he is on my team and wears his heart on his sleeve. But the kid is still chirping at opposing fans and players on a routine basis. What did Lavin accomplish in suspending him is all I'm asking?
That Xavier game was very indicative of Lavin's coaching prowess. In the 2nd half he went to the same well about 15 times which was reminiscent of the Jarvis era. No offensive scheme to speak of, just a pick-and-pop on the wing time after time after time.
I can give this guy a master class in coaching in just 15 minutes. Maybe establish Sanchez on the blocks where he can use his passing ability? How about from Day 1 allow Rysheed to handle the ball and get into the paint so we can get to the FT line and create easy chances? Maybe mix your looks defensively so that a team can't figure out your gimmicky zone and then exploit it for 15 minutes at a time? Perhaps teach your players about limitations and playing within themselves? How about teaching Jakarr how to play within an offense and becoming a willing passer?
I think Lavin is a good guy. I just can't stand watching this team play. We really are a talented group, and this guy is responsible for that. He is also fully responsible for their inability to develop into something special and grow into consistent winners.