C7 Update
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tom in salem
Well-known member
http://thequad.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/03/14/a-new-big-east-is-a-better-big-east/
“I wish you guys would stop writing obits and start looking to the future,” Thompson said. “We are looking forward and we will have Big East basketball next season and the postseason tournament will be played at Madison Square Garden with some of the best teams in the country, some of the best coaches in the country.”
“I wish you guys would stop writing obits and start looking to the future,” Thompson said. “We are looking forward and we will have Big East basketball next season and the postseason tournament will be played at Madison Square Garden with some of the best teams in the country, some of the best coaches in the country.”
The question then becomes what are you looking for? To me, the only other options are Gonzaga and St. Mary's and I just don't think the logistics of that relationship work.
Creighton and Dayton are both really good basketball schools with really strong fanbases (much stronger than ours). I think we should be happy to have them.
L J S A
Well-known member
I think I'd be most happy with Butler, Xavier, Gonzaga, VCU, and St. Louis. That is not to say that I don't recognize the crowds that Creighton and Dayton both draw -- Creighton in particular looks like an NBA game.
I think my big issue is with Dayton. I root for them at least half the time I see them play, but things change when you have to share a conference with them. They just don't jump out at me and say "big-time conference."
tom in salem
Well-known member
Pete Thamel @SIPeteThamel
Presidents and athletic officials at Xavier and Butler left A-10 meetings this am. No announcement expected, but they are gone
Pete Thamel @SIPeteThamel
The Xavier and Butler departures (without Dayton and SLU) mean that if the Catholic Seven go to 10 next year, Creighton had edge.
Pete Thamel @SIPeteThamel
To clarify on Xavier and Butler: Schools officials physically got up and left the A-10 meetings this morning.
Presidents and athletic officials at Xavier and Butler left A-10 meetings this am. No announcement expected, but they are gone
Pete Thamel @SIPeteThamel
The Xavier and Butler departures (without Dayton and SLU) mean that if the Catholic Seven go to 10 next year, Creighton had edge.
Pete Thamel @SIPeteThamel
To clarify on Xavier and Butler: Schools officials physically got up and left the A-10 meetings this morning.
Rob Lenhart
Member
NEW YORK -- In the final rendition of the Big East Tournament as we knew it, Georgetown has emerged as the unquestioned headliner. The Hoyas have the top seed, best player in Otto Porter, and coach John Thompson III has done the best coaching job in the league this year.
The Hoyas also delivered the matchup everyone wants to see, clawing past Cincinnati on Thursday to set up a fitting final Big East game with storied rival Syracuse in the semifinals on Friday night.
Off the court, the Hoyas are taking a victory lap, too. This has not been as well received. The actions of Georgetown president Jack DeGoia have peeved officials in both Georgetown's new and old leagues and raised questions of whether the Hoyas are wielding too much power in the formation of the "new" Big East.
DeGoia has emerged as the most powerful leader in the new league. He's also been a divisive one, as it took months of lobbying to convince DeGoia to break away from the Big East and join the Catholic Seven. Officials around the league were flabbergasted when he broke the league's media ban to take credit for leadership in a league he was reluctant to join. The tension resurfaced recently after a profile of DeGoia appeared in the Washington Post with the headline, "Georgetown takes lead in preserving basketball tradition of Catholic 7."
"Not only are they doing a victory lap, they're not doing the work to earn it," said one school official. "At the time they want all the dealings to be clandestine; for them to go out front and take credit is beyond reprehensible."
Added another: "There were a lot of eye rolls."
DeGoia couldn't be reached for comment.
DeGoia is a philosopher and considered a brilliant academic. But the conference game is predicated on business and television acumen, and those skills are being questioned. The oddest part of the Catholic Seven's TV deal with Fox is that the conference declined to take their product to market, canceling meetings with high-level potential TV partners.
Fox's offer of nearly $500 million, which will pay schools north of $4 million per season, was contingent on not talking to another network. It's certainly a good deal and the league is the cusp of banking a lot of money. But there's a strong feeling in the television industry that the Catholic Seven left some money on the table, as it could have received more cash and exposure if it cut a deal with two different networks. There were no lack of suitors, and the decision to not take meetings to explore other options was considered an anomaly.
"Very unusual," said an industry source. "I don't ever recall a situation with a property like this where people didn't at least take meetings to find out what other opportunities will be out there."
DeGoia is viewed in "old" Big East circles as one of the most vocal opponents -- along with officials from Rutgers, Notre Dame and Pitt -- of the Big East signing a deal for $130 million annually with ESPN nearly two years ago. To compare, the deal the soon-to-be-renamed Big East just signed is worth $130 million over seven years.
There will always be the question of whether Pitt and Syracuse would have defected if the Big East had signed that ESPN deal in May 2011. The answer is likely yes, as the there's seemingly nothing that could stop the gale force of realignment. The decision to reject the television deal looks foolish in retrospect. At DeGoia's suggestion, Georgetown Board Chair Paul Tagliabue was brought in to consult on Big East matters. He famously insisted, "We can manage the risk," when convincing officials to take the league to the open market. The Big East couldn't manage the risk. It fell apart within 18 months.
Recently, John Thompson III joked that he'd love to call the new Big East "the Georgetown league." But when you look at what's happened, he may not be joking. There have been formal discussions about the new league's office being in Washington. The lawyer who is essentially acting as commissioner, Joe Leccese, is a Georgetown graduate. The person who will be spearheading the search for the new commissioner, Liz Boardman of Russell Reynolds, is a former Georgetown field hockey player.
While Georgetown's fingerprints are obvious, a big test of Georgetown's power will be whether or not VCU joins the league in the next wave of expansion. While Georgetown hasn't lobbied against VCU in meetings, television sources say that the Hoyas don't want VCU in the league. (The prevailing thought being that VCU is too close geographically for Georgetown's comfort and being a public school doesn't fit the profile.) Many schools in the Catholic Seven are enamored with VCU, especially because the league's bottom four teams -- Providence, DePaul, Seton Hall and St. John's -- have combined to win just won NCAA tournament game in the last 10 years.
Thompson III's "Georgetown League" may be closer to a reality than most people realize. And as the "new" Big East sits on the cusp of a promising new future, some are wondering if there's too much Georgetown in the "Georgetown League."
Read More:http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/co...rgetown-catholic-seven-tension/#ixzz2Nd1WNPcH
The Hoyas also delivered the matchup everyone wants to see, clawing past Cincinnati on Thursday to set up a fitting final Big East game with storied rival Syracuse in the semifinals on Friday night.
Off the court, the Hoyas are taking a victory lap, too. This has not been as well received. The actions of Georgetown president Jack DeGoia have peeved officials in both Georgetown's new and old leagues and raised questions of whether the Hoyas are wielding too much power in the formation of the "new" Big East.
DeGoia has emerged as the most powerful leader in the new league. He's also been a divisive one, as it took months of lobbying to convince DeGoia to break away from the Big East and join the Catholic Seven. Officials around the league were flabbergasted when he broke the league's media ban to take credit for leadership in a league he was reluctant to join. The tension resurfaced recently after a profile of DeGoia appeared in the Washington Post with the headline, "Georgetown takes lead in preserving basketball tradition of Catholic 7."
"Not only are they doing a victory lap, they're not doing the work to earn it," said one school official. "At the time they want all the dealings to be clandestine; for them to go out front and take credit is beyond reprehensible."
Added another: "There were a lot of eye rolls."
DeGoia couldn't be reached for comment.
DeGoia is a philosopher and considered a brilliant academic. But the conference game is predicated on business and television acumen, and those skills are being questioned. The oddest part of the Catholic Seven's TV deal with Fox is that the conference declined to take their product to market, canceling meetings with high-level potential TV partners.
Fox's offer of nearly $500 million, which will pay schools north of $4 million per season, was contingent on not talking to another network. It's certainly a good deal and the league is the cusp of banking a lot of money. But there's a strong feeling in the television industry that the Catholic Seven left some money on the table, as it could have received more cash and exposure if it cut a deal with two different networks. There were no lack of suitors, and the decision to not take meetings to explore other options was considered an anomaly.
"Very unusual," said an industry source. "I don't ever recall a situation with a property like this where people didn't at least take meetings to find out what other opportunities will be out there."
DeGoia is viewed in "old" Big East circles as one of the most vocal opponents -- along with officials from Rutgers, Notre Dame and Pitt -- of the Big East signing a deal for $130 million annually with ESPN nearly two years ago. To compare, the deal the soon-to-be-renamed Big East just signed is worth $130 million over seven years.
There will always be the question of whether Pitt and Syracuse would have defected if the Big East had signed that ESPN deal in May 2011. The answer is likely yes, as the there's seemingly nothing that could stop the gale force of realignment. The decision to reject the television deal looks foolish in retrospect. At DeGoia's suggestion, Georgetown Board Chair Paul Tagliabue was brought in to consult on Big East matters. He famously insisted, "We can manage the risk," when convincing officials to take the league to the open market. The Big East couldn't manage the risk. It fell apart within 18 months.
Recently, John Thompson III joked that he'd love to call the new Big East "the Georgetown league." But when you look at what's happened, he may not be joking. There have been formal discussions about the new league's office being in Washington. The lawyer who is essentially acting as commissioner, Joe Leccese, is a Georgetown graduate. The person who will be spearheading the search for the new commissioner, Liz Boardman of Russell Reynolds, is a former Georgetown field hockey player.
While Georgetown's fingerprints are obvious, a big test of Georgetown's power will be whether or not VCU joins the league in the next wave of expansion. While Georgetown hasn't lobbied against VCU in meetings, television sources say that the Hoyas don't want VCU in the league. (The prevailing thought being that VCU is too close geographically for Georgetown's comfort and being a public school doesn't fit the profile.) Many schools in the Catholic Seven are enamored with VCU, especially because the league's bottom four teams -- Providence, DePaul, Seton Hall and St. John's -- have combined to win just won NCAA tournament game in the last 10 years.
Thompson III's "Georgetown League" may be closer to a reality than most people realize. And as the "new" Big East sits on the cusp of a promising new future, some are wondering if there's too much Georgetown in the "Georgetown League."
Read More:http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/co...rgetown-catholic-seven-tension/#ixzz2Nd1WNPcH
If it irks me to see this what does the administration feel. You know the ones who hired Jarvis and Roberts.
a public school doesn't fit the profile. Many schools in the Catholic Seven are enamored with VCU, especially because the league's bottom four teams -- Providence, DePaul, Seton Hall and St. John's -- have combined to win just won NCAA tournament game in the last 10 years
a public school doesn't fit the profile. Many schools in the Catholic Seven are enamored with VCU, especially because the league's bottom four teams -- Providence, DePaul, Seton Hall and St. John's -- have combined to win just won NCAA tournament game in the last 10 years
Class of 72
Active member
Gtown beat Cuse twice and lost in OT......they are all in the same conference this year.
Class of 72
Active member
I do not think religion has anything to do with the alignment. The fact they do not field BCS level football teams does.
Except for Notre Dame, most of the players at our schools come from non-Catholic backgrounds.
The size of Duke, as you know, is underwhelming but they are the best in the ACC. Maryland is humongous but they are going the humongous BIG. So, while size may matter if you are Kim Kardashian, schools like Gonzaga, Duke, St. Mary's, and Creighton prove you can be a medium sized university and still be a player on the national stage.
Class of 72
Active member
I do not think religion has anything to do with the alignment. The fact they do not field BCS level football teams does.
Except for Notre Dame, most of the players at our schools come from non-Catholic backgrounds.
The size of Duke, as you know, is underwhelming but they are the best in the ACC. Maryland is humongous but they are going the humongous BIG. So, while size may matter if you are Kim Kardashian, schools like Gonzaga, Duke, St. Mary's, and Creighton prove you can be a medium sized university and still be a player on the national stage.
PS. Duke is the most beautiful campus I have ever visited. The 6,500 undergrads live in a Gothic wonderland!
Rob Lenhart
Member
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Yes, sadly the C7 schools will watch as two schools leaving for the ACC play for the men's championship just as the women's teams did watching two future non-BE schools -ND and UCONN- play in their title game.
It really depends on what this conference is going for. If it is trying to create a power basketball conference, then the answer is probably to bring in St. Louis and either Richmond or VCU. If loyalty and staying true to the Catholic institutions is more important, then it is St. Louis and Dayton.
I don't really think either choice is really a bad one per se. What I will say however is that by inviting Butler to the mix kind of kicks the legs out of the Catholic argument. If it had only brought in Xavier and Creighton, then I could see more of a reason to just bring in St. Louis and Dayton.