@Xavier, Wed., Jan. 31, 6:30p, FS-1

[lawmanfan]

I think it is best to accept he can help w midrange game, some physical play driving the ball, but he is sub par on D and not the 3 point guy we desperately need. I think we all expected more.

In a college game dominated by guards/wings as we saw from X last night, SJU is clearly deficient. Many of us assumed Dingle, Luis would provide fire power and that seems doubtful now. Alleyne seemed suitable for a shooting role, but also has been spotty. Taylor as hard as he works can’t be a scoring factor. Wilcher is still learning, but not an impact guy yet. All in all, this is a sobering picture imo w only Jenkins to hit shots, albeit often streaky.

A compensatory road is defending very well consistently to force turnovers and lead to easy hoops. No sense beating dead horse on that.

Dingle just miscast in his role here. He's a scorer who needs the ball in his hands but Jenkins has that role taken. He has rarely been able to get into a groove with his midrange and drive to the hoop game in a part-time, off-ball role.

Somebody needs to sit RJ in a room with tape and work on his decision making process. Clockwork Orange style.

Wilcher I think will be just fine, but like Dingle he suffers from Jenkins using most of the available oxygen (and Pitino's intolerance for mistakes, which freshmen are going to make - although that intolerance somehow does not extend to RJ).

 

[lawmanfan]

Seton Hall and Creighton at home will be harder to win than at Xavier. And UBS (Seton Hall) is not exactly home.

Not harder than at Xavier. But agree the Seton Hall game is going to be a big challenge. A win at X or at Butler would help offset that, cushion is shrinking. I have a good feeling about the Creighton game, for whatever reason.

 

[vegasman2000]

NET only dropped to 38, solidly in right now. Just survive next two games and we are fine.

 

[vegasman2000]

Dingle just miscast in his role here. He's a scorer who needs the ball in his hands but Jenkins has that role taken. He has rarely been able to get into a groove with his midrange and drive to the hoop game in a part-time, off-ball role.

Somebody needs to sit RJ in a room with tape and work on his decision making process. Clockwork Orange style.

Wilcher I think will be just fine, but like Dingle he suffers from Jenkins using most of the available oxygen (and Pitino's intolerance for mistakes, which freshmen are going to make - although that intolerance somehow does not extend to RJ).

Plus maybe Dingle just isn't a Big East player?

 

[fuchsia]

Has everyone forgotten that CRP put this team together on the fly, got what he could and haven't even been our coach for a year yet? Are we supposed to be the number one ranked team in the country under those circumstances?

I think that CRP has done an incredible job. We're back in the NYC spotlight. Attendance is up. We're arguably a much more exciting team than we've been for years, and we're looking at getting back to The Dance. What other coach could have accomplished that much in this short amount of time?

Have patience and you will be rewarded.

I noticed that Omar Stanley was being mentioned by the announcers of the Boise State - UNM game that came on after UCONN-Providence. He wound up with 14 boards and 12 points in an upset of ranked New Mexico coached by Richard Pitino. Given that we were outrebounded vs. Xavier, did our coach in fact shoot two Pitinos with one stone?

 

[Silly Donovan]

OK, nobody jump off a bridge.

That was not a game they needed to win to make the NCAAs, nor was it a game that I ever expected them to win. The situation was further complicated by Xavier predictably coming out on a mission from God after their loss to UConn, while SJU was coming off a week of inactivity and staring at UConn on Saturday. But the bottom line is they lost a road game in the BE against a team that isn't that far behind them and is very well coached. No big deal.

From a criticism standpoint, it's difficult to understand Pitino's decision to press the whole game against a team that kept running past his guards, I think they got a total of one turnover out of that and gave up around 30 fast-break points. And it was also difficult to understand why Soriano is asked to spend so much time setting high picks and then having nobody wait long enough for the roll to get him the ball. Especially against the garbage Xavier bigs there was no excuse not to have him set up down low and feed him the ball the whole game. That would also have taken some air out of Xavier's running tires.

So overall, not the best coaching job IMO, but it was always going to be a tough game to win.

By the way, don't expect a win over UConn also. A competitive single-digit loss would be fine. And after that they will STILL be in the NCAA tournament. They'll just have to take care of business down the stretch against the Hall, Creighton, Georgetown and Depaul (and hopefully steal a win at either Butler or Providence although I'm not optimistic about those nor are they strictly necessary for an NCAA bid).

I think the disconnect here is that for some reason people think this is top 10 team; it isn't and it never was, it's a solid middle-of-the-pack Big East team that has an excellent chance to make the NCAA tournament and then (as we know) anything can happen. Rome wasn't built in a day, and this is not a bad start at all. Relax.

You keep saying that this game and that game won’t be necessary for a Dance bid. So my question is this, aside from the obvious 4 games against the two bottom feeders (although I’m not sure we beat Georgetown away), where are you confident the remaining 3 or 4 wins come from? I ask cause I just don’t see a clear path to the Dance especially with our uninspiring OOC performances.

 

[lawmanfan]

Plus maybe Dingle just isn't a Big East player?

Definitely a Big East player. Just on the wrong team for him.

 

[Hardy]

Plus maybe Dingle just isn't a Big East player?

Really hurts to see Walter Clayton hit 7 3s and put away Kentucky last night. Exactly what this team needs on the offensive end. I did really like what dingle was doing early in the game though; he’s really good at using his body and getting the defenders in bad position in the mid range—he operates at a different speed than Jenkins which makes them an awkward fit but I hope dingle starts working toward his strengths.

 

[NCJohnnie]

I actually think Dingle does a better job than some of our other players of making a simple entry pass to Joel in the post so he can operate down low. Had a nice one last night.

 

[paultzman]

OK, nobody jump off a bridge.

That was not a game they needed to win to make the NCAAs, nor was it a game that I ever expected them to win. The situation was further complicated by Xavier predictably coming out on a mission from God after their loss to UConn, while SJU was coming off a week of inactivity and staring at UConn on Saturday. But the bottom line is they lost a road game in the BE against a team that isn't that far behind them and is very well coached. No big deal.

From a criticism standpoint, it's difficult to understand Pitino's decision to press the whole game against a team that kept running past his guards, I think they got a total of one turnover out of that and gave up around 30 fast-break points. And it was also difficult to understand why Soriano is asked to spend so much time setting high picks and then having nobody wait long enough for the roll to get him the ball. Especially against the garbage Xavier bigs there was no excuse not to have him set up down low and feed him the ball the whole game. That would also have taken some air out of Xavier's running tires.

So overall, not the best coaching job IMO, but it was always going to be a tough game to win.

By the way, don't expect a win over UConn also. A competitive single-digit loss would be fine. And after that they will STILL be in the NCAA tournament. They'll just have to take care of business down the stretch against the Hall, Creighton, Georgetown and Depaul (and hopefully steal a win at either Butler or Providence although I'm not optimistic about those nor are they strictly necessary for an NCAA bid).

I think the disconnect here is that for some reason people think this is top 10 team; it isn't and it never was, it's a solid middle-of-the-pack Big East team that has an excellent chance to make the NCAA tournament and then (as we know) anything can happen. Rome wasn't built in a day, and this is not a bad start at all. Relax.

Solid post!

I just don’t see the improvement on either end of court I hoped for. Not defending consistently seems a problem. Failing to close out UConn, Creighton, X and M’Q is disconcerting as well. Opportunity games are precious.

Your coaching criticism re the press getting ravaged is spot on. Rick is best guy this program could have attracted and glad to have him, but he certainly like any coach is not perfect. Not to pile on, I think Rick has to abandon his lineup/rotation “experiments” and establish an eight man unit.

I never expected high end contender status this year, but “Pitino factor” in retrospect made me a bit unrealistic. Scrambling for a bid as bubble team now seems correct level and moving needle in long term. I am a slow learner.

 

[lawmanfan]

You keep saying that this game and that game won’t be necessary for a Dance bid. So my question is this, aside from the obvious 4 games against the two bottom feeders (although I’m not sure we beat Georgetown away), where are you confident the remaining 3 or 4 wins come from? I ask cause I just don’t see a clear path to the Dance especially with our uninspiring OOC performances.

I have posted the path many times, it's been the same since the beginning of the season:

1. Beat Georgetown and DePaul = 4 wins
2. Win home games against Nova, Providence, X, Butler, Seton Hall (5 wins, 4 in the bank 1 outstanding)
3. Win a road game against one of those 5 teams = 1 win (in the bank, Nova)
4. Go 1-5 against UConn, Marquette, Creighton = 1 win (3 opportunities left, most likely is home vs Creighton)

At 11-9 in the Big East and 19-12 overall, with their metrics, they will be someplace between a 7 and a 10 seed.

For point of reference, as of this morning they remain an 8 seed in Lunardi's bracketology and I think that Nova is somehow still in the last 4 in or the first 4 out.

A loss at home vs the Hall (the game I am most concerned about) could be offset by a win at Butler or (less likely) at Providence. And they do need to win one game against the top 3 teams. If they don't beat the Hall and they can't win 1 game against the top 3, then they don't deserve to be in the NCAA tournament anyway. But even in that scenario it would not surprise me if they make enough of a run in the BET to get back in the conversation - their depth and coaching will be a big plus in the BET, I think.

 

[dk423]

I think the two things that disappoint me most from this group is the inconsistency on defense and the lapses in intensity. I don’t think the team has the offensive skill that can overcome either of those two things. All of this is what Rick has told us. Now that it’s February, I’m done being in the mode of “they’ll learn from ____”.

I also still don’t understand what what we’re doing with Conway touching the floor. Every possession matters, and he is a huge liability.

That said, I don’t think a game like last night should change our outlook on the season and tournament. We’ll see what happens Saturday. But as lawmanfan said, there’s other games that actually are *must* wins. Let’s wait until that before joining Rick in the river

 

[Larry Wright]

Sometimes i swear i think posters here OVER REACT. Last year at this point in the season we lost 7 big east games. This year we lost 4 and 2of them were against nationally ranked teams were we only lost by a point. Last year cant go by our win totals cause of all those cup cake teams to inflat anderson's schedule. Please remember he built this team in less then a month and got the best players he could get. Shooters - Jenkins, Dingle, RJ (who was hurt). Just relax, last year we would of folded and got blown out. Now we came back and tied it.
Also xavier just got blown out by uconn game before so they were most likely pissed. while we had uconn probably on our minds on saturday.

Team has no identity.
Sometimes press is good, sometimes it is awful.
Sometimes play D sometimes it is awful.
Can’t shoot threes
Identity was rebounding I guess but yesterday didn’t.
Even the coaching which we thought would be a given has been uneven. Again this I believe due to putting together a team on the fly.

 

[lawmanfan]

I never expected high end contender status this year, but “Pitino factor” in retrospect made me a bit unrealistic.

I think this is what accounts for many of the posts on the board. As you know I have long felt that establishing units/rotations would be helpful. But who am I to question a Hall of Famer....

 

[paultzman]

I think this is what accounts for many of the posts on the board. As you know I have long felt that establishing units/rotations would be helpful. But who am I to question a Hall of Famer....

Btw, your “Clockwork Orange” Luis comment resulted in me spitting up some coffee, my wife “thanks” you.

 

[Hardy]

I think this is what accounts for many of the posts on the board. As you know I have long felt that establishing units/rotations would be helpful. But who am I to question a Hall of Famer....

I agree regarding a more defined rotation, but I think one problem is it’s unclear who should even be in the rotation. Pitino has spread minutes around and given everyone an opportunity, but outside of Jenkins, Soriano, and ledlum, no one else has really separated themselves from the pack. Instead we’ve gotten some momentary flashes, but no one playing with consistency.

 

[Notanalum]

Great post. I’d love to play 8 but who are the 8? It’s February and we have no idea game by game outside of Jenkins and Soriano! Ledlum probably the 3rd. Who are the best 5? We won’t know this year. Pitino and co are very aware of this issue and there are some specific rumors out there about next season already

 

[dk423]

I think the 8 should be: Dingle, Jenkins, Taylor, Ledlum, Soriano, Zuby, Dunlap, Alleyne. Next 2 are: Wilcher, Traore.

 

[Silly Donovan]

I think the 8 should be: Dingle, Jenkins, Taylor, Ledlum, Soriano, Zuby, Dunlap, Alleyne. Next 2 are: Wilcher, Traore.

The sad thing about Dunlap is while he does see the floor well and moves well without the ball, he can’t hit a shot (or even foul shot) at this point and with an offensively challenged team makes him a liability on the court.

 

[lawmanfan]

Great post. I’d love to play 8 but who are the 8? It’s February and we have no idea game by game outside of Jenkins and Soriano! Ledlum probably the 3rd. Who are the best 5? We won’t know this year. Pitino and co are very aware of this issue and there are some specific rumors out there about next season already

I'll take a shot at it:

First unit:
Jenkins, Wilcher, Taylor, Ledlum, Soriano

Second unit:
Dingle, Alleyne, Luis, Ejafor, Dunlap

Reasoning:
Starting Wilcher allows Jenkins to (theoretically) play off the ball a bit; Jenkins and Soriano get to be the focus of the offense, Taylor and Ledlum provide defense, rebounding, and some offense.

Dingle gets to play with Alleyne who does not need the ball; also unlike Jenkins he is willing to give Dunlap the ball when he's open for a spot-up 3; Luis has room to do his thing; Ejafor does all of the dirty work.

Think both squads have a good mix of offense, defense, and rebounding, you split up Dingle and Jenkins and everyone has enough room to breathe and do their thing.