Will our poor season affect recruiting?

[1and1sju]

So I try to take a more balanced view [... ] - and perhaps realistic

for me..
it's the end of the discussion

So, let me get this straight; your balanced and realistic view is:

everything is good, end of conversation.

Really?

 

[bobre45]

Jakarr was recruited two years ago with Pelle and Sanchez who never showed. Lavin got credit for a fantastic class and wound up playing with six guys after Nuri left. Then DLo recruited Branch. Obekpa was a score but he's really raw. This year looks like a strikeout except for Sanchez and Gift who were recruited awhile ago. Actually lately there ain't been much happening at all.

Still these events aren't strikeouts. Not even close. You said he strikes out year to year with recruits. Bottom line is he has had 2 ROY players that HE signed.

Sorry, but Coach is hitting line drive doubles and singles.

You're looking for grand slams in the bottom of the first inning with your lead off hitter.

It may be time to change teams with this new league forming.

I'm quite sure you'd be very happy with Syracuse and all their success. Then again...

Zan - well noted

not to offend any cat lovers but there is more than one way to, well
you can drive in runs via "small ball" or over the fences.
you can earn a living with one primary/major job or a few grouped together
you can circle the globe in a single swooooop or, God forbid, with stops in every port (airport that is)

I like the way Coach Lavin is moving along
We've already had good times during his brief tenure
and it sure looks as though good times will be ahead

It just isn't in me to go heavy on the criticism - perhaps because I evolved in such judgmental/harsh arenas such as a religious school where if you peed you'd surely go to hell; God didn't like people I suppose;
then in the Army - which I love and have fond memories of and memories of all the decent solid people therein - one was (often not always) lead by fear/threats/career ending mistakes etc.

So I try to take a more balanced view or even optimistic - and perhaps realistic when it comes to Lavin and recruiting BECAUSE

Which SJU coach - Louie included - has recruited as nationally as Steve Lavin?
Which coach has had to recruit a large class and did so with quality?
Which coach year in and out has been involved with multiple top 50-100 recruits?
Which coach has been able to blend both local and out of state and European kids better than coach Lavin?

for me
it's the end of the discussion
all the best

Comparing Lavin to Lou is totally ridiculous. After our #3 recruiting year we wind up with 13 and 16 wins and a gift appearance in the NIT and you have the balls to compare Lavin with Lou who missed the NCAAs like once. I won't even bother going into All the Canadian and European kids Lou got WHEN HE NEEDED THEM. Now that's the key. He anticipated openings and filled them in advance. There were no excuses like the lack of Taffner, the lack of a budget etc. etc. The closest he came was the running joke about the subway tokens. Lou wasn't perfect but comparing his consistent success to Lavin's is a sure way to wind up looking like a fool. I'd suggest you wait until Steve takes his own team to the Dance a few times in a row before you disparage legends.

 

[beast of the east]

Jakarr was recruited two years ago with Pelle and Sanchez who never showed. Lavin got credit for a fantastic class and wound up playing with six guys after Nuri left. Then DLo recruited Branch. Obekpa was a score but he's really raw. This year looks like a strikeout except for Sanchez and Gift who were recruited awhile ago. Actually lately there ain't been much happening at all.

Still these events aren't strikeouts. Not even close. You said he strikes out year to year with recruits. Bottom line is he has had 2 ROY players that HE signed.

Sorry, but Coach is hitting line drive doubles and singles.

You're looking for grand slams in the bottom of the first inning with your lead off hitter.

It may be time to change teams with this new league forming.

I'm quite sure you'd be very happy with Syracuse and all their success. Then again...

Zan - well noted

not to offend any cat lovers but there is more than one way to, well
you can drive in runs via "small ball" or over the fences.
you can earn a living with one primary/major job or a few grouped together
you can circle the globe in a single swooooop or, God forbid, with stops in every port (airport that is)

I like the way Coach Lavin is moving along
We've already had good times during his brief tenure
and it sure looks as though good times will be ahead

It just isn't in me to go heavy on the criticism - perhaps because I evolved in such judgmental/harsh arenas such as a religious school where if you peed you'd surely go to hell; God didn't like people I suppose;
then in the Army - which I love and have fond memories of and memories of all the decent solid people therein - one was (often not always) lead by fear/threats/career ending mistakes etc.

So I try to take a more balanced view or even optimistic - and perhaps realistic when it comes to Lavin and recruiting BECAUSE

Which SJU coach - Louie included - has recruited as nationally as Steve Lavin?
Which coach has had to recruit a large class and did so with quality?
Which coach year in and out has been involved with multiple top 50-100 recruits?
Which coach has been able to blend both local and out of state and European kids better than coach Lavin?

for me
it's the end of the discussion
all the best

Comparing Lavin to Lou is totally ridiculous. After our #3 recruiting year we wind up with 13 and 16 wins and a gift appearance in the NIT and you have the balls to compare Lavin with Lou who missed the NCAAs like once. I won't even bother going into All the Canadian and European kids Lou got WHEN HE NEEDED THEM. Now that's the key. He anticipated openings and filled them in advance. There were no excuses like the lack of Taffner, the lack of a budget etc. etc. The closest he came was the running joke about the subway tokens. Lou wasn't perfect but comparing his consistent success to Lavin's is a sure way to wind up looking like a fool. I'd suggest you wait until Steve takes his own team to the Dance a few times in a row before you disparage legends.

You are so far off in your assessment of Looie's recruiting that you must not even remember if you put your pants on today. Looie recruiting nationally beginning in 1986, the year after the final four. The result? The famous Chuckie Sproling. Foreign players? MArco Baldi was a referral based in part on Looie's visibility in Italy after doing clinics there. Bill Wennington (Canadian) came from Long ISland Lutheran. Sergio Luyk's dad was Walter Berry and Shelton Jones coach in Spain. Looie never started with zero players on the roster, and coached in an era where most players stuck around 4 years. Looie NEVER had the national success Lavin has had in just 2 seasons of recruiting, and certainly didn't send first round picks to the NBA with regularity, something LAvin accomplsihed in his very first recruiting class. Before drawing success comparisons, let's see how Lavin's guys do as seniors with a fully balanced roster, and even then to compare Looie's 526 win career at St. John's to a guy who has coached only 1 seasons with his own guys is beyond ridiculous.

 

[fan5577]

Jakarr was recruited two years ago with Pelle and Sanchez who never showed. Lavin got credit for a fantastic class and wound up playing with six guys after Nuri left. Then DLo recruited Branch. Obekpa was a score but he's really raw. This year looks like a strikeout except for Sanchez and Gift who were recruited awhile ago. Actually lately there ain't been much happening at all.

Still these events aren't strikeouts. Not even close. You said he strikes out year to year with recruits. Bottom line is he has had 2 ROY players that HE signed.

Sorry, but Coach is hitting line drive doubles and singles.

You're looking for grand slams in the bottom of the first inning with your lead off hitter.

It may be time to change teams with this new league forming.

I'm quite sure you'd be very happy with Syracuse and all their success. Then again...

Zan - well noted

not to offend any cat lovers but there is more than one way to, well
you can drive in runs via "small ball" or over the fences.
you can earn a living with one primary/major job or a few grouped together
you can circle the globe in a single swooooop or, God forbid, with stops in every port (airport that is)

I like the way Coach Lavin is moving along
We've already had good times during his brief tenure
and it sure looks as though good times will be ahead

It just isn't in me to go heavy on the criticism - perhaps because I evolved in such judgmental/harsh arenas such as a religious school where if you peed you'd surely go to hell; God didn't like people I suppose;
then in the Army - which I love and have fond memories of and memories of all the decent solid people therein - one was (often not always) lead by fear/threats/career ending mistakes etc.

So I try to take a more balanced view or even optimistic - and perhaps realistic when it comes to Lavin and recruiting BECAUSE

Which SJU coach - Louie included - has recruited as nationally as Steve Lavin?
Which coach has had to recruit a large class and did so with quality?
Which coach year in and out has been involved with multiple top 50-100 recruits?
Which coach has been able to blend both local and out of state and European kids better than coach Lavin?

for me
it's the end of the discussion
all the best

Comparing Lavin to Lou is totally ridiculous. After our #3 recruiting year we wind up with 13 and 16 wins and a gift appearance in the NIT and you have the balls to compare Lavin with Lou who missed the NCAAs like once. I won't even bother going into All the Canadian and European kids Lou got WHEN HE NEEDED THEM. Now that's the key. He anticipated openings and filled them in advance. There were no excuses like the lack of Taffner, the lack of a budget etc. etc. The closest he came was the running joke about the subway tokens. Lou wasn't perfect but comparing his consistent success to Lavin's is a sure way to wind up looking like a fool. I'd suggest you wait until Steve takes his own team to the Dance a few times in a row before you disparage legends.

You are so far off in your assessment of Looie's recruiting that you must not even remember if you put your pants on today. Looie recruiting nationally beginning in 1986, the year after the final four. The result? The famous Chuckie Sproling. Foreign players? MArco Baldi was a referral based in part on Looie's visibility in Italy after doing clinics there. Bill Wennington (Canadian) came from Long ISland Lutheran. Sergio Luyk's dad was Walter Berry and Shelton Jones coach in Spain. Looie never started with zero players on the roster, and coached in an era where most players stuck around 4 years. Looie NEVER had the national success Lavin has had in just 2 seasons of recruiting, and certainly didn't send first round picks to the NBA with regularity, something LAvin accomplsihed in his very first recruiting class. Before drawing success comparisons, let's see how Lavin's guys do as seniors with a fully balanced roster, and even then to compare Looie's 526 win career at St. John's to a guy who has coached only 1 seasons with his own guys is beyond ridiculous.

The biggest problem for a NYC team today is getting kids to stay home. The TV exposure for college b'ball today makes kids very aware of options they never even thought of in the past. The fact that someone would get on Lavin or any other coach for not keeping a kid home is crazy. If I had the skills of some of these kids and had the opportunity to go away to college I would have jumped at it!
That is why having a national presence is so important now. We need some of those Midwest farm boys with wide bodies that can grab a rebound and oh ya hit a jump shot!!

 

[bobre45]

Jakarr was recruited two years ago with Pelle and Sanchez who never showed. Lavin got credit for a fantastic class and wound up playing with six guys after Nuri left. Then DLo recruited Branch. Obekpa was a score but he's really raw. This year looks like a strikeout except for Sanchez and Gift who were recruited awhile ago. Actually lately there ain't been much happening at all.

Still these events aren't strikeouts. Not even close. You said he strikes out year to year with recruits. Bottom line is he has had 2 ROY players that HE signed.

Sorry, but Coach is hitting line drive doubles and singles.

You're looking for grand slams in the bottom of the first inning with your lead off hitter.

It may be time to change teams with this new league forming.

I'm quite sure you'd be very happy with Syracuse and all their success. Then again...

Zan - well noted

not to offend any cat lovers but there is more than one way to, well
you can drive in runs via "small ball" or over the fences.
you can earn a living with one primary/major job or a few grouped together
you can circle the globe in a single swooooop or, God forbid, with stops in every port (airport that is)

I like the way Coach Lavin is moving along
We've already had good times during his brief tenure
and it sure looks as though good times will be ahead

It just isn't in me to go heavy on the criticism - perhaps because I evolved in such judgmental/harsh arenas such as a religious school where if you peed you'd surely go to hell; God didn't like people I suppose;
then in the Army - which I love and have fond memories of and memories of all the decent solid people therein - one was (often not always) lead by fear/threats/career ending mistakes etc.

So I try to take a more balanced view or even optimistic - and perhaps realistic when it comes to Lavin and recruiting BECAUSE

Which SJU coach - Louie included - has recruited as nationally as Steve Lavin?
Which coach has had to recruit a large class and did so with quality?
Which coach year in and out has been involved with multiple top 50-100 recruits?
Which coach has been able to blend both local and out of state and European kids better than coach Lavin?

for me
it's the end of the discussion
all the best

Comparing Lavin to Lou is totally ridiculous. After our #3 recruiting year we wind up with 13 and 16 wins and a gift appearance in the NIT and you have the balls to compare Lavin with Lou who missed the NCAAs like once. I won't even bother going into All the Canadian and European kids Lou got WHEN HE NEEDED THEM. Now that's the key. He anticipated openings and filled them in advance. There were no excuses like the lack of Taffner, the lack of a budget etc. etc. The closest he came was the running joke about the subway tokens. Lou wasn't perfect but comparing his consistent success to Lavin's is a sure way to wind up looking like a fool. I'd suggest you wait until Steve takes his own team to the Dance a few times in a row before you disparage legends.

You are so far off in your assessment of Looie's recruiting that you must not even remember if you put your pants on today. Looie recruiting nationally beginning in 1986, the year after the final four. The result? The famous Chuckie Sproling. Foreign players? MArco Baldi was a referral based in part on Looie's visibility in Italy after doing clinics there. Bill Wennington (Canadian) came from Long ISland Lutheran. Sergio Luyk's dad was Walter Berry and Shelton Jones coach in Spain. Looie never started with zero players on the roster, and coached in an era where most players stuck around 4 years. Looie NEVER had the national success Lavin has had in just 2 seasons of recruiting, and certainly didn't send first round picks to the NBA with regularity, something LAvin accomplsihed in his very first recruiting class. Before drawing success comparisons, let's see how Lavin's guys do as seniors with a fully balanced roster, and even then to compare Looie's 526 win career at St. John's to a guy who has coached only 1 seasons with his own guys is beyond ridiculous.

We'll see how long it takes for Lavin to establish the continuity Lou did. Meanwhile the brand of ball Lou's guys played compared to Lavin's mahem makers is positively no contest. You obviously weren't around to recognize what the game is supposed to look like. I'm not debating the subject with you anymore. Don't fall into the Koolaid vat..

 

[beast of the east]

Jakarr was recruited two years ago with Pelle and Sanchez who never showed. Lavin got credit for a fantastic class and wound up playing with six guys after Nuri left. Then DLo recruited Branch. Obekpa was a score but he's really raw. This year looks like a strikeout except for Sanchez and Gift who were recruited awhile ago. Actually lately there ain't been much happening at all.

Still these events aren't strikeouts. Not even close. You said he strikes out year to year with recruits. Bottom line is he has had 2 ROY players that HE signed.

Sorry, but Coach is hitting line drive doubles and singles.

You're looking for grand slams in the bottom of the first inning with your lead off hitter.

It may be time to change teams with this new league forming.

I'm quite sure you'd be very happy with Syracuse and all their success. Then again...

Zan - well noted

not to offend any cat lovers but there is more than one way to, well
you can drive in runs via "small ball" or over the fences.
you can earn a living with one primary/major job or a few grouped together
you can circle the globe in a single swooooop or, God forbid, with stops in every port (airport that is)

I like the way Coach Lavin is moving along
We've already had good times during his brief tenure
and it sure looks as though good times will be ahead

It just isn't in me to go heavy on the criticism - perhaps because I evolved in such judgmental/harsh arenas such as a religious school where if you peed you'd surely go to hell; God didn't like people I suppose;
then in the Army - which I love and have fond memories of and memories of all the decent solid people therein - one was (often not always) lead by fear/threats/career ending mistakes etc.

So I try to take a more balanced view or even optimistic - and perhaps realistic when it comes to Lavin and recruiting BECAUSE

Which SJU coach - Louie included - has recruited as nationally as Steve Lavin?
Which coach has had to recruit a large class and did so with quality?
Which coach year in and out has been involved with multiple top 50-100 recruits?
Which coach has been able to blend both local and out of state and European kids better than coach Lavin?

for me
it's the end of the discussion
all the best

Comparing Lavin to Lou is totally ridiculous. After our #3 recruiting year we wind up with 13 and 16 wins and a gift appearance in the NIT and you have the balls to compare Lavin with Lou who missed the NCAAs like once. I won't even bother going into All the Canadian and European kids Lou got WHEN HE NEEDED THEM. Now that's the key. He anticipated openings and filled them in advance. There were no excuses like the lack of Taffner, the lack of a budget etc. etc. The closest he came was the running joke about the subway tokens. Lou wasn't perfect but comparing his consistent success to Lavin's is a sure way to wind up looking like a fool. I'd suggest you wait until Steve takes his own team to the Dance a few times in a row before you disparage legends.

You are so far off in your assessment of Looie's recruiting that you must not even remember if you put your pants on today. Looie recruiting nationally beginning in 1986, the year after the final four. The result? The famous Chuckie Sproling. Foreign players? MArco Baldi was a referral based in part on Looie's visibility in Italy after doing clinics there. Bill Wennington (Canadian) came from Long ISland Lutheran. Sergio Luyk's dad was Walter Berry and Shelton Jones coach in Spain. Looie never started with zero players on the roster, and coached in an era where most players stuck around 4 years. Looie NEVER had the national success Lavin has had in just 2 seasons of recruiting, and certainly didn't send first round picks to the NBA with regularity, something LAvin accomplsihed in his very first recruiting class. Before drawing success comparisons, let's see how Lavin's guys do as seniors with a fully balanced roster, and even then to compare Looie's 526 win career at St. John's to a guy who has coached only 1 seasons with his own guys is beyond ridiculous.

We'll see how long it takes for Lavin to establish the continuity Lou did. Meanwhile the brand of ball Lou's guys played compared to Lavin's mahem makers is positively no contest. You obviously weren't around to recognize what the game is supposed to look like. I'm not debating the subject with you anymore. Don't fall into the Koolaid vat..

We were spoiled for more than 20 years by Looie's ranked teams year after year, that rarely made it past round two of the NCAA's. I'm not even sure that today Looie could have the same success. The recruiting world has changed so much, and college basketball has so many more programs capable of snagging a top player here and there. It's not Kool-Aid, its just far too early to compare, especially given the state of the roster that LAvin inherited.

 

[bobre45]

Jakarr was recruited two years ago with Pelle and Sanchez who never showed. Lavin got credit for a fantastic class and wound up playing with six guys after Nuri left. Then DLo recruited Branch. Obekpa was a score but he's really raw. This year looks like a strikeout except for Sanchez and Gift who were recruited awhile ago. Actually lately there ain't been much happening at all.

Still these events aren't strikeouts. Not even close. You said he strikes out year to year with recruits. Bottom line is he has had 2 ROY players that HE signed.

Sorry, but Coach is hitting line drive doubles and singles.

You're looking for grand slams in the bottom of the first inning with your lead off hitter.

It may be time to change teams with this new league forming.

I'm quite sure you'd be very happy with Syracuse and all their success. Then again...

Zan - well noted

not to offend any cat lovers but there is more than one way to, well
you can drive in runs via "small ball" or over the fences.
you can earn a living with one primary/major job or a few grouped together
you can circle the globe in a single swooooop or, God forbid, with stops in every port (airport that is)

I like the way Coach Lavin is moving along
We've already had good times during his brief tenure
and it sure looks as though good times will be ahead

It just isn't in me to go heavy on the criticism - perhaps because I evolved in such judgmental/harsh arenas such as a religious school where if you peed you'd surely go to hell; God didn't like people I suppose;
then in the Army - which I love and have fond memories of and memories of all the decent solid people therein - one was (often not always) lead by fear/threats/career ending mistakes etc.

So I try to take a more balanced view or even optimistic - and perhaps realistic when it comes to Lavin and recruiting BECAUSE

Which SJU coach - Louie included - has recruited as nationally as Steve Lavin?
Which coach has had to recruit a large class and did so with quality?
Which coach year in and out has been involved with multiple top 50-100 recruits?
Which coach has been able to blend both local and out of state and European kids better than coach Lavin?

for me
it's the end of the discussion
all the best

Comparing Lavin to Lou is totally ridiculous. After our #3 recruiting year we wind up with 13 and 16 wins and a gift appearance in the NIT and you have the balls to compare Lavin with Lou who missed the NCAAs like once. I won't even bother going into All the Canadian and European kids Lou got WHEN HE NEEDED THEM. Now that's the key. He anticipated openings and filled them in advance. There were no excuses like the lack of Taffner, the lack of a budget etc. etc. The closest he came was the running joke about the subway tokens. Lou wasn't perfect but comparing his consistent success to Lavin's is a sure way to wind up looking like a fool. I'd suggest you wait until Steve takes his own team to the Dance a few times in a row before you disparage legends.

You are so far off in your assessment of Looie's recruiting that you must not even remember if you put your pants on today. Looie recruiting nationally beginning in 1986, the year after the final four. The result? The famous Chuckie Sproling. Foreign players? MArco Baldi was a referral based in part on Looie's visibility in Italy after doing clinics there. Bill Wennington (Canadian) came from Long ISland Lutheran. Sergio Luyk's dad was Walter Berry and Shelton Jones coach in Spain. Looie never started with zero players on the roster, and coached in an era where most players stuck around 4 years. Looie NEVER had the national success Lavin has had in just 2 seasons of recruiting, and certainly didn't send first round picks to the NBA with regularity, something LAvin accomplsihed in his very first recruiting class. Before drawing success comparisons, let's see how Lavin's guys do as seniors with a fully balanced roster, and even then to compare Looie's 526 win career at St. John's to a guy who has coached only 1 seasons with his own guys is beyond ridiculous.

We'll see how long it takes for Lavin to establish the continuity Lou did. Meanwhile the brand of ball Lou's guys played compared to Lavin's mahem makers is positively no contest. You obviously weren't around to recognize what the game is supposed to look like. I'm not debating the subject with you anymore. Don't fall into the Koolaid vat..

We were spoiled for more than 20 years by Looie's ranked teams year after year, that rarely made it past round two of the NCAA's. I'm not even sure that today Looie could have the same success. The recruiting world has changed so much, and college basketball has so many more programs capable of snagging a top player here and there. It's not Kool-Aid, its just far too early to compare, especially given the state of the roster that LAvin inherited.

Louie was included in the comparison not by me. I just reacted to it. Lou recruited who he needed to consistently put a quality product on the floor. Lavin has yet to do that here. When he does he will win and have his pick of the litters. Winning has to happen first however. He was fortunate to make the NCAAs with Norm's team. That gave us an unexpected jump start in recruiting. If the class had panned out and we were able to win 20 plus we'd still be signing kids. Maybe next year.

 

[MJDinkins]

Jakarr was recruited two years ago with Pelle and Sanchez who never showed. Lavin got credit for a fantastic class and wound up playing with six guys after Nuri left. Then DLo recruited Branch. Obekpa was a score but he's really raw. This year looks like a strikeout except for Sanchez and Gift who were recruited awhile ago. Actually lately there ain't been much happening at all.

Still these events aren't strikeouts. Not even close. You said he strikes out year to year with recruits. Bottom line is he has had 2 ROY players that HE signed.

Sorry, but Coach is hitting line drive doubles and singles.

You're looking for grand slams in the bottom of the first inning with your lead off hitter.

It may be time to change teams with this new league forming.

I'm quite sure you'd be very happy with Syracuse and all their success. Then again...

Zan - well noted

not to offend any cat lovers but there is more than one way to, well
you can drive in runs via "small ball" or over the fences.
you can earn a living with one primary/major job or a few grouped together
you can circle the globe in a single swooooop or, God forbid, with stops in every port (airport that is)

I like the way Coach Lavin is moving along
We've already had good times during his brief tenure
and it sure looks as though good times will be ahead

It just isn't in me to go heavy on the criticism - perhaps because I evolved in such judgmental/harsh arenas such as a religious school where if you peed you'd surely go to hell; God didn't like people I suppose;
then in the Army - which I love and have fond memories of and memories of all the decent solid people therein - one was (often not always) lead by fear/threats/career ending mistakes etc.

So I try to take a more balanced view or even optimistic - and perhaps realistic when it comes to Lavin and recruiting BECAUSE

Which SJU coach - Louie included - has recruited as nationally as Steve Lavin?
Which coach has had to recruit a large class and did so with quality?
Which coach year in and out has been involved with multiple top 50-100 recruits?
Which coach has been able to blend both local and out of state and European kids better than coach Lavin?

for me
it's the end of the discussion
all the best

Comparing Lavin to Lou is totally ridiculous. After our #3 recruiting year we wind up with 13 and 16 wins and a gift appearance in the NIT and you have the balls to compare Lavin with Lou who missed the NCAAs like once. I won't even bother going into All the Canadian and European kids Lou got WHEN HE NEEDED THEM. Now that's the key. He anticipated openings and filled them in advance. There were no excuses like the lack of Taffner, the lack of a budget etc. etc. The closest he came was the running joke about the subway tokens. Lou wasn't perfect but comparing his consistent success to Lavin's is a sure way to wind up looking like a fool. I'd suggest you wait until Steve takes his own team to the Dance a few times in a row before you disparage legends.

You are so far off in your assessment of Looie's recruiting that you must not even remember if you put your pants on today. Looie recruiting nationally beginning in 1986, the year after the final four. The result? The famous Chuckie Sproling. Foreign players? MArco Baldi was a referral based in part on Looie's visibility in Italy after doing clinics there. Bill Wennington (Canadian) came from Long ISland Lutheran. Sergio Luyk's dad was Walter Berry and Shelton Jones coach in Spain. Looie never started with zero players on the roster, and coached in an era where most players stuck around 4 years. Looie NEVER had the national success Lavin has had in just 2 seasons of recruiting, and certainly didn't send first round picks to the NBA with regularity, something LAvin accomplsihed in his very first recruiting class. Before drawing success comparisons, let's see how Lavin's guys do as seniors with a fully balanced roster, and even then to compare Looie's 526 win career at St. John's to a guy who has coached only 1 seasons with his own guys is beyond ridiculous.

We'll see how long it takes for Lavin to establish the continuity Lou did. Meanwhile the brand of ball Lou's guys played compared to Lavin's mahem makers is positively no contest. You obviously weren't around to recognize what the game is supposed to look like. I'm not debating the subject with you anymore. Don't fall into the Koolaid vat..

We were spoiled for more than 20 years by Looie's ranked teams year after year, that rarely made it past round two of the NCAA's. I'm not even sure that today Looie could have the same success. The recruiting world has changed so much, and college basketball has so many more programs capable of snagging a top player here and there. It's not Kool-Aid, its just far too early to compare, especially given the state of the roster that LAvin inherited.

He was fortunate to make the NCAAs with Norm's team. That gave us an unexpected jump start in recruiting.

The 2011 class was already in place, with the exception of Gift, before "Norm's" team ever stepped on the floor for the 2010-2011 season. So, what unexpected jump start did Lavin gain, recruiting-wise, from that season?

Please, elaborate....

 

[Sherman Sheridan & Grant]

Jakarr was recruited two years ago with Pelle and Sanchez who never showed. Lavin got credit for a fantastic class and wound up playing with six guys after Nuri left. Then DLo recruited Branch. Obekpa was a score but he's really raw. This year looks like a strikeout except for Sanchez and Gift who were recruited awhile ago. Actually lately there ain't been much happening at all.

Still these events aren't strikeouts. Not even close. You said he strikes out year to year with recruits. Bottom line is he has had 2 ROY players that HE signed.

Sorry, but Coach is hitting line drive doubles and singles.

You're looking for grand slams in the bottom of the first inning with your lead off hitter.

It may be time to change teams with this new league forming.

I'm quite sure you'd be very happy with Syracuse and all their success. Then again...

Zan - well noted

not to offend any cat lovers but there is more than one way to, well
you can drive in runs via "small ball" or over the fences.
you can earn a living with one primary/major job or a few grouped together
you can circle the globe in a single swooooop or, God forbid, with stops in every port (airport that is)

I like the way Coach Lavin is moving along
We've already had good times during his brief tenure
and it sure looks as though good times will be ahead

It just isn't in me to go heavy on the criticism - perhaps because I evolved in such judgmental/harsh arenas such as a religious school where if you peed you'd surely go to hell; God didn't like people I suppose;
then in the Army - which I love and have fond memories of and memories of all the decent solid people therein - one was (often not always) lead by fear/threats/career ending mistakes etc.

So I try to take a more balanced view or even optimistic - and perhaps realistic when it comes to Lavin and recruiting BECAUSE

Which SJU coach - Louie included - has recruited as nationally as Steve Lavin?
Which coach has had to recruit a large class and did so with quality?
Which coach year in and out has been involved with multiple top 50-100 recruits?
Which coach has been able to blend both local and out of state and European kids better than coach Lavin?

for me
it's the end of the discussion
all the best

Comparing Lavin to Lou is totally ridiculous. After our #3 recruiting year we wind up with 13 and 16 wins and a gift appearance in the NIT and you have the balls to compare Lavin with Lou who missed the NCAAs like once. I won't even bother going into All the Canadian and European kids Lou got WHEN HE NEEDED THEM. Now that's the key. He anticipated openings and filled them in advance. There were no excuses like the lack of Taffner, the lack of a budget etc. etc. The closest he came was the running joke about the subway tokens. Lou wasn't perfect but comparing his consistent success to Lavin's is a sure way to wind up looking like a fool. I'd suggest you wait until Steve takes his own team to the Dance a few times in a row before you disparage legends.

You are so far off in your assessment of Looie's recruiting that you must not even remember if you put your pants on today. Looie recruiting nationally beginning in 1986, the year after the final four. The result? The famous Chuckie Sproling. Foreign players? MArco Baldi was a referral based in part on Looie's visibility in Italy after doing clinics there. Bill Wennington (Canadian) came from Long ISland Lutheran. Sergio Luyk's dad was Walter Berry and Shelton Jones coach in Spain. Looie never started with zero players on the roster, and coached in an era where most players stuck around 4 years. Looie NEVER had the national success Lavin has had in just 2 seasons of recruiting, and certainly didn't send first round picks to the NBA with regularity, something LAvin accomplsihed in his very first recruiting class. Before drawing success comparisons, let's see how Lavin's guys do as seniors with a fully balanced roster, and even then to compare Looie's 526 win career at St. John's to a guy who has coached only 1 seasons with his own guys is beyond ridiculous.

We'll see how long it takes for Lavin to establish the continuity Lou did. Meanwhile the brand of ball Lou's guys played compared to Lavin's mahem makers is positively no contest. You obviously weren't around to recognize what the game is supposed to look like. I'm not debating the subject with you anymore. Don't fall into the Koolaid vat..

We were spoiled for more than 20 years by Looie's ranked teams year after year, that rarely made it past round two of the NCAA's. I'm not even sure that today Looie could have the same success. The recruiting world has changed so much, and college basketball has so many more programs capable of snagging a top player here and there. It's not Kool-Aid, its just far too early to compare, especially given the state of the roster that LAvin inherited.

Thanks for your more moderate response - I didn't realize what a touchstone my remark would be - "disparage legends"? "wasn't around to recognize what the game is supposed to look like"? someone's too touchy and/or over-reacting - maybe it's me. And let's see, yes I did suit up today pants and all.
Marco Baldi the great foreign recruit?
Chuckie as in couldn't hit the jump shot he was noted for?
Sergio Luyk, may he rest in peace, was good. Past away much too early.
Bill Wennington was terrific and without him perhaps no final four - and pardon me if I forgot his Canadian roots.

I haven't checked this post in a while and was surprised. Somewhat.
Of course Louie was great in his time and yes college basketball has changed considerably. Blue chips, budgets$$$.

And true perhaps I'm jumping the gun on Coach Lavin and what his legacy will be.
It is "far too early".
And no the Lavin family is not paying me to issue a stream of positive comments.
As I believe was my first sentence in my post, I just like the overall direction and recruiting style that he brings - and -
to be fair,
would someone pull out the old videotapes of SJU fans bitching and moaning about Louie's style of play, his recruiting deficiencies.

Whatever.
I don't drink Kool-aid; junket renard custard perhaps...

A lot of fair observations though.
Am I forgiven for such heresy?
http://redmen.com/1x/components/com_kunena/template/blue_eagle/images/emoticons/wink.png

Thanks.

all the best

 

[SI1996]

One concern that I have is that our poor results and horrific end to the season will affect recruiting. All the top kids always say they want to go to a school that will challenge for a National Championship. It seems more imperative then ever that Lavin has a good won loss record next year to continue to draw the top recruits. Could our dismal performance this year have steered the likes of Martin, Lawrence and Wainright in a different direction?

I guess not.

 

[dee]

I think the title to this thread is deceiving. when you think about it, we really didnt have a poor season. If Harrison didnt have such a bad temper and attitude, I am convinced this team would have won a few more games down the stretch and made the big dance. They had the pieces and it was there for them to be in the tournament.

 

[westchesterjoe]

Jakarr was recruited two years ago with Pelle and Sanchez who never showed. Lavin got credit for a fantastic class and wound up playing with six guys after Nuri left. Then DLo recruited Branch. Obekpa was a score but he's really raw. This year looks like a strikeout except for Sanchez and Gift who were recruited awhile ago. Actually lately there ain't been much happening at all.

Still these events aren't strikeouts. Not even close. You said he strikes out year to year with recruits. Bottom line is he has had 2 ROY players that HE signed.

Sorry, but Coach is hitting line drive doubles and singles.

You're looking for grand slams in the bottom of the first inning with your lead off hitter.

It may be time to change teams with this new league forming.

I'm quite sure you'd be very happy with Syracuse and all their success. Then again...

Zan - well noted

not to offend any cat lovers but there is more than one way to, well
you can drive in runs via "small ball" or over the fences.
you can earn a living with one primary/major job or a few grouped together
you can circle the globe in a single swooooop or, God forbid, with stops in every port (airport that is)

I like the way Coach Lavin is moving along
We've already had good times during his brief tenure
and it sure looks as though good times will be ahead

It just isn't in me to go heavy on the criticism - perhaps because I evolved in such judgmental/harsh arenas such as a religious school where if you peed you'd surely go to hell; God didn't like people I suppose;
then in the Army - which I love and have fond memories of and memories of all the decent solid people therein - one was (often not always) lead by fear/threats/career ending mistakes etc.

So I try to take a more balanced view or even optimistic - and perhaps realistic when it comes to Lavin and recruiting BECAUSE

Which SJU coach - Louie included - has recruited as nationally as Steve Lavin?
Which coach has had to recruit a large class and did so with quality?
Which coach year in and out has been involved with multiple top 50-100 recruits?
Which coach has been able to blend both local and out of state and European kids better than coach Lavin?

for me
it's the end of the discussion
all the best

Comparing Lavin to Lou is totally ridiculous. After our #3 recruiting year we wind up with 13 and 16 wins and a gift appearance in the NIT and you have the balls to compare Lavin with Lou who missed the NCAAs like once. I won't even bother going into All the Canadian and European kids Lou got WHEN HE NEEDED THEM. Now that's the key. He anticipated openings and filled them in advance. There were no excuses like the lack of Taffner, the lack of a budget etc. etc. The closest he came was the running joke about the subway tokens. Lou wasn't perfect but comparing his consistent success to Lavin's is a sure way to wind up looking like a fool. I'd suggest you wait until Steve takes his own team to the Dance a few times in a row before you disparage legends.

You are so far off in your assessment of Looie's recruiting that you must not even remember if you put your pants on today. Looie recruiting nationally beginning in 1986, the year after the final four. The result? The famous Chuckie Sproling. Foreign players? MArco Baldi was a referral based in part on Looie's visibility in Italy after doing clinics there. Bill Wennington (Canadian) came from Long ISland Lutheran. Sergio Luyk's dad was Walter Berry and Shelton Jones coach in Spain. Looie never started with zero players on the roster, and coached in an era where most players stuck around 4 years. Looie NEVER had the national success Lavin has had in just 2 seasons of recruiting, and certainly didn't send first round picks to the NBA with regularity, something LAvin accomplsihed in his very first recruiting class. Before drawing success comparisons, let's see how Lavin's guys do as seniors with a fully balanced roster, and even then to compare Looie's 526 win career at St. John's to a guy who has coached only 1 seasons with his own guys is beyond ridiculous.

Well, Louie had the following NBA FIRST ROUND PICKS.. They are as follows:

1.Mullin
2. Berry
3. Wennington
4.Mark Jackson
5. Malik Sealy
6. Jayson Williams
7. Reggie Carter.. Not sure as he was selected by Knicks in his Junior YEAR AS 2ND ROUNDER. NBA rules allowed those territory picks in those days.He was a ALL American First teamer.
8. Robert Werdann- i believe he was 1st round.Not sure.2nd for sure.
9.Mel Davis


2nd rounders;
1. Shelton Jones
2.Willie Glass
3. Billy Schaeffer
4. Billy Paultz
5.Shawnelle Scott
6.Glen Williams
7. David Russell

I may have missed a few, here and there but, Louie got his share of elite level Local players, back in the day. Point being that Louie got talent too, maybe not as reputed as Steve but, those he got could play basketball and, no one got thrown off the team and, very few transfers out of program.. Sure, it was different times but,...

 

[beast of the east]

Jakarr was recruited two years ago with Pelle and Sanchez who never showed. Lavin got credit for a fantastic class and wound up playing with six guys after Nuri left. Then DLo recruited Branch. Obekpa was a score but he's really raw. This year looks like a strikeout except for Sanchez and Gift who were recruited awhile ago. Actually lately there ain't been much happening at all.

Still these events aren't strikeouts. Not even close. You said he strikes out year to year with recruits. Bottom line is he has had 2 ROY players that HE signed.

Sorry, but Coach is hitting line drive doubles and singles.

You're looking for grand slams in the bottom of the first inning with your lead off hitter.

It may be time to change teams with this new league forming.

I'm quite sure you'd be very happy with Syracuse and all their success. Then again...

Zan - well noted

not to offend any cat lovers but there is more than one way to, well
you can drive in runs via "small ball" or over the fences.
you can earn a living with one primary/major job or a few grouped together
you can circle the globe in a single swooooop or, God forbid, with stops in every port (airport that is)

I like the way Coach Lavin is moving along
We've already had good times during his brief tenure
and it sure looks as though good times will be ahead

It just isn't in me to go heavy on the criticism - perhaps because I evolved in such judgmental/harsh arenas such as a religious school where if you peed you'd surely go to hell; God didn't like people I suppose;
then in the Army - which I love and have fond memories of and memories of all the decent solid people therein - one was (often not always) lead by fear/threats/career ending mistakes etc.

So I try to take a more balanced view or even optimistic - and perhaps realistic when it comes to Lavin and recruiting BECAUSE

Which SJU coach - Louie included - has recruited as nationally as Steve Lavin?
Which coach has had to recruit a large class and did so with quality?
Which coach year in and out has been involved with multiple top 50-100 recruits?
Which coach has been able to blend both local and out of state and European kids better than coach Lavin?

for me
it's the end of the discussion
all the best

Comparing Lavin to Lou is totally ridiculous. After our #3 recruiting year we wind up with 13 and 16 wins and a gift appearance in the NIT and you have the balls to compare Lavin with Lou who missed the NCAAs like once. I won't even bother going into All the Canadian and European kids Lou got WHEN HE NEEDED THEM. Now that's the key. He anticipated openings and filled them in advance. There were no excuses like the lack of Taffner, the lack of a budget etc. etc. The closest he came was the running joke about the subway tokens. Lou wasn't perfect but comparing his consistent success to Lavin's is a sure way to wind up looking like a fool. I'd suggest you wait until Steve takes his own team to the Dance a few times in a row before you disparage legends.

You are so far off in your assessment of Looie's recruiting that you must not even remember if you put your pants on today. Looie recruiting nationally beginning in 1986, the year after the final four. The result? The famous Chuckie Sproling. Foreign players? MArco Baldi was a referral based in part on Looie's visibility in Italy after doing clinics there. Bill Wennington (Canadian) came from Long ISland Lutheran. Sergio Luyk's dad was Walter Berry and Shelton Jones coach in Spain. Looie never started with zero players on the roster, and coached in an era where most players stuck around 4 years. Looie NEVER had the national success Lavin has had in just 2 seasons of recruiting, and certainly didn't send first round picks to the NBA with regularity, something LAvin accomplsihed in his very first recruiting class. Before drawing success comparisons, let's see how Lavin's guys do as seniors with a fully balanced roster, and even then to compare Looie's 526 win career at St. John's to a guy who has coached only 1 seasons with his own guys is beyond ridiculous.

We'll see how long it takes for Lavin to establish the continuity Lou did. Meanwhile the brand of ball Lou's guys played compared to Lavin's mahem makers is positively no contest. You obviously weren't around to recognize what the game is supposed to look like. I'm not debating the subject with you anymore. Don't fall into the Koolaid vat..

We were spoiled for more than 20 years by Looie's ranked teams year after year, that rarely made it past round two of the NCAA's. I'm not even sure that today Looie could have the same success. The recruiting world has changed so much, and college basketball has so many more programs capable of snagging a top player here and there. It's not Kool-Aid, its just far too early to compare, especially given the state of the roster that LAvin inherited.

Thanks for your more moderate response - I didn't realize what a touchstone my remark would be - "disparage legends"? "wasn't around to recognize what the game is supposed to look like"? someone's too touchy and/or over-reacting - maybe it's me. And let's see, yes I did suit up today pants and all.
Marco Baldi the great foreign recruit?
Chuckie as in couldn't hit the jump shot he was noted for?
Sergio Luyk, may he rest in peace, was good. Past away much too early.
Bill Wennington was terrific and without him perhaps no final four - and pardon me if I forgot his Canadian roots.

I haven't checked this post in a while and was surprised. Somewhat.
Of course Louie was great in his time and yes college basketball has changed considerably. Blue chips, budgets$$$.

And true perhaps I'm jumping the gun on Coach Lavin and what his legacy will be.
It is "far too early".
And no the Lavin family is not paying me to issue a stream of positive comments.
As I believe was my first sentence in my post, I just like the overall direction and recruiting style that he brings - and -
to be fair,
would someone pull out the old videotapes of SJU fans bitching and moaning about Louie's style of play, his recruiting deficiencies.

Whatever.
I don't drink Kool-aid; junket renard custard perhaps...

A lot of fair observations though.
Am I forgiven for such heresy?
http://redmen.com/1x/components/com_kunena/template/blue_eagle/images/emoticons/wink.png

Thanks.

all the best

First off, I love reading your posts. They are always so respectful of the poster and written in measured tones, that it speaks volumes about you.

I've been reflecting on the Looie legacy, and also after going to Denver for the NCAA's two years ago.

I have a feeling that when Lavin gets it going full tilt, if he merely gets NCAA bids most years, and proceeds to go out mostly in the first and second round, we will all be disappointed. Even when you look at Looie's successes of going deeper, many were in a 32 team draw. Like most things, we are spoiled with the vision of what we think Lavin can achieve, and the bar will be set pretty high.

 

[jr49]

Good question on day we get 5 STAR. Do we remove it fromboard now?

 

[buckethead]

Jakarr was recruited two years ago with Pelle and Sanchez who never showed. Lavin got credit for a fantastic class and wound up playing with six guys after Nuri left. Then DLo recruited Branch. Obekpa was a score but he's really raw. This year looks like a strikeout except for Sanchez and Gift who were recruited awhile ago. Actually lately there ain't been much happening at all.

Still these events aren't strikeouts. Not even close. You said he strikes out year to year with recruits. Bottom line is he has had 2 ROY players that HE signed.

Sorry, but Coach is hitting line drive doubles and singles.

You're looking for grand slams in the bottom of the first inning with your lead off hitter.

It may be time to change teams with this new league forming.

I'm quite sure you'd be very happy with Syracuse and all their success. Then again...

Zan - well noted

not to offend any cat lovers but there is more than one way to, well
you can drive in runs via "small ball" or over the fences.
you can earn a living with one primary/major job or a few grouped together
you can circle the globe in a single swooooop or, God forbid, with stops in every port (airport that is)

I like the way Coach Lavin is moving along
We've already had good times during his brief tenure
and it sure looks as though good times will be ahead

It just isn't in me to go heavy on the criticism - perhaps because I evolved in such judgmental/harsh arenas such as a religious school where if you peed you'd surely go to hell; God didn't like people I suppose;
then in the Army - which I love and have fond memories of and memories of all the decent solid people therein - one was (often not always) lead by fear/threats/career ending mistakes etc.

So I try to take a more balanced view or even optimistic - and perhaps realistic when it comes to Lavin and recruiting BECAUSE

Which SJU coach - Louie included - has recruited as nationally as Steve Lavin?
Which coach has had to recruit a large class and did so with quality?
Which coach year in and out has been involved with multiple top 50-100 recruits?
Which coach has been able to blend both local and out of state and European kids better than coach Lavin?

for me
it's the end of the discussion
all the best

Comparing Lavin to Lou is totally ridiculous. After our #3 recruiting year we wind up with 13 and 16 wins and a gift appearance in the NIT and you have the balls to compare Lavin with Lou who missed the NCAAs like once. I won't even bother going into All the Canadian and European kids Lou got WHEN HE NEEDED THEM. Now that's the key. He anticipated openings and filled them in advance. There were no excuses like the lack of Taffner, the lack of a budget etc. etc. The closest he came was the running joke about the subway tokens. Lou wasn't perfect but comparing his consistent success to Lavin's is a sure way to wind up looking like a fool. I'd suggest you wait until Steve takes his own team to the Dance a few times in a row before you disparage legends.

You are so far off in your assessment of Looie's recruiting that you must not even remember if you put your pants on today. Looie recruiting nationally beginning in 1986, the year after the final four. The result? The famous Chuckie Sproling. Foreign players? MArco Baldi was a referral based in part on Looie's visibility in Italy after doing clinics there. Bill Wennington (Canadian) came from Long ISland Lutheran. Sergio Luyk's dad was Walter Berry and Shelton Jones coach in Spain. Looie never started with zero players on the roster, and coached in an era where most players stuck around 4 years. Looie NEVER had the national success Lavin has had in just 2 seasons of recruiting, and certainly didn't send first round picks to the NBA with regularity, something LAvin accomplsihed in his very first recruiting class. Before drawing success comparisons, let's see how Lavin's guys do as seniors with a fully balanced roster, and even then to compare Looie's 526 win career at St. John's to a guy who has coached only 1 seasons with his own guys is beyond ridiculous.

Well, Louie had the following NBA FIRST ROUND PICKS.. They are as follows:

1.Mullin
2. Berry
3. Wennington
4.Mark Jackson
5. Malik Sealy
6. Jayson Williams
7. Reggie Carter.. Not sure as he was selected by Knicks in his Junior YEAR AS 2ND ROUNDER. NBA rules allowed those territory picks in those days.He was a ALL American First teamer.
8. Robert Werdann- i believe he was 1st round.Not sure.2nd for sure.
9.Mel Davis


2nd rounders;
1. Shelton Jones
2.Willie Glass
3. Billy Schaeffer
4. Billy Paultz
5.Shawnelle Scott
6.Glen Williams
7. David Russell

I may have missed a few, here and there but, Louie got his share of elite level Local players, back in the day. Point being that Louie got talent too, maybe not as reputed as Steve but, those he got could play basketball and, no one got thrown off the team and, very few transfers out of program.. Sure, it was different times but,...

Kevin Williams - 2nd round 1983

 

[bobre45]

When evaluating Lou the overriding theme has to be that he accomplished a lot without a great deal to work with. So much has been added in the form of facilities, budget, salaries etc. it's only natural to expect the heirs to the position to produce more than he did. So far it hasn't even been close for a variety of inexplicable reasons. I think some of our recruiting has at least minimized the age old "St Johns will never recover" story and all that remains is performing accordingly. Fingers crossed going forward for a return to the consistent respect we once enjoyed.

 

[dee]

When evaluating Lou the overriding theme has to be that he accomplished a lot without a great deal to work with. So much has been added in the form of facilities, budget, salaries etc. it's only natural to expect the heirs to the position to produce more than he did. So far it hasn't even been close for a variety of inexplicable reasons. I think some of our recruiting has at least minimized the age old "St Johns will never recover" story and all that remains is performing accordingly. Fingers crossed going forward for a return to the consistent respect we once enjoyed.

Yes the days of Roberts and Jarvis will in the future be known as the dark ages in st johns basketball// we may finally be seeing the light at the end of the tunnel

 

[BOB BARKER]

Better incl mahoney(lou's hand picked successor) in yr dark ages..scenario....The overall trend is now toward condensing major basketball talents in the big programs....Big east more like a-10 than big ten,acc...hence,sj decline..swimming agst the tide...

 

[Las Vegan]

Jakarr was recruited two years ago with Pelle and Sanchez who never showed. Lavin got credit for a fantastic class and wound up playing with six guys after Nuri left. Then DLo recruited Branch. Obekpa was a score but he's really raw. This year looks like a strikeout except for Sanchez and Gift who were recruited awhile ago. Actually lately there ain't been much happening at all.

Still these events aren't strikeouts. Not even close. You said he strikes out year to year with recruits. Bottom line is he has had 2 ROY players that HE signed.

Sorry, but Coach is hitting line drive doubles and singles.

You're looking for grand slams in the bottom of the first inning with your lead off hitter.

It may be time to change teams with this new league forming.

I'm quite sure you'd be very happy with Syracuse and all their success. Then again...

Zan - well noted

not to offend any cat lovers but there is more than one way to, well
you can drive in runs via "small ball" or over the fences.
you can earn a living with one primary/major job or a few grouped together
you can circle the globe in a single swooooop or, God forbid, with stops in every port (airport that is)

I like the way Coach Lavin is moving along
We've already had good times during his brief tenure
and it sure looks as though good times will be ahead

It just isn't in me to go heavy on the criticism - perhaps because I evolved in such judgmental/harsh arenas such as a religious school where if you peed you'd surely go to hell; God didn't like people I suppose;
then in the Army - which I love and have fond memories of and memories of all the decent solid people therein - one was (often not always) lead by fear/threats/career ending mistakes etc.

So I try to take a more balanced view or even optimistic - and perhaps realistic when it comes to Lavin and recruiting BECAUSE

Which SJU coach - Louie included - has recruited as nationally as Steve Lavin?
Which coach has had to recruit a large class and did so with quality?
Which coach year in and out has been involved with multiple top 50-100 recruits?
Which coach has been able to blend both local and out of state and European kids better than coach Lavin?

for me
it's the end of the discussion
all the best

Comparing Lavin to Lou is totally ridiculous. After our #3 recruiting year we wind up with 13 and 16 wins and a gift appearance in the NIT and you have the balls to compare Lavin with Lou who missed the NCAAs like once. I won't even bother going into All the Canadian and European kids Lou got WHEN HE NEEDED THEM. Now that's the key. He anticipated openings and filled them in advance. There were no excuses like the lack of Taffner, the lack of a budget etc. etc. The closest he came was the running joke about the subway tokens. Lou wasn't perfect but comparing his consistent success to Lavin's is a sure way to wind up looking like a fool. I'd suggest you wait until Steve takes his own team to the Dance a few times in a row before you disparage legends.

You are so far off in your assessment of Looie's recruiting that you must not even remember if you put your pants on today. Looie recruiting nationally beginning in 1986, the year after the final four. The result? The famous Chuckie Sproling. Foreign players? MArco Baldi was a referral based in part on Looie's visibility in Italy after doing clinics there. Bill Wennington (Canadian) came from Long ISland Lutheran. Sergio Luyk's dad was Walter Berry and Shelton Jones coach in Spain. Looie never started with zero players on the roster, and coached in an era where most players stuck around 4 years. Looie NEVER had the national success Lavin has had in just 2 seasons of recruiting, and certainly didn't send first round picks to the NBA with regularity, something LAvin accomplsihed in his very first recruiting class. Before drawing success comparisons, let's see how Lavin's guys do as seniors with a fully balanced roster, and even then to compare Looie's 526 win career at St. John's to a guy who has coached only 1 seasons with his own guys is beyond ridiculous.

Well, Louie had the following NBA FIRST ROUND PICKS.. They are as follows:

1.Mullin
2. Berry
3. Wennington
4.Mark Jackson
5. Malik Sealy
6. Jayson Williams
7. Reggie Carter.. Not sure as he was selected by Knicks in his Junior YEAR AS 2ND ROUNDER. NBA rules allowed those territory picks in those days.He was a ALL American First teamer.
8. Robert Werdann- i believe he was 1st round.Not sure.2nd for sure.
9.Mel Davis


2nd rounders;
1. Shelton Jones
2.Willie Glass
3. Billy Schaeffer
4. Billy Paultz
5.Shawnelle Scott
6.Glen Williams
7. David Russell

I may have missed a few, here and there but, Louie got his share of elite level Local players, back in the day. Point being that Louie got talent too, maybe not as reputed as Steve but, those he got could play basketball and, no one got thrown off the team and, very few transfers out of program.. Sure, it was different times but,...

Looie had at least two other first round picks - Sonny Dove and John Warren, and a second rounder - Joe DePre. Maybe Bobby McIntire, too.

 

[jofi]

Has recruiting changed. Yes. The kids are looking for a career not and education. But how has having dorms on campuses changed things. In the past, athletes were given a stipend plus r&b off campus. Wow an apartment with $$$$ to spend. Now they need to live on campus. How has this changed things????