Why Steve Lavin Returned to Coaching
- Thread starter paultzman
- Start date
No, marriage “splashed”
No longer married, but he has landed a new "recruit". Unsurprisingly, another 5-star.
Boo Harvey
Well-known member
Sampson was not an impactful college player. I don’t think he would have made much of a difference for us. His freshman year was particularly poor as I recall. Agree on LoVett and Musssini
It's easy to say now that Sampson was impactful. The point remains he was a top 60 recruit at the time he committed to Lavin and St. John's.
Boo Harvey
Well-known member
My point is the cupboard was extremely bare. Dougherty and LoVett weren’t eligible. Sampson would not have elevated us. Lavin had a history of going after high risk high reward players without ensuring a well-balanced roster.
We would have been really bad for at least a year or two if Lavin stayed. Whether he could have ultimately turned the ship is anybody’s guess, but it appeared to many that he’d lost interest.
That brings us back to topic of discussion from the past couple days. Would you bust your ass if you were thoroughly aware--during the season--you were gonna receive the axe after the season?
No, in fact I (not SL) would have deliberately left the cupboard as bare as possible.
Boo Harvey
Well-known member
My view, without any inside info, is as follows: The school made an impulsive move hiring Mullin that obviously backfired.
While Lavin enjoyed some success, he had also significantly underachieved. His recruiting was on the downswing and he did not appear to be aggressively searching for a full and balanced roster. Instead, he appeared to be swinging for the fences for the Briscos of the world without any backup plan.
How much of his recruiting struggles were a function of lack of support of the administration, the cancer, being burtout, or the honeymoon period being over is anybody’s guess.
But his recruiting dropped off significantly well before the final year. As for his in-game coaching ability, there seems to be a near consensus among this Board that it was average at best.
I think Lavin is a charismatic and quality individual. He continues to speak well about SJU and we enjoyed some nice moments while he was coach. For that, I will always remember him fondly.
But I think we can do better. Whether CMA is the right guy is a big question mark. But we can only look forward. I find myself surprisingly optimistic for next year. When this past season ended, I had us penciled in as a bottom dweller. Now I think we have a real chance to dance. Im very much looking forward to November.
While Lavin enjoyed some success, he had also significantly underachieved. His recruiting was on the downswing and he did not appear to be aggressively searching for a full and balanced roster. Instead, he appeared to be swinging for the fences for the Briscos of the world without any backup plan.
How much of his recruiting struggles were a function of lack of support of the administration, the cancer, being burtout, or the honeymoon period being over is anybody’s guess.
But his recruiting dropped off significantly well before the final year. As for his in-game coaching ability, there seems to be a near consensus among this Board that it was average at best.
I think Lavin is a charismatic and quality individual. He continues to speak well about SJU and we enjoyed some nice moments while he was coach. For that, I will always remember him fondly.
But I think we can do better. Whether CMA is the right guy is a big question mark. But we can only look forward. I find myself surprisingly optimistic for next year. When this past season ended, I had us penciled in as a bottom dweller. Now I think we have a real chance to dance. Im very much looking forward to November.
braintrust
Well-known member
What I remember about Lavin...
1. Post Norm, he put us on the national basketball map...our Midnight Hoops was nationally televised...our recruits came from all over the country.
2. He was a poor X and O basketball coach. That was evidenced when Dunlap left. Also poor at halftime adjustments.
3. He was a great St Johns ambassador, just preferred hanging in the City more than Queens. Wish him the best.
1. Post Norm, he put us on the national basketball map...our Midnight Hoops was nationally televised...our recruits came from all over the country.
2. He was a poor X and O basketball coach. That was evidenced when Dunlap left. Also poor at halftime adjustments.
3. He was a great St Johns ambassador, just preferred hanging in the City more than Queens. Wish him the best.
But it appeared Lavin had stopped "busting his ass" well before that point.
But it appeared Lavin had stopped "busting his ass" well before that point.
MJ you bring up a valid point. The school handed the situation horribly. It’s not like Norm was still coaching, it was Steve Lavin who resurrected the program after Norms incompetence. He deserved better treatment.
Joe Olivia’s coup backfired in the long term. Seriously Joes management of the basketball program is a serious red flag, I just hope with Cragg in place he has kept his distance to legal counsel, and handling budgets and other functions within the University and stays a million miles away from dealing with the mens basketball program.
MJ you bring up a valid point. The school handed the situation horribly. It’s not like Norm was still coaching, it was Steve Lavin who resurrected the program after Norms incompetence. He deserved better treatment.
Joe Olivia’s coup backfired in the long term. Seriously Joes management of the basketball program is a serious red flag, I just hope with Cragg in place he has kept his distance to legal counsel, and handling budgets and other functions within the University and stays a million miles away from dealing with the mens basketball program.
Appearances can be deceiving. I'm sure Panther and a couple others can vouch for this in regards to Briscoe. He had told coaches and, if I'm not mistaken, players that he was gonna commit to the Johnnies. If Briscoe committed then you're likely talking about a top 3 recruiting class with Sampson, Diallo, and, of course, Briscoe.
That doesn't seem like someone who had stopped "busting his ass." Regardless, Lavin had the rug pulled from underneath him during his final season and he was aware of the happenings.
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Boo Harvey
Well-known member
As I said before, these were Hail Marys with no backup plan. We didn’t land Diallo and we didn’t land Briscoe. And even if we landed both along with Sampson, we still wouldn’t have been good the following year.
There was no roster balance and Lavin’s recruiting had tailed off significantly long before the final year. “Busting your ass” requires more than going after a few high profile recruits.
Get your point Boo. But, Briscoe, from what I recall, was not a Hail Mary. My recollection is that his dad wanted SJ and wasn’t happy at the selection. I says this, not because I think he wasnt entitled to make his own choice, just reinforcing fact that we were very serious contenders.
We should bring up old posts from this site. Lavin used to get killed on here because he was not nearly as active on the recruiting trail as he needed to be.
He was mainly being attacked for missing out on highly-rated targets. Not to mention, lingering effects of cancer, a couple of outside issues, and a staff where largely he and Chiles we're doing the heavy lifting played a role in his downfall. As fordham mentioned, he needed to shake up his staff.
Also keep in mind he was getting blasted for what the CTK coach Arbitello was saying about him never being at their gym which led to people thinking he was lazy and not recruiting locally which as Panther noted was a BS lie because Panther was at games at CTK with Lavin to watch kids
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Most exciting year I've had as a Saint John's fan since the good Jarvis teams was Lavin's first year where he turned Norm's recruits into an exciting team that produced multiple top 20 upsets and might have advanced in NCAA tourney but for the DJ injury. What I would give for another year like that one...
Let me state this one last time. I was at CTK games with the Lavin and staff. Omar Calhoun was there and he also had a sophmore who was pretty good. Some on here were so anti Lavin that they believed whatever was put out there. There were really no players at CTK that had success at the High Major level at that time. Arbitelle was also mad because Lave got a commitment from Delarosa without his help.
As for Briscoe, I was in a room after Midnight Madness with Tony Chiles, Rico Hines, D'Angelo Harrison, and Rysheed Jordan when Briscoe stated that he was coming to St Johns and looking forward to Playing with Jordan if he was still here. However, at the last minute, he got a better "NIL" deal from Kentucky. Guess who dropped the bag off???