Who Has The Better Resume?

NYCRedmen

NYCRedmen

Well-known member
Assume for the moment that we finish with the same record as Villanova (lets say 20 wins) and we don't play them again in the Big East Tournament. Now assume you are determining which of those two to take for one spot on Selection Sunday, what weighs more for you; which team has the worst "bad losses" (San Fran & UNCA vs Columbia & LaSalle) or the fact that they won the head to head meeting way back in the beginning of January?
 
The fact that Nova beat Louisville and Syracuse combined with the head to head match up. It's a no brainer.

PS LaSalle is 18-6 with an RPI of 35. Not a bad loss even without the Big 5 considerations.

PPS, if either of them get to 20 wins they're probably in as it would likely mean they got to the BE final or upset a lot of top teams at the end of the season.
 
Assume for the moment that we finish with the same record as Villanova (lets say 20 wins) and we don't play them again in the Big East Tournament. Now assume you are determining which of those two to take for one spot on Selection Sunday, what weighs more for you; which team has the worst "bad losses" (San Fran & UNCA vs Columbia & LaSalle) or the fact that they won the head to head meeting way back in the beginning of January?
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What are the RPI's and SOS?
Also record in last 10 games (including how each fared in the BET) means a lot if I was voting as well as Road/Neutral court performance. Those would be my factors.
 
Nova still has to play Marquette, seton hall, Pitt and Georgetown. They have as tough of a road as we do in next 4 and could win 3 or lose 3 of those.
 
The fact that Nova beat Louisville and Syracuse combined with the head to head match up. It's a no brainer.

PS LaSalle is 18-6 with an RPI of 35. Not a bad loss even without the Big 5 considerations.

PPS, if either of them get to 20 wins they're probably in as it would likely mean they got to the BE final or upset a lot of top teams at the end of the season.
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Agree but .doubt we hit 20 wins Would love to see it but the 2nd 1/2 of our last game was dissappointing esp leading 41-19
 
The fact that Nova beat Louisville and Syracuse combined with the head to head match up. It's a no brainer.

PS LaSalle is 18-6 with an RPI of 35. Not a bad loss even without the Big 5 considerations.

PPS, if either of them get to 20 wins they're probably in as it would likely mean they got to the BE final or upset a lot of top teams at the end of the season.
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Agree but .doubt we hit 20 wins Would love to see it but the 2nd 1/2 of our last game was dissappointing esp leading 41-19
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I doubt either team hits 20 wins but was only making a comment there because the original questions asked if both teams were tied at 20 which would get in.

With regard to being outscored 35-28 in the last 15 minutes, well despite Joe's histrionics on the game thread the game was, barring a miraculous shooting run by USF, over. Like all good NCAA teams USF was able to put together two good spurts from that point in but the game never got to single digits. Jakarr and Dlo sat at the same time so obviously the team and staff didn't think it was that big of a deal. I'm sure everyone would have preferred the final score to be 80-40 but it was a solid win just the same. (watched a bit of the rerun after I got home).
 
Since when is it a no-brainer? They are neck and neck in the eyes of the Selection Committee with Nova having the head-to-head advantage.

Nova-
RPI 55
SOS 33

SJU
RPI 59
SOS 31

Remaining Nova schedule (opponent's RPI/SOS):
Marquette (14/17)
@Seton Hall (122/62)
@Pitt (40/45)
GTown (16/43)

Remaining SJU schedule (opponent's RPI/SOS):
Pitt (40/45)
@Prov (85/38)
@ND (44/79)
Marquette (14/17)

Out of all of those teams, only Marquette (an NCAA tourney lock) has played a tougher schedule than SJU. Not even Georgetown.

Nova has lost to Providence twice this season. Nova's remaining average opponents' RPI is 48. SJU's is 45. Nova's game @Seton Hall is the worst of the bunch win or lose.
 
I remember back in 1967, the first season I seriously paid attention to all the races in baseball, going into the last weekend of the season the Red Sox, Angels, Twins, and I believe the Tigers all had a chance for the AL pennant going into the final weekend. It has been descirbed as the greatest pennant race in history. It was thoroughly worth it watching the games, and hearing the inning by inning reports of what was going on with the other teams.

Here, I don't even think its worth the mental exercise at this point. We have 4 tough games, have a good chance to win 3, but could lose all 4. I'd rather they just take care of the business in front of them, one at a time. I agree with those who say as far as serious games this season, Pitt becomes the biggest so far. Lose and all NCAA hopes are gone. Win and we can start to dream, even if the odds still don't favor us.
 
Since when is it a no-brainer? They are neck and neck in the eyes of the Selection Committee with Nova having the head-to-head advantage.

Nova-
RPI 55
SOS 33

SJU
RPI 59
SOS 31

Remaining Nova schedule (opponent's RPI/SOS):
Marquette (14/17)
@Seton Hall (122/62)
@Pitt (40/45)
GTown (16/43)

Remaining SJU schedule (opponent's RPI/SOS):
Pitt (40/45)
@Prov (85/38)
@ND (44/79)
Marquette (14/17)

Out of all of those teams, only Marquette (an NCAA tourney lock) has played a tougher schedule than SJU. Not even Georgetown.

Nova has lost to Providence twice this season. Nova's remaining average opponents' RPI is 48. SJU's is 45. Nova's game @Seton Hall is the worst of the bunch win or lose.
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At this point, assuming they perform equally equal the balance of the season, Nova has only 1 loss outside the top 100 and 2 wins against the top 10 RPI, St Johns has 3 losses outside the top 100 and 0 top 25 wins (forget top 10). St Johns best win in the RPI vs UConn is at home matched by Nova beating them on the road. No brainer RIGHT NOW if it were a choice of one or the other. Both team IMHO still need to play themselves into the tournament and hopefully one won't get in at the expense of the other. The more Big Smoke teams the better.
 
I remember back in 1967, the first season I seriously paid attention to all the races in baseball, going into the last weekend of the season the Red Sox, Angels, Twins, and I believe the Tigers all had a chance for the AL pennant going into the final weekend. It has been descirbed as the greatest pennant race in history. It was thoroughly worth it watching the games, and hearing the inning by inning reports of what was going on with the other teams.

Here, I don't even think its worth the mental exercise at this point. We have 4 tough games, have a good chance to win 3, but could lose all 4. I'd rather they just take care of the business in front of them, one at a time. I agree with those who say as far as serious games this season, Pitt becomes the biggest so far. Lose and all NCAA hopes are gone. Win and we can start to dream, even if the odds still don't favor us.
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I understand what you are saying (although I was not alive back in 1967). But to me this kind of discussion, especially with just 4 games left, is like being at a baseball game in September & scoreboard watching, because your team is in a pennant race. This is a part of what makes college basketball fun, it's not like the NBA where almost half the teams make the playoffs.
 
The fact that Nova beat Louisville and Syracuse combined with the head to head match up. It's a no brainer.

PS LaSalle is 18-6 with an RPI of 35. Not a bad loss even without the Big 5 considerations.

PPS, if either of them get to 20 wins they're probably in as it would likely mean they got to the BE final or upset a lot of top teams at the end of the season.
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As much as I hate it...I agree with all points...LaSalle has been surprising this year...Love our long term prospects but think Nova is more balanced right now (can score from all parts of the floor)
 
Since when is it a no-brainer? They are neck and neck in the eyes of the Selection Committee with Nova having the head-to-head advantage.

Nova-
RPI 55
SOS 33

SJU
RPI 59
SOS 31

Remaining Nova schedule (opponent's RPI/SOS):
Marquette (14/17)
@Seton Hall (122/62)
@Pitt (40/45)
GTown (16/43)

Remaining SJU schedule (opponent's RPI/SOS):
Pitt (40/45)
@Prov (85/38)
@ND (44/79)
Marquette (14/17)

Out of all of those teams, only Marquette (an NCAA tourney lock) has played a tougher schedule than SJU. Not even Georgetown.

Nova has lost to Providence twice this season. Nova's remaining average opponents' RPI is 48. SJU's is 45. Nova's game @Seton Hall is the worst of the bunch win or lose.
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At this point, assuming they perform equally equal the balance of the season, Nova has only 1 loss outside the top 100 and 2 wins against the top 10 RPI, St Johns has 3 losses outside the top 100 and 0 top 25 wins (forget top 10). St Johns best win in the RPI vs UConn is at home matched by Nova beating them on the road. No brainer RIGHT NOW if it were a choice of one or the other. Both team IMHO still need to play themselves into the tournament and hopefully one won't get in at the expense of the other. The more Big Smoke teams the better.
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That's not how it works. You don't beat a team when they are ranked and then not get credit for it because they lost a few late. On our resume it will still say #14 Cincy and #20 Notre Dame. Those teams totally deserved their rankings at the time. Don't cut us short, we have 2 top 25 wins and beat UConn who I told you guys would be much better than anticipated and they are. UConn can end up a 20 win team this year.
 
I remember back in 1967, the first season I seriously paid attention to all the races in baseball, going into the last weekend of the season the Red Sox, Angels, Twins, and I believe the Tigers all had a chance for the AL pennant going into the final weekend. It has been descirbed as the greatest pennant race in history. It was thoroughly worth it watching the games, and hearing the inning by inning reports of what was going on with the other teams.

Here, I don't even think its worth the mental exercise at this point. We have 4 tough games, have a good chance to win 3, but could lose all 4. I'd rather they just take care of the business in front of them, one at a time. I agree with those who say as far as serious games this season, Pitt becomes the biggest so far. Lose and all NCAA hopes are gone. Win and we can start to dream, even if the odds still don't favor us.
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I don't know if you were kidding or really meant that if we lose to Pitt all NCAA hopes would be gone. This could not be further from the truth. If they lose to Pitt but beat ND, Providence and Marquette they are almost definitely in and they are a lock to be in with three wins plus winning one in the Big East.
 
I remember back in 1967, the first season I seriously paid attention to all the races in baseball, going into the last weekend of the season the Red Sox, Angels, Twins, and I believe the Tigers all had a chance for the AL pennant going into the final weekend. It has been descirbed as the greatest pennant race in history. It was thoroughly worth it watching the games, and hearing the inning by inning reports of what was going on with the other teams.

Here, I don't even think its worth the mental exercise at this point. We have 4 tough games, have a good chance to win 3, but could lose all 4. I'd rather they just take care of the business in front of them, one at a time. I agree with those who say as far as serious games this season, Pitt becomes the biggest so far. Lose and all NCAA hopes are gone. Win and we can start to dream, even if the odds still don't favor us.
Click to expand...
I don't know if you were kidding or really meant that if we lose to Pitt all NCAA hopes would be gone. This could not be further from the truth. If they lose to Pitt but beat ND, Providence and Marquette they are almost definitely in and they are a lock to be in with three wins plus winning one in the Big East.
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Hope springs eternal. If we cannot beat Pitt at home, the likelihood that we beat ND on the road, Providence on the road, and MArquette at home are vwry very long odds.
 
I remember back in 1967, the first season I seriously paid attention to all the races in baseball, going into the last weekend of the season the Red Sox, Angels, Twins, and I believe the Tigers all had a chance for the AL pennant going into the final weekend. It has been descirbed as the greatest pennant race in history. It was thoroughly worth it watching the games, and hearing the inning by inning reports of what was going on with the other teams.

Here, I don't even think its worth the mental exercise at this point. We have 4 tough games, have a good chance to win 3, but could lose all 4. I'd rather they just take care of the business in front of them, one at a time. I agree with those who say as far as serious games this season, Pitt becomes the biggest so far. Lose and all NCAA hopes are gone. Win and we can start to dream, even if the odds still don't favor us.
Click to expand...

I understand what you are saying (although I was not alive back in 1967). But to me this kind of discussion, especially with just 4 games left, is like being at a baseball game in September & scoreboard watching, because your team is in a pennant race. This is a part of what makes college basketball fun, it's not like the NBA where almost half the teams make the playoffs.
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4 games remaining in an 18 game conference schedule is 22% of the schedule. I just think its a little premature to zero in on one team (Nova) and compare our chances tot heirs, since in 3 games they may be solidly in, or solidly out depending on how they play it out. SImilalry in 3 games, we may or may not be in a position to ocmpare our bubble hopes to anyone.
 
Since when is it a no-brainer? They are neck and neck in the eyes of the Selection Committee with Nova having the head-to-head advantage.

Nova-
RPI 55
SOS 33

SJU
RPI 59
SOS 31

Remaining Nova schedule (opponent's RPI/SOS):
Marquette (14/17)
@Seton Hall (122/62)
@Pitt (40/45)
GTown (16/43)

Remaining SJU schedule (opponent's RPI/SOS):
Pitt (40/45)
@Prov (85/38)
@ND (44/79)
Marquette (14/17)

Out of all of those teams, only Marquette (an NCAA tourney lock) has played a tougher schedule than SJU. Not even Georgetown.

Nova has lost to Providence twice this season. Nova's remaining average opponents' RPI is 48. SJU's is 45. Nova's game @Seton Hall is the worst of the bunch win or lose.
Click to expand...

At this point, assuming they perform equally equal the balance of the season, Nova has only 1 loss outside the top 100 and 2 wins against the top 10 RPI, St Johns has 3 losses outside the top 100 and 0 top 25 wins (forget top 10). St Johns best win in the RPI vs UConn is at home matched by Nova beating them on the road. No brainer RIGHT NOW if it were a choice of one or the other. Both team IMHO still need to play themselves into the tournament and hopefully one won't get in at the expense of the other. The more Big Smoke teams the better.
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That's not how it works. You don't beat a team when they are ranked and then not get credit for it because they lost a few late. On our resume it will still say #14 Cincy and #20 Notre Dame. Those teams totally deserved their rankings at the time. Don't cut us short, we have 2 top 25 wins and beat UConn who I told you guys would be much better than anticipated and they are. UConn can end up a 20 win team this year.
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Actually, with regard to the RPI, that's exactly how it works. Quality wins are based on the teams RPI not at the time of the win but in that team's overall body of work. In your mind Miami sucked in November. Not so in the minds of those who designed the RPI and really not so in the minds of those who make the brackets. The RPI is important and STJ no longer has high quality RPI wins. They have some good wins but also some horrid losses. Both teams are on the bubble and in the greater scheme of things they are very close but I haven't seen a bracket in a week that has STJ ranked over Nova. Given that their SOS and RPI are nearly identical the good wins/bad losses put Nova clearly ahead.
 
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