Top 50 Greatest Players
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CR, are you saying Mel Counts' game was unorthodox?
And by the way, I totally agree with your assessment of Pat Ewing's college career. Because he was the dominant force in the Big East -- and especially against St. John's -- we here in the NYC area tend to overrate his collegiate legacy.
CR, are you saying Mel Counts' game was unorthodox?
And by the way, I totally agree with your assessment of Pat Ewing's college career. Because he was the dominant force in the Big East -- and especially against St. John's -- we here in the NYC area tend to overrate his collegiate legacy.
Dead serious about Mel. One of the ALL TIME GREAT west coast collegians. Most folks only remember the geeky looking pro backup to both Russell and Chamberlain. A 13 year pro with 8pts and 6 rebs per game.
But at Oregon State Mel was a thing of Beauty. Led them to the Dance all three years of college. Took them to their only Final Four. A member of the 1964 Gold Medal US Olympic Basketball team. He was THE greatest rebounder in the Pac schools history until a guy named Alcindor showed up. His 3 varsity years:
So: 18.6 pts, 13.5 rebs
Jr: 21.3 pts, 15.6 rebs
Sr: 26.7 pts, 16.9 rebs
beast of the east
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I agree 100%. There has not been as intimidating a defensive presence in college basketball in the past 45 years as Ewing. The first time we saw him against St. John's, GTown went into a zone, and he spread his arms across the lane. It looked as if his wingspin covered the paint in its entirety.
You don't measure Ewing the collegian by 15 and 9. Unlike Alcindor, Ewing teams got through draws of 48,48,48, and 64 teams.
You don't measure Ewing the collegian by 15 and 9. Unlike Alcindor, Ewing teams got through draws of 48,48,48, and 64 teams.
"... most imposing player I've ever seen on a basketball court at any level."
At any level? Main Man, take it you never saw Wilt Chamberlain, Bill Russell, Kareem Abdul Jabbar, Bill Walton, Michael Jordan, Larry Bird, Magic Johnson, Hakeem Olajuwon, Shaquille O'Neal, just to name a few -- which I find hard to believe.
CR, are you saying Mel Counts' game was unorthodox?
And by the way, I totally agree with your assessment of Pat Ewing's college career. Because he was the dominant force in the Big East -- and especially against St. John's -- we here in the NYC area tend to overrate his collegiate legacy.
Dead serious about Mel. One of the ALL TIME GREAT west coast collegians. Most folks only remember the geeky looking pro backup to both Russell and Chamberlain. A 13 year pro with 8pts and 6 rebs per game.
But at Oregon State Mel was a thing of Beauty. Led them to the Dance all three years of college. Took them to their only Final Four. A member of the 1964 Gold Medal US Olympic Basketball team. He was THE greatest rebounder in the Pac schools history until a guy named Alcindor showed up. His 3 varsity years:
So: 18.6 pts, 13.5 rebs
Jr: 21.3 pts, 15.6 rebs
Sr: 26.7 pts, 16.9 rebs
CR, was only commenting ironically (which was lost, I guess) on Mel Counts' game, which, from what I vaguely remember, was unorthodox for someone who was 7'-2" or thereabout.
Never saw Wilt or Russell except in film. Jabbar and Walton were past their prime (Walton way past) when I started really getting into hoops. Jordan was the best. Bird and Magic were almost the best. Hakeem was great and Shaq was pretty awesome.
That said I have never seen a player intimidate his opponents as much as Ewing at Gtown. He scared the isht out of everybody trying to guard him or trying to score on him*.
*Except Kevin Williams who had the biggest pair I've ever seen and Walter Berry who thought he could score on Jesus.
Bama qb was a 4 star recruit and heir apparent to qb position. He is a redshirt soph with no playing experience coming into season. He is not bad-doesn't have wide out weapons that previous qb McElroy had (Julio Jones). Bama long range kicker had stronger leg in high school-cannot atest to his accuracy but Bama has 3 kickers on schoolie and as fan base asserts are not getting bang for buck (most D1 kickers are walk-ons). They have a verbal from #1 ranked fg kicker from state of Georgia and again is offering him a schollie.
beast of the east
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Didn't Berry avergae around 40 points a game at his peak in Europe? He also earned a ton of money there to my knowledge. I do know that until recently he lived in a mansion in Saddle River. I had also read back then during his prime in Europe that there was interest from several NBA teams. I think Berry has moved to Georgia, but if I run into him this season, I'll ask him.
beast of the east
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The best college player I saw who didn't pan out well in the pros was Indiana's Scott May.
Billy had an unorthodox hook shot that was virtually unstoppable when it was on. It had a great deal of separation between the ball release and the defender. When he played for '63-'64 Knicks (one of many different stops in the NBA and ABA), I once saw him put up close to 40 points against Bill Russell, who couldn't get his hand near the ball. But he was strictly a one-dimensional player (averaged about 16 ppg for the Knicks), hence his much-traveled pro career.
Every fan who grew up in the NYC area in the early 60s remembers Barry Kramer. He was it! But in his senior year, his pre-season No. 1 Violets failed to live up to expectations and his pro career was a big disappointment to local fans as well, be it due to injuries or whatever. (Teammate Harold "Happy" Hairston did go on to have a very solid 11-year NBA career.)
He did great in Europe as a player and money wise and yes I believe after he grew up a little there there might have been some greater NBA interest. But I think Europe was easy and tax free and Berry liked it there. It was the opinion that he went to Europe for the money despite his successes in and great offers from the NBA that's revisionist.
beast of the east
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He didn't have great offers from the NBA - it was more like feelers put out and invites to camp. There is little quesiton he could have made a roster and been a contributor. Berry, though, wouldn't leave unless there was some serious money offered by the NBA that was in the neighborhood of what he was being paid - which I think was around $5 million per in Europe. There was no quesiton he could score, even in the NBA, but his attitude along with poor defense did him in during his brief stint in the pros.