@Seton Hall, Sun. Jan. 22, 12 Noon, FS1/570AM

[mjmaherjr]

Sean Muto would have helped our front line this year

 

[we are sju]

Topic is relevant. One of the Bucknasty's, there are two or three I think said we need a Anthony Glover type. Glover and Singleton's name come up from time to time through the years and time has warped people's memories of them. Never once since those guys left have I wished a similar player was on the current team. Mostly because usually we need much more talented players to be relevant again. Paul was irrationally upset by this line of thinking.

Singleton or Glover would help this team immeasurably. Singleton had hands and would handle the passes that the current bigs flub and despite being a cripple was a ferocious rebounder. And Glover - who I think was underrated, not over rated - would have bitch slapped Delgado back to Puerto Rico or El Salvador or wherever. They were Spartans. Our front line players are barely Amazons.

First of all, if I were to pick out a guy from the past for this team it would not be Singleton, who is in fact one of my favorite past players. You brought his name into the discussion, not me. It wouldn't be him for this team because he didn't run the floor exceptionally well and would not provide the height and interior presence that we need. He did well in LC's half court style because it was smart, controlled basketball and he complimented other good basketball players. But in this fantasy, I'd never worry about him taking vacations mid-game - any game. I'd never doubt that he was working his tail off in practice and in his own time. And without a doubt he'd have the best hands on this current team and when we were in the half court he could catch and finish regardless of who our opponent would be as well as provide offensive rebounding. AND he'd be the only guy on the team boxing out. I'm certain that Lovett and Ponds assist numbers would go up significantly and we'd see a lot of nice interior passing that we only got glimpses of so far after they were fumbled and our passers were reigned in. Their own shooting percentages would increase because having some options on the inside means less pressure on the outside and as a smart, intuitive, team player he'd also be kicking the ball back out to give them good shots. I can't remember the last time I saw a good drive and kick or pass and kick from out guys. We should be doing that all game...

What I would like to see is a smart, physical presence on defense and someone that can catch the ball and finish on offense - in that order of priority.

Both of your guys could do all of that except finish.
Listen those guys were fine but when Singleton played I was a teenager who liked watching David Russell, Walter Berry, Shelton jones and Willie Glass. A slow, pump faking guy who couldn't jump was never going to be one of my favorite players of that time period. Glover came in with a lot of hype and basically replaced Artest. That was not a good trade for us. I have a lot of players I remember fondly when we were good. Honestly I mostly remember those two guys for getting blocked a lot. Well that and that BS tech that Singleton got called for so Duke could beat us.

 

[mjmaherjr]

Topic is relevant. One of the Bucknasty's, there are two or three I think said we need a Anthony Glover type. Glover and Singleton's name come up from time to time through the years and time has warped people's memories of them. Never once since those guys left have I wished a similar player was on the current team. Mostly because usually we need much more talented players to be relevant again. Paul was irrationally upset by this line of thinking.

Singleton or Glover would help this team immeasurably. Singleton had hands and would handle the passes that the current bigs flub and despite being a cripple was a ferocious rebounder. And Glover - who I think was underrated, not over rated - would have bitch slapped Delgado back to Puerto Rico or El Salvador or wherever. They were Spartans. Our front line players are barely Amazons.

First of all, if I were to pick out a guy from the past for this team it would not be Singleton, who is in fact one of my favorite past players. You brought his name into the discussion, not me. It wouldn't be him for this team because he didn't run the floor exceptionally well and would not provide the height and interior presence that we need. He did well in LC's half court style because it was smart, controlled basketball and he complimented other good basketball players. But in this fantasy, I'd never worry about him taking vacations mid-game - any game. I'd never doubt that he was working his tail off in practice and in his own time. And without a doubt he'd have the best hands on this current team and when we were in the half court he could catch and finish regardless of who our opponent would be as well as provide offensive rebounding. AND he'd be the only guy on the team boxing out. I'm certain that Lovett and Ponds assist numbers would go up significantly and we'd see a lot of nice interior passing that we only got glimpses of so far after they were fumbled and our passers were reigned in. Their own shooting percentages would increase because having some options on the inside means less pressure on the outside and as a smart, intuitive, team player he'd also be kicking the ball back out to give them good shots. I can't remember the last time I saw a good drive and kick or pass and kick from out guys. We should be doing that all game...

What I would like to see is a smart, physical presence on defense and someone that can catch the ball and finish on offense - in that order of priority.

Well that and that BS tech that Singleton got called for so Duke could beat us.

I will harbor anger over that call for the rest of my life unless I get Alzheimers beforehand and even then I probably won't get over it

 

[bamafan]

Topic is relevant. One of the Bucknasty's, there are two or three I think said we need a Anthony Glover type. Glover and Singleton's name come up from time to time through the years and time has warped people's memories of them. Never once since those guys left have I wished a similar player was on the current team. Mostly because usually we need much more talented players to be relevant again. Paul was irrationally upset by this line of thinking.

Singleton or Glover would help this team immeasurably. Singleton had hands and would handle the passes that the current bigs flub and despite being a cripple was a ferocious rebounder. And Glover - who I think was underrated, not over rated - would have bitch slapped Delgado back to Puerto Rico or El Salvador or wherever. They were Spartans. Our front line players are barely Amazons.

First of all, if I were to pick out a guy from the past for this team it would not be Singleton, who is in fact one of my favorite past players. You brought his name into the discussion, not me. It wouldn't be him for this team because he didn't run the floor exceptionally well and would not provide the height and interior presence that we need. He did well in LC's half court style because it was smart, controlled basketball and he complimented other good basketball players. But in this fantasy, I'd never worry about him taking vacations mid-game - any game. I'd never doubt that he was working his tail off in practice and in his own time. And without a doubt he'd have the best hands on this current team and when we were in the half court he could catch and finish regardless of who our opponent would be as well as provide offensive rebounding. AND he'd be the only guy on the team boxing out. I'm certain that Lovett and Ponds assist numbers would go up significantly and we'd see a lot of nice interior passing that we only got glimpses of so far after they were fumbled and our passers were reigned in. Their own shooting percentages would increase because having some options on the inside means less pressure on the outside and as a smart, intuitive, team player he'd also be kicking the ball back out to give them good shots. I can't remember the last time I saw a good drive and kick or pass and kick from out guys. We should be doing that all game...

What I would like to see is a smart, physical presence on defense and someone that can catch the ball and finish on offense - in that order of priority.

Both of your guys could do all of that except finish.
Listen those guys were fine but when Singleton played I was a teenager who liked watching David Russell, Walter Berry, Shelton jones and Willie Glass. A slow, pump faking guy who couldn't jump was never going to be one of my favorite players of that time period. Glover came in with a lot of hype and basically replaced Artest. That was not a good trade for us. I have a lot of players I remember fondly when we were good. Honestly I mostly remember those two guys for getting blocked a lot. Well that and that BS tech that Singleton got called for so Duke could beat us.

Yes those two guys did get their shots blocked a lot. That reminds me of one of Peter Vesey's better lines in his NY Post nba articles wherein he wrote that NY Knick Glen Gondrezick (via UNLV) was the only NBA player that could block his own jump shot.

 

[redken]

Need to find an Anthony Glover type player. Guy was a beast down low.

You know this might be a unpopular stance but I do not have the same fond and fuzzy memories of Glover or Billy Singleton that most on here have. I think both those guys, though solid hard working players might have led the nation in getting their shots thrown back at them. Singleton had to pump fake 50 times to get a shot off.

For undersized power forwards give me Ty Grant and Lamont Middleton over those other two guys any day of the week.
BTW I think Marvin Clark can fit that role next year.

"unpopular" in the way that mental retardation is unpopular.

Both were overrated.
Grant and Middleton much better basketball players.

Say what?

List of guys who played the 4 spot during their career here who I have seen play that are better than Glover / Singleton in chronological order:
1. Russell
2. Berry
3. Shelton Jones
4.Jayson Williams-Played 4-Wersdann was 5
5. Roshown Mcleod
6. Ty Grant
7. Lamont Middleton
8. Charles Minlend
9. Ron Artest-Played the 4
10. Lamont Hamilton
11. Mo Harkless
12. Jakar Sampson
13. Dom Pointer
*14. Forgot Brownlee
Somewhere between 15-18 would be Glover, Singleton, Burrell and Jeff Allen

You are probably too young for George Johnson, who was better at the 4 here than any of the above.

Only Walter Berry was better than George Johnson. An absolute stud. Not even close with other names mentioned.

 

[we are sju]

Need to find an Anthony Glover type player. Guy was a beast down low.

You know this might be a unpopular stance but I do not have the same fond and fuzzy memories of Glover or Billy Singleton that most on here have. I think both those guys, though solid hard working players might have led the nation in getting their shots thrown back at them. Singleton had to pump fake 50 times to get a shot off.

For undersized power forwards give me Ty Grant and Lamont Middleton over those other two guys any day of the week.
BTW I think Marvin Clark can fit that role next year.

"unpopular" in the way that mental retardation is unpopular.

Both were overrated.
Grant and Middleton much better basketball players.

Say what?

List of guys who played the 4 spot during their career here who I have seen play that are better than Glover / Singleton in chronological order:
1. Russell
2. Berry
3. Shelton Jones
4.Jayson Williams-Played 4-Wersdann was 5
5. Roshown Mcleod
6. Ty Grant
7. Lamont Middleton
8. Charles Minlend
9. Ron Artest-Played the 4
10. Lamont Hamilton
11. Mo Harkless
12. Jakar Sampson
13. Dom Pointer
*14. Forgot Brownlee
Somewhere between 15-18 would be Glover, Singleton, Burrell and Jeff Allen

You are probably too young for George Johnson, who was better at the 4 here than any of the above.

Only Walter Berry was better than George Johnson. An absolute stud. Not even close with other names mentioned.

Too young for Johnson at ST John's but family friend played with him there and when he was with the Pacers I used to get tickets to see them play the Knicks. Got to go into locker room a couple times and got a bunch of autographs that I lost somewhere along the line. Herb Williams, Clark Kellog and Billy Knight were their best players. Also got Dave Winfield's autograph as he was at that game and visiting someone in Pacers locker room. I think it was his first season in NY or offseason he signed. Michael Ray Richardson told me to get out of his way when I asked him for an autograph when I saw him in the hallway when we were leaving. Had two hookers with him, so I guess he was busy.

 

[lawmanfan]

Need to find an Anthony Glover type player. Guy was a beast down low.

You know this might be a unpopular stance but I do not have the same fond and fuzzy memories of Glover or Billy Singleton that most on here have. I think both those guys, though solid hard working players might have led the nation in getting their shots thrown back at them. Singleton had to pump fake 50 times to get a shot off.

For undersized power forwards give me Ty Grant and Lamont Middleton over those other two guys any day of the week.
BTW I think Marvin Clark can fill that role next year.

If you did not appreciate Anthony Glover's play then there is nothing that can be done for you. It is not purely a matter of sentiment in terms of appreciating a guy who played so hard and did so well despite giving up 6 inches and a ton of "athleticism" every night. It is that the guy did all of the things that need to be done to make your team better. Are there better players in the world? Sure. Would he start for UCLA? No, he wouldn't. But neither of those things have anything at all to do with the original point, which was Buck Nasty's indisputably true comment that a player like Anthony Glover would make this team immeasurably better.

If you somehow disagree with that, then you're entitled to your opinion. But it is not just an "unpopular" one, it is totally uninformed from a basketball standpoint. And I thought I had seen it all on this site. Silly me.

 

[we are sju]

Need to find an Anthony Glover type player. Guy was a beast down low.

You know this might be a unpopular stance but I do not have the same fond and fuzzy memories of Glover or Billy Singleton that most on here have. I think both those guys, though solid hard working players might have led the nation in getting their shots thrown back at them. Singleton had to pump fake 50 times to get a shot off.

For undersized power forwards give me Ty Grant and Lamont Middleton over those other two guys any day of the week.
BTW I think Marvin Clark can fill that role next year.

If you did not appreciate Anthony Glover's play then there is nothing that can be done for you. It is not purely a matter of sentiment in terms of appreciating a guy who played so hard and did so well despite giving up 6 inches and a ton of "athleticism" every night. It is that the guy did all of the things that need to be done to make your team better. Are there better players in the world? Sure. Would he start for UCLA? No, he wouldn't. But neither of those things have anything at all to do with the original point, which was Buck Nasty's indisputably true comment that a player like Anthony Glover would make this team immeasurably better.

If you somehow disagree with that, then you're entitled to your opinion. But it is not just an "unpopular" one, it is totally uninformed from a basketball standpoint. And I thought I had seen it all on this site. Silly me.

Give me Walter Berry, you can have Glover and Singleton. My team will be better. To each his own some people like fat girls some like models. Role players are fine but when your team is bad I don't wish we had role players. That is my point. Well that and no as a kid and then a 20 something I did not enjoy watching either guy. Nothing personal. T y Grant was a role player and so was Middleton. I just thought they were better but for some reason no one waxes poetic about them?

 

[we are sju]

Senior Year
Singleton 6.8 / 4.7 / 40%/ 71% Lost in 1st round NCAA
Middleton 12.2 / 6.2 / 53% / 69% Lost in 2nd round NCAA
Grant 10.5 / 8.6 / 59% / 59% Lost in Elite 8 played with broken hand in tourney.
Glover 10.3 / 5.6 / 46% / 69% Won NIT

Look at FG% for each guy. Thus the getting blocked thing.

 

[Ray Morgan]

If any of the names mentioned, with the exception of Berry and GJ, started the season on this team, posters would be bitching about them. Why? Because we would still be losing. Everyone would be begging for Mullin to play that kid Yakwe, who looked so good as a freshman. This team is so undersized, and so soft, that only a handful of front court players I have seen who played here would be free from criticism, and would have resulted in multiple wins. Mel Davis, Sonny Dove, George Johnson, and maybe a few others would probably put us in the top 4 or 5 in the conference. Maybe Billy Paultz in his final season.

So all the staff needs to do is sign a player as good as one of them, or 2 front court players that add up to one of them. Nothing on recruiting central through 2018 is all that encouraging. Looking back at our last elite 8 team, they did not have a big front line. So it's not necessarily the size of the dog as much as the fight in them. Then again, our undoing against Ohio State was Ken Johnson, who dominated our front court. So a little more size and maybe that team wins it all. And if the staff doesn't find those bigs soon, we may be referring to the Barkley-Artest team as our last elite 8 team for many, many years.

 

[fun]

Give me Walter Berry, you can have Glover and Singleton. My team will be better. To each his own some people like fat girls some like models. Role players are fine but when your team is bad I don't wish we had role players. That is my point. Well that and no as a kid and then a 20 something I did not enjoy watching either guy. Nothing personal. T y Grant was a role player and so was Middleton. I just thought they were better but for some reason no one waxes poetic about them?

No one's saying Glover was better than Walter Berry: there was only one Walter Berry and he was better than everyone. People was poetic about Singleton because he was a high school AA who reinvented himself after a catastrophic injury. People wax poetic about Glover because his effort and strength overcame his height. People wax poetic about Grant all the time. Sure, Lamont you dummy Middleton is something of a forgotten man, but so is Mitch Foster, and he'd help too. The fact is that any of these guys would help. Not only do they have skills and size that our bigs lack but their presence would allow our young bigs to develop normally, as opposed to being thrown to the wolves.

 

[we are sju]

Give me Walter Berry, you can have Glover and Singleton. My team will be better. To each his own some people like fat girls some like models. Role players are fine but when your team is bad I don't wish we had role players. That is my point. Well that and no as a kid and then a 20 something I did not enjoy watching either guy. Nothing personal. T y Grant was a role player and so was Middleton. I just thought they were better but for some reason no one waxes poetic about them?

No one's saying Glover was better than Walter Berry: there was only one Walter Berry and he was better than everyone. People was poetic about Singleton because he was a high school AA who reinvented himself after a catastrophic injury. People wax poetic about Glover because his effort and strength overcame his height. People wax poetic about Grant all the time. Sure, Lamont you dummy Middleton is something of a forgotten man, but so is Mitch Foster, and he'd help too. The fact is that any of these guys would help. Not only do they have skills and size that our bigs lack but their presence would allow our young bigs to develop normally, as opposed to being thrown to the wolves.

Anyone would help. But as the op was hoping for a Glover type I was just pointing out I think we need something a little better. Than I wondered aloud why BS and AG are mentioned from time to time before other guys I thought were better. Again when all those guys were playing we were generally pretty good so there were better players around that I enjoyed more.
I don't dislike either guy. In fact in the history of the program there were only really two players who I couldn't stand to watch.

 

[fun]

Give me Walter Berry, you can have Glover and Singleton. My team will be better. To each his own some people like fat girls some like models. Role players are fine but when your team is bad I don't wish we had role players. That is my point. Well that and no as a kid and then a 20 something I did not enjoy watching either guy. Nothing personal. T y Grant was a role player and so was Middleton. I just thought they were better but for some reason no one waxes poetic about them?

No one's saying Glover was better than Walter Berry: there was only one Walter Berry and he was better than everyone. People was poetic about Singleton because he was a high school AA who reinvented himself after a catastrophic injury. People wax poetic about Glover because his effort and strength overcame his height. People wax poetic about Grant all the time. Sure, Lamont you dummy Middleton is something of a forgotten man, but so is Mitch Foster, and he'd help too. The fact is that any of these guys would help. Not only do they have skills and size that our bigs lack but their presence would allow our young bigs to develop normally, as opposed to being thrown to the wolves.

Anyone would help. But as the op was hoping for a Glover type I was just pointing out I think we need something a little better. Than I wondered aloud why BS and AG are mentioned from time to time before other guys I thought were better. Again when all those guys were playing we were generally pretty good so there were better players around that I enjoyed more.
I don't dislike either guy. In fact in the history of the program there were only really two players who I couldn't stand to watch.

Geno and Larry Wright?

 

[we are sju]

Give me Walter Berry, you can have Glover and Singleton. My team will be better. To each his own some people like fat girls some like models. Role players are fine but when your team is bad I don't wish we had role players. That is my point. Well that and no as a kid and then a 20 something I did not enjoy watching either guy. Nothing personal. T y Grant was a role player and so was Middleton. I just thought they were better but for some reason no one waxes poetic about them?

No one's saying Glover was better than Walter Berry: there was only one Walter Berry and he was better than everyone. People was poetic about Singleton because he was a high school AA who reinvented himself after a catastrophic injury. People wax poetic about Glover because his effort and strength overcame his height. People wax poetic about Grant all the time. Sure, Lamont you dummy Middleton is something of a forgotten man, but so is Mitch Foster, and he'd help too. The fact is that any of these guys would help. Not only do they have skills and size that our bigs lack but their presence would allow our young bigs to develop normally, as opposed to being thrown to the wolves.

Anyone would help. But as the op was hoping for a Glover type I was just pointing out I think we need something a little better. Than I wondered aloud why BS and AG are mentioned from time to time before other guys I thought were better. Again when all those guys were playing we were generally pretty good so there were better players around that I enjoyed more.
I don't dislike either guy. In fact in the history of the program there were only really two players who I couldn't stand to watch.

Geno and Larry Wright?

Half right. Though if I were to make a list of guys I didn't like pretty sure all of them played for the same guy.

 

[fuchsia]

Need to find an Anthony Glover type player. Guy was a beast down low.

You know this might be a unpopular stance but I do not have the same fond and fuzzy memories of Glover or Billy Singleton that most on here have. I think both those guys, though solid hard working players might have led the nation in getting their shots thrown back at them. Singleton had to pump fake 50 times to get a shot off.

For undersized power forwards give me Ty Grant and Lamont Middleton over those other two guys any day of the week.
BTW I think Marvin Clark can fill that role next year.

If you did not appreciate Anthony Glover's play then there is nothing that can be done for you. It is not purely a matter of sentiment in terms of appreciating a guy who played so hard and did so well despite giving up 6 inches and a ton of "athleticism" every night. It is that the guy did all of the things that need to be done to make your team better. Are there better players in the world? Sure. Would he start for UCLA? No, he wouldn't. But neither of those things have anything at all to do with the original point, which was Buck Nasty's indisputably true comment that a player like Anthony Glover would make this team immeasurably better.

If you somehow disagree with that, then you're entitled to your opinion. But it is not just an "unpopular" one, it is totally uninformed from a basketball standpoint. And I thought I had seen it all on this site. Silly me.

The starting center for the 1964 UCLA NCAA championship team was 6'5" Fred Slaughter whose game was much like AG's.

 

[monte]

Need to find an Anthony Glover type player. Guy was a beast down low.

You know this might be a unpopular stance but I do not have the same fond and fuzzy memories of Glover or Billy Singleton that most on here have. I think both those guys, though solid hard working players might have led the nation in getting their shots thrown back at them. Singleton had to pump fake 50 times to get a shot off.

For undersized power forwards give me Ty Grant and Lamont Middleton over those other two guys any day of the week.
BTW I think Marvin Clark can fill that role next year.

If you did not appreciate Anthony Glover's play then there is nothing that can be done for you. It is not purely a matter of sentiment in terms of appreciating a guy who played so hard and did so well despite giving up 6 inches and a ton of "athleticism" every night. It is that the guy did all of the things that need to be done to make your team better. Are there better players in the world? Sure. Would he start for UCLA? No, he wouldn't. But neither of those things have anything at all to do with the original point, which was Buck Nasty's indisputably true comment that a player like Anthony Glover would make this team immeasurably better.

If you somehow disagree with that, then you're entitled to your opinion. But it is not just an "unpopular" one, it is totally uninformed from a basketball standpoint. And I thought I had seen it all on this site. Silly me.

The starting center for the 1964 UCLA NCAA championship team was 6'5" Fred Slaughter whose game was much like AG's.

When you're born with a last name of Slaughter, you're pretty much destined to be a tough SOB.