Our blessing is our curse

[sirvoo]

We operate under the assumption that recruits want to come here because you get to "play at the garden", the Mecca of basketball. A lot of ppl scratch their heads at how anyone would want to pass that up. In the past almost decade now its been more of a deterrent than a benefit.

Of course most of us are gonna try to get to the games in queens or manhattan on a fairly consistent basis. But in a town like New York, if you're only moderately relavent, people are gonna find something better to do. That's just the way it is. You think ppl in Syracuse, Morgantown, Milwaukee, or even Cincinnati (Lawrence) have anything better to do? Heck no. The easiest way to fix that is to get off to a hot start in 2013-14 season. The crowd today was most excited when the 5th grade CYO ballers were draining long 3's, we need to change this moving forward.

 

[DieHard Johnny]

I agree its a curse when u are not a top team bec. Pitt & scuse should be playin us on campus where we play them. in the 80s st.j's owned the city mullin-berry - jax & Lou were loved & adored
The Garden rocked n was a sea of RED I was a student from 83-87 n lived those glory yrs
We won 2 BigEast titles made the final4 & should have made at least another except Berry left early
the knicks had Bernard King a should be hof player that was it
NYcity is about winning being competitive is not good enough too much to do instead
Lavin needs to get a great point guard & play more big games on campus to get the home court edge back
Pitt,rutg & Marq should have been at CA We were 6.5pt dogs ag pitt cause they win alot at msg even vegas knew it that spread is even if at CA

 

[Las Vegan]

The problem with playing additional games on campus is we are stuck with a 5600 capacity, cramped, uncomfortable sweatbox, with few amenities. Had the administration torn down Alumni Hall and built a modern, comfortable 7500 capacity venue, we could have played the majority of games there, using the garden only when crowds of 12-20 thousand could be anticipated. Had Father Harrington not alienated the alum, Riley, who was reportedly going to donate 20 million toward athletics, we might have been able to have had Taffner and a new arena. When I see the campus arenas that schools such as; St. Louis, Xavier. Dayton, Butler and Richmond are playing their games in, it is unacceptable that STJ, with all the Big East money, is forced to play in a decidedly inferior venue.

 

[austour]

The problem with playing additional games on campus is we are stuck with a 5600 capacity, cramped, uncomfortable sweatbox, with few amenities. Had the administration torn down Alumni Hall and built a modern, comfortable 7500 capacity venue, we could have played the majority of games there, using the garden only when crowds of 12-20 thousand could be anticipated. Had Father Harrington not alienated the alum, Riley, who was reportedly going to donate 20 million toward athletics, we might have been able to have had Taffner and a new arena. When I see the campus arenas that schools such as; St. Louis, Xavier. Dayton, Butler and Richmond are playing their games in, it is unacceptable that STJ, with all the Big East money, is forced to play in a decidedly inferior venue.

Riley committed $20 mill that was earmarked for the Field House which was a $16 mill project. and which was picked up by the Taffners after Riley took his Doh-boy and went crying home. Nothing was ever committed for anything more than minor renovations to Carnesecca which is what I guess the other $4 mill was for, though the final budget for the recent renovations actually ended up at $5million.

 

[STJ11Redmen]

The problem with playing additional games on campus is we are stuck with a 5600 capacity, cramped, uncomfortable sweatbox, with few amenities. Had the administration torn down Alumni Hall and built a modern, comfortable 7500 capacity venue, we could have played the majority of games there, using the garden only when crowds of 12-20 thousand could be anticipated. Had Father Harrington not alienated the alum, Riley, who was reportedly going to donate 20 million toward athletics, we might have been able to have had Taffner and a new arena. When I see the campus arenas that schools such as; St. Louis, Xavier. Dayton, Butler and Richmond are playing their games in, it is unacceptable that STJ, with all the Big East money, is forced to play in a decidedly inferior venue.

We don't need a big on-campus venue because we have Madison Square Garden at our disposal. The teams you mentioned don't play their games at big arenas let alone the best arena in the world. Do you see Marquette, DePaul, Providence, Seton Hall, Georgetown or Villanova with nice on-campus facilities? Carnsecca is definitely the nicest campus gym out of all of the schools in the conference and with MSG we are the ones who need a nice campus gym the least.

 

[LINY89]

The problem with playing additional games on campus is we are stuck with a 5600 capacity, cramped, uncomfortable sweatbox, with few amenities. Had the administration torn down Alumni Hall and built a modern, comfortable 7500 capacity venue, we could have played the majority of games there, using the garden only when crowds of 12-20 thousand could be anticipated. Had Father Harrington not alienated the alum, Riley, who was reportedly going to donate 20 million toward athletics, we might have been able to have had Taffner and a new arena. When I see the campus arenas that schools such as; St. Louis, Xavier. Dayton, Butler and Richmond are playing their games in, it is unacceptable that STJ, with all the Big East money, is forced to play in a decidedly inferior venue.

We don't need a big on-campus venue because we have Madison Square Garden at our disposal. The teams you mentioned don't play their games at big arenas let alone the best arena in the world. Do you see Marquette, DePaul, Providence, Seton Hall, Georgetown or Villanova with nice on-campus facilities? Carnsecca is definitely the nicest campus gym out of all of the schools in the conference and with MSG we are the ones who need a nice campus gym the least.

I'll have what he's smoking. Really? The best on campus arena in the Big East? LOL

This is Nova's new Pavillion they are getting...

 

[STJ11Redmen]

I'll have what he's smoking. Really? The best on campus arena in the Big East? LOL

This is Nova's new Pavillion they are getting...

I meant conference as in the Catholic 7 schools who primarily play their games off campus. Currently Carnsecca is nicer than the Pavilion, the Carnsecca models looked pretty nice too before it was re-built. It's hard to turn a dump into a masterpiece.

 

[beast of the east]

I'll have what he's smoking. Really? The best on campus arena in the Big East? LOL

This is Nova's new Pavillion they are getting...

I meant conference as in the Catholic 7 schools who primarily play their games off campus. Currently Carnsecca is nicer than the Pavilion, the Carnsecca models looked pretty nice too before it was re-built. It's hard to turn a dump into a masterpiece.

I've been in the Pavillion many times. First off, from the looks of the rendering, it appears to be a remake of the old Pavillion. The old Pavillion often sells out, so that is reason number one for a new Pavillion. Second is Villanova Alumni, despite being 1/3 our size, contribute an equal amount to the school as SJU alumni. The old Pavillion isn't very nice, but it hasn't stopped fans from coming to games.

Conceptually the remake looks similar to CA, with seatbacks on one side, and bleachers on the other. The only improvement over CA appears to be luxury boxes at the upper levels. We obviously couldn't do that except maybe behind the backboards because of a low ceiling.

 

[LINY89]

I'll have what he's smoking. Really? The best on campus arena in the Big East? LOL

This is Nova's new Pavillion they are getting...

I meant conference as in the Catholic 7 schools who primarily play their games off campus. Currently Carnsecca is nicer than the Pavilion, the Carnsecca models looked pretty nice too before it was re-built. It's hard to turn a dump into a masterpiece.

I've been in the Pavillion many times. First off, from the looks of the rendering, it appears to be a remake of the old Pavillion. The old Pavillion often sells out, so that is reason number one for a new Pavillion. Second is Villanova Alumni, despite being 1/3 our size, contribute an equal amount to the school as SJU alumni. The old Pavillion isn't very nice, but it hasn't stopped fans from coming to games.

Conceptually the remake looks similar to CA, with seatbacks on one side, and bleachers on the other. The only improvement over CA appears to be luxury boxes at the upper levels. We obviously couldn't do that except maybe behind the backboards because of a low ceiling.

And a real scoreboard and video screen that shows replays. And a ceiling that doesn't look like the inside of home depot or some other industrial place. And a cleaner looking court. And true dome seating. And a real student section. If we played in the MAAC I'd probably deal with CA, but as a Big East team with history being known for one sport specifically, I have no idea how we cannot invest most in that kind of stuff.

 

[beast of the east]

I'll have what he's smoking. Really? The best on campus arena in the Big East? LOL

This is Nova's new Pavillion they are getting...

I meant conference as in the Catholic 7 schools who primarily play their games off campus. Currently Carnsecca is nicer than the Pavilion, the Carnsecca models looked pretty nice too before it was re-built. It's hard to turn a dump into a masterpiece.

I've been in the Pavillion many times. First off, from the looks of the rendering, it appears to be a remake of the old Pavillion. The old Pavillion often sells out, so that is reason number one for a new Pavillion. Second is Villanova Alumni, despite being 1/3 our size, contribute an equal amount to the school as SJU alumni. The old Pavillion isn't very nice, but it hasn't stopped fans from coming to games.

Conceptually the remake looks similar to CA, with seatbacks on one side, and bleachers on the other. The only improvement over CA appears to be luxury boxes at the upper levels. We obviously couldn't do that except maybe behind the backboards because of a low ceiling.

And a real scoreboard and video screen that shows replays. And a ceiling that doesn't look like the inside of home depot or some other industrial place. And a cleaner looking court. And true dome seating. And a real student section. If we played in the MAAC I'd probably deal with CA, but as a Big East team with history being known for one sport specifically, I have no idea how we cannot invest most in that kind of stuff.

Joe, the ceiling is how I can see its the old Pavillion with a remake. The ceiling actually looks very 60's-ish, kind of space-age design, and I think they are cleaning it up. If it makes you feel better the Pavillion was called the DuPont Pavillion after the family owned Dupon Chemical company. The only problem was that the heir to the fortune was a bit of a wrestling freak and perverse defiant, and murdered some guy in a brutal sadistic way. At least we don't have that in CA - that's a pretty safe bet.

 

[LINY89]

If murder is what it takes to get an on campus arena like that in Queens, then we have some dirty work to do. I kid I kid, but really CA sucks. It's one of those places you want to embrace so bad, but it doesn't have that lovable, comfortable, homey quality to it. I love the display inside the lobby and even the metal lettering outside...it's just the court and the seats I don't like.

 

[STJ11Redmen]

And a real scoreboard and video screen that shows replays. And a ceiling that doesn't look like the inside of home depot or some other industrial place. And a cleaner looking court. And true dome seating. And a real student section. If we played in the MAAC I'd probably deal with CA, but as a Big East team with history being known for one sport specifically, I have no idea how we cannot invest most in that kind of stuff.

First, that is not a confirmed design for Nova. It is a proposal that does not currently have funding. Second, our scoreboard at CA has replay capabilities, why they don't show replays? I don't know but how can you be so sure Nova's will? With regards to the home depot ceiling, their ceiling looks like the top of a jester hat. You also say that model has a cleaner court than ours. Just yesterday you were saying you'd prefer if we had a court with some sort of design on it like Oregon. Next you say that arena has "dome seating." I don't even know what dome seating means. We play our big games and half our games overall at freaking Madison Square Garden, what more do you want?

The school needs money to build nice things. Why don't you put your money where your mouth is and show up to a game every once in a while instead of running up an electricity bill that probably equals the price of a ticket by posting a hundred posts of nonsense during every game you watch on TV.

 

[beast of the east]

If murder is what it takes to get an on campus arena like that in Queens, then we have some dirty work to do. I kid I kid, but really CA sucks. It's one of those places you want to embrace so bad, but it doesn't have that lovable, comfortable, homey quality to it. I love the display inside the lobby and even the metal lettering outside...it's just the court and the seats I don't like.

http://www.cnn.com/US/9702/25/dupont.verdict/reax.html

 

[LINY89]

Haha oops I meant bowl seating. That one actually made me laugh that I typed "dome" seating lol...I am not certain Nova's will have replay but I'd bet almost anything it will because of their program's status. Clean doesn't mean blank, it just means visually appealing IMO. We can easily have a design like a big basketball at mid court with a giant SJ inside of it with the NYC skyline in black on the top edge rounded around the curve of the ball...something creative is my point.

 

[Las Vegan]

The problem with playing additional games on campus is we are stuck with a 5600 capacity, cramped, uncomfortable sweatbox, with few amenities. Had the administration torn down Alumni Hall and built a modern, comfortable 7500 capacity venue, we could have played the majority of games there, using the garden only when crowds of 12-20 thousand could be anticipated. Had Father Harrington not alienated the alum, Riley, who was reportedly going to donate 20 million toward athletics, we might have been able to have had Taffner and a new arena. When I see the campus arenas that schools such as; St. Louis, Xavier. Dayton, Butler and Richmond are playing their games in, it is unacceptable that STJ, with all the Big East money, is forced to play in a decidedly inferior venue.

Riley committed $20 mill that was earmarked for the Field House which was a $16 mill project. and which was picked up by the Taffners after Riley took his Doh-boy and went crying home. Nothing was ever committed for anything more than minor renovations to Carnesecca which is what I guess the other $4 mill was for, though the final budget for the recent renovations actually ended up at $5million.

You are correct that Riley's donation was contingent upon the hiring of Doherty. I believe that Doherty was the choice of the selection commitee. We ended up with Norm and no donation. As far as not getting a new arena, if both Taffner and Riley had donated, we might have been able to replace, rather than try to rehab, a 50 year old structure.

 

[beast of the east]

The problem with playing additional games on campus is we are stuck with a 5600 capacity, cramped, uncomfortable sweatbox, with few amenities. Had the administration torn down Alumni Hall and built a modern, comfortable 7500 capacity venue, we could have played the majority of games there, using the garden only when crowds of 12-20 thousand could be anticipated. Had Father Harrington not alienated the alum, Riley, who was reportedly going to donate 20 million toward athletics, we might have been able to have had Taffner and a new arena. When I see the campus arenas that schools such as; St. Louis, Xavier. Dayton, Butler and Richmond are playing their games in, it is unacceptable that STJ, with all the Big East money, is forced to play in a decidedly inferior venue.

Riley committed $20 mill that was earmarked for the Field House which was a $16 mill project. and which was picked up by the Taffners after Riley took his Doh-boy and went crying home. Nothing was ever committed for anything more than minor renovations to Carnesecca which is what I guess the other $4 mill was for, though the final budget for the recent renovations actually ended up at $5million.

You are correct that Riley's donation was contingent upon the hiring of Doherty. I believe that Doherty was the choice of the selection commitee. We ended up with Norm and no donation. As far as not getting a new arena, if both Taffner and Riley had donated, we might have been able to replace, rather than try to rehab, a 50 year old structure.

you are dead wrong that Riley's pledge had any contingencies to it. He pledged a large sum - I believe the number was $5 million, for a fieldhouse with practice facilities and student use facilities. He was then made head of the search committee, and felt that he did his job as stated, only to have FH embarrass him by hiring someone else. So he justifiably got angry, and pulled his pledge.

Actually, both Taffner and Riley donated millions to the University. I wish we'd stop ripping the guy on this board. Even after pulling his pledge, he still is one of our most generous donors in SJU history. Besides donating millions, he also estbalished intenrships and jobs for SJU students at Goldman Sachs. And no, he's not a friend of mine.

What we have at St. Johns is one of the worst alumni bases in the country in terms of percentgae of alumni who donate to the University. More than 80% of our alumni do not donate, and that number was under 4% when FH arrived on campus. Now imagine the type of arena we could build if even 60% of our alumni donated regularly. It's always easy to make excuses why you personally can't and why someone else should. Not a personal shot at you, but is a shot at all alumni who complain about our facilities yet never have donated a dime. And, no, buying season tickets isn't a donation - we are receiving something in return (tickets) for sending the school money. That doesn't build arenas - generous alumni - all of us - do.

 

[Las Vegan]

The problem with playing additional games on campus is we are stuck with a 5600 capacity, cramped, uncomfortable sweatbox, with few amenities. Had the administration torn down Alumni Hall and built a modern, comfortable 7500 capacity venue, we could have played the majority of games there, using the garden only when crowds of 12-20 thousand could be anticipated. Had Father Harrington not alienated the alum, Riley, who was reportedly going to donate 20 million toward athletics, we might have been able to have had Taffner and a new arena. When I see the campus arenas that schools such as; St. Louis, Xavier. Dayton, Butler and Richmond are playing their games in, it is unacceptable that STJ, with all the Big East money, is forced to play in a decidedly inferior venue.

We don't need a big on-campus venue because we have Madison Square Garden at our disposal. The teams you mentioned don't play their games at big arenas let alone the best arena in the world. Do you see Marquette, DePaul, Providence, Seton Hall, Georgetown or Villanova with nice on-campus facilities? Carnsecca is definitely the nicest campus gym out of all of the schools in the conference and with MSG we are the ones who need a nice campus gym the least.

No, we don't need a big venue. That's why I suggested 7500 capacity. It would make more sense to play on campus, show a filled arena, with a real student section, rather than a playing at msg when it's two-thirds empty and a few rows of students, and losing money each time. The garden is there for the big games.
The reason G'town, Seton Hall, DePaul and Providence play at a city arena is due to not having any room, on campus, to build one. DePaul has been exploring the feasibility for building an arena near their campus. Butler could play where the Pacers play, but prefer their own Hinkle Fieldhouse. St. Louis, Xavier, Richmond, etc all have modern large municipal arenas they could use, but prefer their modern, ten thousand capacity campus arenas. Look, the garden is great when we are a top twenty team, and have a big time opponent, but it doesn't make sense, financially or artistically, to play there in front of 7-8000 quiet attendees.

 

[redmen2014champs]

The problem with playing additional games on campus is we are stuck with a 5600 capacity, cramped, uncomfortable sweatbox, with few amenities. Had the administration torn down Alumni Hall and built a modern, comfortable 7500 capacity venue, we could have played the majority of games there, using the garden only when crowds of 12-20 thousand could be anticipated. Had Father Harrington not alienated the alum, Riley, who was reportedly going to donate 20 million toward athletics, we might have been able to have had Taffner and a new arena. When I see the campus arenas that schools such as; St. Louis, Xavier. Dayton, Butler and Richmond are playing their games in, it is unacceptable that STJ, with all the Big East money, is forced to play in a decidedly inferior venue.

Riley committed $20 mill that was earmarked for the Field House which was a $16 mill project. and which was picked up by the Taffners after Riley took his Doh-boy and went crying home. Nothing was ever committed for anything more than minor renovations to Carnesecca which is what I guess the other $4 mill was for, though the final budget for the recent renovations actually ended up at $5million.

You are correct that Riley's donation was contingent upon the hiring of Doherty. I believe that Doherty was the choice of the selection commitee. We ended up with Norm and no donation. As far as not getting a new arena, if both Taffner and Riley had donated, we might have been able to replace, rather than try to rehab, a 50 year old structure.

you are dead wrong that Riley's pledge had any contingencies to it. He pledged a large sum - I believe the number was $5 million, for a fieldhouse with practice facilities and student use facilities. He was then made head of the search committee, and felt that he did his job as stated, only to have FH embarrass him by hiring someone else. So he justifiably got angry, and pulled his pledge.

Actually, both Taffner and Riley donated millions to the University. I wish we'd stop ripping the guy on this board. Even after pulling his pledge, he still is one of our most generous donors in SJU history. Besides donating millions, he also estbalished intenrships and jobs for SJU students at Goldman Sachs. And no, he's not a friend of mine.

What we have at St. Johns is one of the worst alumni bases in the country in terms of percentgae of alumni who donate to the University. More than 80% of our alumni do not donate, and that number was under 4% when FH arrived on campus. Now imagine the type of arena we could build if even 60% of our alumni donated regularly. It's always easy to make excuses why you personally can't and why someone else should. Not a personal shot at you, but is a shot at all alumni who complain about our facilities yet never have donated a dime. And, no, buying season tickets isn't a donation - we are receiving something in return (tickets) for sending the school money. That doesn't build arenas - generous alumni - all of us - do.

Not really familiar with the situation but can't blame the guy for being upset about the hiring of Norm Roberts who couldn't even win at Queens College. I'm sure he's glad now that the money didn't just get wasted in Chang's pockets.

 

[Las Vegan]

The problem with playing additional games on campus is we are stuck with a 5600 capacity, cramped, uncomfortable sweatbox, with few amenities. Had the administration torn down Alumni Hall and built a modern, comfortable 7500 capacity venue, we could have played the majority of games there, using the garden only when crowds of 12-20 thousand could be anticipated. Had Father Harrington not alienated the alum, Riley, who was reportedly going to donate 20 million toward athletics, we might have been able to have had Taffner and a new arena. When I see the campus arenas that schools such as; St. Louis, Xavier. Dayton, Butler and Richmond are playing their games in, it is unacceptable that STJ, with all the Big East money, is forced to play in a decidedly inferior venue.

Riley committed $20 mill that was earmarked for the Field House which was a $16 mill project. and which was picked up by the Taffners after Riley took his Doh-boy and went crying home. Nothing was ever committed for anything more than minor renovations to Carnesecca which is what I guess the other $4 mill was for, though the final budget for the recent renovations actually ended up at $5million.

You are correct that Riley's donation was contingent upon the hiring of Doherty. I believe that Doherty was the choice of the selection commitee. We ended up with Norm and no donation. As far as not getting a new arena, if both Taffner and Riley had donated, we might have been able to replace, rather than try to rehab, a 50 year old structure.

you are dead wrong that Riley's pledge had any contingencies to it. He pledged a large sum - I believe the number was $5 million, for a fieldhouse with practice facilities and student use facilities. He was then made head of the search committee, and felt that he did his job as stated, only to have FH embarrass him by hiring someone else. So he justifiably got angry, and pulled his pledge.

Actually, both Taffner and Riley donated millions to the University. I wish we'd stop ripping the guy on this board. Even after pulling his pledge, he still is one of our most generous donors in SJU history. Besides donating millions, he also estbalished intenrships and jobs for SJU students at Goldman Sachs. And no, he's not a friend of mine.

What we have at St. Johns is one of the worst alumni bases in the country in terms of percentgae of alumni who donate to the University. More than 80% of our alumni do not donate, and that number was under 4% when FH arrived on campus. Now imagine the type of arena we could build if even 60% of our alumni donated regularly. It's always easy to make excuses why you personally can't and why someone else should. Not a personal shot at you, but is a shot at all alumni who complain about our facilities yet never have donated a dime. And, no, buying season tickets isn't a donation - we are receiving something in return (tickets) for sending the school money. That doesn't build arenas - generous alumni - all of us - do.

First, no one is ripping Riley or any other donor. Also, Riley and Doherty were friends. Riley headed up the commitee that chose Doherty, although I recall one member preferred Bobby Gonzalez. In any event. Harrington and Louie interviewed Roberts and hired him, which completely undermined the search group and Riley, so the pledge withdrawal was directly related to Doherty not getting the position. Terrible way of conducting business. My initial comment came from watching games recently played at Butler, Richmond, St. Louis and Xavier, who will all be joining our new conference, and thinking how great the atmosphere looked on television.
I agree the donations from alums are very low, but the fault shouldn't be all on them. They obviously don't feel much affiliation with their alma mater, and some of the blame for that falls on the school.

 

[austour]

I understand that Riley gave lots of money and wanted to be some shwingy booster. But if you're gonna extort the school for influence you should be able to bring something better to the table than your ex-swimming pupil, the Pillsbury Doh-boy.