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[quote="SJUFAN2" post=379210][quote="Logen" post=379116]It is estimated that upwards of 30,000 people die in the US alone annually from the flu. Estimates are in the hundreds of thousands world-wide. I am not seeking to discount the potential seriousness, just trying to offer a bit of perspective.[/quote]

That's correct. That turns about to be 0.001% of people that get infected. So let's put that into perspective
[URL]https://www.nydailynews.com/ne...0229-ljovjday4nf4pku2jpog4crzvm-story.html#nt[/URL]=oft-Triple%20Chain~Recommender~~content_id-duplicate-duplicate~~1~yes-art~automated~automatedpage
According to the Daily News, 83,000+ cases worldwide that we know about, 2800+ deaths. That's 0.034% of known cases ending up dead.
+ We don't know how it spreads. But it seems to spread easily so far.
+ We don't have a vaccine for it
+ We don't even have accurate data from its source of origin: China.

Fact is that we don't know what we don't know yet, but if the same number of people in this country catch this as catch the flu, then the math gets pretty scary pretty fast.

1 in 1000 dies from the flu. 30,000 deaths a year. 30,000 x 1,000 = 30 million flu cases a year.
3.4 people die for every 100 infected with the Corona-virus (per daily news). 30 Million Corona-virus cases in this country would result in 1,020,000 deaths if those stats hold. That ratio could go down, but it's trending up. A week ago it was being reported as being between 2% and 3%.

I think we are well past the point of people being able to ignore this and the threat it represents.
I know we are MILES past the point we should still be using the flu as a reason not to be concerned.[/quote]

And I guess my posting “I am not seeking to discount the potential seriousness” conveys to you a lack of concern? I am almost 70 years old and have lived through countless doomsday scenarios and unavoidable “end of the world as we know it“ predictions fueled by a media only interested in selling their ”dam soap” as a wise man said years ago. From impending nuclear holocausts to the planet freezing and then burning up to diseases that are going to purge mankind. I guess coronavirus is going to do what SARS and Ebola couldn’t. Maybe it will, it’s real impact is still very much unknown and I am not making light of what COULD BE a very real horror. I was just trying to offer some common sense perspective until FACTS are available, but feel free to panic.
Since information out of China is suspect to say the least, and even their reaction to treating all “patients” has to be questioned given their human rights record, it is virtually impossible to get an accurate mortality rate figure at this time. Compounding that analysis is Iran appears to also have a high occurrence and that is another black hole when it comes to anything resembling transparency, not to mention that history tells us they also could very well be offering “selective” medical treatment to the infected.
Anyway, I would be very much interested to hear what you are doing to protect you and yours since we are MILES past the point of not being concerned; breathing masks, hand washing, isolation?
 
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[quote="Logen" post=379424] And I guess my posting “I am not seeking to discount the potential seriousness” conveys to you a lack of concern? [/quote] No. I was with you until then. It was the part where you blew past that disclaimer to throw out a stat about the flu to put this in "perspective" that you lost me. Now if your point was that 30k flu deaths is a hell of alot and we should be more concerned about this since it seems to kill at a much higher rate, then I apologize. I completely misunderstood your point. Feel free to clarify if that's the case. If not, then carry on.

[quote="Logen" post=379424] I am almost 70 years old and have lived through countless doomsday scenarios and unavoidable “end of the world as we know it“ predictions fueled by a media only interested in selling their ”dam soap” as a wise man said years ago. From impending nuclear holocausts to the planet freezing and then burning up to diseases that are going to purge mankind.[/quote]

Stop. Predictions about an event possibly happening aren't the same thing as dealing with a disease in real time. One is fantasy, the other is reality. At your age I'd expect you to know the difference.

[quote="Logen" post=379424] I guess coronavirus is going to do what SARS and Ebola couldn’t. Maybe it will, it’s real impact is still very much unknown and I am not making light of what COULD BE a very real horror. [/quote] Not making light? That first sentence was serious?

[quote="Logen" post=379424] I was just trying to offer some common sense perspective until FACTS are available, but feel free to panic. [/quote]

Facts are available. Not all of them. Not nearly enough of them. But if you are going to wait until all the facts are in you are going to miss the opportunity to do something about this except watch.

Current fact is that the nations dealing with this have reported 83K cases and 2.8k fatalities. Maybe that ratio goes up, maybe it goes down. Who knows? But those are the figures we have, either disprove them or accept that those are what we have to make our decisions based upon. Just saying they might have been manipulated by bad actors and deciding not to do anything but wait for more facts comes off as a conspiracy theory with no factual support.

And who said people should panic? I'm just saying it's dangerous to tell people this is like the flu, and that people should be paying attention because current data says this is way worse than the flu. That's all. That's the message.

[quote="Logen" post=379424] Since information out of China is suspect to say the least, and even their reaction to treating all “patients” has to be questioned given their human rights record, it is virtually impossible to get an accurate mortality rate figure at this time.[/quote] By that logic we will never be able to provide an accurate mortality rate, so why bother? Heck, if we can't get an accurate figure then why do anything?

I mean it's not like China is going to become more credible overnight, are they? And clearly we aren't getting the whole picture there, but either you take what they are saying/reporting seriously or you write it off as nonsense.

You willing to bet millions of lives on this being some ploy by China to destabilize the west by creating a panic? I'm not. But my dad didn't turn our basement into a bomb shelter and they didn't teach me in grade school that the best way to deal with a nuclear war was to "duck and cover" under my desk.

[quote="Logen" post=379424] Compounding that analysis is Iran appears to also have a high occurrence and that is another black hole when it comes to anything resembling transparency, not to mention that history tells us they also could very well be offering “selective” medical treatment to the infected. [/quote]

I'm not sure what you are suggesting here. Is seems like you are suggesting that Iran is inflating its fatality rate by selectively treating some patients and letting others die. That's a big leap considering that you just said that place is a black hole when it comes to letting out information.

[quote="Logen" post=379424]Anyway, I would be very much interested to hear what you are doing to protect you and yours since we are MILES past the point of not being concerned; breathing masks, hand washing, isolation? [/quote]
I'm not suggesting people do anything except stay INFORMED so they can make informed decisions for themselves and their loved ones. You want to wear a mask, or wash your hands 50 times a day, or go live in a log cabin in the woods until it's over....knock yourself out. Just make sure you get your flu shot before you unplug.
 
SJJUFAN2 wrote:
"I'm not suggesting people do anything except stay INFORMED so they can make informed decisions for themselves and their loved ones."
LMFAO!
I think you are suggesting a lot more than people stay "informed" by your point by point exhaustive retorts.
I don't think there is a single redmen fan here that doesn't have access to the latest information from American based sources. You have admitted not knowing anything more than anyone else here and yet you ridiculed people concerned about the flu. Well buddy boy there are only 100 reported cases of the CV and 1 death while the number of flu cases this season is 131,604, the highest since the state began keeping records in 1998. The previous record was the 2017-18 season with 128,892 recorded cases. Last week, 10,520 laboratory-confirmed cases of influenza have been reported and 1,454 people have been hospitalized with influenza. THUS, if you have not been vaccinated for the flu you could be one of the 1,454 people hospitalized. Finally Mr. Doomberg, this is 2020 and not 100 years ago. Development of a vaccine is being fast tracked and I don't think it will take years to figure this thing out. My advice is to wash your hands and stop picking your nose.
Meanwhile, make sure you use a condom because sexually transmitted infections hit a record high 2.4 million cases making it the fifth year in a row that cases of chlamydia, gonorrhea and syphilis have spiked, according to new numbers from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
 
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[quote="Class of 72" post=379461]SJJUFAN2 wrote:
"I'm not suggesting people do anything except stay INFORMED so they can make informed decisions for themselves and their loved ones."
LMFAO!
I think you are suggesting a lot more than people stay "informed" by your point by point exhaustive retorts.
I don't think there is a single redmen fan here that doesn't have access to the latest information from American based sources. You have admitted not knowing anything more than anyone else here and yet you ridiculed people concerned about the flu. Well buddy boy there are only 100 reported cases of the CV and 1 death while the number of flu cases this season is 131,604, the highest since the state began keeping records in 1998. The previous record was the 2017-18 season with 128,892 recorded cases. Last week, 10,520 laboratory-confirmed cases of influenza have been reported and 1,454 people have been hospitalized with influenza. THUS, if you have not been vaccinated for the flu you could be one of the 1,454 people hospitalized. Finally Mr. Doomberg, this is 2020 and not 100 years ago. Development of a vaccine is being fast tracked and I don't think it will take years to figure this thing out. My advice is to wash your hands and stop picking your nose.
Meanwhile, make sure you use a condom because sexually transmitted infections hit a record high 2.4 million cases making it the fifth year in a row that cases of chlamydia, gonorrhea and syphilis have spiked, according to new numbers from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.[/quote]

Wow. That's amazing. You managed to pull your head out of the sand and stuff it up your ass all in one move. Impressive.

 
[quote="SJUFAN2" post=379500][quote="Class of 72" post=379461]SJJUFAN2 wrote:
"I'm not suggesting people do anything except stay INFORMED so they can make informed decisions for themselves and their loved ones."
LMFAO!
I think you are suggesting a lot more than people stay "informed" by your point by point exhaustive retorts.
I don't think there is a single redmen fan here that doesn't have access to the latest information from American based sources. You have admitted not knowing anything more than anyone else here and yet you ridiculed people concerned about the flu. Well buddy boy there are only 100 reported cases of the CV and 1 death while the number of flu cases this season is 131,604, the highest since the state began keeping records in 1998. The previous record was the 2017-18 season with 128,892 recorded cases. Last week, 10,520 laboratory-confirmed cases of influenza have been reported and 1,454 people have been hospitalized with influenza. THUS, if you have not been vaccinated for the flu you could be one of the 1,454 people hospitalized. Finally Mr. Doomberg, this is 2020 and not 100 years ago. Development of a vaccine is being fast tracked and I don't think it will take years to figure this thing out. My advice is to wash your hands and stop picking your nose.
Meanwhile, make sure you use a condom because sexually transmitted infections hit a record high 2.4 million cases making it the fifth year in a row that cases of chlamydia, gonorrhea and syphilis have spiked, according to new numbers from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.[/quote]

Wow. That's amazing. You managed to pull your head out of the sand and stuff it up your ass all in one move. Impressive.

[/quote]

Thank you for the kind words Mr. Doomberg. I happen to have seen the John Oliver show and thought that it was funny. I would discuss the pandemic more with you but I am on line at Cosco buying 20 cases of water, vinyl gloves and 10 burka's for Mrs. 72 as they were out of surgical masks and N95 respirators.
I do want to leave you with one final piece of advice and that is buy some hot and sour soup which CNN just reported is what the residents of Wuhan have been eating which has caused the virus to level off there.
Just avoid the fcking bat soup since you seem to already be bat shit crazy.
Finally make St. John's basketball great again and vote redmen.com in November.
 
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Why are so many freaking out about Coronavirus? For a large majority, those who are infected have pretty much a typical flu and then recover. The media lost credibility long ago, but they are really causing alarm for no real reason.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=379939]Why are so many freaking out about Coronavirus? For a large majority, those who are infected have pretty much a typical flu and then recover. The media lost credibility long ago, but they are really causing alarm for no real reason.[/quote]

ughhh...yeah...it's the media's fault... "causing alarm for no real reason"... pinch:

[URL]https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/summary.html[/URL]
1- No vaccine for 12-24 months.
2- You can have it, and spread it for 2 weeks before you show symptoms.
3- about 30% seem to show sever symptoms with highest death rates among the elderly, those with diabetes, heart or respiratory issues and those with compromised immune systems.
4- Current global fatality rate according to the CDC is 3.4% or 34x more lethal than the seasonal flu.
5- China has 85 Million people under house quarantine.
6- Japan has closed all its schools for a month.
7- Italy has similar closures of colleges, schools, Museums, sports venues.
8- Major corporations are restricting global travel for their employees
9- Major corporation(s) like Microsoft in the Seattle area (our first outbreak) now telling people to work from home if possible for the rest of the month.

Yeah...not one real reason for concern because countries and fortune 500 corporations always make critical decisions and overreact without any reason at all...:whistle:
 
[quote="SJUFAN2" post=379947][quote="Mike Zaun" post=379939]Why are so many freaking out about Coronavirus? For a large majority, those who are infected have pretty much a typical flu and then recover. The media lost credibility long ago, but they are really causing alarm for no real reason.[/quote]

ughhh...yeah...it's the media's fault... "causing alarm for no real reason"... pinch:

[URL]https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/summary.html[/URL]
1- No vaccine for 12-24 months.
2- You can have it, and spread it for 2 weeks before you show symptoms.
3- about 30% seem to show sever symptoms with highest death rates among the elderly, those with diabetes, heart or respiratory issues and those with compromised immune systems.
4- Current global fatality rate according to the CDC is 3.4% or 34x more lethal than the seasonal flu.
5- China has 85 Million people under house quarantine.
6- Japan has closed all its schools for a month.
7- Italy has similar closures of colleges, schools, Museums, sports venues.
8- Major corporations are restricting global travel for their employees
9- Major corporation(s) like Microsoft in the Seattle area (our first outbreak) now telling people to work from home if possible for the rest of the month.

Yeah...not one real reason for concern because countries and fortune 500 corporations always make critical decisions and overreact without any reason at all...:whistle:[/quote]

30% of cases are severe? I have not heard that anywhere...I'd be curious what the sample size was and what population was sampled. I understand this is more threatening to the elderly and those with compromised immune systems, but so is everything else. Coronavirus has killed what, barely 100 world wide? Ebola and Swine Flu killed half a million people world wide. I would be seriously concerned if you see tons of otherwise healthy people dying from this or leaving lasting damage, but that's not the case at all. Obviously no one wants anyone to die, but anything is more lethal to the elderly. It's something you don't want to get, but there's what a 97% chance you'll be fine? It's absolutely media panic because they want to politicize it. Swine was never politicized and way way more deadly world wide. No need to ask why.
 
And you can’t believe any news coming out of China.
 
[quote="Class of 72" post=379949]Let's not forget our pets!
[attachment=1332]2d0ea43ab6194c45e90a40ead2b8794d.jpg[/attachment]o[/quote]

In all seriousness I thought I read pets can't contract it.
 
I just read the entire article you posted and did not see 30% of cases being severe...anywhere. There is still a lot experts do not understand and there is a ton of confusion because the media is freaking people out to politicize it which results in the stock market tanking and health professionals trying to calm people down. This is not the plague. All of this crazy panic with BS information is making people buy up all the masks and now doctors don't have enough. Cases of water bottles, soap, etc. are selling out of stores. I always think of the comedian Vic DiBitetto with his viral video. The news says a bomb cyclone is coming! I gotta get the bread and the milk! And he freaks out over the panic that the news built up. Of course the storm almost never turns out to be even half of what was hyped up. You have to understand that the media needs ratings and they are willing to freak people out to do so. They also have political motivations. The health professionals are not freaking out and there are no healthy 25 year old athletes dropping dead all over the US from coronavirus. People need to relax. I understand the need to be preventative and be cautious, but there are racist hate crimes against Asians being committed all over the city because of this BS panic. That's what this stuff sows.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=379954]I just read the entire article you posted and did not see 30% of cases being severe...anywhere. There is still a lot experts do not understand and there is a ton of confusion because the media is freaking people out to politicize it which results in the stock market tanking and health professionals trying to calm people down. This is not the plague. All of this crazy panic with BS information is making people buy up all the masks and now doctors don't have enough. Cases of water bottles, soap, etc. are selling out of stores. I always think of the comedian Vic DiBitetto with his viral video. The news says a bomb cyclone is coming! I gotta get the bread and the milk! And he freaks out over the panic that the news built up. Of course the storm almost never turns out to be even half of what was hyped up. You have to understand that the media needs ratings and they are willing to freak people out to do so. They also have political motivations. The health professionals are not freaking out and there are no healthy 25 year old athletes dropping dead all over the US from coronavirus. People need to relax. I understand the need to be preventative and be cautious, but there are racist hate crimes against Asians being committed all over the city because of this BS panic. That's what this stuff sows.[/quote]

Started to respond to this, then realized it's just not worth it. You be you and carry on.
 
[quote="SJUFAN2" post=379958][quote="Mike Zaun" post=379954]I just read the entire article you posted and did not see 30% of cases being severe...anywhere. There is still a lot experts do not understand and there is a ton of confusion because the media is freaking people out to politicize it which results in the stock market tanking and health professionals trying to calm people down. This is not the plague. All of this crazy panic with BS information is making people buy up all the masks and now doctors don't have enough. Cases of water bottles, soap, etc. are selling out of stores. I always think of the comedian Vic DiBitetto with his viral video. The news says a bomb cyclone is coming! I gotta get the bread and the milk! And he freaks out over the panic that the news built up. Of course the storm almost never turns out to be even half of what was hyped up. You have to understand that the media needs ratings and they are willing to freak people out to do so. They also have political motivations. The health professionals are not freaking out and there are no healthy 25 year old athletes dropping dead all over the US from coronavirus. People need to relax. I understand the need to be preventative and be cautious, but there are racist hate crimes against Asians being committed all over the city because of this BS panic. That's what this stuff sows.[/quote]

Started to respond to this, then realized it's just not worth it. You be you and carry on.[/quote]

SJUFAN2, I agree but would hope moderators don't allow political drivel to creep in to discussion of current health threat.
 
[quote="fuchsia" post=379964][quote="SJUFAN2" post=379958][quote="Mike Zaun" post=379954]I just read the entire article you posted and did not see 30% of cases being severe...anywhere. There is still a lot experts do not understand and there is a ton of confusion because the media is freaking people out to politicize it which results in the stock market tanking and health professionals trying to calm people down. This is not the plague. All of this crazy panic with BS information is making people buy up all the masks and now doctors don't have enough. Cases of water bottles, soap, etc. are selling out of stores. I always think of the comedian Vic DiBitetto with his viral video. The news says a bomb cyclone is coming! I gotta get the bread and the milk! And he freaks out over the panic that the news built up. Of course the storm almost never turns out to be even half of what was hyped up. You have to understand that the media needs ratings and they are willing to freak people out to do so. They also have political motivations. The health professionals are not freaking out and there are no healthy 25 year old athletes dropping dead all over the US from coronavirus. People need to relax. I understand the need to be preventative and be cautious, but there are racist hate crimes against Asians being committed all over the city because of this BS panic. That's what this stuff sows.[/quote]

Started to respond to this, then realized it's just not worth it. You be you and carry on.[/quote]

SJUFAN2, I agree but would hope moderators don't allow political drivel to creep in to discussion of current health threat.[/quote]

I'm with you fuchsia. It would be nice, but sadly it's gotten to the point in this country that even a world wide health emergency gets dismissed by some as a political attack on their team, or fake media propaganda. Even worse, some continue to crack jokes about bat soup and dogs wearing biohazard suits.
From my perspective, if someone can't set that stuff aside and have a reasoned discussion about how to keep this from getting out of control then they aren't part of the solution. Keeping politics out of this is going to be tough though, especially when you get CDC and WHO doctors saying the global fatality rate is 3.4% based on current data and to stay home if you are sick, only to then have the POTUS on TV last night telling millions of FOX viewers that it's his "hunch" the rate is well below 1% and people that have mild symptoms are ok going to work.

Anyway, I'll do my part. No more politics from me. I'm dropping out of this thread. I'll keep an eye on things and delete political stuff for you, and I'll lock the thread of it gets out of hand.

Since you are one of the few on here actually looking for information, here's an interesting article from two weeks ago that gives a solid background on what challenges we are facing, why doing nothing isn't a good option, and how this stacks up with other viruses like SARS and MERS up to this point. Hopefully you find this helpful.

[URL]https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2020/02/covid-vaccine/607000/[/URL]
 
I think I shared this already but wanted to do so again for those curious about the latest figures.

[URL]https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/[/URL]

A few takeaways.

There have so far been 97, 910 cases reported and 3,353 deaths(3.4%). But there are still 40,433 active cases of which an additional 6,479 patients are in severe or critical condition right now, so accurately projecting the mortality rate is kind of difficult. It may yet prove to be as deadly as SARS or MERS.

So far of resolved cases 94% have recovered while 6% have died.

Once it gets a foothold somewhere it's going to get much worse before it gets better as folks who do not know they are infected spread the disease like a body on tap commercial. Then once quarantine directives start to take effect things start the descending bell curve.

That said I agree with MZ on one thing, dont' panic, just be vigilant, take precautions and wash your damn hands!
 
Some local perspective.....
New Jersey coronavirus cases: 2
New Jerseyans who have died from flu or pneumonia this season: 1,091
 
By the time this is over Otis will go down as having the most viewed and posted on thread in the rookie forum woty a thread named after him. He’s not there yet but it’s going that way. I’m jealous
 
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[quote="SJUFAN2" post=379500][quote="Class of 72" post=379461]SJJUFAN2 wrote:
"I'm not suggesting people do anything except stay INFORMED so they can make informed decisions for themselves and their loved ones."
LMFAO!
I think you are suggesting a lot more than people stay "informed" by your point by point exhaustive retorts.
I don't think there is a single redmen fan here that doesn't have access to the latest information from American based sources. You have admitted not knowing anything more than anyone else here and yet you ridiculed people concerned about the flu. Well buddy boy there are only 100 reported cases of the CV and 1 death while the number of flu cases this season is 131,604, the highest since the state began keeping records in 1998. The previous record was the 2017-18 season with 128,892 recorded cases. Last week, 10,520 laboratory-confirmed cases of influenza have been reported and 1,454 people have been hospitalized with influenza. THUS, if you have not been vaccinated for the flu you could be one of the 1,454 people hospitalized. Finally Mr. Doomberg, this is 2020 and not 100 years ago. Development of a vaccine is being fast tracked and I don't think it will take years to figure this thing out. My advice is to wash your hands and stop picking your nose.
Meanwhile, make sure you use a condom because sexually transmitted infections hit a record high 2.4 million cases making it the fifth year in a row that cases of chlamydia, gonorrhea and syphilis have spiked, according to new numbers from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.[/quote]

Wow. That's amazing. You managed to pull your head out of the sand and stuff it up your ass all in one move. Impressive.

[/quote]

Wow, thanks for enlightening me, all this time I was researching medical people and publications when all I needed to do was waste my time with an agenda driven, political hack disguised as a second rate comedian to stay INFORMED.
 
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[quote="Logen" post=380038][quote="SJUFAN2" post=379500][quote="Class of 72" post=379461]SJJUFAN2 wrote:
"I'm not suggesting people do anything except stay INFORMED so they can make informed decisions for themselves and their loved ones."
LMFAO!
I think you are suggesting a lot more than people stay "informed" by your point by point exhaustive retorts.
I don't think there is a single redmen fan here that doesn't have access to the latest information from American based sources. You have admitted not knowing anything more than anyone else here and yet you ridiculed people concerned about the flu. Well buddy boy there are only 100 reported cases of the CV and 1 death while the number of flu cases this season is 131,604, the highest since the state began keeping records in 1998. The previous record was the 2017-18 season with 128,892 recorded cases. Last week, 10,520 laboratory-confirmed cases of influenza have been reported and 1,454 people have been hospitalized with influenza. THUS, if you have not been vaccinated for the flu you could be one of the 1,454 people hospitalized. Finally Mr. Doomberg, this is 2020 and not 100 years ago. Development of a vaccine is being fast tracked and I don't think it will take years to figure this thing out. My advice is to wash your hands and stop picking your nose.
Meanwhile, make sure you use a condom because sexually transmitted infections hit a record high 2.4 million cases making it the fifth year in a row that cases of chlamydia, gonorrhea and syphilis have spiked, according to new numbers from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.[/quote]

Wow. That's amazing. You managed to pull your head out of the sand and stuff it up your ass all in one move. Impressive.

[/quote]

Wow, thanks for enlightening me, all this time I was researching medical people and publications when all I needed to do was waste my time with an agenda driven, political hack disguised as a second rate comedian to stay INFORMED.[/quote]

Well I was going to leave this thread to you "nothing to see here, move along" guys but since you quoted me, one last post:

Wow four days to respond and that's it? Candidly I expected better from you, but I also expected you to take the bait days ago. You disappoint on so many levels. Bully for you though, please carry on...
 
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