Norm Roberts

i don't know how anyone can say leaving the program needing nine scholarship players at once is better than what it was by any standard.
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I think that you (and Jarvis) are the only guys who think that Roberts left the program in worse situation than Jarvis.

Don´t you remember the sanctions or less scholarships?

For a recruiter like Lavin to have 9 scholarships in the same year is not a problem, it´s a present.

I still remember when Jarvis said that he left the team in a better situation than when he arrived (Fraschilla firing) 
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I remember Jarvis saying that too.l I threw up almost immediately.

And newsie, what kind of roster did Jarvis leave in his wake for Norm? Exactly four guys who came to STJ on scholly as follows: the shell of Daryl Hill, Lamont, a broken Diakite and Tyler Jones. Oh and maybe Special FX, I think he committed to Jarvis. So Norm was pretty much faced with the same challenge coming in as he left Lavin going out. At least Norm left Lavin a year's worth of a full roster to work with. Inheriting a pile of shite and leaving behind manure is better than nothing.

(and yes I blame him most of all for Pittsburgh because if he hadn't been on work stoppage for two years before he was dumped he wouldn't have been fired in December and Pittsburgh probably wouldn't have happened so his wake washed away Grady, Ingram and Keita, leaving only the aforementioned players,a shattered image and NCAA violations). 
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The best thing that ever happened to Norm was Jarvis! The least succesful coach in the history of the program is still being given a mulligan by people by simply bringing up Jarvis. Norm was not lazy or crooked. That is the only positive thing you can say for him. While i think it is silly that people still bring up Norm and Jarvis at all, it is even more silly to keep defending Norm. Jarvis nearly killed the program. Norm kept the program clean but did almost make it irrelevant.  
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Nobody is giving Norm a mulligan. When he was hired the program was radioactive. Nobody wanted to touch it, with the school one more impropriety away from being turned into 40 years of wasteland. Norm was brought here because he would do as told, avoid controversy, and play it clean. Plus, the admin knew he wouldn;t abandon the program even if, by chance, he became a hot ticket and desired elsewhere. He worked hard, and did everything that was, or should have realistically been expected of him. Especially since, at that time, an honest program, and not the top twenty, was the real priority. Maybe his time here was too long, but Lavin's instant recruiting success tells you Norm took the radioactivity away. 
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My only issue with this is that if you brought in a Lavin type after year 3 or no later than after year 4 the program would be further along and we would not have had to sit through such ugly basketball. Or even if you had brought in a clean coach with any coaching or recruiting skill things would have been easier on the fans. Whatever, what is done is done. 
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Can't argue with that. Similarly you can't argue with the fact that if me Auntie had balls she'd be my Uncle . . . But she doesn't. How bad Norm was has little to do with the answer to the simple yes or no question, did he leave the program in better shape than he found it.
 
i don't know how anyone can say leaving the program needing nine scholarship players at once is better than what it was by any standard.
Click to expand...
 

I think that you (and Jarvis) are the only guys who think that Roberts left the program in worse situation than Jarvis.

Don´t you remember the sanctions or less scholarships?

For a recruiter like Lavin to have 9 scholarships in the same year is not a problem, it´s a present.

I still remember when Jarvis said that he left the team in a better situation than when he arrived (Fraschilla firing) 
Click to expand...
 

I remember Jarvis saying that too.l I threw up almost immediately.

And newsie, what kind of roster did Jarvis leave in his wake for Norm? Exactly four guys who came to STJ on scholly as follows: the shell of Daryl Hill, Lamont, a broken Diakite and Tyler Jones. Oh and maybe Special FX, I think he committed to Jarvis. So Norm was pretty much faced with the same challenge coming in as he left Lavin going out. At least Norm left Lavin a year's worth of a full roster to work with. Inheriting a pile of shite and leaving behind manure is better than nothing.

(and yes I blame him most of all for Pittsburgh because if he hadn't been on work stoppage for two years before he was dumped he wouldn't have been fired in December and Pittsburgh probably wouldn't have happened so his wake washed away Grady, Ingram and Keita, leaving only the aforementioned players,a shattered image and NCAA violations). 
Click to expand...
 

The best thing that ever happened to Norm was Jarvis! The least succesful coach in the history of the program is still being given a mulligan by people by simply bringing up Jarvis. Norm was not lazy or crooked. That is the only positive thing you can say for him. While i think it is silly that people still bring up Norm and Jarvis at all, it is even more silly to keep defending Norm. Jarvis nearly killed the program. Norm kept the program clean but did almost make it irrelevant.  
Click to expand...
 

Nobody is giving Norm a mulligan. When he was hired the program was radioactive. Nobody wanted to touch it, with the school one more impropriety away from being turned into 40 years of wasteland. Norm was brought here because he would do as told, avoid controversy, and play it clean. Plus, the admin knew he wouldn;t abandon the program even if, by chance, he became a hot ticket and desired elsewhere. He worked hard, and did everything that was, or should have realistically been expected of him. Especially since, at that time, an honest program, and not the top twenty, was the real priority. Maybe his time here was too long, but Lavin's instant recruiting success tells you Norm took the radioactivity away. 
Click to expand...
 

My only issue with this is that if you brought in a Lavin type after year 3 or no later than after year 4 the program would be further along and we would not have had to sit through such ugly basketball. Or even if you had brought in a clean coach with any coaching or recruiting skill things would have been easier on the fans. Whatever, what is done is done. 
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Can't argue with that. Similarly you can't argue with the fact that if me Auntie had balls she'd be my Uncle . . . But she doesn't. How bad Norm was has little to do with the answer to the simple yes or no question, did he leave the program in better shape than he found it.
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Yes.
 
Yes, but can we please put this topic to rest for once and for all. It's like listening to a friend of mine who keeps going on and on about his ex-wife even though they've been divorced for over 20 years. Get over it! Let's wish Norm, like him or not, good luck and a good life, and move on ... especially when we have a program that's on such a dramatic upswing.
 
Norm was a stopgap measure brought here to restore integrity to the program. He had good relations with the media, and recruited a lot of good kids. He did what he was brought here to do by a shellshocked administration.  he left the program in better shape than he found it, and was gracefully shown the door when order was restored. He is back where he belongs, as an assistant. Good luck to him.
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Ray hit the nail on the head. Norm did not bring the program backward, Jarvis did that (and you could argue everyone before him but after Louis). Norm (and maybe Fran, if you forget about image including the one of him showcasing his scrotum) is the only coach since Lapchick to leave the program in better shape than when he got it. However it was only in marginally better shape and nowhere near the progress that a big time program should expect from their coach. Truth is until hiring Lavin St Johns wasn't a big time program. Now they look like they are and hopefully that will continue throughout Lavin's tenure as coach and after he is gone, which I hope is a long time from now.
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Maybe Jarvis turned the program in the wrong direction, spiraling downward, but Norm kept it going in that direction. 
 
i don't know how anyone can say leaving the program needing nine scholarship players at once is better than what it was by any standard.
Click to expand...
 

I think that you (and Jarvis) are the only guys who think that Roberts left the program in worse situation than Jarvis.

Don´t you remember the sanctions or less scholarships?

For a recruiter like Lavin to have 9 scholarships in the same year is not a problem, it´s a present.

I still remember when Jarvis said that he left the team in a better situation than when he arrived (Fraschilla firing) 
Click to expand...
 

I remember Jarvis saying that too.l I threw up almost immediately.

And newsie, what kind of roster did Jarvis leave in his wake for Norm? Exactly four guys who came to STJ on scholly as follows: the shell of Daryl Hill, Lamont, a broken Diakite and Tyler Jones. Oh and maybe Special FX, I think he committed to Jarvis. So Norm was pretty much faced with the same challenge coming in as he left Lavin going out. At least Norm left Lavin a year's worth of a full roster to work with. Inheriting a pile of shite and leaving behind manure is better than nothing.

(and yes I blame him most of all for Pittsburgh because if he hadn't been on work stoppage for two years before he was dumped he wouldn't have been fired in December and Pittsburgh probably wouldn't have happened so his wake washed away Grady, Ingram and Keita, leaving only the aforementioned players,a shattered image and NCAA violations). 
Click to expand...
 

The best thing that ever happened to Norm was Jarvis! The least succesful coach in the history of the program is still being given a mulligan by people by simply bringing up Jarvis. Norm was not lazy or crooked. That is the only positive thing you can say for him. While i think it is silly that people still bring up Norm and Jarvis at all, it is even more silly to keep defending Norm. Jarvis nearly killed the program. Norm kept the program clean but did almost make it irrelevant.  
Click to expand...
 

Nobody is giving Norm a mulligan. When he was hired the program was radioactive. Nobody wanted to touch it, with the school one more impropriety away from being turned into 40 years of wasteland. Norm was brought here because he would do as told, avoid controversy, and play it clean. Plus, the admin knew he wouldn;t abandon the program even if, by chance, he became a hot ticket and desired elsewhere. He worked hard, and did everything that was, or should have realistically been expected of him. Especially since, at that time, an honest program, and not the top twenty, was the real priority. Maybe his time here was too long, but Lavin's instant recruiting success tells you Norm took the radioactivity away. 
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your post is a total load. We could have hired a real coach, but FH didnt want any part of it. After firing both Fraschilla and JArvis, FH was done with primadonas, and hired a career loser. Thank God NR has redeemed himself in his own mind, and led Florida to the elite 8 . To give NR ANY credit for the success Lavin had recruiting while taking over a .500 team that went out in the 1st round of the NIT is frigging despicable even if based in total ignorance.
 
i don't know how anyone can say leaving the program needing nine scholarship players at once is better than what it was by any standard.
Click to expand...
 

I think that you (and Jarvis) are the only guys who think that Roberts left the program in worse situation than Jarvis.

Don´t you remember the sanctions or less scholarships?

For a recruiter like Lavin to have 9 scholarships in the same year is not a problem, it´s a present.

I still remember when Jarvis said that he left the team in a better situation than when he arrived (Fraschilla firing) 
Click to expand...
 

I remember Jarvis saying that too.l I threw up almost immediately.

And newsie, what kind of roster did Jarvis leave in his wake for Norm? Exactly four guys who came to STJ on scholly as follows: the shell of Daryl Hill, Lamont, a broken Diakite and Tyler Jones. Oh and maybe Special FX, I think he committed to Jarvis. So Norm was pretty much faced with the same challenge coming in as he left Lavin going out. At least Norm left Lavin a year's worth of a full roster to work with. Inheriting a pile of shite and leaving behind manure is better than nothing.

(and yes I blame him most of all for Pittsburgh because if he hadn't been on work stoppage for two years before he was dumped he wouldn't have been fired in December and Pittsburgh probably wouldn't have happened so his wake washed away Grady, Ingram and Keita, leaving only the aforementioned players,a shattered image and NCAA violations). 
Click to expand...
 

The best thing that ever happened to Norm was Jarvis! The least succesful coach in the history of the program is still being given a mulligan by people by simply bringing up Jarvis. Norm was not lazy or crooked. That is the only positive thing you can say for him. While i think it is silly that people still bring up Norm and Jarvis at all, it is even more silly to keep defending Norm. Jarvis nearly killed the program. Norm kept the program clean but did almost make it irrelevant.  
Click to expand...
 

Nobody is giving Norm a mulligan. When he was hired the program was radioactive. Nobody wanted to touch it, with the school one more impropriety away from being turned into 40 years of wasteland. Norm was brought here because he would do as told, avoid controversy, and play it clean. Plus, the admin knew he wouldn;t abandon the program even if, by chance, he became a hot ticket and desired elsewhere. He worked hard, and did everything that was, or should have realistically been expected of him. Especially since, at that time, an honest program, and not the top twenty, was the real priority. Maybe his time here was too long, but Lavin's instant recruiting success tells you Norm took the radioactivity away. 
Click to expand...
 

My only issue with this is that if you brought in a Lavin type after year 3 or no later than after year 4 the program would be further along and we would not have had to sit through such ugly basketball. Or even if you had brought in a clean coach with any coaching or recruiting skill things would have been easier on the fans. Whatever, what is done is done. 
Click to expand...
 

Can't argue with that. Similarly you can't argue with the fact that if me Auntie had balls she'd be my Uncle . . . But she doesn't. How bad Norm was has little to do with the answer to the simple yes or no question, did he leave the program in better shape than he found it.
Click to expand...
 

Actually, with gay marriage, your auntie can have balls and still be your aunt. :)
 
Look I grew to despise Norm more than anything in the world. And our scholarship situation was a direct result of his ineptitude.

BUT he left us with a team of kids who never had real coaching ( but they were coachable ) a team of no stars other than Hardy and after a bunch of games getting used to Lavins system went on a run as good as any team I've watched has gone on at home with some huge freaking wins.

The open schollies while a curse was also a blessing. Thank God we have Lavin filling them. Hard work for sure but I trust no one else to get our program to elite status 
 
I doubt anyone hates Brian Mahoney, a genuinely good guy.. Brian got the job because Louie insisted he get it and back then loyalty went further ,sometimes, than brains. Brian was fired as Coach at Manhattan College, his alma mater and among its' all time great players, because he went 3 and 21 his last year. Brian was rewarded by Louie.

Roberts came here with similar unimpressive results from Queens College as Head coach..His resume as Assistant Coach was largely a function of following Bill Self around.. How lucky was that?

I think the administration here was beserk after Jarvis and conducted a poor search, hiring Roberts, when head coaches with far better resumes were available... It took a take charge guy like Repole to convince a reluctant Administration that hiring a NAME COACH LIKE LAVIN, was absolutely necessary..

I mean Repole even posted an offer for Billy Donavan, who took a few days to turn it down but, not without giving respect to the St John's program's history.
 
I doubt anyone hates Brian Mahoney, a genuinely good guy.. Brian got the job because Louie insisted he get it and back then loyalty went further ,sometimes, than brains. Brian was fired as Coach at Manhattan College, his alma mater and among its' all time great players, because he went 3 and 21 his last year. Brian was rewarded by Louie.

Roberts came here with similar unimpressive results from Queens College as Head coach..His resume as Assistant Coach was largely a function of following Bill Self around.. How lucky was that?

I think the administration here was beserk after Jarvis and conducted a poor search, hiring Roberts, when head coaches with far better resumes were available... It took a take charge guy like Repole to convince a reluctant Administration that hiring a NAME COACH LIKE LAVIN, was absolutely necessary..

I mean Repole even posted an offer for Billy Donavan, who took a few days to turn it down but, not without giving respect to the St John's program's history.
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hahahahahahah.....I have no problem with Mahoney.

It's these Norm Roberts threads I can't stand anymore. Far be it for me to play the "Mod police" but I wish any thread like this would be closed and locked immediately. Why should anyone give a damn about this guy anymore?

Sorry, but I'm entitled to my opinion before I get told to get off my high horse.
 
 sit back, relax and have another guinness lol
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Nope....nothing but double IPAs and black IPAs right now. Really digging anything Founders makes, too.
Just sick of the Roberts threads. Like I said, myself, I'd close and lock any thread about him, but that not my job. Modding is a tough job, too, I may add, an often thankless one.
 
 And on a separate note the Norm curse seeped into florida the last 10 minutes. :)

Nice win for the Big East. That Dieng guy was a killer on defense at the end.

BTW Watching the studio it's crazy how much more captivating Lavin is compared to who else they put in there
 
 Watching the Florida/Marquette game last night and seeing NR on the bench taking stats, made me feel that that is precisely what he is good for and nothing else. That horrible experiment of hiring him as our head coach put our program back a decade in so many respects. So glad we got Lavin!!
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I am 100% certain that he is a lousy stat keeper as well.
 
Yet if it were up to some on this board ( read OLDFAN ) we'd have had Norm for yet another year and totally missed an oppoetunity to hire a man who will bring this program into the 21St. century.
 
I doubt anyone hates Brian Mahoney, a genuinely good guy.. Brian got the job because Louie insisted he get it and back then loyalty went further ,sometimes, than brains. Brian was fired as Coach at Manhattan College, his alma mater and among its' all time great players, because he went 3 and 21 his last year. Brian was rewarded by Louie.

Roberts came here with similar unimpressive results from Queens College as Head coach..His resume as Assistant Coach was largely a function of following Bill Self around.. How lucky was that?

I think the administration here was beserk after Jarvis and conducted a poor search, hiring Roberts, when head coaches with far better resumes were available... It took a take charge guy like Repole to convince a reluctant Administration that hiring a NAME COACH LIKE LAVIN, was absolutely necessary..

I mean Repole even posted an offer for Billy Donavan, who took a few days to turn it down but, not without giving respect to the St John's program's history.
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Please don't compare Robert to Mahoney. Mahoney was a D1 college player, and was actually the head assistant at SJU for almost 20 years, carrying the clipboard and the go to guy in time outs to map out plays and defense. Roberts was a recruiter for Bill Self, and apparently a bird dog and not the closer. Everyone in coaching circles respected Mahoney. No one spoke of NRs coaching prowess, and a fair number quietly questioned the hire.

I don't start these idiotic NR threads, but as long as they are around, will respond to anyone who posts fictional accounts of the positives the NR accomplished here. He is an incompetent strategist, a poor recruiter when the main man, and a poor leader who didn't use his assistant coaches to the fullest.
 
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