NBA Draft

[quote="Monte" post=288895][quote="Beast of the East" post=288843]Knicks pass on Porter.. damn them. Definitely worth the gamble with huge upside

Nova, 3 first round pics and Brunson goes early 2nd round. good for them.

IMO DiVicenzo will not make a good pro.[/quote]

IMO Donte will be a very good pro.[/quote]

Jalen Brunson too?
 
[quote="Monte" post=288896][quote="gman" post=288863][quote="Beast of the East" post=288862][quote="redmanwest" post=288854]Some saying MJP won't play this year, so... Don't know much about the Knox kid, but most picks at 9 have questions.

I am hung up on the fact that Delgado was not picked. No NBA team could use a proven low post scorer and pro caliber rebounder? I know that there is a premium now on shooters, but I would bet a ton of dough that Delgado will be a better NBA than DeVincenzo, albeit at different positions. DeVincenzo is a nice college player, and most love his athleticism, but I am not sure he translates to an NBA career, at his height etc. Could be wrong. Strikes me as a guy who smartly struck while the iron was hot.[/quote]

Very good post. I agree about Delgado. I think he is nasty strong, even for the NBA.[/quote]

A lot of good players don't get drafted. Rawle Alkins, Malik Newman, Alonzo Trier, etc.

A lot of teams like drafting these foreign players they can stash in the 2nd round.[/quote]

Why not figure out a way to let kids who don't get drafted return to college if they want?[/quote]

I do not support the idea of letting these undrafted 'kids' return to school. First off, they are 18-20yr old young men. They are not 'kids'. They are old enough to make their own decisions. No one forces them to enter the draft. They choose to leave college on their own, and in doing so voluntarily give up their remaining eligibility with the risk of going undrafted. It's a risk/reward decision that they make for themselves. If things don't work out, sorry, but they must live with the consequences.
 
[quote="Eric Williamson" post=288983][quote="Monte" post=288896][quote="gman" post=288863][quote="Beast of the East" post=288862][quote="redmanwest" post=288854]Some saying MJP won't play this year, so... Don't know much about the Knox kid, but most picks at 9 have questions.

I am hung up on the fact that Delgado was not picked. No NBA team could use a proven low post scorer and pro caliber rebounder? I know that there is a premium now on shooters, but I would bet a ton of dough that Delgado will be a better NBA than DeVincenzo, albeit at different positions. DeVincenzo is a nice college player, and most love his athleticism, but I am not sure he translates to an NBA career, at his height etc. Could be wrong. Strikes me as a guy who smartly struck while the iron was hot.[/quote]

Very good post. I agree about Delgado. I think he is nasty strong, even for the NBA.[/quote]

A lot of good players don't get drafted. Rawle Alkins, Malik Newman, Alonzo Trier, etc.

A lot of teams like drafting these foreign players they can stash in the 2nd round.[/quote]

Why not figure out a way to let kids who don't get drafted return to college if they want?[/quote]

I do not support the idea of letting these undrafted 'kids' return to school. First off, they are 18-20yr old young men. They are not 'kids'. They are old enough to make their own decisions. No one forces them to enter the draft. They choose to leave college on their own, and in doing so voluntarily give up their remaining eligibility with the risk of going undrafted. It's a risk/reward decision that they make for themselves. If things don't work out, sorry, but they must live with the consequences.[/quote]

Nope, not so fast.
A growing body of science concludes that “critical parts of the brain are not fully developed until well after the age of 18... and “are not fully finished developing until about age 25...18 year olds are about halfway through that process...”
and “the brain’s reward system becomes highly active right around the time of puberty and then gradually goes back to an adult level...around age 25 and that makes young adults more interested in entering uncertain situations....”
This lends credence to allowing them to return if not drafted, imo.
 
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[quote="Eric Williamson" post=288983][quote="Monte" post=288896][quote="gman" post=288863][quote="Beast of the East" post=288862][quote="redmanwest" post=288854]Some saying MJP won't play this year, so... Don't know much about the Knox kid, but most picks at 9 have questions.

I am hung up on the fact that Delgado was not picked. No NBA team could use a proven low post scorer and pro caliber rebounder? I know that there is a premium now on shooters, but I would bet a ton of dough that Delgado will be a better NBA than DeVincenzo, albeit at different positions. DeVincenzo is a nice college player, and most love his athleticism, but I am not sure he translates to an NBA career, at his height etc. Could be wrong. Strikes me as a guy who smartly struck while the iron was hot.[/quote]

Very good post. I agree about Delgado. I think he is nasty strong, even for the NBA.[/quote]

A lot of good players don't get drafted. Rawle Alkins, Malik Newman, Alonzo Trier, etc.

A lot of teams like drafting these foreign players they can stash in the 2nd round.[/quote]

Why not figure out a way to let kids who don't get drafted return to college if they want?[/quote]

I do not support the idea of letting these undrafted 'kids' return to school. First off, they are 18-20yr old young men. They are not 'kids'. They are old enough to make their own decisions. No one forces them to enter the draft. They choose to leave college on their own, and in doing so voluntarily give up their remaining eligibility with the risk of going undrafted. It's a risk/reward decision that they make for themselves. If things don't work out, sorry, but they must live with the consequences.[/quote]



Thank God I do not have to live with the consequences of the decisions I made at 18-21 years old. I still believe that basketball should be the same as baseball, you go right out of high school or go to college for 3 years.
 
[quote="panther2" post=288986][quote="Eric Williamson" post=288983][quote="Monte" post=288896][quote="gman" post=288863][quote="Beast of the East" post=288862][quote="redmanwest" post=288854]Some saying MJP won't play this year, so... Don't know much about the Knox kid, but most picks at 9 have questions.

I am hung up on the fact that Delgado was not picked. No NBA team could use a proven low post scorer and pro caliber rebounder? I know that there is a premium now on shooters, but I would bet a ton of dough that Delgado will be a better NBA than DeVincenzo, albeit at different positions. DeVincenzo is a nice college player, and most love his athleticism, but I am not sure he translates to an NBA career, at his height etc. Could be wrong. Strikes me as a guy who smartly struck while the iron was hot.[/quote]

Very good post. I agree about Delgado. I think he is nasty strong, even for the NBA.[/quote]

A lot of good players don't get drafted. Rawle Alkins, Malik Newman, Alonzo Trier, etc.

A lot of teams like drafting these foreign players they can stash in the 2nd round.[/quote]

Why not figure out a way to let kids who don't get drafted return to college if they want?[/quote]

I do not support the idea of letting these undrafted 'kids' return to school. First off, they are 18-20yr old young men. They are not 'kids'. They are old enough to make their own decisions. No one forces them to enter the draft. They choose to leave college on their own, and in doing so voluntarily give up their remaining eligibility with the risk of going undrafted. It's a risk/reward decision that they make for themselves. If things don't work out, sorry, but they must live with the consequences.[/quote]



Thank God I do not have to live with the consequences of the decisions I made at 18-21 years old. I still believe that basketball should be the same as baseball, you go right out of high school or go to college for 3 years.[/quote]

Of all the suggestions that have been made, this one makes the most sense.
The NBA should continue to strive to make "the G" a true minor league and NBA feeder program
They have made some good strides but need to do more to raise the profile of the G League
But this proposed system is a win-win for everyone
It enables kids to go pro when they want and the college game will support "student athletes"
 
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HS baseball players are all 'eligible' to be drafted by MLB teams. If drafted and they do not like the round they've picked or do not like the bonus slotted for that pick in that round, they are not obligated to go pro.
I think the MLB draft is real up to Rounds 8 - 10. Beyond that, bonus levels become very modest.
Pro hoops is not structured at all like baseball.
Beyond the 2nd round, a player who exposes himself to the 'draft' is in a black hole of uncertainty, with little or no guaranteed money.
IMO, these college hoops KIDS must be allowed to return to college 'to play' or to 'scholarship'--but not wind up in limbo if undrafted.
 
[quote="Chicago Days" post=288990]HS baseball players are all 'eligible' to be drafted by MLB teams. If drafted and they do not like the round they've picked or do not like the bonus slotted for that pick in that round, they are not obligated to go pro.
I think the MLB draft is real up to Rounds 8 - 10. Beyond that, bonus levels become very modest.
Pro hoops is not structured at all like baseball.
Beyond the 2nd round, a player who exposes himself to the 'draft' is in a black hole of uncertainty, with little or no guaranteed money.
IMO, these college hoops KIDS must be allowed to return to college 'to play' or to 'scholarship'--but not wind up in limbo if undrafted.[/quote]

Players selected in the 2nd round of the NBA draft are in a black hole as well.
Only players picked in the 1st round get guaranteed money.
 
[quote="MarkRedman" post=288994][quote="Chicago Days" post=288990]HS baseball players are all 'eligible' to be drafted by MLB teams. If drafted and they do not like the round they've picked or do not like the bonus slotted for that pick in that round, they are not obligated to go pro.
I think the MLB draft is real up to Rounds 8 - 10. Beyond that, bonus levels become very modest.
Pro hoops is not structured at all like baseball.
Beyond the 2nd round, a player who exposes himself to the 'draft' is in a black hole of uncertainty, with little or no guaranteed money.
IMO, these college hoops KIDS must be allowed to return to college 'to play' or to 'scholarship'--but not wind up in limbo if undrafted.[/quote]

Players selected in the 2nd round of the NBA draft are in a black hole as well.
Only players picked in the 1st round get guaranteed money.[/quote]


K i thought 2nd round guys got some G League deal or roster time or something.
K thanks.
Makes it worse than i thought.
 
[quote="oldschool Redmen" post=288899][quote="Monte" post=288896][quote="gman" post=288863][quote="Beast of the East" post=288862][quote="redmanwest" post=288854]Some saying MJP won't play this year, so... Don't know much about the Knox kid, but most picks at 9 have questions.

I am hung up on the fact that Delgado was not picked. No NBA team could use a proven low post scorer and pro caliber rebounder? I know that there is a premium now on shooters, but I would bet a ton of dough that Delgado will be a better NBA than DeVincenzo, albeit at different positions. DeVincenzo is a nice college player, and most love his athleticism, but I am not sure he translates to an NBA career, at his height etc. Could be wrong. Strikes me as a guy who smartly struck while the iron was hot.[/quote]

Very good post. I agree about Delgado. I think he is nasty strong, even for the NBA.[/quote]

A lot of good players don't get drafted. Rawle Alkins, Malik Newman, Alonzo Trier, etc.

A lot of teams like drafting these foreign players they can stash in the 2nd round.[/quote]

Why not figure out a way to let kids who don't get drafted return to college if they want?[/quote]

Could they enter without hiring an agent, or do they have to hire an agent?[/quote]

Good question. Don't know the answer. In any event not sure why they would have to officially hire an agent before getting drafted. They can have someone on standby and the minute they get drafted they hire him. If they don't get drafted, they retain college eligibility(if they so choose) and no agent. Doesn't seem all that difficult to arrange, and it benefits everyone involved. But then again, I may be missing something that some of the brilliant legal minds on this board know of..
 
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[quote="Chicago Days" post=288984][quote="Eric Williamson" post=288983][quote="Monte" post=288896][quote="gman" post=288863][quote="Beast of the East" post=288862][quote="redmanwest" post=288854]Some saying MJP won't play this year, so... Don't know much about the Knox kid, but most picks at 9 have questions.

I am hung up on the fact that Delgado was not picked. No NBA team could use a proven low post scorer and pro caliber rebounder? I know that there is a premium now on shooters, but I would bet a ton of dough that Delgado will be a better NBA than DeVincenzo, albeit at different positions. DeVincenzo is a nice college player, and most love his athleticism, but I am not sure he translates to an NBA career, at his height etc. Could be wrong. Strikes me as a guy who smartly struck while the iron was hot.[/quote]

Very good post. I agree about Delgado. I think he is nasty strong, even for the NBA.[/quote]

A lot of good players don't get drafted. Rawle Alkins, Malik Newman, Alonzo Trier, etc.

A lot of teams like drafting these foreign players they can stash in the 2nd round.[/quote]

Why not figure out a way to let kids who don't get drafted return to college if they want?[/quote]

I do not support the idea of letting these undrafted 'kids' return to school. First off, they are 18-20yr old young men. They are not 'kids'. They are old enough to make their own decisions. No one forces them to enter the draft. They choose to leave college on their own, and in doing so voluntarily give up their remaining eligibility with the risk of going undrafted. It's a risk/reward decision that they make for themselves. If things don't work out, sorry, but they must live with the consequences.[/quote]

Nope, not so fast.
A growing body of science concludes that “critical parts of the brain are not fully developed until well after the age of 18... and “are not fully finished developing until about age 25...18 year olds are about halfway through that process...”
and “the brain’s reward system becomes highly active right around the time of puberty and then gradually goes back to an adult level...around age 25 and that makes young adults more interested in entering uncertain situations....”
This lends credence to allowing them to return if not drafted, imo.[/quote]

Thanks Chicago
BBC News:
Sep 23, 2013 · We used to think that the brain was fully developed by very early teenagerhood and we now realise that the brain doesn't stop developing until mid-20s or even early 30s. ... The change follows developments in our understanding of emotional maturity, hormonal development and particularly brain activity.

Let each man here reflect back honestly on himself - mature at 20? 25? 30?
All I know is that I’ve taken decades to grow up emotionally (being mature in a relationship w a woman, displaying poise and patience with life’s challenges, being able to give and receive love .,,how to be grateful, how to heal from
Life’s inevitable scars...) and I sense I’m not alone. And with each few years I am a different person - for the better.

All the best
 
Alkins is more of a forward then a guard and a little small by NBA standards. He will definitely get a shot by some team. I think DiVencenzo will be ok. He does most things well offensively and I don't think he is a bad defender.
 
[quote="Monte" post=288998]
Good question. Don't know the answer. In any event not sure why they would have to officially hire an agent before getting drafted. They can have someone on standby and the minute they get drafted they hire him. If they don't get drafted, they retain college eligibility(if they so choose) and no agent. Doesn't seem all that difficult to arrange, and it benefits everyone involved. But then again, I may be missing something that some of the brilliant legal minds on this board know of..[/quote]

Ray Allen didn't hire an agent when he came out. He hired a lawyer to look over the contract at a cheaper rate.

I'm not sure why any rookie would hire an agent -- you are slotted into a certain money amount. And there are probably other ways to field endorsement offers instead of paying a considerable percentage to an agent.
 
I guess the agent has the connections w/teams to get support to come in for workouts, and know who they will be working out against etc.

If they don't get drafted, I don't think they can enter draft again next year.. might need to just be free agent. I read once about Randolph Morris from Kentucky who did this. Not sure if others more recently.
 
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[quote="RedStormNC" post=289003]I guess the agent has the connections w/teams to get support to come in for workouts, and know who they will be working out against etc.

If they don't get drafted, I don't think they can enter draft again next year.. might need to just be free agent. I read once about Randolph Morris from Kentucky who did this. Not sure if others more recently.[/quote]

I think you’re right about that RedStormNC, but if a rule change permits their return, then they may be allowed to enter again the following year?
Dunno.
Makes more sense to me than the current system.
At least, maybe they’ll get their degree, improve their game, and be more attractive to NBA and foreign pro teams.
 
[quote="OLV72" post=288946][quote="Monte" post=288895][quote="Beast of the East" post=288843]Knicks pass on Porter.. damn them. Definitely worth the gamble with huge upside

Nova, 3 first round pics and Brunson goes early 2nd round. good for them.

IMO DiVicenzo will not make a good pro.[/quote]

IMO Donte will be a very good pro.[/quote]

Jalen Brunson too?[/quote]

I predict Jalen will finish 2nd in the ROY voting next year ;)
 
[quote="Chicago Days" post=288984][quote="Eric Williamson" post=288983][quote="Monte" post=288896][quote="gman" post=288863][quote="Beast of the East" post=288862][quote="redmanwest" post=288854]Some saying MJP won't play this year, so... Don't know much about the Knox kid, but most picks at 9 have questions.

I am hung up on the fact that Delgado was not picked. No NBA team could use a proven low post scorer and pro caliber rebounder? I know that there is a premium now on shooters, but I would bet a ton of dough that Delgado will be a better NBA than DeVincenzo, albeit at different positions. DeVincenzo is a nice college player, and most love his athleticism, but I am not sure he translates to an NBA career, at his height etc. Could be wrong. Strikes me as a guy who smartly struck while the iron was hot.[/quote]

Very good post. I agree about Delgado. I think he is nasty strong, even for the NBA.[/quote]

A lot of good players don't get drafted. Rawle Alkins, Malik Newman, Alonzo Trier, etc.

A lot of teams like drafting these foreign players they can stash in the 2nd round.[/quote]

Why not figure out a way to let kids who don't get drafted return to college if they want?[/quote]

I do not support the idea of letting these undrafted 'kids' return to school. First off, they are 18-20yr old young men. They are not 'kids'. They are old enough to make their own decisions. No one forces them to enter the draft. They choose to leave college on their own, and in doing so voluntarily give up their remaining eligibility with the risk of going undrafted. It's a risk/reward decision that they make for themselves. If things don't work out, sorry, but they must live with the consequences.[/quote]

Nope, not so fast.
A growing body of science concludes that “critical parts of the brain are not fully developed until well after the age of 18... and “are not fully finished developing until about age 25...18 year olds are about halfway through that process...”
and “the brain’s reward system becomes highly active right around the time of puberty and then gradually goes back to an adult level...around age 25 and that makes young adults more interested in entering uncertain situations....”
This lends credence to allowing them to return if not drafted, imo.[/quote]


If your argument is that their brains are not fully developed until age 25, and until that point they make decisions irrationally based on some sort of instant/short term expectation/reward, and therefore they cannot mentally comprehend the ramifications of their actions and/or decisions, should that philosophy also be applied to all individuals in the age range, and not just athletes declaring for the draft? If a young adult knowingly breaks the law, are they justified in saying that they should not be punished because their brains are not fully developed and their brain's reward system is too active?
 
[quote="Eric Williamson" post=289021][quote="Chicago Days" post=288984][quote="Eric Williamson" post=288983][quote="Monte" post=288896][quote="gman" post=288863][quote="Beast of the East" post=288862][quote="redmanwest" post=288854]Some saying MJP won't play this year, so... Don't know much about the Knox kid, but most picks at 9 have questions.

I am hung up on the fact that Delgado was not picked. No NBA team could use a proven low post scorer and pro caliber rebounder? I know that there is a premium now on shooters, but I would bet a ton of dough that Delgado will be a better NBA than DeVincenzo, albeit at different positions. DeVincenzo is a nice college player, and most love his athleticism, but I am not sure he translates to an NBA career, at his height etc. Could be wrong. Strikes me as a guy who smartly struck while the iron was hot.[/quote]

Very good post. I agree about Delgado. I think he is nasty strong, even for the NBA.[/quote]

A lot of good players don't get drafted. Rawle Alkins, Malik Newman, Alonzo Trier, etc.

A lot of teams like drafting these foreign players they can stash in the 2nd round.[/quote]

Why not figure out a way to let kids who don't get drafted return to college if they want?[/quote]

I do not support the idea of letting these undrafted 'kids' return to school. First off, they are 18-20yr old young men. They are not 'kids'. They are old enough to make their own decisions. No one forces them to enter the draft. They choose to leave college on their own, and in doing so voluntarily give up their remaining eligibility with the risk of going undrafted. It's a risk/reward decision that they make for themselves. If things don't work out, sorry, but they must live with the consequences.[/quote]

Nope, not so fast.
A growing body of science concludes that “critical parts of the brain are not fully developed until well after the age of 18... and “are not fully finished developing until about age 25...18 year olds are about halfway through that process...”
and “the brain’s reward system becomes highly active right around the time of puberty and then gradually goes back to an adult level...around age 25 and that makes young adults more interested in entering uncertain situations....”
This lends credence to allowing them to return if not drafted, imo.[/quote]


If your argument is that their brains are not fully developed until age 25, and until that point they make decisions irrationally based on some sort of instant/short term expectation/reward, and therefore they cannot mentally comprehend the ramifications of their actions and/or decisions, should that philosophy also be applied to all individuals in the age range, and not just athletes declaring for the draft? If a young adult knowingly breaks the law, are they justified in saying that they should not be punished because their brains are not fully developed and their brain's reward system is too active?[/quote]

Breaking the law is a different dynamic, man.
Obviously, people are ‘responsible’ for what they do,
But, all things are not black and white.
So, yes, It might involve taking a different approach before 18 year olds are launched into adult prisons.
Meanwhile, we’re talking about college KIDS, 18-20 years old, all lit up with their egos and dreams of NBA glory and riches, prematurely opting for the NBA draft with a very narrow window of guaranteed $$$$’s.
So, yeah, they should be allowed to return to college IF they’re not drafted imo.
 
"Let each man here reflect back honestly on himself - mature at 20? 25? 30?
All I know is that I’ve taken decades to grow up emotionally (being mature in a relationship w a woman, displaying poise and patience with life’s challenges, being able to give and receive love .,,how to be grateful, how to heal from
Life’s inevitable scars...) and I sense I’m not alone. And with each few years I am a different person - for the better.

All the best "

Dear SS&G,
In your case, I absolutely believe in your continuing development. In my case I suspect failing memory impairs my understanding of just how rotten I truly am.
 
[quote="Chicago Days" post=289022][quote="Eric Williamson" post=289021][quote="Chicago Days" post=288984][quote="Eric Williamson" post=288983][quote="Monte" post=288896][quote="gman" post=288863][quote="Beast of the East" post=288862][quote="redmanwest" post=288854]Some saying MJP won't play this year, so... Don't know much about the Knox kid, but most picks at 9 have questions.

I am hung up on the fact that Delgado was not picked. No NBA team could use a proven low post scorer and pro caliber rebounder? I know that there is a premium now on shooters, but I would bet a ton of dough that Delgado will be a better NBA than DeVincenzo, albeit at different positions. DeVincenzo is a nice college player, and most love his athleticism, but I am not sure he translates to an NBA career, at his height etc. Could be wrong. Strikes me as a guy who smartly struck while the iron was hot.[/quote]

Very good post. I agree about Delgado. I think he is nasty strong, even for the NBA.[/quote]

A lot of good players don't get drafted. Rawle Alkins, Malik Newman, Alonzo Trier, etc.

A lot of teams like drafting these foreign players they can stash in the 2nd round.[/quote]

Why not figure out a way to let kids who don't get drafted return to college if they want?[/quote]

I do not support the idea of letting these undrafted 'kids' return to school. First off, they are 18-20yr old young men. They are not 'kids'. They are old enough to make their own decisions. No one forces them to enter the draft. They choose to leave college on their own, and in doing so voluntarily give up their remaining eligibility with the risk of going undrafted. It's a risk/reward decision that they make for themselves. If things don't work out, sorry, but they must live with the consequences.[/quote]

Nope, not so fast.
A growing body of science concludes that “critical parts of the brain are not fully developed until well after the age of 18... and “are not fully finished developing until about age 25...18 year olds are about halfway through that process...”
and “the brain’s reward system becomes highly active right around the time of puberty and then gradually goes back to an adult level...around age 25 and that makes young adults more interested in entering uncertain situations....”
This lends credence to allowing them to return if not drafted, imo.[/quote]


If your argument is that their brains are not fully developed until age 25, and until that point they make decisions irrationally based on some sort of instant/short term expectation/reward, and therefore they cannot mentally comprehend the ramifications of their actions and/or decisions, should that philosophy also be applied to all individuals in the age range, and not just athletes declaring for the draft? If a young adult knowingly breaks the law, are they justified in saying that they should not be punished because their brains are not fully developed and their brain's reward system is too active?[/quote]

Breaking the law is a different dynamic, man.
Obviously, people are ‘responsible’ for what they do,
But, all things are not black and white.
So, yes, It might involve taking a different approach before 18 year olds are launched into adult prisons.
Meanwhile, we’re talking about college KIDS, 18-20 years old, all lit up with their egos and dreams of NBA glory and riches, prematurely opting for the NBA draft with a very narrow window of guaranteed $$$$’s.
So, yeah, they should be allowed to return to college IF they’re not drafted imo.[/quote]

They are not kids....they are young adults, and should be treated as such. They are fully capable of understanding the consequences of their decisions. If another student fails out of college because they never studied or went to class, should the university be like, 'oh well, he/she was just a young, dumb kid?' I understand that everyone makes dumb decisions when we are that age, alot of them that we probably regret. But at the end of the day, we chose to make those decisions, and must live with the consequences. Simple as that.

Also, how is that going to affect recruiting? For example, say Arizona has no scholarships left for 2018-2019. Then Rawle declares for draft, and boom, a schollie opens up. They jump on another player right away and give him that last scholarship. Well Rawle goes undrafted and wants to go back to Arizona. Sorry, no scholarships available. I understand that that is something each school has to deal with individually, but it's something to think about.

Here's my solution: If you want to let undrafted players return to school, then fine. But they should be treated as a transfer player, and will be required to sit out a year.
 
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