Maryville Saints - Exhibition matchup

So my assessment based on commentary is that the season is circling the drain. So is the coaching staff. No Hurleys are available. Cluess is probably too old. We have a Duke AD, which means Tommy Amaker and his 1 NCAA Tournament appearance in 10 years as a high major coach is the most likely recipient of our scorn and derision next year. I should find out when spring training starts, because the Mets will be awesome next year, and should get adequately pumped for that. They will probably finish 4th in the NL East, and have at least 25 wins, should be enough for a bid come tourney-time.
 
It's really difficult to draw any definitive conclusions when you play against a D2 team. You blow them out, and it's a D2 team. The only thing you can be is negative based on a score that was too close and overall poor play, which is what happened last night.

Most D2 players have played with or against D1 before and are not intimidated. We exhibited very little of the physical superiority we possess except maybe for Figueroa and Simon (who looked much more like a forward than a guard last night).

Too often we looked disorganized, the way an orchestra sounds when they are warming up. Let's hope it's just that, Heron or no Heron.
 
Unlike a previous poster,I liked our defensive intensity for the most part. It looks like they are going to press a lot. The only shortcoming on D was 3-Pt defense. That being said, a few of the threes given up were hoisted up as soon as they got over half-court. Some were contested and just went in. One was when a player grabbed a loose ball with a second left on the clock and just threw it up and it went in.

Offensively, I wasn’t too impressed. The positive was that we made a concerted effort to get the ball inside to Keita. Also, we got a few offensive boards. Otherwise, it looked rather disorganized and we threw up a few too many threes when we weren’t hitting them. I didn’t see too many well run set plays. It’s early, so I hope they improve on that.
 
[quote="Beast of the East" post=300091]
Most D2 players have played with or against D1 before and are not intimidated.
[/quote]

#3 was their best player, and it was confirmed on Rumble that he was a transfer from Eastern Illinois. Looks like he got some burn there, too. 6 ppg as a sophomore. Not a surprise, if you watched him play last night.

I actually think their coach might have gotten a bit too cute with him. Took him out when he was really rolling, to give him some extra rest at the under 8 media TO, and he and the Maryville offense never looked the same after that. His 3-pointer with 7:05 left was Maryville's final FG.
 
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They should have Keita walk around with a basketball in his hand 24/7. Had the same issue with a kid I coached in AAU. It helps believe me.
 
[quote="Mario DiMaria" post=300100]They should have Keita walk around with a basketball in his hand 24/7. Had the same issue with a kid I coached in AAU. It helps believe me.[/quote]

Not like that idiot Yakwe, who carried books :)
 
[quote="Beast of the East" post=300091]It's really difficult to draw any definitive conclusions when you play against a D2 team. You blow them out, and it's a D2 team. The only thing you can be is negative based on a score that was too close and overall poor play, which is what happened last night.

Most D2 players have played with or against D1 before and are not intimidated. We exhibited very little of the physical superiority we possess except maybe for Figueroa and Simon (who looked much more like a forward than a guard last night).

Too often we looked disorganized, the way an orchestra sounds when they are warming up. Let's hope it's just that, Heron or no Heron.[/quote]

If anyone has ever played any form of organized sports they would have a better understanding that regardless of classification of divisions or experience teams will play up or down to their competition. It is just how it works. I mean look at the bright side, at least we decisively won. There was a point in time we had a good chance of losing to a high school team.
 
We knew we had a tendency to play down to bums, so that's what I'm hoping happened even though there's no excuse. My big concern over anything else is that we do not look like we have any chemistry or plan. Yes LJ and Keita are new, but Ponds, Clark, and Simon should know each other by now and play like it. They didn't. We were actually there on many of the 3's they shot, however the hands were not up in their face. Still don't get why the 3 pt defense issue hasn't been at least improved a bit. A well-coached team can take a bunch of individuals and form a cohesive team that plays together to their strengths and makes each other better. We look like a bunch of individuals out there.
 
[quote="Roamer" post=300103][quote="Beast of the East" post=300091]It's really difficult to draw any definitive conclusions when you play against a D2 team. You blow them out, and it's a D2 team. The only thing you can be is negative based on a score that was too close and overall poor play, which is what happened last night.

Most D2 players have played with or against D1 before and are not intimidated. We exhibited very little of the physical superiority we possess except maybe for Figueroa and Simon (who looked much more like a forward than a guard last night).

Too often we looked disorganized, the way an orchestra sounds when they are warming up. Let's hope it's just that, Heron or no Heron.[/quote]

If anyone has ever played any form of organized sports they would have a better understanding that regardless of classification of divisions or experience teams will play up or down to their competition. It is just how it works. I mean look at the bright side, at least we decisively won. There was a point in time we had a good chance of losing to a high school team.[/quote] Decisive win? :whistle:
 
[quote="SJU1512" post=300079]Offensively I actually thought team looked like they were further along than Nov. 1. Shamorie had a weird game but if Shamorie is one of the bigger concerns in an exhibition that's probably a good thing given how we know he competes when lights are on :) . Figgy goes without saying but Keita looked outstanding as well and if Heron is anything close to advertised we added 3 major pieces that can impact this level. Major.

I think Dixon may struggle early at this level, small and not that quick, but seems skilled and is nice depth. A little surprised/concerned Williams didn't play given how Dixon looked. Trimble looked solid and when Heron is back I don't think it's a given Dixon will be taking the reserve guard minutes from him. Being able to physically compete really matters especially as SJU is undersized.

That all said scrimmage or no scrimmage difficult to watch last night and not be concerned about this team defensively. You wouldn't expect a baseball player to pick up a bat in January and time 100mph. But you would expect him not to step in the bucket repeatedly, and that's what SJU did defensively last night.

Either the staff has a severely flawed defensive philosophy that the players are executing as asked, or the players aren't executing a more favorable defensive strategy that the staff is trying to implement. I tend to think it's the former because this is mostly fundamental stuff that has been persistent across seasons. It's not an effort thing as guys seemed really engaged and active last night. But it's not enough to have length and athleticism and effort. Defense is a team sport. Two consistent breakdowns that have been and continue to be bone crunching:

1. There were probably conservatively 10+ times last night that we had 5 guys with at least one foot on the strong side of the rim line. Yes, theoretically that's how you might exaggeratedly teach a youth team to play help defense. But this is high major division 1 basketball in an era when the 3 is being emphasized probably more than ever. Our extreme help creates 3s that wide open wouldn't even begin to describe. Think about the amount of corner 3s Maryville created by driving baseline - with absolutely no play on the rim - and drawing 2-3 white shirts. It's too easy which even Maryville was able to remind last night and we don't need to imagine what better teams can do against this because we watched our 3pt fg defense last year. We need to take more chances with contested shots at the rim (especially since Keita seems like he can alter) as opposed to taking that away and giving away the 3 point line almost completely.

2. We don't defend screens. Not on the ball, not off the ball. In the P&R you either hedge and recover or fight underneath. We seemingly do neither, with both of our guys just sort of drifting with the ball, which kind of prevents the drive (?), but even if it does leaves the screener mostly wide open. This is largely why teams with bigs who can shoot have crushed us in the pick and pop and last night it was there again almost whenever Maryville wanted it. Off the ball you need the man on the screener to get a bump on the opposing player coming off the screen so he can't take his desired path from A to B. With our physical advantage last night we should have been blowing these guys up every time they wanted to come off a screen to the point where they didn't want to run motion off the ball anymore. Instead late in game with game on line Maryville runs a basic downscreen unimpeded for a wide open 3. It would genuinely be unacceptable to have that little resistance on that play if we were defending Draymond Green screening for Klay Thompson. To have it happen last night really makes you wonder if there even is a defensive approach.

Given how basic this stuff is I hope it changes, but given how long it's been going on I don't know if it does. If so team is going to have to press for close to 40, which they probably should anyway to take advantage of skillset, but this sort of defensive approach in the half court will almost necessitate it. Maybe too harsh for a scrimmage, but that was mind boggling last night for a pick-up game let alone right before it starts to count, and only more concerning because consistent with what we've seen previously. I think this team is really going to score but they are going to have to score a lot unless they make some pretty material changes defensively.[/quote]

You teach defense. We just don't have the teachers to teach that aspect of the game which is basically absent in NBA players. We have two former NBA players coaching kids but there is very little teaching going on from what we have seen over these past 3 years.
 
Everyone relax..it's an exhibition! I know we didn't play all that well but we got a pleasant surprise from LJ. Heron didn't play and Ponds had an off night (the T was bad I must admit) This game means nothing. I am full of Hope that this team does well. Can we save the "jump off the cliff" comments till we play a game that actually counts.
 
[quote="plandome4" post=300117]Everyone relax..it's an exhibition! I know we didn't play all that well but we got a pleasant surprise from LJ. Heron didn't play and Ponds had an off night (the T was bad I must admit) This game means nothing. I am full of Hope that this team does well. Can we save the "jump off the cliff" comments till we play a game that actually counts.[/quote]

Neither players nor fans are in mid-season form yet. Both working out the cobwebs. Don't worry.
 
Ponds did not have an off night---he was not serious during warm ups and it carried over into the game.He had an attitude best changed but consistant with coach jawing at refs I spent the night thinking we might lose to an undersized Div2 school
 
The only true positive I saw was Figueroa, who looked very talented and was clearly engaged. Three point defense was bad, but not as bad as it looked in a box score, at least three of the shots were total prayers that were answered. Just as concerning to me was three point offense, this was a huge problem last year and it is hard to win in basketball in 2018 without consistent outside shooting.

As for the freshman, they didn’t play because the team never put the game away. In any meaningful game you are going to play eight, maybe nine, some of these guys are going to see very little burn. If you really wanted them to play yesterday were you also fine if they lost? Based on the posts after a closed door scrimmage I don’t think so.
 
Years ago there was a significant drop off in talent between major ,mid major, div 2 and so on. Each year the gap seems to close.
There are so many talented players out there and unlike years ago when schools would not admit recruits because of grades every one gets admitted so the pool of players gets bigger and bigger and there are so many AAU teams playing so many games the number of talented players seems to keep increasing.
 
[quote="Enright" post=300131]Years ago there was a significant drop off in talent between major ,mid major, div 2 and so on. Each year the gap seems to close.
There are so many talented players out there and unlike years ago when schools would not admit recruits because of grades every one gets admitted so the pool of players gets bigger and bigger and there are so many AAU teams playing so many games the number of talented players seems to keep increasing.[/quote]

While not using this as an excuse for our performance, I still didnt think we played great, I fully agree with this. Plus we all know the 3 pointer is the great equalizer. Doesn't matter who we are playing. If it's a team that can shoot, they are going to hang around with us. For whatever reason we cannot guard the 3.
 
Did not view the game, but have one question. Did we play any zone defense, either straight-up, transitioning from press, or even on out of bounds plays?
 
[quote="Room112" post=300135][quote="Enright" post=300131]Years ago there was a significant drop off in talent between major ,mid major, div 2 and so on. Each year the gap seems to close.
There are so many talented players out there and unlike years ago when schools would not admit recruits because of grades every one gets admitted so the pool of players gets bigger and bigger and there are so many AAU teams playing so many games the number of talented players seems to keep increasing.[/quote]

While not using this as an excuse for our performance, I still didnt think we played great, I fully agree with this. Plus we all know the 3 pointer is the great equalizer. Doesn't matter who we are playing. If it's a team that can shoot, they are going to hang around with us. For whatever reason we cannot guard the 3.[/quote]

Against a tiny team like Maryville you can easily extend the defense and not worry about their inside game but Simon, Marvin and Ponds have been together long enough to know that even if our coaches are not demanding it. An offense has to have Rhythm and to have Rhythm you need a good conductor. Ponds casually walking the ball up and hoisting a three pointer without ever passing the ball once is not going to impress scouts.
 
[quote="Las Vegan" post=300143]Did not view the game, but have one question. Did we play any zone defense, either straight-up, transitioning from press, or even on out of bounds plays?[/quote]

LMFAO!
 
[quote="Roamer" post=300103][quote="Beast of the East" post=300091]It's really difficult to draw any definitive conclusions when you play against a D2 team. You blow them out, and it's a D2 team. The only thing you can be is negative based on a score that was too close and overall poor play, which is what happened last night.

Most D2 players have played with or against D1 before and are not intimidated. We exhibited very little of the physical superiority we possess except maybe for Figueroa and Simon (who looked much more like a forward than a guard last night).

Too often we looked disorganized, the way an orchestra sounds when they are warming up. Let's hope it's just that, Heron or no Heron.[/quote]

If anyone has ever played any form of organized sports they would have a better understanding that regardless of classification of divisions or experience teams will play up or down to their competition. It is just how it works. I mean look at the bright side, at least we decisively won. There was a point in time we had a good chance of losing to a high school team.[/quote]

So motivate them. Tell them if we're up by 25+ at halftime, in the 2nd half you guys can play street ball. No set plays, just do as you want, but if it gets to 15pnts, I'm taking over again.
 
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