Lavin and the new league

[MCNPA]

Tubby's record in-conference isn't great at Minnesota but he's still 117-65 overall. Agree he could do better in the league, but it isnt like he's pulling his weight. Minnesota is a very hard place to recruit to which IMO is the biggest problem,

You are correct .... He is not pulling his weight for $2 million! LOL!

I actually meant to say it isn't like he's not pulling his own weight. His overall record is good. Agree that 2-mil per year is expensive for any coach not in the top 4 in his conference every year. Like I said though, Minnesota a tough place to recruit to it seems, although I could be wrong. He can certainly do better, but I'd caution criticizing his record as it is excellent overall.

 

[1and1sju]

We should renew this Tubby debate in about a week; next 3 games Minnesots plays at #12 Illionois, at #5 Indiana, and home for #2 Michigan.

He survives that stretch and Minnesota will be looking pretty.

Also, MCN, you said in your post that SJU's problems have been mostly hustle and discipline.. stemming from our sometimes poor defense and rebounding. It may not be "in-game coaching" per se, but if ever there is an area a coach can impact a team it's on their level of hustle and discipline, no?
Maybe in game coaching is overrated, you could be right about that, but those two things are the first signs of good coaching are they not?

I'm actually not criticizing coach Lavin here, - we played real hard against Cincy, I'm just saying its weird for you to defend him and then say our biggest problems are hustle and defense. Huh?

 

[Class of 72]

Tubby's record in-conference isn't great at Minnesota but he's still 117-65 overall. Agree he could do better in the league, but it isnt like he's pulling his weight. Minnesota is a very hard place to recruit to which IMO is the biggest problem,

You are correct .... He is not pulling his weight for $2 million! LOL!

I actually meant to say it isn't like he's not pulling his own weight. His overall record is good. Agree that 2-mil per year is expensive for any coach not in the top 4 in his conference every year. Like I said though, Minnesota a tough place to recruit to it seems, although I could be wrong. He can certainly do better, but I'd caution criticizing his record as it is excellent overall.

I know what you meant to say my friend, just breaking balls! LOL!
If you think Minnesota is a tough place to recruit try Milwaukee (Marquette) or Waco (Baylor).... Ever been to Iowa states' great home town? LOL!
I almost forgot the most tundra place of all.....our favorite nemesis Syracuse! LOL!
I would take Minneapolis over Syracuse any day......no offense to our many alums in the north country.

 

[MCNPA]

We should renew this Tubby debate in about a week; next 3 games Minnesots plays at #12 Illionois, at #5 Indiana, and home for #2 Michigan.

He survives that stretch and Minnesota will be looking pretty.

Also, MCN, you said in your post that SJU's problems have been mostly hustle and discipline.. stemming from our sometimes poor defense and rebounding. It may not be "in-game coaching" per se, but if ever there is an area a coach can impact a team it's on their level of hustle and discipline, no?
Maybe in game coaching is overrated, you could be right about that, but those two things are the first signs of good coaching are they not?

I'm actually not criticizing coach Lavin here, - we played real hard against Cincy, I'm just saying its weird for you to defend him and then say our biggest problems are hustle and defense. Huh?

Actually, with young players, getting them to hustle at both ends is one of the hardest things for any coach. Players tend to start understanding betterthe little things they need to do to win as they get older which is why teams with more upperclassmen generally fare better. Young players straight out of HS are too busy playing on adrenaline and looking to dunk and score. They coast back on defense etc. you saw the Cincy game and it is obvious they are being taught these things. They aren't always going out and doing them and playing at both ends like they need to. I'm hoping these kids had an epiphany instead of wondering why they weren't winning. It was a simple formula against Cincy, which was playing harder on the glass and the defensive end. The strategy was fine.

 

[Section9]

I'd also say talent usually trumps all

True...at the end of the day you are probably right. Cuse and Kentucky are going to be good whether it's a HS coach or a decent college coach at the helm.

Your theory didn't work for Tubby Smith while he was at UK, and after about five years, if he lasts that long, it's not going to work with Hopkins either.

Are you referring to the same Tubby Smith who spent 10 yrs at UK?
Went the Dance all 10 yrs?
1 Championship
3 Elite 8's
2 Sweet 16's
Went 263-83 for a winning percentage of 76%

Guy wins non stop

Then why'd he leave and wind up at Minnesota? My point is Cal recruits like crazy and he's the reason UK is at a higher level than when they had Tubby. Plus, who was the coach right after Rupp, can't remeber his name, but he wasn't as successful either.

 

[Mean Gene]

I'd also say talent usually trumps all

True...at the end of the day you are probably right. Cuse and Kentucky are going to be good whether it's a HS coach or a decent college coach at the helm.

Your theory didn't work for Tubby Smith while he was at UK, and after about five years, if he lasts that long, it's not going to work with Hopkins either.

Are you referring to the same Tubby Smith who spent 10 yrs at UK?
Went the Dance all 10 yrs?
1 Championship
3 Elite 8's
2 Sweet 16's
Went 263-83 for a winning percentage of 76%

Guy wins non stop

Then why'd he leave and wind up at Minnesota? My point is Cal recruits like crazy and he's the reason UK is at a higher level than when they had Tubby. Plus, who was the coach right after Rupp, can't remeber his name, but he wasn't as successful either.

I think after Rupp it was Joe B. Hall and I think he was a successful coach. There might have been someone in between Rupp and Hall.

 

[Mean Gene]

Joe B. Hall succeeded Adolph Rupp and had a record of 297 -100. He averaged 22 wins and 7 losses over 13 seasons.

 

[Moose]

I'd also say talent usually trumps all

True...at the end of the day you are probably right. Cuse and Kentucky are going to be good whether it's a HS coach or a decent college coach at the helm.

Your theory didn't work for Tubby Smith while he was at UK, and after about five years, if he lasts that long, it's not going to work with Hopkins either.

Are you referring to the same Tubby Smith who spent 10 yrs at UK?
Went the Dance all 10 yrs?
1 Championship
3 Elite 8's
2 Sweet 16's
Went 263-83 for a winning percentage of 76%

Guy wins non stop

Then why'd he leave and wind up at Minnesota? My point is Cal recruits like crazy and he's the reason UK is at a higher level than when they had Tubby. Plus, who was the coach right after Rupp, can't remeber his name, but he wasn't as successful either.

He left because he knew the natives were getting antsy. Kentucky is like UCLA. Ridiculous expectations.

Your right about Cal. Only a matter of time before he leaves Kentucky with question marks and bad press like he did his previous stops.

 

[Marillac]

The first post in this thread is ridiculous. Lavin is nothing less than a saving grace for this program. We spent years looking for diamonds in the rough from the remaining kids that big boys didn't want. Lavin changed that from jump street. He had his first top 100 kid within his first month and he hasn't look back since.

We start two freshman bigs and three sophs--one of which who has played all of two games at STJ and less than 20 in his career. Recruiting trumps coaching any day of the week. If Moe didn't leave for the NBA we'd be a Sweet 16 team. If Sampson was eligible, we'd probably have a few more wins and be on the cusp of a making a run at the top 25. Those things happen, but this team in too you and too unskilled at this point to overcome that. Talk about Kentucky all you want, the fact is they always had a few upperclassmen next to the young guns (Josh Harrelson, Darius Miller, Eloy Vargas, DeAndre Liggins).

I can't wait to have a roster with top 100 juniors and seniors that Lavin recruited, and to break into that top 20 talent pool when the team starts winning.

 

[Class of 72]

The first post in this thread is ridiculous. Lavin is nothing less than a saving grace for this program. We spent years looking for diamonds in the rough from the remaining kids that big boys didn't want. Lavin changed that from jump street. He had his first top 100 kid within his first month and he hasn't look back since.

We start two freshman bigs and three sophs--one of which who has played all of two games at STJ and less than 20 in his career. Recruiting trumps coaching any day of the week. If Moe didn't leave for the NBA we'd be a Sweet 16 team. If Sampson was eligible, we'd probably have a few more wins and be on the cusp of a making a run at the top 25. Those things happen, but this team in too you and too unskilled at this point to overcome that. Talk about Kentucky all you want, the fact is they always had a few upperclassmen next to the young guns (Josh Harrelson, Darius Miller, Eloy Vargas, DeAndre Liggins).

I can't wait to have a roster with top 100 juniors and seniors that Lavin recruited, and to break into that top 20 talent pool when the team starts winning.

If Moe was still here AND Orlando was eligible this would likely be an undefeated team, nationally ranked and the scalpers would have returned to Carnesecca Arena. Right now I would settle for Sanchez and a run in the Big East.

 

[Moose]

The first post in this thread is ridiculous. Lavin is nothing less than a saving grace for this program. We spent years looking for diamonds in the rough from the remaining kids that big boys didn't want. Lavin changed that from jump street. He had his first top 100 kid within his first month and he hasn't look back since.

We start two freshman bigs and three sophs--one of which who has played all of two games at STJ and less than 20 in his career. Recruiting trumps coaching any day of the week. If Moe didn't leave for the NBA we'd be a Sweet 16 team. If Sampson was eligible, we'd probably have a few more wins and be on the cusp of a making a run at the top 25. Those things happen, but this team in too you and too unskilled at this point to overcome that. Talk about Kentucky all you want, the fact is they always had a few upperclassmen next to the young guns (Josh Harrelson, Darius Miller, Eloy Vargas, DeAndre Liggins).

I can't wait to have a roster with top 100 juniors and seniors that Lavin recruited, and to break into that top 20 talent pool when the team starts winning.

If Moe was still here AND Orlando was eligible this would likely be an undefeated team, nationally ranked and the scalpers would have returned to Carnesecca Arena. Right now I would settle for Sanchez and a run in the Big East.

If Moe was still here we wouldn't have Orlando.

 

[lawmanfan]

If Moe was still here we wouldn't have Orlando.

Amusing, since Moe is in Orlando.
And also, since we don't really have Orlando, do we. At least, not yet.

 

[Class of 72]

The first post in this thread is ridiculous. Lavin is nothing less than a saving grace for this program. We spent years looking for diamonds in the rough from the remaining kids that big boys didn't want. Lavin changed that from jump street. He had his first top 100 kid within his first month and he hasn't look back since.

We start two freshman bigs and three sophs--one of which who has played all of two games at STJ and less than 20 in his career. Recruiting trumps coaching any day of the week. If Moe didn't leave for the NBA we'd be a Sweet 16 team. If Sampson was eligible, we'd probably have a few more wins and be on the cusp of a making a run at the top 25. Those things happen, but this team in too you and too unskilled at this point to overcome that. Talk about Kentucky all you want, the fact is they always had a few upperclassmen next to the young guns (Josh Harrelson, Darius Miller, Eloy Vargas, DeAndre Liggins).

I can't wait to have a roster with top 100 juniors and seniors that Lavin recruited, and to break into that top 20 talent pool when the team starts winning.

If Moe was still here AND Orlando was eligible this would likely be an undefeated team, nationally ranked and the scalpers would have returned to Carnesecca Arena. Right now I would settle for Sanchez and a run in the Big East.

If Moe was still here we wouldn't have Orlando.

I disagree. We would not have Christain Jones and Lavin would have still sat Gift.
Moe, Sanchez, Karr, Garrett and Obepka would have looked like a Big East front line.
I would have also redshirted Pointer if possible.

 

[Moose]

The first post in this thread is ridiculous. Lavin is nothing less than a saving grace for this program. We spent years looking for diamonds in the rough from the remaining kids that big boys didn't want. Lavin changed that from jump street. He had his first top 100 kid within his first month and he hasn't look back since.

We start two freshman bigs and three sophs--one of which who has played all of two games at STJ and less than 20 in his career. Recruiting trumps coaching any day of the week. If Moe didn't leave for the NBA we'd be a Sweet 16 team. If Sampson was eligible, we'd probably have a few more wins and be on the cusp of a making a run at the top 25. Those things happen, but this team in too you and too unskilled at this point to overcome that. Talk about Kentucky all you want, the fact is they always had a few upperclassmen next to the young guns (Josh Harrelson, Darius Miller, Eloy Vargas, DeAndre Liggins).

I can't wait to have a roster with top 100 juniors and seniors that Lavin recruited, and to break into that top 20 talent pool when the team starts winning.

If Moe was still here AND Orlando was eligible this would likely be an undefeated team, nationally ranked and the scalpers would have returned to Carnesecca Arena. Right now I would settle for Sanchez and a run in the Big East.

If Moe was still here we wouldn't have Orlando.

I disagree. We would not have Christain Jones and Lavin would have still sat Gift.
Moe, Sanchez, Karr, Garrett and Obepka would have looked like a Big East front line.
I would have also redshirted Pointer if possible.

We wouldn't have Jones either. But I also don' think Sanchez would be here. When Moe left the interest level ballooned from his camp.