It's On Lavin This Year

[lawmanfan]

It looks as though our team is made up of two distinct elements this year: (1) an experienced backcourt that ought to provide the majority of the points we score; and (2) a group of post players who aren't likely to demand the ball and who have the size to clear space, grab rebounds, and clean up the garbage.

That is a clear change from the past few seasons, where there has been some tension about ball distribution between the guards and a frontcourt star. By tension I don't mean friction, only that there is only one ball to go around, and it has never seemed to me that Lavin's teams had a plan they were comfortable with about who gets the ball where and when to take a shot.

I think that this year's group has components that could be blended into a real team, one in which everybody has a role and knows what it is. That sort of clarity helps players play together on offense and defense, and gets you to a place where the whole is greater than the sum of the parts.

If we can do that, then I think we can have a very nice season.

I also think that just about 100% of the responsibility for that rests with the coach. There's no more "we're the youngest team in the country," no more "we're learning to play together," no more "we lost this guy to the NBA after one year," etc. It's the coach's job to take this group, find roles for them (which really shouldn't be that hard given the cast of characters), give them a plan, manage the personalities, create a team character, and put them in a position to succeed.

Moreover, those decisions should be made very early in the year, instead of experimenting until mid-December before settling on a plan.

 

[19854ever]

Lawman good post, the concern i have is the front court, The De La Rosa brothers are deemed not ready or fit enough to play at this level, Keith Thomas may not be eligible, and we are left with Amir or Sir Dom playing out of position.

Too many questions again, and built in excuses for Steve (Sanchez graduated Jakarr left for the NBA) etc. I hope they can win but would not be surprised if its another NIT year.

 

[paultzman]

Lawman good post, the concern i have is the front court, The De La Rosa brothers are deemed not ready or fit enough to play at this level, Keith Thomas may not be eligible, and we are left with Amir or Sir Dom playing out of position.

Too many questions again, and built in excuses for Steve (Sanchez graduated Jakarr left for the NBA) etc. I hope they can win but would not be surprised if its another NIT year.

Losing Thomas, which appears likely, we are screwed. Good to support the program, but any notion that Joey & Adonis can fill this void is misplaced. Teams will really take to Obekpa to draw fouls. Your NIT forecast,sans Thomas, is reasonable. Very frustrating, but then again, "We are Saint John's".

 

[TobinGrad]

It was 100% on Lavin last year as well. Hes only here now because there was a transition going on and no one anticipated nor was prepared to act on his failure last season. The absence of Thomas is no excuse for not making and advancing in the tourney this year. There are less talented teams who will make it in this year.

There really is no excuse for not being ranked and advancing in the tourney this season. Barely slipping in as a bubble team and losing in the first round with a team this experienced should result in Lavin losing his job.

 

[Jack Williams]

Lawman good post, the concern i have is the front court, The De La Rosa brothers are deemed not ready or fit enough to play at this level, Keith Thomas may not be eligible, and we are left with Amir or Sir Dom playing out of position.

Too many questions again, and built in excuses for Steve (Sanchez graduated Jakarr left for the NBA) etc. I hope they can win but would not be surprised if its another NIT year.

Losing Thomas, which appears likely, we are screwed. Good to support the program, but any notion that Joey & Adonis can fill this void is misplaced. Teams will really take to Obekpa to draw fouls. Your NIT forecast,sans Thomas, is reasonable. Very frustrating, but then again, "We are Saint John's".

Back to square one before we got Thomas. The notion then was "we go as far as our back court takes us" that's how this year is going to be the way this situation is looking.

Jones is our final hope, which is not a great thing, IMO. Maybe he made strides, but you made a great point about CO, the dude will get in foul trouble. Does anyone trust jones to man the post for maybe 15 mpg at the center position??? Answer should be a resounding no, and i hope I'm sooo wrong about CJ, but I don't see it. I like jones and think he's a good player and is going to be much better than he showed 2 years ago, but it's looking like he might be getting thrown into a situation that he might not be able to handle, which is playing more than 20 minutes a game.

 

[monte]

It was 100% on Lavin last year as well. Hes only here now because there was a transition going on and no one anticipated nor was prepared to act on his failure last season. The absence of Thomas is no excuse for not making and advancing in the tourney this year. There are less talented teams who will make it in this year.

There really is no excuse for not being ranked and advancing in the tourney this season. Barely slipping in as a bubble team and losing in the first round with a team this experienced should result in Lavin losing his job.

I'm so beaten down that I would kill for an NCAA berth and first round elimination.

 

[Jack Williams]

It was 100% on Lavin last year as well. Hes only here now because there was a transition going on and no one anticipated nor was prepared to act on his failure last season. The absence of Thomas is no excuse for not making and advancing in the tourney this year. There are less talented teams who will make it in this year.

There really is no excuse for not being ranked and advancing in the tourney this season. Barely slipping in as a bubble team and losing in the first round with a team this experienced should result in Lavin losing his job.

Disagree. Big time. If Lavin takes this team to the tournament, and gets the 2015 class we are dreaming of, regardless of a 1st round exit, he's staying.

 

[monte]

Lawman good post, the concern i have is the front court, The De La Rosa brothers are deemed not ready or fit enough to play at this level, Keith Thomas may not be eligible, and we are left with Amir or Sir Dom playing out of position.

Too many questions again, and built in excuses for Steve (Sanchez graduated Jakarr left for the NBA) etc. I hope they can win but would not be surprised if its another NIT year.

Losing Thomas, which appears likely, we are screwed. Good to support the program, but any notion that Joey & Adonis can fill this void is misplaced. Teams will really take to Obekpa to draw fouls. Your NIT forecast,sans Thomas, is reasonable. Very frustrating, but then again, "We are Saint John's".

Back to square one before we got Thomas. The notion then was "we go as far as our back court takes us" that's how this year is going to be the way this situation is looking.

Jones is our final hope, which is not a great thing, IMO. Maybe he made strides, but you made a great point about CO, the dude will get in foul trouble. Does anyone trust jones to man the post for maybe 15 mpg at the center position??? Answer should be a resounding no, and i hope I'm sooo wrong about CJ, but I don't see it. I like jones and think he's a good player and is going to be much better than he showed 2 years ago, but it's looking like he might be getting thrown into a situation that he might not be able to handle, which is playing more than 20 minutes a game.

Even with Thomas, we have a bunch of roll players up front. Lets hope we get a stellar year out of our backcourt and that Lavin can mix and match our front court guys and get decent productivity out of the bunch.

 

[Jack Williams]

Lawman good post, the concern i have is the front court, The De La Rosa brothers are deemed not ready or fit enough to play at this level, Keith Thomas may not be eligible, and we are left with Amir or Sir Dom playing out of position.

Too many questions again, and built in excuses for Steve (Sanchez graduated Jakarr left for the NBA) etc. I hope they can win but would not be surprised if its another NIT year.

Losing Thomas, which appears likely, we are screwed. Good to support the program, but any notion that Joey & Adonis can fill this void is misplaced. Teams will really take to Obekpa to draw fouls. Your NIT forecast,sans Thomas, is reasonable. Very frustrating, but then again, "We are Saint John's".

Back to square one before we got Thomas. The notion then was "we go as far as our back court takes us" that's how this year is going to be the way this situation is looking.

Jones is our final hope, which is not a great thing, IMO. Maybe he made strides, but you made a great point about CO, the dude will get in foul trouble. Does anyone trust jones to man the post for maybe 15 mpg at the center position??? Answer should be a resounding no, and i hope I'm sooo wrong about CJ, but I don't see it. I like jones and think he's a good player and is going to be much better than he showed 2 years ago, but it's looking like he might be getting thrown into a situation that he might not be able to handle, which is playing more than 20 minutes a game.

Even with Thomas, we have a bunch of roll players up front. Lets hope we get a stellar year out of our backcourt and that Lavin can mix and match our front court guys and get decent productivity out of the bunch.

Without Thomas our front court stands as (let me know if I'm forgetting anyone)


Obekpa
Pointer
Jones
JDR
ADR
Amar


The top 3 will play, the bottom 3 are giant question marks. If Amar comes in and hits threes, cool, but we need rebounding.

 

[monte]

Lawman good post, the concern i have is the front court, The De La Rosa brothers are deemed not ready or fit enough to play at this level, Keith Thomas may not be eligible, and we are left with Amir or Sir Dom playing out of position.

Too many questions again, and built in excuses for Steve (Sanchez graduated Jakarr left for the NBA) etc. I hope they can win but would not be surprised if its another NIT year.

Losing Thomas, which appears likely, we are screwed. Good to support the program, but any notion that Joey & Adonis can fill this void is misplaced. Teams will really take to Obekpa to draw fouls. Your NIT forecast,sans Thomas, is reasonable. Very frustrating, but then again, "We are Saint John's".

Back to square one before we got Thomas. The notion then was "we go as far as our back court takes us" that's how this year is going to be the way this situation is looking.

Jones is our final hope, which is not a great thing, IMO. Maybe he made strides, but you made a great point about CO, the dude will get in foul trouble. Does anyone trust jones to man the post for maybe 15 mpg at the center position??? Answer should be a resounding no, and i hope I'm sooo wrong about CJ, but I don't see it. I like jones and think he's a good player and is going to be much better than he showed 2 years ago, but it's looking like he might be getting thrown into a situation that he might not be able to handle, which is playing more than 20 minutes a game.

Even with Thomas, we have a bunch of roll players up front. Lets hope we get a stellar year out of our backcourt and that Lavin can mix and match our front court guys and get decent productivity out of the bunch.

Without Thomas our front court stands as (let me know if I'm forgetting anyone)


Obekpa
Pointer
Jones
JDR
ADR
Amar


The top 3 will play, the bottom 3 are giant question marks. If Amar comes in and hits threes, cool, but we need rebounding.

Sounds about right except seems like Amar will get a fair amount of PT. The DLR bros will be on the bench for the most part.

 

[redfazed]

Lawman good post, the concern i have is the front court, The De La Rosa brothers are deemed not ready or fit enough to play at this level, Keith Thomas may not be eligible, and we are left with Amir or Sir Dom playing out of position.

Too many questions again, and built in excuses for Steve (Sanchez graduated Jakarr left for the NBA) etc. I hope they can win but would not be surprised if its another NIT year.

Losing Thomas, which appears likely, we are screwed. Good to support the program, but any notion that Joey & Adonis can fill this void is misplaced. Teams will really take to Obekpa to draw fouls. Your NIT forecast,sans Thomas, is reasonable. Very frustrating, but then again, "We are Saint John's".

Back to square one before we got Thomas. The notion then was "we go as far as our back court takes us" that's how this year is going to be the way this situation is looking.

Jones is our final hope, which is not a great thing, IMO. Maybe he made strides, but you made a great point about CO, the dude will get in foul trouble. Does anyone trust jones to man the post for maybe 15 mpg at the center position??? Answer should be a resounding no, and i hope I'm sooo wrong about CJ, but I don't see it. I like jones and think he's a good player and is going to be much better than he showed 2 years ago, but it's looking like he might be getting thrown into a situation that he might not be able to handle, which is playing more than 20 minutes a game.

Even with Thomas, we have a bunch of roll players up front. Lets hope we get a stellar year out of our backcourt and that Lavin can mix and match our front court guys and get decent productivity out of the bunch.

Without Thomas our front court stands as (let me know if I'm forgetting anyone)


Obekpa
Pointer
Jones
JDR
ADR
Amar


The top 3 will play, the bottom 3 are giant question marks. If Amar comes in and hits threes, cool, but we need rebounding.

I read the comments of people who were at the open practice and it seemed like Amar was in some ways more impressive than Thomas. I believe someone said that Thomas was not able to keep up the pace at times and not all contributing offensively. On top of that the draftexpress.com guy saw the team practice and commented on Amar being "interesting" but said nothing about Thomas.

Could it be possible that Amar is the better player to begin with? I don't know the answer...just speculating.

 

[Jack Williams]

Lawman good post, the concern i have is the front court, The De La Rosa brothers are deemed not ready or fit enough to play at this level, Keith Thomas may not be eligible, and we are left with Amir or Sir Dom playing out of position.

Too many questions again, and built in excuses for Steve (Sanchez graduated Jakarr left for the NBA) etc. I hope they can win but would not be surprised if its another NIT year.

Losing Thomas, which appears likely, we are screwed. Good to support the program, but any notion that Joey & Adonis can fill this void is misplaced. Teams will really take to Obekpa to draw fouls. Your NIT forecast,sans Thomas, is reasonable. Very frustrating, but then again, "We are Saint John's".

Back to square one before we got Thomas. The notion then was "we go as far as our back court takes us" that's how this year is going to be the way this situation is looking.

Jones is our final hope, which is not a great thing, IMO. Maybe he made strides, but you made a great point about CO, the dude will get in foul trouble. Does anyone trust jones to man the post for maybe 15 mpg at the center position??? Answer should be a resounding no, and i hope I'm sooo wrong about CJ, but I don't see it. I like jones and think he's a good player and is going to be much better than he showed 2 years ago, but it's looking like he might be getting thrown into a situation that he might not be able to handle, which is playing more than 20 minutes a game.

Even with Thomas, we have a bunch of roll players up front. Lets hope we get a stellar year out of our backcourt and that Lavin can mix and match our front court guys and get decent productivity out of the bunch.

Without Thomas our front court stands as (let me know if I'm forgetting anyone)


Obekpa
Pointer
Jones
JDR
ADR
Amar


The top 3 will play, the bottom 3 are giant question marks. If Amar comes in and hits threes, cool, but we need rebounding.

I read the comments of people who were at the open practice and it seemed like Amar was in some ways more impressive than Thomas. I believe someone said that Thomas was not able to keep up the pace at times and not all contributing offensively. On top of that the draftexpress.com guy saw the team practice and commented on Amar being "interesting" but said nothing about Thomas.

Could it be possible that Amar is the better player to begin with? I don't know the answer...just speculating.

Don't know, but at this point I sure hope so!

 

[monte]

Lawman good post, the concern i have is the front court, The De La Rosa brothers are deemed not ready or fit enough to play at this level, Keith Thomas may not be eligible, and we are left with Amir or Sir Dom playing out of position.

Too many questions again, and built in excuses for Steve (Sanchez graduated Jakarr left for the NBA) etc. I hope they can win but would not be surprised if its another NIT year.

Losing Thomas, which appears likely, we are screwed. Good to support the program, but any notion that Joey & Adonis can fill this void is misplaced. Teams will really take to Obekpa to draw fouls. Your NIT forecast,sans Thomas, is reasonable. Very frustrating, but then again, "We are Saint John's".

Back to square one before we got Thomas. The notion then was "we go as far as our back court takes us" that's how this year is going to be the way this situation is looking.

Jones is our final hope, which is not a great thing, IMO. Maybe he made strides, but you made a great point about CO, the dude will get in foul trouble. Does anyone trust jones to man the post for maybe 15 mpg at the center position??? Answer should be a resounding no, and i hope I'm sooo wrong about CJ, but I don't see it. I like jones and think he's a good player and is going to be much better than he showed 2 years ago, but it's looking like he might be getting thrown into a situation that he might not be able to handle, which is playing more than 20 minutes a game.

Even with Thomas, we have a bunch of roll players up front. Lets hope we get a stellar year out of our backcourt and that Lavin can mix and match our front court guys and get decent productivity out of the bunch.

Without Thomas our front court stands as (let me know if I'm forgetting anyone)


Obekpa
Pointer
Jones
JDR
ADR
Amar


The top 3 will play, the bottom 3 are giant question marks. If Amar comes in and hits threes, cool, but we need rebounding.

I read the comments of people who were at the open practice and it seemed like Amar was in some ways more impressive than Thomas. I believe someone said that Thomas was not able to keep up the pace at times and not all contributing offensively. On top of that the draftexpress.com guy saw the team practice and commented on Amar being "interesting" but said nothing about Thomas.

Could it be possible that Amar is the better player to begin with? I don't know the answer...just speculating.

Thought the comment about not being able to keep up was about ADR, which doesn't surprise me having watched him quite a bit last year.

 

[paultzman]

Lawman good post, the concern i have is the front court, The De La Rosa brothers are deemed not ready or fit enough to play at this level, Keith Thomas may not be eligible, and we are left with Amir or Sir Dom playing out of position.

Too many questions again, and built in excuses for Steve (Sanchez graduated Jakarr left for the NBA) etc. I hope they can win but would not be surprised if its another NIT year.

Losing Thomas, which appears likely, we are screwed. Good to support the program, but any notion that Joey & Adonis can fill this void is misplaced. Teams will really take to Obekpa to draw fouls. Your NIT forecast,sans Thomas, is reasonable. Very frustrating, but then again, "We are Saint John's".

Back to square one before we got Thomas. The notion then was "we go as far as our back court takes us" that's how this year is going to be the way this situation is looking.

Jones is our final hope, which is not a great thing, IMO. Maybe he made strides, but you made a great point about CO, the dude will get in foul trouble. Does anyone trust jones to man the post for maybe 15 mpg at the center position??? Answer should be a resounding no, and i hope I'm sooo wrong about CJ, but I don't see it. I like jones and think he's a good player and is going to be much better than he showed 2 years ago, but it's looking like he might be getting thrown into a situation that he might not be able to handle, which is playing more than 20 minutes a game.

Even with Thomas, we have a bunch of roll players up front. Lets hope we get a stellar year out of our backcourt and that Lavin can mix and match our front court guys and get decent productivity out of the bunch.

Without Thomas our front court stands as (let me know if I'm forgetting anyone)


Obekpa
Pointer
Jones
JDR
ADR
Amar


The top 3 will play, the bottom 3 are giant question marks. If Amar comes in and hits threes, cool, but we need rebounding.

I read the comments of people who were at the open practice and it seemed like Amar was in some ways more impressive than Thomas. I believe someone said that Thomas was not able to keep up the pace at times and not all contributing offensively. On top of that the draftexpress.com guy saw the team practice and commented on Amar being "interesting" but said nothing about Thomas.

Could it be possible that Amar is the better player to begin with? I don't know the answer...just speculating.

Don't know, but at this point I sure hope so!

Relying on a freshman to step in there for high minutes is usually folly. It sounds like he can be a decent complementary player in year one, but Thomas is a beast suited for immediate battle with BE bigs. Amar, to be fair, has to be afforded opportunity to mature physically & gain experience. I would not expect him to fill Thomas void. Visualize Xavier with Stainbrook and the PF who torched us last year. These interior match ups with most BE opponents will be quite challenging without Thomas. Just my opinion. Then again, we will have to go with whoever is there and hope our guards are super productive.

 

[otis]

[

.....If Lavin takes this team to the tournament, and gets the 2015 class we are dreaming of, regardless of a 1st round exit, he's staying.

Underscore "dreaming of".

Yeah I sincerely hope Briscoe, Diallo, and Sampson (sp?) commit to St.John's but the hard fact is that Lavin has successfully recruited just 1 high schooler during the past 18 months.

According to Rivals Lavin offered 15 high schoolers during the 2014 cycle and got just 1 commitment.

This cycle Lavin will have at least 6 scholarships yet as of October 29 deep into the cycle he has zero recruits committed despite the fact that 85%+/- of the top 150 players in the class of 2015 are no longer available.

We are....

 

[paultzman]

Un

[

.....If Lavin takes this team to the tournament, and gets the 2015 class we are dreaming of, regardless of a 1st round exit, he's staying.

Underscore "dreaming of".

Yeah I sincerely hope Briscoe, Diallo, and Sampson (sp?) commit to St.John's but the hard fact is that Lavin has successfully recruited just 1 high schooler during the past 18 months.

According to Rivals Lavin offered 15 high schoolers during the 2014 cycle and got just 1 commitment.

This cycle Lavin will have at least 6 scholarships yet as of October 29 deep into the cycle he has zero recruits committed despite the fact that 85%+/- of the top 150 players in the class of 2015 are no longer available.

We are....

Couldn't resist could you? :cheer:

 

[Redzone]

18 - 13
Usual under achieving by players and coach staff.
turmoil of some kind [/u][/b]will surely surface again. late for meeting, missed practice, academic violation, court outbursts, etc.
highly regarded recruits prove to be Ok at best .(if over the top they would be at Syracuse, Louisville, G'town, UCONN, etc)
Usual end of season push will be needed for NCAA's due to the usual inexplicable losses out of conference.
NIT.....again. Disappointment within program = 1st round exit.
Last 10 years of optimism followed by unacceptable results for program says so.
Would however be fun to be significant again even for 1 year.



Academic issue...check, recruits not fit enough to play at this level....check, more realizations re: NIT....check. Stay tuned. Here we go again.

 

[simplyred]

18 - 13
Usual under achieving by players and coach staff.
turmoil of some kind [/u][/b]will surely surface again. late for meeting, missed practice, academic violation, court outbursts, etc.
highly regarded recruits prove to be Ok at best .(if over the top they would be at Syracuse, Louisville, G'town, UCONN, etc)
Usual end of season push will be needed for NCAA's due to the usual inexplicable losses out of conference.
NIT.....again. Disappointment within program = 1st round exit.
Last 10 years of optimism followed by unacceptable results for program says so.
Would however be fun to be significant again even for 1 year.



Academic issue...check, recruits not fit enough to play at this level....check, more realizations re: NIT....check. Stay tuned. Here we go again.

Kentucky is looking to increase its fanbase.

 

[Jack Williams]

[

.....If Lavin takes this team to the tournament, and gets the 2015 class we are dreaming of, regardless of a 1st round exit, he's staying.

Underscore "dreaming of".

Yeah I sincerely hope Briscoe, Diallo, and Sampson (sp?) commit to St.John's but the hard fact is that Lavin has successfully recruited just 1 high schooler during the past 18 months.

According to Rivals Lavin offered 15 high schoolers during the 2014 cycle and got just 1 commitment.

This cycle Lavin will have at least 6 scholarships yet as of October 29 deep into the cycle he has zero recruits committed despite the fact that 85%+/- of the top 150 players in the class of 2015 are no longer available.

We are....

Guess who's back, back again....


these stats you throw out about 85% of recruits already committed doesn't change the fact that 3 five star recruits are seriously considering us, 2 high ranked JUCOs are as well, along with an overseas guard. Complain all you want about the past recruiting class but it's a waste of time and energy, things as of now look decent even with 0 people committed we will see how it plays out

 

[Amaseinyourface]

Lawman good post, the concern i have is the front court, The De La Rosa brothers are deemed not ready or fit enough to play at this level, Keith Thomas may not be eligible, and we are left with Amir or Sir Dom playing out of position.

Too many questions again, and built in excuses for Steve (Sanchez graduated Jakarr left for the NBA) etc. I hope they can win but would not be surprised if its another NIT year.

Losing Thomas, which appears likely, we are screwed. Good to support the program, but any notion that Joey & Adonis can fill this void is misplaced. Teams will really take to Obekpa to draw fouls. Your NIT forecast,sans Thomas, is reasonable. Very frustrating, but then again, "We are Saint John's".

"screwed" I think is a bit of a stretch. Ceiling definitely lowered, but potential for an ncaa season is still very much in play.