Fordham (MSG), Sat., Dec. 16, 3:30p, FS1

Astoria STH said:
  • Short of it is that we need to be 5-1 (11-4) from here until we travel down to Nova on 1/6.
  • The only loss can be @UConn where the margin needs to be respectable.
  • Our NET can't afford anything else and it will only reset to the mid 50's range that we were at late last week if we get this done.
  • The Fordham game can't be close, we need to blow them out as well as Hofstra.
  • Xavier at home and @Butler are must wins as well.

There is no getting around this if we aspire to be an at large team. The run that we were supposed to be in the middle of would've allowed for a BE loss outside of UConn, that is no longer the case, Sunday ruined that for us.
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Completely agree!
 
guinness77 said:
I hate to say this but any D1 team can beat another D1 team on any given night. It might be once out of 100 times, but a comment like this reeks of entitlement.

I’m really not trying to single you out, and Rick Pitino or no Rick Pitino, we haven’t won a tournament game in 20 years and haven’t made it past Thursday in the BET in years and we’re just expected to go out and have no problems against a decent program like Fordham. I mean, lol, where do you think Soriano came from?
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Agreed. Every team on our remaining schedule could beat us at least 10 times out of 100.
 
carmineabbatiello said:
The Rams will be a handful for us. I'm looking forward to the Soriano- Tsimbila matchup
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This would be bad. Fordham is not a good team even by ‘local’ standards. If this is a close game, a team like Hofstra will wipe the floor with us. I was the most cynical person on this board with the RP hiring and even I think a more likely result is that we beat Fordham by double digits. Unfortunately , I think that game will give us a false sense of ‘we are going in the right direction’ only to run into the brick wall that will be the big east schedule.

Realistically, I think we are in for the same thing we have had year after year since Norm Roberts. A record that is padded by a less than stellar non conference schedule followed by a rude awakening during the first 1/3 to 1/2 of Big East play followed by a second half of big east play that includes a surprising win or two that gives us hope for next year only to be disappointed again.
 
This game is all about how you respond. This needs to be a thorough ass kicking. And the defense needs to be the talking point. They are getting their butt's handed to them in film and on the court the next week, guaranteed. Respond like a veteran team. Keep them under 60-65 pts and win by 25+

No mercy. Make a statement.
 
The one thing most of us agree on is we are disappointed in the results so far, especially the D. That does not equate to being panic struck and seems legitimate reaction in light of Rick hire and related publicity. Let’s start the climb upward by controlling Fordham from the start with tenacious defense and get ready for BE play. Wouldn’t it be nice to get off to a good start in BE play in first 5 or 6 games (not a recent tradition here) to give players, staff & this loony fan base something to aspire to down the stretch.
 
paultzman said:
The one thing most of us agree on is we are disappointed in the results so far, especially the D. That does not equate to being panic struck and seems legitimate reaction in light of Rick hire and related publicity. Let’s start the climb upward by controlling Fordham from the start with tenacious defense and get ready for BE play. Wouldn’t it be nice to get off to a good start in BE play in first 5 or 6 games (not a recent tradition here) to give players, staff & this loony fan base something to aspire to down the stretch.
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Yes agreed. There is a balance to be struck. There are people over the ledge making absurdly silly comments about the coach or the players off of the loss. Everyone would love to be Ole Miss right now with their first year HC obviously. We all have high hopes. Rick Pitino hasn't forgotten how to coach...these are talented players...albeit potentially flawed in one way or another. Defense is the talking point, how do you fix that mid season, IDK, that's gonna be really hard. When you score 80 ppg you're gonna win more than you're not in college so it's not scoring regardless of how insufficient the scoring from the bench is at the moment while we wait for RJ is.
 
SJUDave said:
Yes agreed. There is a balance to be struck. There are people over the ledge making absurdly silly comments about the coach or the players off of the loss. Everyone would love to be Ole Miss right now with their first year HC obviously. We all have high hopes. Rick Pitino hasn't forgotten how to coach...these are talented players...albeit potentially flawed in one way or another. Defense is the talking point, how do you fix that mid season, IDK, that's gonna be really hard. When you score 80 ppg you're gonna win more than you're not in college so it's not scoring regardless of how insufficient the scoring from the bench is at the moment while we wait for RJ is.
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You're right, it will definitely be hard, but to fix it mid-season is probably a combination of things. The roster won't change, but you can give alleyne more minutes and reduce dingle's minutes (but run more offense through dingle when he is in the game). Alleyne is simply the best on-ball defender in the back court, so he's going to have to play more--I'm sure he will. It looks like rick is already focusing on crashing the boards and creating turnovers, while that won't help defend, it can create fewer defensive possessions. A big part of the issue is speed on the perimeter which won't change mid-season, but there's technique pitino can work on as well--for example, forcing slashers to their off hand, giving more backside help, etc. I have no doubt that pitino can fix the defense at least to a level that the team is competitive for an ncaa tourney birth.
 
SJUDave said:
This game is all about how you respond. This needs to be a thorough ass kicking. And the defense needs to be the talking point. They are getting their butt's handed to them in film and on the court the next week, guaranteed. Respond like a veteran team. Keep them under 60-65 pts and win by 25+

No mercy. Make a statement.
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I agree Dave. I don’t want to have to sweat this game at all. I want to be leading by enough throughout the game that Wilcher and Dunlap get quality time. If we don’t then I think we have resign ourselves to the fact that it’s going to be same’ol, same’ol with this team also.
 
RedStormRising said:
This would be bad. Fordham is not a good team even by ‘local’ standards. If this is a close game, a team like Hofstra will wipe the floor with us. I was the most cynical person on this board with the RP hiring and even I think a more likely result is that we beat Fordham by double digits. Unfortunately , I think that game will give us a false sense of ‘we are going in the right direction’ only to run into the brick wall that will be the big east schedule.

Realistically, I think we are in for the same thing we have had year after year since Norm Roberts. A record that is padded by a less than stellar non conference schedule followed by a rude awakening during the first 1/3 to 1/2 of Big East play followed by a second half of big east play that includes a surprising win or two that gives us hope for next year only to be disappointed again.
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Are you out of your mind? Comparing pitino to Robert's? This schedule we had is more difficult less cupcakes then Robert's team. Thsi schedule is not padded . Wow worst post of the week award goes to
 
A win is a must in this cross town rivalry. Fordham will play the game with a vengeance.
There will be hundreds of "accepted students" at this game as the university is trying to impress these high school students to make St. John's their school.
 

NCAA College Basketball Strength of Schedule Rankings & Ratings

NCAA College Basketball Strength of Schedule Rankings & Ratings from TeamRankings.com, your source for NCAAB computer power rankings.
www.teamrankings.com www.teamrankings.com

we are at 49 with strength of schedule according to this so saying our early season is cupcakes must not be watching St. Johns University mens basketball may st. john's lutheran elementary school lol
 
guinness77 said:
I hate to say this but any D1 team can beat another D1 team on any given night. It might be once out of 100 times, but a comment like this reeks of entitlement.

I’m really not trying to single you out, and Rick Pitino or no Rick Pitino, we haven’t won a tournament game in 20 years and haven’t made it past Thursday in the BET in years and we’re just expected to go out and have no problems against a decent program like Fordham. I mean, lol, where do you think Soriano came from?
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I really don’t think you can bring the history of the last 20 years in discussion here. This a new coach (a HOF coach), an overhauled roster, NIL money involved , higher rated players/recruits etc. I stand by my statement that Fordham should not be a handfull for St. John’s. The last time Fordham should have been a handfull for the Johnnies was decades ago. And now add in this last poor loss and the motivation and talent level should be there for a convincing victory.

If as coach Pitino has emphatically stated that “St.. John’s will be back, and it’s going to happen fast”, this game should be a solid win. In recent memory, would you ever have considered a Fordham game to be a struggle, even with some of our recent less qualified staff?
 
paultzman said:
Hopefully “process” includes holding Rams to 40% shooting and commitment to defensive level Rick is clamoring for.
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Paultz, respectfully perhaps Pitino should do something more than "clamor" for better defense. It has been evident in multiple games this season that he is willing to keep trying to pound square pegs into round holes. Maybe they will eventually turn into round pegs, but if I were him I would give at least some consideration to, I dunno, doing something different. If the players you brought in can't defend in the system you want to play, maybe you have to be at least somewhat flexible if you want to win games.

The fact that he flat out quit on the BC game with 2 minutes to go when it was still possible to make a run was not an encouraging sign.

I understand that he has a roster (that he put together) that has some deficiencies (no shade, he did well to get what he got), but you gotta work with the team you have, not the team you wish you had.

Fordham is scrappy, as is Hofstra. There are no more games on the schedule that can be taken for granted. The players have to kick in - but so does the coach.
 
lawmanfan said:
Paultz, respectfully perhaps Pitino should do something more than "clamor" for better defense. It has been evident in multiple games this season that he is willing to keep trying to pound square pegs into round holes. Maybe they will eventually turn into round pegs, but if I were him I would give at least some consideration to, I dunno, doing something different. If the players you brought in can't defend in the system you want to play, maybe you have to be at least somewhat flexible if you want to win games.

The fact that he flat out quit on the BC game with 2 minutes to go when it was still possible to make a run was not an encouraging sign.

I understand that he has a roster (that he put together) that has some deficiencies (no shade, he did well to get what he got), but you gotta work with the team you have, not the team you wish you had.

Fordham is scrappy, as is Hofstra. There are no more games on the schedule that can be taken for granted. The players have to kick in - but so does the coach.
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Excellent post LMF. And while I will acknowledge that Coach Pitino is by history and accomplishments an outstanding coach, with the little I know of the game having coached HS hoops in the past, I sat there wondering what coach was going to do to stem the tide of one penetration/lay up after another which eventually cost St. John’s the game. And given the stature of Coach Pitino, I almost feel guilty questioning any move he makes or does not make during a game yet I still wondered if the insertion of a zone may have disrupted that BC run that won them the game.
 
Silly Donovan said:
Excellent post LMF. And while I will acknowledge that Coach Pitino is by history and accomplishments an outstanding coach, with the little I know of the game having coached HS hoops in the past, I sat there wondering what coach was going to do to stem the tide of one penetration/lay up after another which eventually cost St. John’s the game. And given the stature of Coach Pitino, I almost feel guilty questioning any move he makes or does not make during a game yet I still wondered if the insertion of a zone may have disrupted that BC run that won them the game.
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have we seen them go Zone at all this season?
 
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