Daily News- St. John's MUST return to The NCAA's

[1and1sju]

Has the teams record not improved with his recruits over the 2 years that they've played? It would seem to suggest that this year they'll improve even more because of depth, talent and experience. Just because you may have certain expectations in your own head about what their W/L should be doesn't mean that it's correct. I feel that you expect them to go like 26-8 this year and anything less is failure. He is building a program here. Takes more than 2 years to do that. 1 of those years he wasn't even coaching his own recruits... granted no excuse to not coach when you have cancer... as Dr. Leo Marvin once said "baby steps, Bob"

The team should have done better last year. The problem was not youth or Harkless not being there, it was poor offensive coaching. Lavin has remedied that with the Whitesell hire.

26-8 would actually be a dissapointing record given this teams talent. They really shouldnt lose more than 6 games and anything less than Elite-8 would be underperforming. Anything less than Sweet-16 would be failure.
They should realistically enter this season with National Championship ambitions

You realize there are about 15+ other teams that have top 100 talent at almost every position right? Just look at Georgetown and Marquette. Even Villanova.
Do we have a lot of talent? Yes. Should we be good? Yea. But it's not like we are Kentucky or Alabama in football. The talent level isn't SO far ahead of everyone else that we are prohibitive favorites.

Expecting the team to lose less than 6 games is a tall order. 2 teams in the whole country didn't lose 5 games last year... Gonzaga who has a mediocre schedule, and Duke.

 

[Marillac]

Either take credit for Harkless' NBA success or use his loss as an excuse. Not both. I posted that Dunlap wouldn't last the day it was announced so what was accomplished? Lavin continues to turn his nose up on serviceable roster filler players and gets caught short. Take a look at our commitments for 14 and 15 if you disagree. If Sampson and CO leave early will that be the next excuse? Smell the coffee.

Why?
I really don't see it as an "excuse." It's what happened. Moe would have gone top 5 this year if he stayed, and his early departure--magnified by Sampson missing a year due to academics--really left this team thin up front and underskiled. You don't expect a kid ranked around 40 to be one-and-done and a near lottery pick. The exposure he gained in this system and in this city had in that position much sooner than he would have been at another school. Why can't Lavin take credit for that?

 

[basketballjones]

Maybe we can get to...say...20 wins once and a bid to the tournament before we go expecting 26 wins and a top seed in the East Region.

 

[TobinGrad]

Has the teams record not improved with his recruits over the 2 years that they've played? It would seem to suggest that this year they'll improve even more because of depth, talent and experience. Just because you may have certain expectations in your own head about what their W/L should be doesn't mean that it's correct. I feel that you expect them to go like 26-8 this year and anything less is failure. He is building a program here. Takes more than 2 years to do that. 1 of those years he wasn't even coaching his own recruits... granted no excuse to not coach when you have cancer... as Dr. Leo Marvin once said "baby steps, Bob"

The team should have done better last year. The problem was not youth or Harkless not being there, it was poor offensive coaching. Lavin has remedied that with the Whitesell hire.

26-8 would actually be a dissapointing record given this teams talent. They really shouldnt lose more than 6 games and anything less than Elite-8 would be underperforming. Anything less than Sweet-16 would be failure.
They should realistically enter this season with National Championship ambitions

You realize there are about 15+ other teams that have top 100 talent at almost every position right? Just look at Georgetown and Marquette. Even Villanova.
Do we have a lot of talent? Yes. Should we be good? Yea. But it's not like we are Kentucky or Alabama in football. The talent level isn't SO far ahead of everyone else that we are prohibitive favorites.

Expecting the team to lose less than 6 games is a tall order. 2 teams in the whole country didn't lose 5 games last year... Gonzaga who has a mediocre schedule, and Duke.

SJU is one of the most talented teams in the nation this year, with top 60 talent at most positions and multiple NBA prospects. They are also very experienced. They should realistically finish 1st in the BE conference this season and compete for at least a 2-seed in the tourney.

 

[beast of the east]

Either take credit for Harkless' NBA success or use his loss as an excuse. Not both. I posted that Dunlap wouldn't last the day it was announced so what was accomplished? Lavin continues to turn his nose up on serviceable roster filler players and gets caught short. Take a look at our commitments for 14 and 15 if you disagree. If Sampson and CO leave early will that be the next excuse? Smell the coffee.

How many one and done's have we had in SJU history? Omar Cook, and one other, both ill advised. Harkless remains a bright hope heading into his second season. Of course you can have it both ways - recruiting his caliber of player was a smashing success, him getting drafted after one season speaks well of the exposure he got in our program, AND it hurt of team the following season. We've NEVER, EVER, EVER had the type of recruiting success that could sustain the exist of sure fire 1st round draft choices after one or two seasons. Lavin recruited a one-and-done forward in his very first recruiting class along with the maligned but talented Harrison, then as an encore, brought in both Obekpa and Sampson, and now has added the #17 ranked player in the country. In all of the years I've followed St. John's, we never had that kind of continued success reeling in high ranked players, certainly not after the NR debacle and program crash.

 

[MJDinkins]

Has the teams record not improved with his recruits over the 2 years that they've played? It would seem to suggest that this year they'll improve even more because of depth, talent and experience. Just because you may have certain expectations in your own head about what their W/L should be doesn't mean that it's correct. I feel that you expect them to go like 26-8 this year and anything less is failure. He is building a program here. Takes more than 2 years to do that. 1 of those years he wasn't even coaching his own recruits... granted no excuse to not coach when you have cancer... as Dr. Leo Marvin once said "baby steps, Bob"

The team should have done better last year. The problem was not youth or Harkless not being there, it was poor offensive coaching. Lavin has remedied that with the Whitesell hire.

26-8 would actually be a dissapointing record given this teams talent. They really shouldnt lose more than 6 games and anything less than Elite-8 would be underperforming. Anything less than Sweet-16 would be failure.
They should realistically enter this season with National Championship ambitions

You realize there are about 15+ other teams that have top 100 talent at almost every position right? Just look at Georgetown and Marquette. Even Villanova.
Do we have a lot of talent? Yes. Should we be good? Yea. But it's not like we are Kentucky or Alabama in football. The talent level isn't SO far ahead of everyone else that we are prohibitive favorites.

Expecting the team to lose less than 6 games is a tall order. 2 teams in the whole country didn't lose 5 games last year... Gonzaga who has a mediocre schedule, and Duke.

SJU is one of the most talented teams in the nation this year, with top 60 talent at most positions and multiple NBA prospects. They are also very experienced. They should realistically finish 1st in the BE conference this season and compete for at least a 2-seed in the tourney.

They are capable of finishing 1st in the conference and vying for a #2 seed in the NCAA Tournament. But would you be disappointed if they were to finish 3rd in the conference and garner a #4 seed in the NCAA Tournament?

 

[1and1sju]

Has the teams record not improved with his recruits over the 2 years that they've played? It would seem to suggest that this year they'll improve even more because of depth, talent and experience. Just because you may have certain expectations in your own head about what their W/L should be doesn't mean that it's correct. I feel that you expect them to go like 26-8 this year and anything less is failure. He is building a program here. Takes more than 2 years to do that. 1 of those years he wasn't even coaching his own recruits... granted no excuse to not coach when you have cancer... as Dr. Leo Marvin once said "baby steps, Bob"

The team should have done better last year. The problem was not youth or Harkless not being there, it was poor offensive coaching. Lavin has remedied that with the Whitesell hire.

26-8 would actually be a dissapointing record given this teams talent. They really shouldnt lose more than 6 games and anything less than Elite-8 would be underperforming. Anything less than Sweet-16 would be failure.
They should realistically enter this season with National Championship ambitions

You realize there are about 15+ other teams that have top 100 talent at almost every position right? Just look at Georgetown and Marquette. Even Villanova.
Do we have a lot of talent? Yes. Should we be good? Yea. But it's not like we are Kentucky or Alabama in football. The talent level isn't SO far ahead of everyone else that we are prohibitive favorites.

Expecting the team to lose less than 6 games is a tall order. 2 teams in the whole country didn't lose 5 games last year... Gonzaga who has a mediocre schedule, and Duke.

SJU is one of the most talented teams in the nation this year, with top 60 talent at most positions and multiple NBA prospects. They are also very experienced. They should realistically finish 1st in the BE conference this season and compete for at least a 2-seed in the tourney.

There's a big difference between saying they should finish first and saying they could finish first.

 

[Andrew]

Has the teams record not improved with his recruits over the 2 years that they've played? It would seem to suggest that this year they'll improve even more because of depth, talent and experience. Just because you may have certain expectations in your own head about what their W/L should be doesn't mean that it's correct. I feel that you expect them to go like 26-8 this year and anything less is failure. He is building a program here. Takes more than 2 years to do that. 1 of those years he wasn't even coaching his own recruits... granted no excuse to not coach when you have cancer... as Dr. Leo Marvin once said "baby steps, Bob"

The team should have done better last year. The problem was not youth or Harkless not being there, it was poor offensive coaching. Lavin has remedied that with the Whitesell hire.

26-8 would actually be a dissapointing record given this teams talent. They really shouldnt lose more than 6 games and anything less than Elite-8 would be underperforming. Anything less than Sweet-16 would be failure.
They should realistically enter this season with National Championship ambitions

You realize there are about 15+ other teams that have top 100 talent at almost every position right? Just look at Georgetown and Marquette. Even Villanova.
Do we have a lot of talent? Yes. Should we be good? Yea. But it's not like we are Kentucky or Alabama in football. The talent level isn't SO far ahead of everyone else that we are prohibitive favorites.

Expecting the team to lose less than 6 games is a tall order. 2 teams in the whole country didn't lose 5 games last year... Gonzaga who has a mediocre schedule, and Duke.

SJU is one of the most talented teams in the nation this year, with top 60 talent at most positions and multiple NBA prospects. They are also very experienced. They should realistically finish 1st in the BE conference this season and compete for at least a 2-seed in the tourney.

They are capable of finishing 1st in the conference and vying for a #2 seed in the NCAA Tournament. But would you be disappointed if they were to finish 3rd in the conference and garner a #4 seed in the NCAA Tournament?

I don't think third in the conference will give them a #4 seed unless they beat Syracuse and Wisconsin. Third in the conference is probably a 6 or 7 seed.

 

[beast of the east]

Has the teams record not improved with his recruits over the 2 years that they've played? It would seem to suggest that this year they'll improve even more because of depth, talent and experience. Just because you may have certain expectations in your own head about what their W/L should be doesn't mean that it's correct. I feel that you expect them to go like 26-8 this year and anything less is failure. He is building a program here. Takes more than 2 years to do that. 1 of those years he wasn't even coaching his own recruits... granted no excuse to not coach when you have cancer... as Dr. Leo Marvin once said "baby steps, Bob"

The team should have done better last year. The problem was not youth or Harkless not being there, it was poor offensive coaching. Lavin has remedied that with the Whitesell hire.


26-8 would actually be a dissapointing record given this teams talent. They really shouldnt lose more than 6 games and anything less than Elite-8 would be underperforming. Anything less than Sweet-16 would be failure.
They should realistically enter this season with National Championship ambitions

You realize there are about 15+ other teams that have top 100 talent at almost every position right? Just look at Georgetown and Marquette. Even Villanova.
Do we have a lot of talent? Yes. Should we be good? Yea. But it's not like we are Kentucky or Alabama in football. The talent level isn't SO far ahead of everyone else that we are prohibitive favorites.

Expecting the team to lose less than 6 games is a tall order. 2 teams in the whole country didn't lose 5 games last year... Gonzaga who has a mediocre schedule, and Duke.

SJU is one of the most talented teams in the nation this year, with top 60 talent at most positions and multiple NBA prospects. They are also very experienced. They should realistically finish 1st in the BE conference this season and compete for at least a 2-seed in the tourney.

They are capable of finishing 1st in the conference and vying for a #2 seed in the NCAA Tournament. But would you be disappointed if they were to finish 3rd in the conference and garner a #4 seed in the NCAA Tournament?

I don't think third in the conference will give them a #4 seed unless they beat Syracuse and Wisconsin. Third in the conference is probably a 6 or 7 seed.

Slow down! Third in conference could be a 13-5 record in conference and 24 or 25 wins overall, or could be as few as 10 or 11 wins with a tie. Projecting what the seeds will be is a little premature. I think we should wait at least till halftime of the first game.

 

[Andrew]

Has the teams record not improved with his recruits over the 2 years that they've played? It would seem to suggest that this year they'll improve even more because of depth, talent and experience. Just because you may have certain expectations in your own head about what their W/L should be doesn't mean that it's correct. I feel that you expect them to go like 26-8 this year and anything less is failure. He is building a program here. Takes more than 2 years to do that. 1 of those years he wasn't even coaching his own recruits... granted no excuse to not coach when you have cancer... as Dr. Leo Marvin once said "baby steps, Bob"

The team should have done better last year. The problem was not youth or Harkless not being there, it was poor offensive coaching. Lavin has remedied that with the Whitesell hire.


26-8 would actually be a dissapointing record given this teams talent. They really shouldnt lose more than 6 games and anything less than Elite-8 would be underperforming. Anything less than Sweet-16 would be failure.
They should realistically enter this season with National Championship ambitions

You realize there are about 15+ other teams that have top 100 talent at almost every position right? Just look at Georgetown and Marquette. Even Villanova.
Do we have a lot of talent? Yes. Should we be good? Yea. But it's not like we are Kentucky or Alabama in football. The talent level isn't SO far ahead of everyone else that we are prohibitive favorites.

Expecting the team to lose less than 6 games is a tall order. 2 teams in the whole country didn't lose 5 games last year... Gonzaga who has a mediocre schedule, and Duke.

SJU is one of the most talented teams in the nation this year, with top 60 talent at most positions and multiple NBA prospects. They are also very experienced. They should realistically finish 1st in the BE conference this season and compete for at least a 2-seed in the tourney.

They are capable of finishing 1st in the conference and vying for a #2 seed in the NCAA Tournament. But would you be disappointed if they were to finish 3rd in the conference and garner a #4 seed in the NCAA Tournament?

I don't think third in the conference will give them a #4 seed unless they beat Syracuse and Wisconsin. Third in the conference is probably a 6 or 7 seed.

Slow down! Third in conference could be a 13-5 record in conference and 24 or 25 wins overall, or could be as few as 10 or 11 wins with a tie. Projecting what the seeds will be is a little premature. I think we should wait at least till halftime of the first game.

Fair enough

 

[dee]

New York Daily News:

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/college/score-madness-bust-st-john-article-1.1483872

That article is spot on.

I dont like the part about the pressure. I dont like that talk because then it gets into the heads of players. We have as much pressure as any other college team that wants to advance in the ncaa including teams like Duke and UK
We are going to blow them all away this year

 

[Marillac]

Has the teams record not improved with his recruits over the 2 years that they've played? It would seem to suggest that this year they'll improve even more because of depth, talent and experience. Just because you may have certain expectations in your own head about what their W/L should be doesn't mean that it's correct. I feel that you expect them to go like 26-8 this year and anything less is failure. He is building a program here. Takes more than 2 years to do that. 1 of those years he wasn't even coaching his own recruits... granted no excuse to not coach when you have cancer... as Dr. Leo Marvin once said "baby steps, Bob"

The team should have done better last year. The problem was not youth or Harkless not being there, it was poor offensive coaching. Lavin has remedied that with the Whitesell hire.

26-8 would actually be a dissapointing record given this teams talent. They really shouldnt lose more than 6 games and anything less than Elite-8 would be underperforming. Anything less than Sweet-16 would be failure.
They should realistically enter this season with National Championship ambitions

You realize there are about 15+ other teams that have top 100 talent at almost every position right?

I actually researched this last year. There were about 5 teams that could lay claim to being able to start an RSCI top 75 player at each position. St. John's has the ability to do that this year. I can't imagine that # tripling, but your point is well received. The crazy part for St. John's is that a lot of those top 75 guys are now Juniors (Branch #52, Pointer #35, Harrison #47). The lowest top 100 RSCI player is #69, Obekpa, so really this list could be squeezed to top 70 players and that might eliminate another team.

 

[beast of the east]

Has the teams record not improved with his recruits over the 2 years that they've played? It would seem to suggest that this year they'll improve even more because of depth, talent and experience. Just because you may have certain expectations in your own head about what their W/L should be doesn't mean that it's correct. I feel that you expect them to go like 26-8 this year and anything less is failure. He is building a program here. Takes more than 2 years to do that. 1 of those years he wasn't even coaching his own recruits... granted no excuse to not coach when you have cancer... as Dr. Leo Marvin once said "baby steps, Bob"

The team should have done better last year. The problem was not youth or Harkless not being there, it was poor offensive coaching. Lavin has remedied that with the Whitesell hire.

26-8 would actually be a dissapointing record given this teams talent. They really shouldnt lose more than 6 games and anything less than Elite-8 would be underperforming. Anything less than Sweet-16 would be failure.
They should realistically enter this season with National Championship ambitions

You realize there are about 15+ other teams that have top 100 talent at almost every position right?

I actually researched this last year. There were about 5 teams that could lay claim to being able to start an RSCI top 75 player at each position. St. John's has the ability to do that this year. I can't imagine that # tripling, but your point is well received. The crazy part for St. John's is that a lot of those top 75 guys are now Juniors (Branch #52, Pointer #35, Harrison #47). The lowest top 100 RSCI player is #69, Obekpa, so really this list could be squeezed to top 70 players and that might eliminate another team.

Hey Marillac,
Very nice job... This makes me feel a lot better about this team. Now if just one of them becomes "The Man", we could do some real damage.

 

[MCNPA]

Has the teams record not improved with his recruits over the 2 years that they've played? It would seem to suggest that this year they'll improve even more because of depth, talent and experience. Just because you may have certain expectations in your own head about what their W/L should be doesn't mean that it's correct. I feel that you expect them to go like 26-8 this year and anything less is failure. He is building a program here. Takes more than 2 years to do that. 1 of those years he wasn't even coaching his own recruits... granted no excuse to not coach when you have cancer... as Dr. Leo Marvin once said "baby steps, Bob"

The team should have done better last year. The problem was not youth or Harkless not being there, it was poor offensive coaching. Lavin has remedied that with the Whitesell hire.

26-8 would actually be a dissapointing record given this teams talent. They really shouldnt lose more than 6 games and anything less than Elite-8 would be underperforming. Anything less than Sweet-16 would be failure.
They should realistically enter this season with National Championship ambitions

You realize there are about 15+ other teams that have top 100 talent at almost every position right?

I actually researched this last year. There were about 5 teams that could lay claim to being able to start an RSCI top 75 player at each position. St. John's has the ability to do that this year. I can't imagine that # tripling, but your point is well received. The crazy part for St. John's is that a lot of those top 75 guys are now Juniors (Branch #52, Pointer #35, Harrison #47). The lowest top 100 RSCI player is #69, Obekpa, so really this list could be squeezed to top 70 players and that might eliminate another team.

Hey Marillac,
Very nice job... This makes me feel a lot better about this team. Now if just one of them becomes "The Man", we could do some real damage.

We have some guys that are "the man". Obekpa defensively lead the country in blocked shots. He defensively is "the man". Harrison has been near #1 in the Big East in scoring his first two seasons. He too is "the man". We have Jakarr Sampson who was rookie of the year. Another guy who can be tremendous. Add Branch, Jordan, Sanchez, Pointer etc. we don't need "the man". We need a team which is what I think we will have this year.

 

[paultzman]

“@jeffborzello: Good question. I'll go with St. John's. Others: Tennessee, Cal, Iowa. RT @mynewhate: Which team outside your top 25 has the highest ceiling?”

CBS Poll reference.

 

[MainMan]

Weak thread.