redstorm89
Active member
I would love to know what are 3 point percentages are from non - conference play vs conference play. seems like the high percentages were against lesser competition.
@Creighton, Tues. Feb. 28, 8pm, CBSSN/570AM
- Thread starter Knight
- Start date
I would love to know what are 3 point percentages are from non - conference play vs conference play. seems like the high percentages were against lesser competition.
Very close! Ellison was -18 in the first half. Rest of team was +5 without Malik on the floor, a 23 point swing.
Second half was a little better. Ellison was -5, rest of the team was +4 without Malik on the floor, a 9 point swing.
For the game Ellison was -23. The rest of the team was +9 without Malik on the floor, a 32 point swing.
If you remove a -3 for rest of team and a +3 for Ellison when the game got out of hand in the last few minutes, it's -26 and +12, a 38 point swing in ~36 minutes of basketball.
And it wasn't like it was only driven by one good/bad run or something. If you remove the end of the game, Ellison had 6 sessions on the court. Only 1 was positive, a +1 when he scored the 8 quick points. Over same stretch of game the rest of the team had 5 sessions without Ellison on the court. Only 1 was negative, a -2 in the last 30 seconds of the 1st half when Creighton had a tip in near the buzzer.
Individual +/- is a flawed statistic in my view, especially in small samples. I don't think one player being +4 and another being -4 in a game is statistically meaningful, or even necessarily means the player in the positive had a better game. Bigger fan of +/- for entire 5-player combinations.
But when the numbers are extreme it's difficult to ignore. And these numbers are absolutely astounding. Especially for a player that played the third most minutes on the team last night after playing the second most against Georgetown, while not playing particularly well in either game.
Plenty of other guys didn't play well last night, but this seems to be a growing trend for Ellison with significant minutes for not a lot of production. What is the staff trying to accomplish here?
Great points! With a trio of guards with deadly speed next season in Ponds, LoVett & Simon & hopefully an additional rebounder, I also don't see how he will function in an accelerated running game. He doesn't seem effective making good decisions in general, but on the break he often looks lost, perhaps a bit slow. I am also not sure why his stroke is so off. Earlier in season he seemed able to hit his jump shots & looked a little smoother in process. Now his stroke looks MIA. Staff is certainly giving him opportunity, so I assume they see light at end of tunnel.
stjohnschris
Active member
Great analysis of the numbers. I can only think that CM sees Ellison as covering two important criteria...height and ball handling. He had 4 solid offensive performances mid-season, and it seemed to solidify his name into the starting line-up and get him overall minutes. 24.5 average (minutes) per game, Darien Williams 11.2, and Mussini 18.6. I also feel it's not entirely about the numbers. Williams, Mussini (and Owens) all bring energy to the floor...heck even Amar brings positive energy to the floor. That doesn't show up on the stat line, but to me, it counts.
Creighton recap:http://www.bigeastboards.com/
L J S A
Well-known member
Not too many high school seniors left over who could even give us what Ellison gives us next season. And a talented fifth-year-guy may not want to come when he sees Clark and Ahmed on the roster. If all goes well with Simon and Clark, Ellison gets less minutes, but does something with the minutes he gets.
Not every player in college basketball wants to transfer and some can be role players. If Ellison needs to play a ton of minutes and there is a program that he would be happy at that will give him that then who knows. I would prefer to see him stay and be a useful sub and if things don't work out for us possibly more.
we are sju
Active member
Is Simon allowed to practice with the team?
If he is allowed to, what Ellison does as far as transferring would be a pretty good indication of how good Simon will be.
Class of 72
Active member
The Creighton loss was not about Alibegovic or Freudenberg getting minutes. It was not about x's and o's.
Like many games we have lost this season it is about milk cartons.
The only variable is whose picture goes on the milk cartons. Yes, we were missing Owens but last night Marcus Lovett was MIA once again. In the last two games he has been the conductor without his baton.
For most of the game, Ellison had his picture reserved for the milk carton as did Bashir Ahmed.
When we have milk carton issues we lose games....to anyone. Villanova for sure but just as likely LIU or Delaware State.
Hopefully next year.........
Next year.....
The story of our lives when it comes to St. John's basketball.
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[/quote]
Like many games we have lost this season it is about milk cartons.
The only variable is whose picture goes on the milk cartons. Yes, we were missing Owens but last night Marcus Lovett was MIA once again. In the last two games he has been the conductor without his baton.
For most of the game, Ellison had his picture reserved for the milk carton as did Bashir Ahmed.
When we have milk carton issues we lose games....to anyone. Villanova for sure but just as likely LIU or Delaware State.
Hopefully next year.........
Next year.....
The story of our lives when it comes to St. John's basketball.
westchesterjoe
Active member
Not sure why Ellison gets the Minutes he does, 24 per game. And, I do'nt see him as a effective deliverer for the Ball'.
To me, he makes way too many poor decisions passing wise and shooting wise. He is not a good shooter from the field or the line.
Maybe, at his size, 6'6" Mullin sees him as a point forward, like Chris was with GS under Don Nelson. I don't see Ellison having any of the skills to be that type player. I like the idea of Ponds or Lovett handling the Ball on ever sequence, they are much better distributors of the Ball than Ellison. . Poor Lovett, he tries to give Yakwe the Ball in position to score only to see the Ball fumbled and lost or, Yakwe missing another Bunny 2 feet from the rim.
I hope Mullin can get better movement and utilization when Ponds and Lovett are in the game together. I would rather have one of them , at the top of the Key, getting the touches that Ellison is getting now.
To me, he makes way too many poor decisions passing wise and shooting wise. He is not a good shooter from the field or the line.
Maybe, at his size, 6'6" Mullin sees him as a point forward, like Chris was with GS under Don Nelson. I don't see Ellison having any of the skills to be that type player. I like the idea of Ponds or Lovett handling the Ball on ever sequence, they are much better distributors of the Ball than Ellison. . Poor Lovett, he tries to give Yakwe the Ball in position to score only to see the Ball fumbled and lost or, Yakwe missing another Bunny 2 feet from the rim.
I hope Mullin can get better movement and utilization when Ponds and Lovett are in the game together. I would rather have one of them , at the top of the Key, getting the touches that Ellison is getting now.
I think Ellison and AA get the minutes they get because someone has to get minutes and we still don't have a complete D1 roster. I have become a complete schizophrenic with my emotions; during a game, complete lunacy and undoubtedly unrealistic expectations, and after, when some degree of sanity enters into the picture and objectively realize the strides we have made.
Class of 72
Active member
Alibegovic has been getting more minutes than we expected in December because someone has to fill in for the lost minutes of Sima and now the missing Owens. Ellison gets more minutes than he deserves because Detlef Shrimp turned out be Richard Freudenberg. If his minutes don't decrease next year with Justin Simon it would be because Pervis Ellison has a picture of Mullin getting a bj from a Laker cheerleader.
Just got around to watching this game on my DVR and the best thing about the telecast was listening to Pete Gillen pronounce our frosh forward as Richard Fwoidenburgh. Next best thing was watching Ali B run through that pick even though he was called for a flagrant.