Apology

[firestorm]

Any more apologies?

Yes I apologize to coach for having board full of posters who think they know more than he does coaching college basketball.

Sorry I didn't bite on your baiting.

Serious question, at any point in his four years here have you ever heard or seen one of our players, an opposing player, an opposing coach, a former player/coach, an announcer, an analyst in the studio, or a reporter compliment coach Lavin on the things he does in practice or the decisions he makes during games?

I'm sure it's happened, but the fact that all of us probably need to think very hard to come up with an example... that in itself is very telling.

Yes! After the 'Nova loss, Gus Johnson said, and I paraphrase here, that you know Lavin will have these guys ready and will motivate them. Now, that didn't happen for the X game, but I thought that was a compliment. And on a recent Red Storm Report, JaKarr attributed the team's recent success to Lavin's motivation and keeping things positive. This kind of thing is not always clearly visible on the court, whether during practice or during a game, but it's obviously there, just based on JaKarr's observations.

That's the problem I'm seeing though. I keep hearing quotes, cliches and motivational things. Rarely do I hear X and O things out of him or others when speaking of him. We all know its his weakness. Watch some other coaches give interviews. Especially during halftime or right after the game. They speak in technical terms. Break down game. And do it succinctly and not rambling for 2 minutes. He's a motivator and no doubt he can probably rally the troops (last 2 games excluded) but I'd like to see more 'basketball' breakdown.

I was under the impression he left that up to his associate head coach, so maybe he's the one not doing his job?

I'm reluctant to jump back into the fray on this, but can't resist. Just so I understand: our staff were not doing their jobs when they were 0-5, did outstanding work when we won eight of nine, and are back to not doing their jobs now that we've lost two in a row.

Apparently the only people more inconsistent than our coaching staff are the posters on this site...

 

[simplyred]

Spot on, firestorm. Also, I am under the impression that Keady's role is to observe games and counsel Lavin on, among other things, what needs to be worked on in practice. He helps organize practices. Keady is a Hall of Fame coach and one of the most respected people around. He comes to St. John's and gets disrespected by posters on these boards.

 

[MJDinkins]

Spot on, firestorm. Also, I am under the impression that Keady's role is to observe games and counsel Lavin on, among other things, what needs to be worked on in practice. He helps organize practices. Keady is a Hall of Fame coach and one of the most respected people around. He comes to St. John's and gets disrespected by posters on these boards.

It's all about having a medium, IMO. The quote I lifted from Hoyasaxa speaks volumes, if you ask me.

 

[logen]

Any more apologies?

Yes I apologize to coach for having board full of posters who think they know more than he does coaching college basketball.

Sorry I didn't bite on your baiting.

Serious question, at any point in his four years here have you ever heard or seen one of our players, an opposing player, an opposing coach, a former player/coach, an announcer, an analyst in the studio, or a reporter compliment coach Lavin on the things he does in practice or the decisions he makes during games?

I'm sure it's happened, but the fact that all of us probably need to think very hard to come up with an example... that in itself is very telling.

Yes! After the 'Nova loss, Gus Johnson said, and I paraphrase here, that you know Lavin will have these guys ready and will motivate them. Now, that didn't happen for the X game, but I thought that was a compliment. And on a recent Red Storm Report, JaKarr attributed the team's recent success to Lavin's motivation and keeping things positive. This kind of thing is not always clearly visible on the court, whether during practice or during a game, but it's obviously there, just based on JaKarr's observations.

That's the problem I'm seeing though. I keep hearing quotes, cliches and motivational things. Rarely do I hear X and O things out of him or others when speaking of him. We all know its his weakness. Watch some other coaches give interviews. Especially during halftime or right after the game. They speak in technical terms. Break down game. And do it succinctly and not rambling for 2 minutes. He's a motivator and no doubt he can probably rally the troops (last 2 games excluded) but I'd like to see more 'basketball' breakdown.

I was under the impression he left that up to his associate head coach, so maybe he's the one not doing his job?

I'm reluctant to jump back into the fray on this, but can't resist. Just so I understand: our staff were not doing their jobs when they were 0-5, did outstanding work when we won eight of nine, and are back to not doing their jobs now that we've lost two in a row.

Apparently the only people more inconsistent than our coaching staff are the posters on this site...

Since you jumped in, no, I think your analysis of some posters (myself included) of the "job" the staff is doing is way off. I was very vocal from Game 1 about how poorly the team was playing; I think I was relatively consistent through the 0-5 start in my criticism. When we started to win, my posts were mostly that, yes, we were playing well but it had to be sustained and built on. I focused on 3 areas consistently, playing hard, playing D, and sharing the ball. In the last 2 games I think we by and large reverted back to the style we played earlier in the season. Our D against Nova was not horrible but we got broken down pretty consistently; our offense was just that, offensive. Our D against Xavier was ridiculously bad as was our offense. We have a lot of talent on this team and for some reason it hasn't clicked. 10 games (or 9 as you post) is 1/3 of our season and to be satisfied playing good ball for that part of the season just doesn't cut it for me. Sorry.

 

[TonyinFairfield]

Any more apologies?

Yes I apologize to coach for having board full of posters who think they know more than he does coaching college basketball.

Sorry I didn't bite on your baiting.

Serious question, at any point in his four years here have you ever heard or seen one of our players, an opposing player, an opposing coach, a former player/coach, an announcer, an analyst in the studio, or a reporter compliment coach Lavin on the things he does in practice or the decisions he makes during games?

I'm sure it's happened, but the fact that all of us probably need to think very hard to come up with an example... that in itself is very telling.

Yes! After the 'Nova loss, Gus Johnson said, and I paraphrase here, that you know Lavin will have these guys ready and will motivate them. Now, that didn't happen for the X game, but I thought that was a compliment. And on a recent Red Storm Report, JaKarr attributed the team's recent success to Lavin's motivation and keeping things positive. This kind of thing is not always clearly visible on the court, whether during practice or during a game, but it's obviously there, just based on JaKarr's observations.

That's the problem I'm seeing though. I keep hearing quotes, cliches and motivational things. Rarely do I hear X and O things out of him or others when speaking of him. We all know its his weakness. Watch some other coaches give interviews. Especially during halftime or right after the game. They speak in technical terms. Break down game. And do it succinctly and not rambling for 2 minutes. He's a motivator and no doubt he can probably rally the troops (last 2 games excluded) but I'd like to see more 'basketball' breakdown.

Any other game you watch and you'll hear the announcers say "When we were at practice yesterday Cal had the guys doing this drill where _____"
"Buzz has his entire team do 2-1 rebounding drills for an hour to start every practice .... and it shows, because as we've seen tonight his guards rebound as well as most bigs in this league" And I could go on. When people observe practices with good coaches, they walk away genuinely impressed, I've never heard anyone say that about Lavin.

And the best strategic decision I think he made during a game this season was switching to zone against Bucknell in the second half. That was big, and paid huge dividends. But in most "coachable" situations, plays coming out of a timeout or on an in-bound, our conversion rate is pathetic.

At the end of the day its possible his recruiting prowess more than makes up for his weaknesses. That's a debate for another day. But it's painfully obvious to anyone who does understand basketball, that coach isn't comfortable talking actual basketball. He's comfortable talking about the human condition, human interest stories, motivational tactics, and cliches.

I must say that I've never heard announcers comment on what coaches have done during practices. Nor do I think it matters. I for one, really don't care what other coaches do at their practices. Irrelevant to St. John's basketball.

So, if I understand you correctly, you have the opinion that coach isn't comfortable talking actual basketball. And you know he's not comfortable how? Are you inside his head and can read his mind? You are making huge inferences about what someone thinks and feels. It's your opinion, and nothing more. I have a different opinion.

And by the way, to what do you attribute the hot streak of winning 8 of 9? Was coach talking basketball during that stretch of games? Or in your opinion, he had nothing to do with that?

 

[stjohnschris]

During the winning streak, the difference (that I saw) was a sharper focus, intensity and actually hitting shots with regularity. I didn't see any fundamental differences with the way we ran offense or defense.
Lav must have had some great halftime speeches in February and it seemed the coaching staff was doing a good job mentally preparing the team to win. Other than that, nothing has
changed since the beginning of the season. We don't run plays on offense. We have the "pick and don't roll", or the "pick and pop out for a shot that is not in your range", or the isolation dribble drive by a guard or someone who thinks they can dribble like a guard.
Someone on another post made an analogy of an NBA offensive system, which is kind of true. In the wins, we had at least one or two hot hands who were making some great shots...fun to watch and cheer for, but
not a recipie for long term success. There were also some lock down defensive moments, but certainly not every game, and defensive intensity and focus has been inconsistent at best. Under Lavin, I trust that
our recruiting will continue at a high level, I'm confident that he will always represent the team and the school very well, and that he will always be well spoken at media events. But that's not enough to produce a high level program year after year.