A Message to the Presidents of Pitt and Syracuse

C

Class of 72

Active member
 From the New York Times:
“What is lost in all of this is that the presidents — the very people tasked with enforcing the N.C.A.A.’s and the Knight Commission’s principle of ‘presidential control’ of college athletics — have proven to all that they are incapable of fulfilling their mandate,” Princeton’s athletic director, Gary Walters, said, referring to a watchdog group for college athletics. “The hypocrisy is almost tangible.”

Also, I am interested to hear from our legal team here on Redmen.com if there should be any legal action initiated by the Big East against the President of Pitt who led and influenced the conference in rejecting the Billion dollar+ offer by ESPN. Was there collusion between the Presidents of Syracuse and Pitt to both financially and organizationally destroy the Big East and, by extension, the remaining schools financial outlook?
Should a congressional panel begin looking into anti-trust, insider-dealing type scenarios in college sports?
 
my understanding is syracuse fans are livid over the change. they should initiate a petition to get the board of trustees to fire their president.

other than that...it's a big business...and there's very little integrity in big business these days. 
 
What's especially maddening is that both schools are leaving the Big East, a second-tier football conference, for the ACC, another second-tier football conference. Had they gone to the Big Ten or SEC, I might understand, but this ...?  
 
I think something needs to be done to Pitt's president who was/is the president of the Big East board of directors. I don't think its too far fetched that his opinion to the other presidents could have kept the conference from expanding which did 1 of 2 or both a)force Syracuse to think about their own future and ask the ACC for acceptance into their conference b)prevent any movement by the Big East which would immeidately cause a shakeup in college sports and possibly prevent their own move to the ACC. Either way, its obvious he tried to trick the rest of the conference and should eb the center of any probe or investigation IMO.
 
What's especially maddening is that both schools are leaving the Big East, a second-tier football conference, for the ACC, another second-tier football conference. Had they gone to the Big Ten or SEC, I might understand, but this ...?  
Click to expand...

It's a second-tier football conference in no danger of dying. That's why.
 
What's especially maddening is that both schools are leaving the Big East, a second-tier football conference, for the ACC, another second-tier football conference. Had they gone to the Big Ten or SEC, I might understand, but this ...?  
Click to expand...

It's a second-tier football conference in no danger of dying. That's why.
Click to expand...
 

You can only die ONCE and the ACC has already crossed the river Styx! UNC on PROBATION for 2 years. Miami probation to follow. Loss of football recruits to the SEC. All the ACC did was improve their basketball portfolio and faces of the two Big East programs may be gone by 2014.
 
 I’m a Syracuse fan and don’t think Syracuse fans are mad about this at all. It’s a small sample but here’s a poll of Cuse fans, with(currently) 86% for the move:

http://www.syracusefan.com/threads/poll-for-against-move-to-acc.2523/

Even if that poll had 100% against it, it wouldn’t matter, you could have every signature in the world on a petition and the SU administration would never go back. The BET and rivalries with Georgetown, etc were amazing, I felt like the two games at MSG against you guys were starting to get back to the old days, but you have to realize the money difference here. We currently make somewhere between $2.5 and $3 million dollars from the Big East. In the ACC, we are setup to make $11 million dollars a year. Then consider the alternative, a football conference which may or may not have an automatic bid with Navy and Air Force? One which could dissolve at any second, leaving us in football oblivion? No thanks.

For football, it’s a no brainer. We can upgrade our facilities and finally get a practice facility that will put us on par with our rivals. We even leave Rutgers, who eats up a lot of the local talent, behind, which should improve our recruiting. For basketball, I see a lot of comparisons to BC, which I don’t get at all. We’re superior in every way basketball wise to BC. We’ve also spent the last half decade playing in the toughest conference ever built(against teams/coaches who have attacked 2-3 zones before), you know who the 4th most successful program of the ACC has been the last few years? Virginia Tech. If you think we’re going to fade in hoops, I really don’t see it. I think we’re set to destroy a large portion of that league. This could change if JB retires and Hopkins proves to be inept as a coach.
 
 I’m a Syracuse fan and don’t think Syracuse fans are mad about this at all. It’s a small sample but here’s a poll of Cuse fans, with(currently) 86% for the move:

http://www.syracusefan.com/threads/poll-for-against-move-to-acc.2523/

Even if that poll had 100% against it, it wouldn’t matter, you could have every signature in the world on a petition and the SU administration would never go back. The BET and rivalries with Georgetown, etc were amazing, I felt like the two games at MSG against you guys were starting to get back to the old days, but you have to realize the money difference here. We currently make somewhere between $2.5 and $3 million dollars from the Big East. In the ACC, we are setup to make $11 million dollars a year. Then consider the alternative, a football conference which may or may not have an automatic bid with Navy and Air Force? One which could dissolve at any second, leaving us in football oblivion? No thanks.

For football, it’s a no brainer. We can upgrade our facilities and finally get a practice facility that will put us on par with our rivals. We even leave Rutgers, who eats up a lot of the local talent, behind, which should improve our recruiting. For basketball, I see a lot of comparisons to BC, which I don’t get at all. We’re superior in every way basketball wise to BC. We’ve also spent the last half decade playing in the toughest conference ever built(against teams/coaches who have attacked 2-3 zones before), you know who the 4th most successful program of the ACC has been the last few years? Virginia Tech. If you think we’re going to fade in hoops, I really don’t see it. I think we’re set to destroy a large portion of that league. This could change if JB retires and Hopkins proves to be inept as a coach.
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For football, it’s a no brainer. We can upgrade our facilities and finally get a practice facility that will put us on par with our rivals....................
What rivals?
su football has sucked for eons.
Enjoy Tallahassee and Clemson.
Like syracuse without the snow except one thing you will notice.
How fugly upstate NY women are.
Thanks for visiting.
 
I'd be bitter too if I just had this decade against Syracuse:

1/31/2000 H St. John's W 63-57
3/4/2001 @ St. John's W 93-91
2/18/2003 H St. John's W 66-60
1/7/2004 H St. John's W 65-59
1/5/2005 @ St John’s W 79-65
2/23/2005 H St John’s W 83-69
2/12/2006 @ St. John’s W 75-60
1/21/2007 @ St. John's L 60-64
2/11/2007 H St. John's W 76-74
1/2/2008 H St. John’s W 76-70
2/24/2009 @ St. John's W 87-58
3/2/2010 H St. John’s W 85-66
1/12/2011 @ St. John's W 76-59
3/10/2011 BET St. John's W 79-73
 
 
I'd be bitter too if I just had this decade against Syracuse:

1/31/2000 H St. John's W 63-57
3/4/2001 @ St. John's W 93-91
2/18/2003 H St. John's W 66-60
1/7/2004 H St. John's W 65-59
1/5/2005 @ St John’s W 79-65
2/23/2005 H St John’s W 83-69
2/12/2006 @ St. John’s W 75-60
1/21/2007 @ St. John's L 60-64
2/11/2007 H St. John's W 76-74
1/2/2008 H St. John’s W 76-70
2/24/2009 @ St. John's W 87-58
3/2/2010 H St. John’s W 85-66
1/12/2011 @ St. John's W 76-59
3/10/2011 BET St. John's W 79-73
 
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Well done.
Have fun in Utica, or wherever
 
I'd be bitter too if I just had this decade against Syracuse:

1/31/2000 H St. John's W 63-57
3/4/2001 @ St. John's W 93-91
2/18/2003 H St. John's W 66-60
1/7/2004 H St. John's W 65-59
1/5/2005 @ St John’s W 79-65
2/23/2005 H St John’s W 83-69
2/12/2006 @ St. John’s W 75-60
1/21/2007 @ St. John's L 60-64
2/11/2007 H St. John's W 76-74
1/2/2008 H St. John’s W 76-70
2/24/2009 @ St. John's W 87-58
3/2/2010 H St. John’s W 85-66
1/12/2011 @ St. John's W 76-59
3/10/2011 BET St. John's W 79-73
 
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Could you now share with us your BCS Bowl records over the past TEN F N YEARS?!?! Just admit that you dicks sold your Big East soul for a few shekels and lose no sleep about it! Ms. Cantor and her shekels can go f herself! Upgrade your facilities? Why the f didn't you do that while in the Big East so as to make football more viable?
Basketball supported this conference all these years and the football scumbags did nothing to better themselves on a national level to attract TV $$! So how do you justify f n the conference and former business partners that made you? You stab them in the back for more shekels! Your football program will continue to rot in ACC hell and after Boeheim (let's call it A.B. In Syracuse basketball years) your basketball program will join it in the MIDDLE of the ACC pack. You now may bring UNC and Duke to the Dome but you will also be bringing in Clemson, Virginia, Miami, NC State, Wake Forest instead of St. John's, Notre Dame, Villanova, Louisville, Georgetown, Uconn, Marquette, etc. Hope you establish those great ACC rivalries FAST because the Dome was not built in a Day! LOL!
 
Okay, I assumed this thread would just die off, but guess not.

You want me to share our BCS Bowl record for the last ten years? 0-0. We didn’t win the conference, so we didn’t play in one in the last 10 years. It’s kind of like asking for St. John’s record in NCAA tournaments since 2001. There’s just not much to go on because your teams were generally watching from home. That’s what we were doing with BCS games.

Umm, yeah, we sold out the Big East for money/long term stability. I don’t think anyone is disputing that, although we did it for dollars, not shekels. Dollars are the same reason UConn and Rutgers and Villanova and West Virginia and everyone else is trying to get off this sinking ship. Please don’t act like St. John’s is taking the moral high ground here, you just don’t have any other options because football is driving the bus and you don’t have a team. If your administration didn’t do the same thing given the choice as Syracuse, they should and probably would be fired for incompetence.

If you think the Big East made Syracuse, you don’t know Syracuse history pre-Big East. By the high brow tone of your post, this would be shocking if true.

We didn’t upgrade the football facilities in the past because we didn’t have the money, an estimated $16 million. Now we will. Fairly simple.

Your point about the lesser home teams coming to the Dome in basketball and not generating attendance is valid and is a potential concern. It does contradict your next point about how we’ll struggle to beat the Clemson, Virginia, NC State, Wake(who are so bad that they aren’t Dome draws, but will apparently will beat us), I’m sorry but I just don’t see those programs passing us in basketball, Boeheim or not. If you disagree, that’s fine. Time will tell who is right. Worst case, we’ll just take a lesser opponent and throw the game or two in MSG, throw a bone to the NYC alums of New York’s College Team.
 
Okay, I assumed this thread would just die off, but guess not.

You want me to share our BCS Bowl record for the last ten years? 0-0. We didn’t win the conference, so we didn’t play in one in the last 10 years. It’s kind of like asking for St. John’s record in NCAA tournaments since 2001. There’s just not much to go on because your teams were generally watching from home. That’s what we were doing with BCS games.

Umm, yeah, we sold out the Big East for money/long term stability. I don’t think anyone is disputing that, although we did it for dollars, not shekels. Dollars are the same reason UConn and Rutgers and Villanova and West Virginia and everyone else is trying to get off this sinking ship. Please don’t act like St. John’s is taking the moral high ground here, you just don’t have any other options because football is driving the bus and you don’t have a team. If your administration didn’t do the same thing given the choice as Syracuse, they should and probably would be fired for incompetence.


If you think the Big East made Syracuse, you don’t know Syracuse history pre-Big East. By the high brow tone of your post, this would be shocking if true.

We didn’t upgrade the football facilities in the past because we didn’t have the money, an estimated $16 million. Now we will. Fairly simple.

Your point about the lesser home teams coming to the Dome in basketball and not generating attendance is valid and is a potential concern. It does contradict your next point about how we’ll struggle to beat the Clemson, Virginia, NC State, Wake(who are so bad that they aren’t Dome draws, but will apparently will beat us), I’m sorry but I just don’t see those programs passing us in basketball, Boeheim or not. If you disagree, that’s fine. Time will tell who is right. Worst case, we’ll just take a lesser opponent and throw the game or two in MSG, throw a bone to the NYC alums of New York’s College Team.
Click to expand...
 

This thread was dying a slow death. The rate of responses was slowing down. Unfortunately, I think your post will resurrect it. In the end, I just want SJU to have a couple of more shots to beat Syracuse. After you bolt, I never want to see Syracuse again. Happy ACCing.
 
Okay, I assumed this thread would just die off, but guess not.

You want me to share our BCS Bowl record for the last ten years? 0-0. We didn’t win the conference, so we didn’t play in one in the last 10 years. It’s kind of like asking for St. John’s record in NCAA tournaments since 2001. There’s just not much to go on because your teams were generally watching from home. That’s what we were doing with BCS games.

Umm, yeah, we sold out the Big East for money/long term stability. I don’t think anyone is disputing that, although we did it for dollars, not shekels. Dollars are the same reason UConn and Rutgers and Villanova and West Virginia and everyone else is trying to get off this sinking ship. Please don’t act like St. John’s is taking the moral high ground here, you just don’t have any other options because football is driving the bus and you don’t have a team. If your administration didn’t do the same thing given the choice as Syracuse, they should and probably would be fired for incompetence.

If you think the Big East made Syracuse, you don’t know Syracuse history pre-Big East. By the high brow tone of your post, this would be shocking if true.

We didn’t upgrade the football facilities in the past because we didn’t have the money, an estimated $16 million. Now we will. Fairly simple.

Your point about the lesser home teams coming to the Dome in basketball and not generating attendance is valid and is a potential concern. It does contradict your next point about how we’ll struggle to beat the Clemson, Virginia, NC State, Wake(who are so bad that they aren’t Dome draws, but will apparently will beat us), I’m sorry but I just don’t see those programs passing us in basketball, Boeheim or not. If you disagree, that’s fine. Time will tell who is right. Worst case, we’ll just take a lesser opponent and throw the game or two in MSG, throw a bone to the NYC alums of New York’s College Team.
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I appreciate your honesty in that you admit you sold out the Big East for some shekels. I appreciate the moral low-ground of your tone and approach to college sports.
However, your coach the other day stated that Syracuse would not be what it is today without the Big East....he would not be a HofF coach without Dave Gavitt founding the Big East and sarcastically questioned little Ms. Cantor's decision. As for Syracuss basketball history well I kinda know a little. I know that Roy Danforth had to resurrect it from the ashes starting in 1968. I know that for the better part of the 50's and early 60's the basketball program was a joke. I remember you played in the 9,000 seat Manley Field house. Yeah, you guys were the UCLA of the east prior to the Big East!
Oh, and as far as your football program's record while in the Big East--cough, cough--0-0, because you did not win and sucked----well you know what? You can build the best practice facility up there in the North Pole and you will still suck. Yeah, you guys jumped a sinking ship because of football money. But you failed to remind us that you and Pitt planted the explosives in the ships' boiler room! Now take the other great football program schools that think they were propping up the Big East UCONN, Rutgers and little mousy Villanova----well golly I just checked and they also are mediocre football schools! Heck, Nova had the balls to apply on the promise that some day they would be as great a college football power as Syracuse and Rutgers! I am rolling my eyes here! Schmucks like you and those other schools, if admitted, will do squat for ACC football. Heck, two very good football programs that jumped to the ACC pretty much have sucked since leaving and you clowns are not even in their class! Ah yes, what price glory?

1960-1961
4
19
.174
Marc Guley        
1961-1962
2
22
.083
Marc Guley        
1962-1963
8
13
.381
Fred Lewis        
1963-1964
17
8
.680
Fred Lewis NIT Tournament 1st Round      
1964-1965
13
10
.565
Fred Lewis    
NR
 
1965-1966
22
6
.786
Fred Lewis NCAA Sweet Sixteen  
NR
N/A
1966-1967
20
6
.769
Fred Lewis NIT Tournament 1st Round  
NR
 
1967-1968
11
14
.440
Fred Lewis    
NR
 
1968-1969
9
16
.360
Roy Danforth    
NR
 
1969-1970
12
12
.500
Roy Danforth    
NR
 
1970-1971
19
7
.731
Roy Danforth NIT Tournament 1st Round  
NR
 
1971-1972
22
6
.786
Roy Danforth NIT Tournament Round of 16  
NR
 
1972-1973
24
5
.828
Roy Danforth NCAA 2nd Round  
14th
N/A
1973-1974
19
7
.731
Roy Danforth NCAA 1st Round  
NR
N/A
1974-1975
23
9
.719
Roy Danforth NCAA Final Four  
6th
N/A
1975-1976
20
9
.690
Roy Danforth NCAA 1st Round  
NR
N/A
1976-1977
26
4
.867
Jim Boeheim NCAA 2nd Round  
6th
N/A
1977-1978
22
6
.786
Jim Boeheim NCAA 1st Round  
NR
N/A 
 
 Yes, we sold out the Big East. Exactly what St.. John’s leadership would do if they had a choice. Syracuse’s leadership’s job is to do what’s best for, wait for it, Syracuse! Sorry, St. John’s and the other schools aren’t even a blip on the radar . Sorry if we’re hurting feelings here.

Put it this way. You have a job for the last 20-30 years. They treat you good, the boss loves you, you have a lot of friends there, and you are appreciated, but you make like $50-60k a year. It isn’t like you’re starving but you certainly aren’t killing it either. The boss comes to you and says that the company is going to get bought out eventually and you could get laid off and end up on welfare within a few years. Now, another company comes at you with $200k to do the exact things that you do now, albeit with a longer commute and maybe some employees might not like you because you worked at that other company for so long. The old company would undoubtedly have employees that would hate you as well, some because they were shooting for that same job opening, and some because your departure makes the company that much weaker. Would you take the 200k and job security or take the supposed moral high ground, continuing to take the 50-60k with far less job security? What would you say to your friends at the old place who said you sold out?

No one is saying any of the Big East schools are football powers. No one is saying Syracuse football will turn into Alabama football now. Big East football is decidedly mediocre. We made an extremely poor hire in Greg Robinson. Because he sucked as a coach, doesn’t mean that we will suck as a program forever, as you suggest. My point is that we are getting paid a lot more money to be a mediocre football team and that can only help us in rising from being mediocre. It would be like me saying that St. John’s basketball has sucked for the last decade, so no matter what decisions you make, you’ll be terrible. Obviously not the case. You guys had a real nice season last year. Now imagine if the program made 3-4x more in revenue. You think you'd get better or worse?

Okay, great job putting our stats up to prove my point because to be honest, I was too lazy. You bring up Cuse basketball being terrible/irrelevant in the 60’s. Great. We also won the national title in football in 1959. If one is relevant, then so is the other. Obviously, both are irrelevant to today’s landscape. Back to basketball, we had made 6 NCAA tournaments in a row, one of which was a Final Four. This was all before the Big East formed. This wouldn’t be that far off from what we are doing now, so comparing the results, there’s no change despite the drastic changes in everything else(arenas, money, schools we play, etc.) I’m not saying we were the UCLA of the time, but we were essentially the Syracuse of the time, which was my only point. The Big East didn’t ‘make’us.

Why mention the two ‘bad’ football programs that left and not Virginia Tech, who wins that league just about every year? Convenient. Not in their class? We always beat BC when they were in the BE. We won the league over Virginia Tech and Miami twice in the late nineties. We destroyed Miami 66-13 back then.

I really don’t care this much about St. John’s. I actually wish you guys well and thought it was exciting for the two games last year, being in MSG. I understand the bitterness in losing the rivalries and I hope we play from now until forever, in the Dome or MSG. I assume no one here really cares to hear about my takes about Syracuse, so you can have the final word here.
 
  Quotes from a Syracuse moron that joined a St. John' s FAN site:

Yes, we sold out the Big East.
No one is saying any of the Big East schools are football powers. No one is saying Syracuse football will turn into Alabama football now. ......OR EVER!!! Big East football is decidedly mediocre. .....AND SYRACUSE HELPED MAKE IT THAT WAY........We made an extremely poor hire in Greg Robinson and we will suck as a program forever...........My point is that we are getting paid a lot more money to be a mediocre football team...

Okay, great job putting our stats up to prove my point THAT PRIOR TO BOEHEIM WE LOST EVERY THIRD GAME WE PLAYED .....because to be honest, I was too lazy. You bring up Cuse basketball being terrible/irrelevant in the 60’s. Great. We also won the national title in football in 1959...YES, A SHORT HALF CENTURY AGO!!! Back to basketball, we had made 6 NCAA tournaments in a row, one of which was a Final Four. This was all before the Big East formed. ....AND THE REASON WeEWERE INVITED TO JOIN THE LEAGUE. I’m not saying we were the UCLA of the time, but we were essentially the Syracuse of the time, which was my only point. ....THAT SYRACUSE DID NOT BECOME RELEVANT UNTIL THE EARLY 70's. The Big East didn’t ‘make’us....BUT THEY MADE US WHAT WE ARE TODAY......THANK JIMMY B!

Why mention the two ‘bad’ football programs that left and not Virginia Tech, who wins that league just about every year? WHY BECAUSE SYRACUSE WILL LIKELY DO WORSE THAN THOSE TWO.....WHY ELSE....DUH!!! Not in their class? YOU ARE CORRECT BECAUSE WE HAVE NOT BEEN RELEVANT IN FOOTBALL OUTSIDE OF NORTHERN NEW YORK FOR MANY MANY YEARS NOW!

I really don’t care this much about St. John’s. THAT IS WHY JOINED YOUR FAN SITE! I assume no one here really cares to hear about my takes about Syracuse here........YOUR ASSUMPTION IS CORRECT........
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Thank you for showing your orange colors here! I, unlike you, do not wish you well and hope that you will rise to the highest level of mediocrity in both football.....an easy wish....and basketball.......where you will suck after Boeheim. 
 
Okay, I assumed this thread would just die off, but guess not.

You want me to share our BCS Bowl record for the last ten years? 0-0. We didn’t win the conference, so we didn’t play in one in the last 10 years. It’s kind of like asking for St. John’s record in NCAA tournaments since 2001. There’s just not much to go on because your teams were generally watching from home. That’s what we were doing with BCS games.

Umm, yeah, we sold out the Big East for money/long term stability. I don’t think anyone is disputing that, although we did it for dollars, not shekels. Dollars are the same reason UConn and Rutgers and Villanova and West Virginia and everyone else is trying to get off this sinking ship. Please don’t act like St. John’s is taking the moral high ground here, you just don’t have any other options because football is driving the bus and you don’t have a team. If your administration didn’t do the same thing given the choice as Syracuse, they should and probably would be fired for incompetence.

If you think the Big East made Syracuse, you don’t know Syracuse history pre-Big East. By the high brow tone of your post, this would be shocking if true.

We didn’t upgrade the football facilities in the past because we didn’t have the money, an estimated $16 million. Now we will. Fairly simple.

Your point about the lesser home teams coming to the Dome in basketball and not generating attendance is valid and is a potential concern. It does contradict your next point about how we’ll struggle to beat the Clemson, Virginia, NC State, Wake(who are so bad that they aren’t Dome draws, but will apparently will beat us), I’m sorry but I just don’t see those programs passing us in basketball, Boeheim or not. If you disagree, that’s fine. Time will tell who is right. Worst case, we’ll just take a lesser opponent and throw the game or two in MSG, throw a bone to the NYC alums of New York’s College Team.
Click to expand...
 One big fallacy (among others in your thread - you never were, nor will ever be, New York City's College Team. So don't come back to our city, and I say "our city" not because I still live or work in NYC, but NYC has been SJ's city for a loooong time, and to dispute that is to fight a losing battle. And NYC always will be SJ"s college city, no matter how much orange paint your admin tries to throw around NYC. 
 
 Yes, we sold out the Big East. Exactly what St.. John’s leadership would do if they had a choice. Syracuse’s leadership’s job is to do what’s best for, wait for it, Syracuse! Sorry, St. John’s and the other schools aren’t even a blip on the radar . Sorry if we’re hurting feelings here.

Put it this way. You have a job for the last 20-30 years. They treat you good, the boss loves you, you have a lot of friends there, and you are appreciated, but you make like $50-60k a year. It isn’t like you’re starving but you certainly aren’t killing it either. The boss comes to you and says that the company is going to get bought out eventually and you could get laid off and end up on welfare within a few years. Now, another company comes at you with $200k to do the exact things that you do now, albeit with a longer commute and maybe some employees might not like you because you worked at that other company for so long. The old company would undoubtedly have employees that would hate you as well, some because they were shooting for that same job opening, and some because your departure makes the company that much weaker. Would you take the 200k and job security or take the supposed moral high ground, continuing to take the 50-60k with far less job security? What would you say to your friends at the old place who said you sold out?

No one is saying any of the Big East schools are football powers. No one is saying Syracuse football will turn into Alabama football now. Big East football is decidedly mediocre. We made an extremely poor hire in Greg Robinson. Because he sucked as a coach, doesn’t mean that we will suck as a program forever, as you suggest. My point is that we are getting paid a lot more money to be a mediocre football team and that can only help us in rising from being mediocre. It would be like me saying that St. John’s basketball has sucked for the last decade, so no matter what decisions you make, you’ll be terrible. Obviously not the case. You guys had a real nice season last year. Now imagine if the program made 3-4x more in revenue. You think you'd get better or worse?

Okay, great job putting our stats up to prove my point because to be honest, I was too lazy. You bring up Cuse basketball being terrible/irrelevant in the 60’s. Great. We also won the national title in football in 1959. If one is relevant, then so is the other. Obviously, both are irrelevant to today’s landscape. Back to basketball, we had made 6 NCAA tournaments in a row, one of which was a Final Four. This was all before the Big East formed. This wouldn’t be that far off from what we are doing now, so comparing the results, there’s no change despite the drastic changes in everything else(arenas, money, schools we play, etc.) I’m not saying we were the UCLA of the time, but we were essentially the Syracuse of the time, which was my only point. The Big East didn’t ‘make’us.

Why mention the two ‘bad’ football programs that left and not Virginia Tech, who wins that league just about every year? Convenient. Not in their class? We always beat BC when they were in the BE. We won the league over Virginia Tech and Miami twice in the late nineties. We destroyed Miami 66-13 back then.

I really don’t care this much about St. John’s. I actually wish you guys well and thought it was exciting for the two games last year, being in MSG. I understand the bitterness in losing the rivalries and I hope we play from now until forever, in the Dome or MSG. I assume no one here really cares to hear about my takes about Syracuse, so you can have the final word here.
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Shouldn't you be shoveling a couple of feet of snow right now from your driveway up in syracuse
 
 Yes, we sold out the Big East. Exactly what St.. John’s leadership would do if they had a choice. Syracuse’s leadership’s job is to do what’s best for, wait for it, Syracuse! Sorry, St. John’s and the other schools aren’t even a blip on the radar . Sorry if we’re hurting feelings here.
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No hurt feelings. We don't play football. But if you are positive that St John's would have done the exact same thing then you don't really know as much about St Johns as you believe.

Put it this way. You have a job for the last 20-30 years. They treat you good, the boss loves you, you have a lot of friends there, and you are appreciated, but you make like $50-60k a year. It isn’t like you’re starving but you certainly aren’t killing it either. The boss comes to you and says that the company is going to get bought out eventually and you could get laid off and end up on welfare within a few years. Now, another company comes at you with $200k to do the exact things that you do now, albeit with a longer commute and maybe some employees might not like you because you worked at that other company for so long. The old company would undoubtedly have employees that would hate you as well, some because they were shooting for that same job opening, and some because your departure makes the company that much weaker. Would you take the 200k and job security or take the supposed moral high ground, continuing to take the 50-60k with far less job security? What would you say to your friends at the old place who said you sold out?
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Yeah, except its more like you were part of a partnership...a founding member of the firm, and you left to be an associate at another firm for a moderate increase in salary and guaranteed healthcare benefits. You certainly have the right to look out for number one but you'll have to forgive your former partners for thinking you are full of number two.

No one is saying any of the Big East schools are football powers. No one is saying Syracuse football will turn into Alabama football now. Big East football is decidedly mediocre.
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So is ACC football.

We made an extremely poor hire in Greg Robinson. Because he sucked as a coach, doesn’t mean that we will suck as a program forever, as you suggest. My point is that we are getting paid a lot more money to be a mediocre football team and that can only help us in rising from being mediocre. It would be like me saying that St. John’s basketball has sucked for the last decade, so no matter what decisions you make, you’ll be terrible. Obviously not the case. You guys had a real nice season last year. Now imagine if the program made 3-4x more in revenue. You think you'd get better or worse?
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Programs run in cycles. Nobody stays on top forever and everyone on the bottom is one good hire away from relevance again. As St John's fans we are WELL aware of both of those points.

But the right hire for your football team doesn't change the fact that the ACC is a lot closer to the BE in football status than it is the SEC.



I really don’t care this much about St. John’s. I actually wish you guys well and thought it was exciting for the two games last year, being in MSG. I understand the bitterness in losing the rivalries and I hope we play from now until forever, in the Dome or MSG. I assume no one here really cares to hear about my takes about Syracuse, so you can have the final word here.
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I'll miss the rivalry as well. Although I don't know if I'd say that a hammer and a nail have a rivalry so much as they have an association. Its been a real tough last 10 years for us St Johns fans. Most of us aren't angry at Syracuse, it would be like being mad at a whore for making it all about the money and isn't that what being a whore is all about? At the end of the day we are just disappointed that we won't get a chance to return the favor for the last 10 years now that we are back in the game because the sad truth is that outside of a tournament somewhere, I doubt very much we'll be playing you ever again.
 
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