2022 Yankees

[ctstorm]

ctstorm post=444593

I really have a feeling the Yankee are sitting out this year on the Free Agent market. I understood initially sitting and waiting to see what happens with the Collective Bargaining Agreement but other teams are not.   Add to the fact that Hal Steinbrenner is one of eight owner's on a Committee and he came out in favor of lowering the Luxury Tax threshold, it has the makings of a long winter.

Yanks are already over the luxury tax threshold for 2022.  It makes sense that they would wait on the new CBA before going even further over the cap.  

Besides, there are really only 3 spots (1B, SS, CF) they would spend big money on and they aren't looking for a long term solution at 2 of them (SS & CF) because they have elite prospects ticked there in 2023.

I wonder what George S, would have done. 

Don't waste your time.  There is nothing to wonder about.  He'd very likely be doing the exact same thing his son is doing.  

George operated in a different universe that the one we exist in today.   People conveniently forget that when they pine for the 'good old days' under George.   Here are a few differences between George's days and the MLB world we live in today:

No luxury tax.   He could literally buy his way out of a bad contract by paying half to the team taking the player, all with no additional financial penalties.  Today, there are limits on what you can pay, and whatever you do pay stays on your payroll and counts against the luxury tax.  For example...lets say George traded Stanton to the Dodgers and agreed to pay 10m a year of the deal.  Since the Yankees are over the luxury tax they pay a penalty on that money they keep.  Could be as much as 100% which makes it a $20m hit each year to give that player away.  

Fewer, if any, limits on draft compensation you can pay.  If you wanted to draft Drew Henson late inthe first round and give him a boatload of cash to give up football, you could do that then.  Can't anymore.   Heck, today you get  penalties for not signing your top 10 picks including losing IFA pool money.

Limits on international spending.  Today, teams get a limited amount of money to spend on international players each year, the better the record, the lower the pool of money you get to spend.  Exceed that limit and you can't sign any big FA's for a year or two.

New posting system for Japanese stars that ensures that team with the deepest pockets can no longer get whichever player they want.  

All of these changes were designed to keep the Yankees from flexing their financial muscle.   There's not a damn thing George could do to get around them except run his payroll up to 400m a year and that's not happening.  Ever.

Besides, "the 'good old days' weren't always good, and tomorrow's not as bad as it seems"...
George won two titles in late 70's by out spending everyone for FA's.
He made one playoff appearance in the 1980's and the decade that defined his legacy as an owner was the 1990's and that dynasty only came about because he was banned from the sport for a few years and Gene Michael was allowed to build a dynasty.     If George hadn't been banned, Mariano and Jeter would have been a Mariner or Pirate like Jay Buhner and Doug Drabek and we'd have been chasing our tail for another decade or two.


 

I wasn't "pineing" for George at all, who I always thought was bad for baseball. Just wondering about who would be flashing the bigger wallet and who would win the battle of the tabloids. Your points are well taken but no one ever accused George of acting rationally.  

 

[SJU85]

ctstorm post=444593

I really have a feeling the Yankee are sitting out this year on the Free Agent market. I understood initially sitting and waiting to see what happens with the Collective Bargaining Agreement but other teams are not.   Add to the fact that Hal Steinbrenner is one of eight owner's on a Committee and he came out in favor of lowering the Luxury Tax threshold, it has the makings of a long winter.

Yanks are already over the luxury tax threshold for 2022.  It makes sense that they would wait on the new CBA before going even further over the cap.  

Besides, there are really only 3 spots (1B, SS, CF) they would spend big money on and they aren't looking for a long term solution at 2 of them (SS & CF) because they have elite prospects ticked there in 2023.

I wonder what George S, would have done. 

Don't waste your time.  There is nothing to wonder about.  He'd very likely be doing the exact same thing his son is doing.  

George operated in a different universe that the one we exist in today.   People conveniently forget that when they pine for the 'good old days' under George.   Here are a few differences between George's days and the MLB world we live in today:

No luxury tax.   He could literally buy his way out of a bad contract by paying half to the team taking the player, all with no additional financial penalties.  Today, there are limits on what you can pay, and whatever you do pay stays on your payroll and counts against the luxury tax.  For example...lets say George traded Stanton to the Dodgers and agreed to pay 10m a year of the deal.  Since the Yankees are over the luxury tax they pay a penalty on that money they keep.  Could be as much as 100% which makes it a $20m hit each year to give that player away.  

Fewer, if any, limits on draft compensation you can pay.  If you wanted to draft Drew Henson late inthe first round and give him a boatload of cash to give up football, you could do that then.  Can't anymore.   Heck, today you get  penalties for not signing your top 10 picks including losing IFA pool money.

Limits on international spending.  Today, teams get a limited amount of money to spend on international players each year, the better the record, the lower the pool of money you get to spend.  Exceed that limit and you can't sign any big FA's for a year or two.

New posting system for Japanese stars that ensures that team with the deepest pockets can no longer get whichever player they want.  

All of these changes were designed to keep the Yankees from flexing their financial muscle.   There's not a damn thing George could do to get around them except run his payroll up to 400m a year and that's not happening.  Ever.

Besides, "the 'good old days' weren't always good, and tomorrow's not as bad as it seems"...
George won two titles in late 70's by out spending everyone for FA's.
He made one playoff appearance in the 1980's and the decade that defined his legacy as an owner was the 1990's and that dynasty only came about because he was banned from the sport for a few years and Gene Michael was allowed to build a dynasty.     If George hadn't been banned, Mariano and Jeter would have been a Mariner or Pirate like Jay Buhner and Doug Drabek and we'd have been chasing our tail for another decade or two.



 

I wasn't "pineing" for George at all, who I always thought was bad for baseball. Just wondering about who would be flashing the bigger wallet and who would win the battle of the tabloids. Your points are well taken but no one ever accused George of acting rationally.  

Nor did I say the good old days were always good.  Despite the economics and differences, George would have made it work and would have gone down swinging in the battle of the tabloids and twitter.  I doubt very seriously if he acted with the same restraint of Hal.

Draft picks weren’t something he really cared about (but he loved drafting those dual baseball/football guys like as you mentioned Henson, Dion Saunders and John Elway to name a few):

 

[SJU85]

I really have a feeling the Yankee are sitting out this year on the Free Agent market. I understood initially sitting and waiting to see what happens with the Collective Bargaining Agreement but other teams are not.   Add to the fact that Hal Steinbrenner is one of eight owner's on a Committee and he came out in favor of lowering the Luxury Tax threshold, it has the makings of a long winter.

Yanks are already over the luxury tax threshold for 2022.  It makes sense that they would wait on the new CBA before going even further over the cap.  

Besides, there are really only 3 spots (1B, SS, CF) they would spend big money on and they aren't looking for a long term solution at 2 of them (SS & CF) because they have elite prospects ticked there in 2023.

I wonder what George S, would have done. 

Yanks reset the Luxury Tax on them base on where they finished on payroll last year (the salary neutral Rizzo and Gallo deals off set by getting rid of some other salaries).  Off course we shall see what the bones agreement brings.

 

[SJU85]

I really have a feeling the Yankee are sitting out this year on the Free Agent market. I understood initially sitting and waiting to see what happens with the Collective Bargaining Agreement but other teams are not.   Add to the fact that Hal Steinbrenner is one of eight owner's on a Committee and he came out in favor of lowering the Luxury Tax threshold, it has the makings of a long winter.

Yanks are already over the luxury tax threshold for 2022.  It makes sense that they would wait on the new CBA before going even further over the cap.  

Besides, there are really only 3 spots (1B, SS, CF) they would spend big money on and they aren't looking for a long term solution at 2 of them (SS & CF) because they have elite prospects ticked there in 2023.

I know about the two “elite” shortstops but who is this elite center fielder? While I love prospects I have seen far too many Yankee prospects turn into suspects real quick (wasn’t Esteban Florio supposed to be our CF of the future), burn brightly and flame out due to injury or other reasons (Bird, Andujar, Frazier who could also go in the next category also and some would add Sanchez), they manage to screw with them or screw them up (Frazier being sent up and down or kept down one year while he produced when given a chance), Garcia (they changed his delivery and effectively broke him last season).

I don’t mind them not fooling for one of the big ticket shortstops, but need to spend at 1st and CF along with beefing up the pitching (and not with another rehabilitation project or two with a history of breaking down especially if they are older because they inevitably breakdown).

 

[Moose]

Only contract I would have given is Robbie Ray.  That isn't a horrible deal. The Seager and Semien deals are nightmares.  These miffed Yankee fans are are the same Yankee fans who hate the Stanton and Cole contracts right?  

Cashman is definitely going for a trade, there is no question.  He likely wants to pillage the A's again for Olson, or Montas, or Manaea, or Andrus or a few of them.

 

[SJU85]

Only contract I would have given is Robbie Ray.  That isn't a horrible deal. The Seager and Semien deals are nightmares.  These miffed Yankee fans are are the same Yankee fans who hate the Stanton and Cole contracts right?  

Cashman is definitely going for a trade, there is no question.  He likely wants to pillage the A's again for Olson, or Montas, or Manaea, or Andrus or a few of them.

I don’t hate either the Cole or Stanton’s contract.  Ray was the guy I wanted to slide in behind Cole.  I also want to kick the tires on Freeman (who I doubt is leaving the ATL but you never know) but a deal for Olsen would be more than acceptable and possible more realistic (Manaea as part of the deal would be nice).  Would be a block buster trade.

What I don’t want is buying low on a guys with injury histories and counting on them to fill in a gap or gaps as part of your team in either the rotation or everyday lineup.  We don’t have a good history with that.
 

 

[SJUFAN2]

Nor did I say the good old days were always good.  

 

Not a Billy Joel Fan?  /media/kunena/emoticons/smile.png

 

[SJUFAN2]

Only contract I would have given is Robbie Ray.  That isn't a horrible deal. The Seager and Semien deals are nightmares.  These miffed Yankee fans are are the same Yankee fans who hate the Stanton and Cole contracts right?  

Cashman is definitely going for a trade, there is no question.  He likely wants to pillage the A's again for Olson, or Montas, or Manaea, or Andrus or a few of them.

I don’t hate either the Cole or Stanton’s contract.  Ray was the guy I wanted to slide in behind Cole.  I also want to kick the tires on Freeman (who I doubt is leaving the ATL but you never know) but a deal for Olsen would be more than acceptable and possible more realistic (Manaea as part of the deal would be nice).  Would be a block buster trade.

What I don’t want is buying low on a guys with injury histories and counting on them to fill in a gap or gaps as part of your team in either the rotation or everyday lineup.  We don’t have a good history with that.

 

There isn't a pitcher in this class I'd have paid big money to.   Syndegaard on a 1 year deal would have made sense.  After that, better off bargain hunting or working the trade market and saving the money for a better option down the road.  
Cole, Severino, Taillon, Montgomery is a damn good top 4.   After Sherzer, Kershaw and Syndegaard, there really isn't a guy in FA who is so much better than any of those guys that you have to have him.  None of them were worth overpaying for.  

Last year was an incredible year for our minor league system.  A ton of pitchers and position players had break out years.  I have no problems taking a 2 year perspective on this and passing on the "best" available FA's this year to position ourselves to get younger in 2023 (Dominguez, Volpe, Peraza, Gil, Medina, Wells, Perreria, Waldichuck).

The one FA  I'd spend big money on this year is Freeman.
I'd have loved to get Marte on a 2 year deal, but the Mets went all in on him and made that a moot point. Barring a trade, we'll have to roll the dice on Hicks staying healthy and find a cheap back up for when he inevitably gets hurt.  In two years you will either have a young stud in CF in Dominguez or you'll be looking for a long term CF.
I'd sign Simmons for SS and use him as a bridge to Volpe/Peraza.  

After that I'm looking for an impact BP arm in a trade and I'm bargain hunting for a SP or two I can get cheap or short term as insurance for the starting rotation.
Right now you have Cole, Sevy, Tallion, Monty, Cortes, German, Gil, Schmidt, King in the mix for 5 spots.    If you aren't adding an ace, there's no need to overspend on a middling SP.   Better to roll the dice on a guy coming off injury for 1 year on the cheap and give the youngsters a shot.  

Bull pen needs an elite arm to push/replace Chapman.   Is that Loisiga?
Chapman, Loisigia, Green, Holmes, Luetge, Rodriquez, Marianaccio, Riddings, Abreu.   Pretty darn good BP righ there, but I'd be looking for that one more high leverage option.  

 

 

[SJU85]

 

Nor did I say the good old days were always good.  






 

Not a Billy Joel Fan?  /media/kunena/emoticons/smile.png

/media/kunena/emoticons/smile.png Actually I am.

Severino and Taillon have recent injury history and counting on them being your No. 2 and 3 is risky at best, something Cahsman keeps trying expecting different results.  Has not worked out well.  And  even if Severino stays healthy, after his basic inactivity for the last two plus years in game activity, how many innings can we expect.  Well at least it wasn’t Taillon’s this time and your second season after TJ surgery is when you are supposed to feel better.  Schmidt also has a history of injuries.  I like King it of the pen in a swingman role (short and long relief).  Cortes I would definitely give a nice look at as he might be like Rich Hill who after bouncing around, found something later in his career (albeit he is much younger than Hill was).  I like Gil who just needs more command and experience.  I have no problem with Montgomery (just wish they kept him in a few of his starts longer).  German is consistently and maddeningly inconsistent.

I too would focus on Freeman (or Olsen) and get glove at short like Simmons or Galvas until (and hopefully)   Volpe, Peraza or Cabera (probably more of a 2B or utility player ) are ready

I like the bullpen but Loisigia scares me (repeated arm woes).  Agree about pushing Chapman and possibly a future replacement as his Contract is up after next Season

 

[SJU85]

Severino and Taillon have recent injury history and counting on them being your No. 2 and 3 is risky at best, something Cahsman keeps trying expecting different results.  Has not worked out well.  And  even if Severino stays healthy, after his basic inactivity for the last two plus years in game activity, how many innings can we expect.  Well at least it wasn’t Taillon’s this time and your second season after TJ surgery is when you are supposed to feel better.  Schmidt also has a history of injuries.  I like King it of the pen in a swingman role (short and long relief).  Cortes I would definitely give a nice look at as he might be like Rich Hill who after bouncing around, found something later in his career (albeit he is much younger than Hill was).  I like Gil who just needs more command and experience.  I have no problem with Montgomery (just wish they kept him in a few of his starts longer).  German is consistently and maddeningly inconsistent.

I too would focus on Freeman (or Olsen) and get glove at short like Simmons or Galvas until (and hopefully)   Volpe, Peraza or Cabera (probably more of a 2B or utility player ) are ready

I like the bullpen but Loisigia scares me (repeated arm woes).  Agree about pushing Chapman and possibly a future replacement as his Contract is up after next season.

 

[SJU85]

Nor did I say the good old days were always good.  


 

Not a Billy Joel Fan?  /media/kunena/emoticons/smile.png
 

/media/kunena/emoticons/smile.png Actually I am.