If you're were playing against Bird McHale Parrish Ainge and Johnson it would be horrendous with you getting the total blameI always wanted to know what my +/- would be if you put me on the court with Magic, Kareem, Worthy, and AC Green.
The Point Guard Debate
- Thread starter dk423
- Start date
You know, Louie loved pgs who didn't turn the ball over, shot only to keep defenses honest, didn't run much, and weren't flashy. There were a few exceptions (like Rencher). Fans mostly hated it. But we won pretty regularly and capitalized on mistakes opponents made.
I do miss the pure pg days though.
I don't think you'd ever touch the ball on offense, and you might not ever stop an nba player from scoring on you.I always wanted to know what my +/- would be if you put me on the court with Magic, Kareem, Worthy, and AC Green.
But that's reality and not your point I guess.
carmineabbatiello
Well-known member
I think the Darling experiment is over. We just have to go with all the non-point
guard guards and hope that the above average handling/passing ability of our
forwards will carry us through.
guard guards and hope that the above average handling/passing ability of our
forwards will carry us through.
Certainly, at 1-4 vs top teams, we are starting to get an idea of where the team is at right now, and where individuals are right now. It's not a pretty picture.
Darling in these games has not played well. He sat for long stretches vs Auburn, playing only 7 minutes total. Pretty sure Rick didn't like the matchups. It's hard to pin the loss on him.
Sellers followed up his seemingly breakout performance vs Baylor with 1-7 in 34 minutes.
Hopkins was dominant vs Baylor, 2-11 and 7 points vs Auburn.
Ian Jackson played only 15 mins, same as Ayo, and scored 7 points. For all the beating he is taking on here came into game averaging 12.8 ppg.
Mitchell played 31 quiet minutes, 4 pts, zero defensive rebounds and 4 offensive rebs.
Prey played just 5 minutes and hasn't yet appeared to be as promising as he was last season.
Sanon shot 4-7 from 3 and scored 16 pts.
Zuby, after 2 subpar ERA games had a solid night.
You may be right about Darling. In no way is he the reason we lost, but could lose the starter's role.
I don't think Mitchell brings enough scoring as a 6th man, but with Hopkins and Zuby sure fire starters who would be the odd man out among Sellers, Sanon, and Jackson should Mitchell start?
All questions for Rick. I like Mitchell as a starter, and don't think Jackson would thrive as 6th man. That would leave Sellers and Sanon for that role.
Suddenly the bench doesn't seem so deep if Darling doesn't start. If he can't play at the same level he performed vs mid major competition, he will get spot minutes and not much more. Prey has got to do more. I'm not as high on Ayo but i think spot minutes seems right.
Clearly Sanon, Sellers, and Jackson have to be more consistently good for us to be a top 15 team. Zuby and Hopkins will be fine. Mitchell a glue guy and versatile.
When the top 6 play well we will be dangerous. Is it too much to ask that on any given night 4 of the 6 play well. If that happens we should win most games.
I know Pitino doesn’t agree with this based on the minutes distribution, but i still think Jackson should be getting more minutes. Due to his size and athleticism he has the most upside on the defensive end and as a rebounder, which is what we need. He makes a ton of silly mistakes and isn’t a distributor but the bigs are all plus passers anyway. He’s also great at busting scoring droughts bc he can get to the rim and finish better than any of the other guards.
Once again, I post what Zach had mentioned before yesterday's game:
Also a stat I dug up: St. John's is plus-100 on the season in Dylan Darling's 111 minutes. It is also plus-27 in two games here with him on the court and minus-11 when he's not on the floor.
Darling is the best PG on the roster. He's still learning the players he's playing with. Give him a chance to develop.
Also a stat I dug up: St. John's is plus-100 on the season in Dylan Darling's 111 minutes. It is also plus-27 in two games here with him on the court and minus-11 when he's not on the floor.
Darling is the best PG on the roster. He's still learning the players he's playing with. Give him a chance to develop.
mullinmagic
Member
Darling had a hamstring injury yesterday, that's why he only played 7 minutes.
mullinmagic
Member
WTF is with this weird obsession with Darling on here? The truth is that without him, this team would be SCREWED. None of those other hacks like Jackson and Sanon could ever effectively bring the ball up the court for an entire game. The eye test never fails. Not to mention, neither of those two even looks that good as a SG right now. They're also not very smart ballplayers. Lacking court IQ and Jackson's bad turnovers are killers.
Darling is about the only steadying force we have on this team when it comes to setting everyone up. The program missed big-time this offseason by not addressing the PG position more fully.
Darling is about the only steadying force we have on this team when it comes to setting everyone up. The program missed big-time this offseason by not addressing the PG position more fully.
dk423
Well-known member
All criticism of Darling, for me, is x100 more about Rick and Matt than Darling himself.
I love Darling. I hate that he’s our best PG.
if your mom burns the thanksgiving turkey today are you going to blame the turkey over and over though ?
For me at least it's much easier just to root for Darling
We should retitle this thread the guard debate, because none of our guards plays effective defense and are often out of position and as a result get blown by on one on one coverage.
I think the problem is that these guys have always been offense oriented and never had to, or cared to, play D in their careers. That would be OK if we had some gut check defenders out top, we don't.
And as far as Darlings plus numbers, how are they against top opponents? I don't know but maybe he's feasting on lesser opponents.
I think the problem is that these guys have always been offense oriented and never had to, or cared to, play D in their careers. That would be OK if we had some gut check defenders out top, we don't.
And as far as Darlings plus numbers, how are they against top opponents? I don't know but maybe he's feasting on lesser opponents.
dk423
Well-known member
I don't find it easier. I see a team having a top 10 budget, and having an extremely obvious glaring hole, that if filled, they'd be the number one team in the country. It makes the entire viewing experience of the team frustrating.
RedStormRising
Well-known member
Rooting for Darling should be easy. He just got thrust into an impossible situation that by no means was his fault. He should actually be a very positive story. An underdog that excelled at lower levels and is now taking his shot at the big leagues. The problem is he is our starting point guard by default pitted against competition at a level he hasn’t seen and is overmatched. If he came in with Sean Conway, Prey, or Ayo expectations/role where you were just hoping for 5 try hard minutes a game he could be a fan favorite. Unfortunately, he’s the only point guard on a team that had enormous expectations. That would be hard on anyone let alone someone coming from the Big Sky (or even the old PAC-12).
I guess this is my way of saying I was too hard on Darling. He’s trying, on a bum hammy no less. It’s just that his task is to stop the ocean with a sandbag.
The Ghost.
Can developing team defense ease some of the problem of quick guards blowing by us?
From what I’ve seen, the Ghost has quick feet and moves through screens. It’s worth a try. He’s been playing against grown men in Europe.
