Georgetown & Hoosiers Supporters vs. St.John's

[JackofVirginia]

Could not believe the attendance by both schools at the Barclay Center last night. Looked like a full house of red and grey. Couldn't help but to wonder had we been ranked number 1 in the nation and played out of N.Y. would we attract as many fans. And the answer is NO. I began to think about our appearance in the NCAA Tournament against Maryland and Ohio State where we were clearly outnumbered by all opposing fans. And that was in the Elite 8.

 

[Marillac]

Could not believe the attendance by both schools at the Barclay Center last night. Looked like a full house of red and grey. Couldn't help but to wonder had we been ranked number 1 in the nation and played out of N.Y. would we attract as many fans. And the answer is NO. I began to think about our appearance in the NCAA Tournament against Maryland and Ohio State where we were clearly outnumbered by all opposing teams. And that was in the Elite 8.

If we were #1 we'd be playing in front of a near sellout every game. #1Indiana v. G'town in a brand new arena in NYC is a great basketball event. Two historic top 25 teams with enormous alumni bases in NYC.

 

[JackofVirginia]

Could not believe the attendance by both schools at the Barclay Center last night. Looked like a full house of red and grey. Couldn't help but to wonder had we been ranked number 1 in the nation and played out of N.Y. would we attract as many fans. And the answer is NO. I began to think about our appearance in the NCAA Tournament against Maryland and Ohio State where we were clearly outnumbered by all opposing teams. And that was in the Elite 8.

If we were #1 we'd be playing in front of a near sellout every game. #1Indiana v. G'town in a brand new arena in NYC is a great basketball event. Two historic top 25 teams with enormous alumni bases in NYC.

Even if we played outside of New York? Don't believe so.

 

[Marillac]

Could not believe the attendance by both schools at the Barclay Center last night. Looked like a full house of red and grey. Couldn't help but to wonder had we been ranked number 1 in the nation and played out of N.Y. would we attract as many fans. And the answer is NO. I began to think about our appearance in the NCAA Tournament against Maryland and Ohio State where we were clearly outnumbered by all opposing teams. And that was in the Elite 8.

If we were #1 we'd be playing in front of a near sellout every game. #1Indiana v. G'town in a brand new arena in NYC is a great basketball event. Two historic top 25 teams with enormous alumni bases in NYC.

Even if we played outside of New York? Don't believe so.

When we win we draw. Lavin increased attenance 38% in one season. He is bulding a brand here and when this program starts stringing together successful seasons, people will show up.

 

[Section3]

Could not believe the attendance by both schools at the Barclay Center last night. Looked like a full house of red and grey. Couldn't help but to wonder had we been ranked number 1 in the nation and played out of N.Y. would we attract as many fans. And the answer is NO. I began to think about our appearance in the NCAA Tournament against Maryland and Ohio State where we were clearly outnumbered by all opposing teams. And that was in the Elite 8.

If we were #1 we'd be playing in front of a near sellout every game. #1Indiana v. G'town in a brand new arena in NYC is a great basketball event. Two historic top 25 teams with enormous alumni bases in NYC.

Even if we played outside of New York? Don't believe so.

I think the fact that SJ has historically been a commuter school has not lent itself to loyalty post graduation. I think when folks live at a school for 4 years they become part of that community -- for life. We don't have that and hence don't have as many folks who eat and sleep their alma mater.

But do believe that once Lavin re-establishes a winning culture, attendance will improve (it already has started)

 

[upstate redman]

Agree with Section 3. We don't really have a huge fan base outside of NYC, and within the NYC, many of the grads, it doesn't seem, had much of a connection when they were at SJU. Also, NYC is highly populated with people who went to school outside of the metropolitan area, so drawing is hard, since most people in NYC have other teams they root for. However, there are people who love college hoops, and if we are perennial in the top 25, people will come. When I was at Cuse for a year, I went to tons of games, just because I like to watch college bball. Since I didn't go to SJU, it is tough to say this, but I think once we are consistently good the students will show up. How could you not?

I went to a D1 hockey school (d3 everything else) and we were terrible my early years, and freshmen showed up as a pre-game event since upper classmen were entrenched in Greek life (freshmen could not join Greek life). I went to games continually since I played on the club team, and love hockey, and it bothered me the whole campus was apathetic to our only D1 team. Now we are a top 10 team, and games are almost impossible to get into, regardless of what year. In fact, I have been to two road games in the past 2 years where we outnumbered the home team. I was not their, but two weekends ago, we played at Harvard, who is a top 25 team, and my friends in the Boston area all went and said the rink was all Union fans (my alma mater). I also went to the regional finals last year in Bridgeport, and there was probably at least 4,000 Union fans (probably more) and we graduate around 500 students a year. It just goes to show what winning does. I also think because it is a really small school where everyone lives in campus, everyone has a huge affinity for the school, regardless if their care about hockey.

I just want this all for SJU so badly. It is frustrating being one of 6,000 in a dead MSG, but I think if this team hits their stride, with the way they play, they'll pack up the Garden.

 

[LINY89]

Could not believe the attendance by both schools at the Barclay Center last night. Looked like a full house of red and grey. Couldn't help but to wonder had we been ranked number 1 in the nation and played out of N.Y. would we attract as many fans. And the answer is NO. I began to think about our appearance in the NCAA Tournament against Maryland and Ohio State where we were clearly outnumbered by all opposing fans. And that was in the Elite 8.

42,000 enrolled vs. 21,000. They are exactly double our enrollment so there is no chance. You have to remember also, the NYC area is heavily a pro sports stronghold. Tons and tons of Jets/Giants/Knicks/Mets/Yanks/Rangers/etc. fans, but when it comes to college, it's not that big a deal unless SJ is red hot like Lavin's first year. I remember SJ was on covers, on PTI, final four discussions took place, and we were EVERYWHERE. The crowds were raucous at MSG for those Pitt, Duke, Nova games. For Indiana residents, Indiana U. is THE team. They don't have a million pro teams to choose from, and the Hoosiers have a dominant history. In New York the following is diluted, because the other teams I mentioned split people up instead of having 1 main team bringing everyone together. We will never match their attendance since they have a 2:1 population ratio, but if we were #1 I guarantee you the seats would be pretty damn full.

St. John’s has more than 80% of students commuting and living in the NYC area. To compare, Villanova (a small school with a great fanbase) has 90% of their students living on campus meaning 10% commuters! 76% of Nova students are from out of state. I'm telling you it has everything to do with crazy high commuter percentage, since it takes away the school spirit and disconnects you from the happenings around campus. Not to get too corny philosophically, but living on campus makes you one with your school. It grows on you and you feel a real connection. If you commute, you are much more likely to view SJ as simply where you go to class then leave.

Edit: Also just saw that SJ only opened dorms in 1999! It's only been about 13 years which is nothing for such a major transition. Within another 25+ years I think SJ will shed some of the commuter image as it becomes more typical to dorm. This is what happened with Marist by the way. Started as a commuter school now there are tons of great dorms and there are only 5,000 students, but everyone went nuts supporting the school. I think another problem being overlooked is older guys not really being into college sports. Not trying to start anything realizing you guys are mostly older on here and that's great because you do care...but from what I see most older guys are only into pro sports around here. Some of my uncles have a few memories of SJ from the 80's they talk about, but it's not like they follow the team that much.

 

[beast of the east]

Could not believe the attendance by both schools at the Barclay Center last night. Looked like a full house of red and grey. Couldn't help but to wonder had we been ranked number 1 in the nation and played out of N.Y. would we attract as many fans. And the answer is NO. I began to think about our appearance in the NCAA Tournament against Maryland and Ohio State where we were clearly outnumbered by all opposing teams. And that was in the Elite 8.

If we were #1 we'd be playing in front of a near sellout every game. #1Indiana v. G'town in a brand new arena in NYC is a great basketball event. Two historic top 25 teams with enormous alumni bases in NYC.

Even if we played outside of New York? Don't believe so.

I think the fact that SJ has historically been a commuter school has not lent itself to loyalty post graduation. I think when folks live at a school for 4 years they become part of that community -- for life. We don't have that and hence don't have as many folks who eat and sleep their alma mater.

But do believe that once Lavin re-establishes a winning culture, attendance will improve (it already has started)

I don't particularly agree with your assessment about commuter school. The problem goes back a very long way I believe, and it has nothing to do with commuter school or not. Historically we won year enough to be a perennial top 20 team, and we filled both Alumni Hall and MSG. In the Mullin era and beyond, we sold out the entire building with season tickets for years on end, without a student section. I remember sitting in the Alumni Hall and thinking how students couldn't get in the building if they wanted.

The fans were still there during the rather brief Mahoney bad years (with marquee players Zendon Hamilton and Felipe Lopez), and remained in force as Fraschilla rebuilt the team in 1996-97. After the meltdown of the program in the season Jarvis was fired, fans began to depart the following season. Not sure which season fans closest to the court were moved upstairs at CA and replaced by a mostly empty student section opposite the benches, but nearly all of those fans either immediately or shortly after decided to drop their tix. When seaosn ticket holders on the bench side were displaced form long time seats in the points system, many more departed.

After nearly ten seasons of losing, the old fan base, which was loyal and strong, had disintegrated. Lavin's reversal of fortune did increase attendance, but the interest grew as the season went on as the team proved it was for real. Last season, with Lavin out and a whole new cast of players, there wasn't enough winning to boost season tickets substantially.

My opinion is that we will need two consecutive seasons of top twenty teams to rebuild the fan base in terms of ticket sales.

 

[LINY89]

Could not believe the attendance by both schools at the Barclay Center last night. Looked like a full house of red and grey. Couldn't help but to wonder had we been ranked number 1 in the nation and played out of N.Y. would we attract as many fans. And the answer is NO. I began to think about our appearance in the NCAA Tournament against Maryland and Ohio State where we were clearly outnumbered by all opposing teams. And that was in the Elite 8.

If we were #1 we'd be playing in front of a near sellout every game. #1Indiana v. G'town in a brand new arena in NYC is a great basketball event. Two historic top 25 teams with enormous alumni bases in NYC.

Even if we played outside of New York? Don't believe so.

I think the fact that SJ has historically been a commuter school has not lent itself to loyalty post graduation. I think when folks live at a school for 4 years they become part of that community -- for life. We don't have that and hence don't have as many folks who eat and sleep their alma mater.

But do believe that once Lavin re-establishes a winning culture, attendance will improve (it already has started)

I don't particularly agree with your assessment about commuter school. The problem goes back a very long way I believe, and it has nothing to do with commuter school or not. Historically we won year enough to be a perennial top 20 team, and we filled both Alumni Hall and MSG. In the Mullin era and beyond, we sold out the entire building with season tickets for years on end, without a student section. I remember sitting in the Alumni Hall and thinking how students couldn't get in the building if they wanted.

The fans were still there during the rather brief Mahoney bad years (with marquee players Zendon Hamilton and Felipe Lopez), and remained in force as Fraschilla rebuilt the team in 1996-97. After the meltdown of the program in the season Jarvis was fired, fans began to depart the following season. Not sure which season fans closest to the court were moved upstairs at CA and replaced by a mostly empty student section opposite the benches, but nearly all of those fans either immediately or shortly after decided to drop their tix. When seaosn ticket holders on the bench side were displaced form long time seats in the points system, many more departed.

After nearly ten seasons of losing, the old fan base, which was loyal and strong, had disintegrated. Lavin's reversal of fortune did increase attendance, but the interest grew as the season went on as the team proved it was for real. Last season, with Lavin out and a whole new cast of players, there wasn't enough winning to boost season tickets substantially.

My opinion is that we will need two consecutive seasons of top twenty teams to rebuild the fan base in terms of ticket sales.

Trust me when I say 80% commuters makes a big difference. If you go somewhere for a few hours a day vs. living there 24/7, it's not the same. Commuters are much less likely to get involved in on campus activities including sports. They see it as "get my crap done and go home". Residents see it as "let's drink then go to the game I heard we have one tonight". Commuter view is SJ is strictly business...get your degree and leave. Resident view is "this is my home, my school is a big part of me and I want to support it".

You mentioned season ticket holders back in the day. I'm willing to bet it wasn't a big deal to buy them then. They were probably so cheap like everything else compared to today. The public is priced out of CA charging a preposterous $30 to see us play a mid major team in a 100 degree, stuffy, uncomfortable arena. This also has a big negative effect.

Right now you really can't blame the students for not totally embracing this team. I wasn't even alive for the glory days in the mid 80's...I was born in 89 and undergrads at SJ more like 91 and 92. Since the 80's glory days, how many times have we even been ranked? Twice maybe including 2011? It starts with the team. If the team is dominating the fans will come. If the fans come, hype is generated. If hype is generated, the media focuses more on us, if the media focuses more on us we get on ESPN Sportscenter, and so on and so on. Everything else will compliment each other, but it starts with the team. The crazy fans at Nova constantly got to see top 10-15 teams year in and year out.

I also wanted to show you guys something...this is the crowd at a Marist Women's game. It's not uncommon to see this turnout either

our women's team has been ranked a few times, and among the best mid majors while I was there. I don't understand why our women's games are empty. Marist is a perfect example of how women's hoops should be supported especially being so good.

 

[beast of the east]

Could not believe the attendance by both schools at the Barclay Center last night. Looked like a full house of red and grey. Couldn't help but to wonder had we been ranked number 1 in the nation and played out of N.Y. would we attract as many fans. And the answer is NO. I began to think about our appearance in the NCAA Tournament against Maryland and Ohio State where we were clearly outnumbered by all opposing teams. And that was in the Elite 8.

If we were #1 we'd be playing in front of a near sellout every game. #1Indiana v. G'town in a brand new arena in NYC is a great basketball event. Two historic top 25 teams with enormous alumni bases in NYC.

Even if we played outside of New York? Don't believe so.

I think the fact that SJ has historically been a commuter school has not lent itself to loyalty post graduation. I think when folks live at a school for 4 years they become part of that community -- for life. We don't have that and hence don't have as many folks who eat and sleep their alma mater.

But do believe that once Lavin re-establishes a winning culture, attendance will improve (it already has started)

I don't particularly agree with your assessment about commuter school. The problem goes back a very long way I believe, and it has nothing to do with commuter school or not. Historically we won year enough to be a perennial top 20 team, and we filled both Alumni Hall and MSG. In the Mullin era and beyond, we sold out the entire building with season tickets for years on end, without a student section. I remember sitting in the Alumni Hall and thinking how students couldn't get in the building if they wanted.

The fans were still there during the rather brief Mahoney bad years (with marquee players Zendon Hamilton and Felipe Lopez), and remained in force as Fraschilla rebuilt the team in 1996-97. After the meltdown of the program in the season Jarvis was fired, fans began to depart the following season. Not sure which season fans closest to the court were moved upstairs at CA and replaced by a mostly empty student section opposite the benches, but nearly all of those fans either immediately or shortly after decided to drop their tix. When seaosn ticket holders on the bench side were displaced form long time seats in the points system, many more departed.

After nearly ten seasons of losing, the old fan base, which was loyal and strong, had disintegrated. Lavin's reversal of fortune did increase attendance, but the interest grew as the season went on as the team proved it was for real. Last season, with Lavin out and a whole new cast of players, there wasn't enough winning to boost season tickets substantially.

My opinion is that we will need two consecutive seasons of top twenty teams to rebuild the fan base in terms of ticket sales.

Trust me when I say 80% commuters makes a big difference. If you go somewhere for a few hours a day vs. living there 24/7, it's not the same. Commuters are much less likely to get involved in on campus activities including sports. They see it as "get my crap done and go home". Residents see it as "let's drink then go to the game I heard we have one tonight". Commuter view is SJ is strictly business...get your degree and leave. Resident view is "this is my home, my school is a big part of me and I want to support it".

You mentioned season ticket holders back in the day. I'm willing to bet it wasn't a big deal to buy them then. They were probably so cheap like everything else compared to today. The public is priced out of CA charging a preposterous $30 to see us play a mid major team in a 100 degree, stuffy, uncomfortable arena. This also has a big negative effect.

Right now you really can't blame the students for not totally embracing this team. I wasn't even alive for the glory days in the mid 80's...I was born in 89 and undergrads at SJ more like 91 and 92. Since the 80's glory days, how many times have we even been ranked? Twice maybe including 2011? It starts with the team. If the team is dominating the fans will come. If the fans come, hype is generated. If hype is generated, the media focuses more on us, if the media focuses more on us we get on ESPN Sportscenter, and so on and so on. Everything else will compliment each other, but it starts with the team. The crazy fans at Nova constantly got to see top 10-15 teams year in and year out.

I also wanted to show you guys something...this is the crowd at a Marist Women's game. It's not uncommon to see this turnout either

our women's team has been ranked a few times, and among the best mid majors while I was there. I don't understand why our women's games are empty. Marist is a perfect example of how women's hoops should be supported especially being so good.

NYC is not Poughkeepsie, where there is almost zip to do on any given night, and students basically captive on campus. In NYC whether you are the Yankees, the Knicks, or SJU basketball, you'd better be good if you expect fans to show up. Our fan base shows up when you win consistently. Season tickets for SJU are STILL a good buy when the team wins. A season ticket close to the court for $600 - pretty good in NYC if the team is top twenty 25 caliber. When they are a losing team, you can't give tickets away - trust me, I tried plenty during the NR years when I couldn't use them.

 

[LINY89]

Could not believe the attendance by both schools at the Barclay Center last night. Looked like a full house of red and grey. Couldn't help but to wonder had we been ranked number 1 in the nation and played out of N.Y. would we attract as many fans. And the answer is NO. I began to think about our appearance in the NCAA Tournament against Maryland and Ohio State where we were clearly outnumbered by all opposing teams. And that was in the Elite 8.

If we were #1 we'd be playing in front of a near sellout every game. #1Indiana v. G'town in a brand new arena in NYC is a great basketball event. Two historic top 25 teams with enormous alumni bases in NYC.

Even if we played outside of New York? Don't believe so.

I think the fact that SJ has historically been a commuter school has not lent itself to loyalty post graduation. I think when folks live at a school for 4 years they become part of that community -- for life. We don't have that and hence don't have as many folks who eat and sleep their alma mater.

But do believe that once Lavin re-establishes a winning culture, attendance will improve (it already has started)

I don't particularly agree with your assessment about commuter school. The problem goes back a very long way I believe, and it has nothing to do with commuter school or not. Historically we won year enough to be a perennial top 20 team, and we filled both Alumni Hall and MSG. In the Mullin era and beyond, we sold out the entire building with season tickets for years on end, without a student section. I remember sitting in the Alumni Hall and thinking how students couldn't get in the building if they wanted.

The fans were still there during the rather brief Mahoney bad years (with marquee players Zendon Hamilton and Felipe Lopez), and remained in force as Fraschilla rebuilt the team in 1996-97. After the meltdown of the program in the season Jarvis was fired, fans began to depart the following season. Not sure which season fans closest to the court were moved upstairs at CA and replaced by a mostly empty student section opposite the benches, but nearly all of those fans either immediately or shortly after decided to drop their tix. When seaosn ticket holders on the bench side were displaced form long time seats in the points system, many more departed.

After nearly ten seasons of losing, the old fan base, which was loyal and strong, had disintegrated. Lavin's reversal of fortune did increase attendance, but the interest grew as the season went on as the team proved it was for real. Last season, with Lavin out and a whole new cast of players, there wasn't enough winning to boost season tickets substantially.

My opinion is that we will need two consecutive seasons of top twenty teams to rebuild the fan base in terms of ticket sales.

Trust me when I say 80% commuters makes a big difference. If you go somewhere for a few hours a day vs. living there 24/7, it's not the same. Commuters are much less likely to get involved in on campus activities including sports. They see it as "get my crap done and go home". Residents see it as "let's drink then go to the game I heard we have one tonight". Commuter view is SJ is strictly business...get your degree and leave. Resident view is "this is my home, my school is a big part of me and I want to support it".

You mentioned season ticket holders back in the day. I'm willing to bet it wasn't a big deal to buy them then. They were probably so cheap like everything else compared to today. The public is priced out of CA charging a preposterous $30 to see us play a mid major team in a 100 degree, stuffy, uncomfortable arena. This also has a big negative effect.

Right now you really can't blame the students for not totally embracing this team. I wasn't even alive for the glory days in the mid 80's...I was born in 89 and undergrads at SJ more like 91 and 92. Since the 80's glory days, how many times have we even been ranked? Twice maybe including 2011? It starts with the team. If the team is dominating the fans will come. If the fans come, hype is generated. If hype is generated, the media focuses more on us, if the media focuses more on us we get on ESPN Sportscenter, and so on and so on. Everything else will compliment each other, but it starts with the team. The crazy fans at Nova constantly got to see top 10-15 teams year in and year out.

I also wanted to show you guys something...this is the crowd at a Marist Women's game. It's not uncommon to see this turnout either

our women's team has been ranked a few times, and among the best mid majors while I was there. I don't understand why our women's games are empty. Marist is a perfect example of how women's hoops should be supported especially being so good.

NYC is not Poughkeepsie, where there is almost zip to do on any given night, and students basically captive on campus. In NYC whether you are the Yankees, the Knicks, or SJU basketball, you'd better be good if you expect fans to show up. Our fan base shows up when you win consistently. Season tickets for SJU are STILL a good buy when the team wins. A season ticket close to the court for $600 - pretty good in NYC if the team is top twenty 25 caliber. When they are a losing team, you can't give tickets away - trust me, I tried plenty during the NR years when I couldn't use them.

Well we definitely agree on that. I've said it before...enough with the "we CAN be good"...it's time to actually make it happen. Our women's team has been great and you can easily forget this is a sweet 16 team that has been in the top 25 the past 3 years or so. I think the big thing with women's basketball attendance is how taboo it is. One of the best ways to get your balls busted is to say "hey guys, wanna go to that women's basketball game tonight?". The perception is that it's a joke and not worth the time, and it's really powerful. Coming from Marist, we truly broke that stereotype and the seats were packed all the time. It was to the point where opposing teams told newspapers they wish they played for Marist because we drew such big crowds. Our men's team was awful, so we embraced the women and they have not disappointed. I always tell people it's still basketball just minus the dunking. I wish SJ would break that taboo and support the women because they truly are the best team on campus for the past few years.

 

[beast of the east]

Could not believe the attendance by both schools at the Barclay Center last night. Looked like a full house of red and grey. Couldn't help but to wonder had we been ranked number 1 in the nation and played out of N.Y. would we attract as many fans. And the answer is NO. I began to think about our appearance in the NCAA Tournament against Maryland and Ohio State where we were clearly outnumbered by all opposing teams. And that was in the Elite 8.

If we were #1 we'd be playing in front of a near sellout every game. #1Indiana v. G'town in a brand new arena in NYC is a great basketball event. Two historic top 25 teams with enormous alumni bases in NYC.

Even if we played outside of New York? Don't believe so.

I think the fact that SJ has historically been a commuter school has not lent itself to loyalty post graduation. I think when folks live at a school for 4 years they become part of that community -- for life. We don't have that and hence don't have as many folks who eat and sleep their alma mater.

But do believe that once Lavin re-establishes a winning culture, attendance will improve (it already has started)

I don't particularly agree with your assessment about commuter school. The problem goes back a very long way I believe, and it has nothing to do with commuter school or not. Historically we won year enough to be a perennial top 20 team, and we filled both Alumni Hall and MSG. In the Mullin era and beyond, we sold out the entire building with season tickets for years on end, without a student section. I remember sitting in the Alumni Hall and thinking how students couldn't get in the building if they wanted.

The fans were still there during the rather brief Mahoney bad years (with marquee players Zendon Hamilton and Felipe Lopez), and remained in force as Fraschilla rebuilt the team in 1996-97. After the meltdown of the program in the season Jarvis was fired, fans began to depart the following season. Not sure which season fans closest to the court were moved upstairs at CA and replaced by a mostly empty student section opposite the benches, but nearly all of those fans either immediately or shortly after decided to drop their tix. When seaosn ticket holders on the bench side were displaced form long time seats in the points system, many more departed.

After nearly ten seasons of losing, the old fan base, which was loyal and strong, had disintegrated. Lavin's reversal of fortune did increase attendance, but the interest grew as the season went on as the team proved it was for real. Last season, with Lavin out and a whole new cast of players, there wasn't enough winning to boost season tickets substantially.

My opinion is that we will need two consecutive seasons of top twenty teams to rebuild the fan base in terms of ticket sales.

Trust me when I say 80% commuters makes a big difference. If you go somewhere for a few hours a day vs. living there 24/7, it's not the same. Commuters are much less likely to get involved in on campus activities including sports. They see it as "get my crap done and go home". Residents see it as "let's drink then go to the game I heard we have one tonight". Commuter view is SJ is strictly business...get your degree and leave. Resident view is "this is my home, my school is a big part of me and I want to support it".

You mentioned season ticket holders back in the day. I'm willing to bet it wasn't a big deal to buy them then. They were probably so cheap like everything else compared to today. The public is priced out of CA charging a preposterous $30 to see us play a mid major team in a 100 degree, stuffy, uncomfortable arena. This also has a big negative effect.

Right now you really can't blame the students for not totally embracing this team. I wasn't even alive for the glory days in the mid 80's...I was born in 89 and undergrads at SJ more like 91 and 92. Since the 80's glory days, how many times have we even been ranked? Twice maybe including 2011? It starts with the team. If the team is dominating the fans will come. If the fans come, hype is generated. If hype is generated, the media focuses more on us, if the media focuses more on us we get on ESPN Sportscenter, and so on and so on. Everything else will compliment each other, but it starts with the team. The crazy fans at Nova constantly got to see top 10-15 teams year in and year out.

I also wanted to show you guys something...this is the crowd at a Marist Women's game. It's not uncommon to see this turnout either

our women's team has been ranked a few times, and among the best mid majors while I was there. I don't understand why our women's games are empty. Marist is a perfect example of how women's hoops should be supported especially being so good.

NYC is not Poughkeepsie, where there is almost zip to do on any given night, and students basically captive on campus. In NYC whether you are the Yankees, the Knicks, or SJU basketball, you'd better be good if you expect fans to show up. Our fan base shows up when you win consistently. Season tickets for SJU are STILL a good buy when the team wins. A season ticket close to the court for $600 - pretty good in NYC if the team is top twenty 25 caliber. When they are a losing team, you can't give tickets away - trust me, I tried plenty during the NR years when I couldn't use them.

Well we definitely agree on that. I've said it before...enough with the "we CAN be good"...it's time to actually make it happen. Our women's team has been great and you can easily forget this is a sweet 16 team that has been in the top 25 the past 3 years or so. I think the big thing with women's basketball attendance is how taboo it is. One of the best ways to get your balls busted is to say "hey guys, wanna go to that women's basketball game tonight?". The perception is that it's a joke and not worth the time, and it's really powerful. Coming from Marist, we truly broke that stereotype and the seats were packed all the time. It was to the point where opposing teams told newspapers they wish they played for Marist because we drew such big crowds. Our men's team was awful, so we embraced the women and they have not disappointed. I always tell people it's still basketball just minus the dunking. I wish SJ would break that taboo and support the women because they truly are the best team on campus for the past few years.

Nice commentary on women's basketball. My daughters played hs ball, and I coached AAU. The skill level has dramatically improved, and girls are more likely to play textbook basketball, running plays, hit the open player, etc, than guys will. There IS a continental divide in athleticism though, and that hampers interest in women's bball. About 10-12 years ago, I took my girls to see SJU - vs top ranked UCONN. We sat in the front row with about 500 fans in attendnace. We sat behind some UCONN beat reporters who were disgusted at how few fans turned out to see the best team in the country. At SJU, I don't know what it would take to attractlarge crowds. I suspect that nothing short of a championship caliber team would generate enough interest to draw large crowds.

 

[jerseyshorejohnny]

Could not believe the attendance by both schools at the Barclay Center last night. Looked like a full house of red and grey. Couldn't help but to wonder had we been ranked number 1 in the nation and played out of N.Y. would we attract as many fans. And the answer is NO. I began to think about our appearance in the NCAA Tournament against Maryland and Ohio State where we were clearly outnumbered by all opposing fans. And that was in the Elite 8.

FWIW in '99 the Maryland and Ohio State games were played in Knoxville, Tenn.

I was at The Barclay's Center on Monday night and there were a group of fellows in the row in front of me who drove from Indy.

Georgetown, has a lot of alumni in the NY Metro area. In fact I went to the game with 2 of them.

As an aside, saw Max Hooper at the game. He knows a few of the guys on UCLA.

Also at the game were PATRICK and Ralph Dalton.

 

[usguard]

Could not believe the attendance by both schools at the Barclay Center last night. Looked like a full house of red and grey. Couldn't help but to wonder had we been ranked number 1 in the nation and played out of N.Y. would we attract as many fans. And the answer is NO. I began to think about our appearance in the NCAA Tournament against Maryland and Ohio State where we were clearly outnumbered by all opposing teams. And that was in the Elite 8.

If we were #1 we'd be playing in front of a near sellout every game. #1Indiana v. G'town in a brand new arena in NYC is a great basketball event. Two historic top 25 teams with enormous alumni bases in NYC.

Even if we played outside of New York? Don't believe so.

When we win we draw. Lavin increased attenance 38% in one season. He is bulding a brand here and when this program starts stringing together successful seasons, people will show up.

Success and wins fills seats

 

[tom in salem]

Could not believe the attendance by both schools at the Barclay Center last night. Looked like a full house of red and grey. Couldn't help but to wonder had we been ranked number 1 in the nation and played out of N.Y. would we attract as many fans. And the answer is NO. I began to think about our appearance in the NCAA Tournament against Maryland and Ohio State where we were clearly outnumbered by all opposing fans. And that was in the Elite 8.

42,000 enrolled vs. 21,000. They are exactly double our enrollment so there is no chance. You have to remember also, the NYC area is heavily a pro sports stronghold. Tons and tons of Jets/Giants/Knicks/Mets/Yanks/Rangers/etc. fans, but when it comes to college, it's not that big a deal unless SJ is red hot like Lavin's first year. I remember SJ was on covers, on PTI, final four discussions took place, and we were EVERYWHERE. The crowds were raucous at MSG for those Pitt, Duke, Nova games. For Indiana residents, Indiana U. is THE team. They don't have a million pro teams to choose from, and the Hoosiers have a dominant history. In New York the following is diluted, because the other teams I mentioned split people up instead of having 1 main team bringing everyone together. We will never match their attendance since they have a 2:1 population ratio, but if we were #1 I guarantee you the seats would be pretty damn full.

St. John’s has more than 80% of students commuting and living in the NYC area. To compare, Villanova (a small school with a great fanbase) has 90% of their students living on campus meaning 10% commuters! 76% of Nova students are from out of state. I'm telling you it has everything to do with crazy high commuter percentage, since it takes away the school spirit and disconnects you from the happenings around campus. Not to get too corny philosophically, but living on campus makes you one with your school. It grows on
you and you feel a real connection. If you commute, you are much more likely to view SJ as simply where you go to class then leave.

Edit: Also just saw that SJ only opened dorms in 1999! It's only been about 13 years which is nothing for such a major transition. Within another 25+ years I think SJ will shed some of the commuter image as it becomes more typical to dorm. This is what happened with Marist by the way. Started as a commuter school now there are tons of great dorms and there are only 5,000 students, but everyone went nuts supporting the school. I think another problem being overlooked is older guys not really being into college sports. Not trying to start anything realizing you guys are mostly older on here and that's great because you do care...but from what I see most older guys are only into pro sports around here. Some of my uncles have a few memories of SJ from the 80's they talk about, but it's not like they follow the team that much.

Villanova University has a total undergraduate enrollment of 7,111, with a gender distribution of 49.4 percent male students and 50.6 percent female students. At this school, 70.0 percent of the students live in college-owned, -operated, or -affiliated housing and 30.0 percent of students live off campus.

St. John's University has a total undergraduate enrollment of 15,766, with a gender distribution of 45.6 percent male students and 54.4 percent female students. At this school, 31.0 percent of the students live in college-owned, -operated, or -affiliated housing and 69.0 percent of students live off campus.

Both schools have about 5,000 on campus, so there goes your theory out the window.
And as another poster alluded, back in in the 80's when there were no dorms, student representation at the Garden was staggering.

 

[blackpeter24]

I was at the Georgetown v Indiana game on tuesday night. The crowd was large but it was far from a sell out. Large sections of the area were closed off with drawn curtains. The portions of the arena that were open were almost full. If you go the Barclay's Center, check out the 40 40 Club. It is a nice place to have a drink and food before the game.

 

[jerseyshorejohnny]

Excellent point about the curtains. Similar to what Seton Hall does during games at The Rock.

 

[Section3]

Could not believe the attendance by both schools at the Barclay Center last night. Looked like a full house of red and grey. Couldn't help but to wonder had we been ranked number 1 in the nation and played out of N.Y. would we attract as many fans. And the answer is NO. I began to think about our appearance in the NCAA Tournament against Maryland and Ohio State where we were clearly outnumbered by all opposing teams. And that was in the Elite 8.

If we were #1 we'd be playing in front of a near sellout every game. #1Indiana v. G'town in a brand new arena in NYC is a great basketball event. Two historic top 25 teams with enormous alumni bases in NYC.

Even if we played outside of New York? Don't believe so.

I think the fact that SJ has historically been a commuter school has not lent itself to loyalty post graduation. I think when folks live at a school for 4 years they become part of that community -- for life. We don't have that and hence don't have as many folks who eat and sleep their alma mater.

But do believe that once Lavin re-establishes a winning culture, attendance will improve (it already has started)

I don't particularly agree with your assessment about commuter school. The problem goes back a very long way I believe, and it has nothing to do with commuter school or not. Historically we won year enough to be a perennial top 20 team, and we filled both Alumni Hall and MSG. In the Mullin era and beyond, we sold out the entire building with season tickets for years on end, without a student section. I remember sitting in the Alumni Hall and thinking how students couldn't get in the building if they wanted.

The fans were still there during the rather brief Mahoney bad years (with marquee players Zendon Hamilton and Felipe Lopez), and remained in force as Fraschilla rebuilt the team in 1996-97. After the meltdown of the program in the season Jarvis was fired, fans began to depart the following season. Not sure which season fans closest to the court were moved upstairs at CA and replaced by a mostly empty student section opposite the benches, but nearly all of those fans either immediately or shortly after decided to drop their tix. When seaosn ticket holders on the bench side were displaced form long time seats in the points system, many more departed.

After nearly ten seasons of losing, the old fan base, which was loyal and strong, had disintegrated. Lavin's reversal of fortune did increase attendance, but the interest grew as the season went on as the team proved it was for real. Last season, with Lavin out and a whole new cast of players, there wasn't enough winning to boost season tickets substantially.

My opinion is that we will need two consecutive seasons of top twenty teams to rebuild the fan base in terms of ticket sales.

Actually think you both have valid points...

1) Winning is the cure all - I was at game last night and thinking back on the days when I sat in Section 3 Row BB (one leg on one side of half court; other leg on the other side)...great days and Alumni Hall was always either SRO or close...this goes back to the George Johnson days

2) Dorms do create a sense of community and post grad loyalty - I wish there were dorms when I attended SJ...can't deny that universities that have been around have base of 50+ years of loyal grads who lived as part of the university community.

That said, once re-establish ourselves as a perennial winner, we will become a hot ticket again as well as a cost effective alterative to the Knicks for dads wanting to take sons to a big time game

 

[Section3]

[/quote]

Trust me when I say 80% commuters makes a big difference. If you go somewhere for a few hours a day vs. living there 24/7, it's not the same. Commuters are much less likely to get involved in on campus activities including sports. They see it as "get my crap done and go home". Residents see it as "let's drink then go to the game I heard we have one tonight". Commuter view is SJ is strictly business...get your degree and leave. Resident view is "this is my home, my school is a big part of me and I want to support it".

You mentioned season ticket holders back in the day. I'm willing to bet it wasn't a big deal to buy them then. They were probably so cheap like everything else compared to today. The public is priced out of CA charging a preposterous $30 to see us play a mid major team in a 100 degree, stuffy, uncomfortable arena. This also has a big negative effect.

Right now you really can't blame the students for not totally embracing this team. I wasn't even alive for the glory days in the mid 80's...I was born in 89 and undergrads at SJ more like 91 and 92. Since the 80's glory days, how many times have we even been ranked? Twice maybe including 2011? It starts with the team. If the team is dominating the fans will come. If the fans come, hype is generated. If hype is generated, the media focuses more on us, if the media focuses more on us we get on ESPN Sportscenter, and so on and so on. Everything else will compliment each other, but it starts with the team. The crazy fans at Nova constantly got to see top 10-15 teams year in and year out.

I also wanted to show you guys something...this is the crowd at a Marist Women's game. It's not uncommon to see this turnout either

our women's team has been ranked a few times, and among the best mid majors while I was there. I don't understand why our women's games are empty. Marist is a perfect example of how women's hoops should be supported especially being so good.[/quote]

Interesting post and great illustration of what could be...
Interesting tidbit...I believe when I purchased my 1st season ticket package, the price was ~ $32 (LOL)...At one point, I had 6 tickets

 

[Section3]

Excellent point about the curtains. Similar to what Seton Hall does during games at The Rock.

wish MSG would do same thing