Cincy/STJohns rivalry

Jack Williams

Jack Williams

Well-known member
2023 $upporter
 I remember when a rivalry used to be two teams that don't like each other play big and close games. But now the Cincy fans are putting our past seasons up against each other and saying that Cincy is a program that is final4 potential and Johnnies are CBI or NIT caliber. Now I know their fans are just trying to start trouble, but can someone tell me what stellar recruiting class they have to replace the likes of Yancy Gates and Dion Dixon?
 
 I remember when a rivalry used to be two teams that don't like each other play big and close games. But now the Cincy fans are putting our past seasons up against each other and saying that Cincy is a program that is final4 potential and Johnnies are CBI or NIT caliber. Now I know their fans are just trying to start trouble, but can someone tell me what stellar recruiting class they have to replace the likes of Yancy Gates and Dion Dixon?
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Actually, I have a hunch the posters who are believe they are Final Four material and we're CBI or NIT caliber aren't joking around. I think they believe it.

Some of their fans feel they have a couple of players who are going to step up their games to replace Gates and Dixon. I like the Jackson kid, as he plays with lots of energy, but he also needs to harness that energy a bit. Occasionally, it gets him into trouble.

Quite frankly, I believe they'll have a decent team, but I also believe they may take a step backwards.
 
 I remember when a rivalry used to be two teams that don't like each other play big and close games. But now the Cincy fans are putting our past seasons up against each other and saying that Cincy is a program that is final4 potential and Johnnies are CBI or NIT caliber. Now I know their fans are just trying to start trouble, but can someone tell me what stellar recruiting class they have to replace the likes of Yancy Gates and Dion Dixon?
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Looks like they've signed only one player: 6'-7" Juco forward Titus Rubles. JucoRecruiting.com has him ranked #7, three spots lower than Orlando Sanchez.
 
Not sure but seem to recall they may have had a player or two sitting out this season that will become eligible next season. 
 
 No rivalry here. Maybe a budding one.

But if Cincy is a rivalry now because we landed "their" commitment, then add on Providence (Jakarr/Sanchez) and UConn (Harkless).

Most SJU fans probably don't even care much about Cincy.

And I'm not sure why Cincy fans would even care since in their eyes they are a perennial 'Final 4 team'.

I wish Cincy the best because good BE schools are just better for the conference. With the amount of defections that we've had, we should be sticking together more.
 
Cincy had a much better team than us last year. So did a lot of teams. But in a year where they went to the Big East Final and the Sweet 16, a group of 5 freshman went in and beat them on their court as 11.5 point dogs. One game is the smallest sample there is, and Cincy came back and crushed us at our place like they were supposed to. But if we're able to get one on their court when they're having the best season they've had in over a decade and we're replacing 98% of our roster, what happens when those freshman become sophomores and another premier recruiting class arrives? They are at a more established level than us right now, but based on the last two recruiting classes we are bringing in talent more quickly and in greater quantity.

Gut feel we both make the NCAA tourney in 12/13. Would not be surprised if we are jockeying for a similar spot in the BE regular season standings, with an older, more seasoned team producing similar results to a younger, higher upside talent team. But I don't really care about Cincy outside of wanting them to continue to be a consistently nationally competitive program so long as they are in the Big East. Same goes for every other team in the conference.

If we aren't competitive for a spot in the 65 I will be surprised. Maybe that is getting ahead and sounds rose-colored glasses. But if nothing else we are going to have the best player on the floor a lot of nights (D-Lo) with 7 other Top 100/JUCO AA type talents around him. Before you get to anything else (Lavin back, Dunlap, how good can Jakarr be) that's going to have you in most games. Because of how we were perceived last year and the ultimate results, I don't think most people outside our program grasp exactly where D-Lo's season ranked last year, especially from a scoring perspective, and how that projects him moving forward.
 
 Who would you take Harrison or Kilpatrick. Maybe because I'm a redmen fan I would take DLo.
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Difficult for me to answer the question objectively as well! Was very impressed by Kilpatrick last year, but think Harrison is the better overall player. He was certainly better individually as a freshman than Kilpatrick was as a sophomore, but the argument could be made that the playing field was not even as Kilpatrick was on a better team with more scoring options. Still if you tell me Kilpatrick is going to get an extra year of eligibility and we can do a 1 for 1 trade, I don't do it.
 
 After reading the Cincy boards implying they are a top tier program and we are a mid major program. I hope we kick their butt.
 
One thing that this really points out is how lucky STJ fans are to have so many active, sane, rational posters on both their boards. Messages boards are usually a scary place full of lunatics and hyperfans who drive those looking for good conversation/debate away. Similar to the post a few days ago, and why he thanked me I have no idea, we should all be grateful to Paul (and Dave for that matter) for the great job they do providing such effective forums as these.

Sure we've had our crazies (Scotch, Cos, and a few others) and we still have a few trolls but effective moderators keep that under control as well as attract other good board members. You can't get that at a Rivals or Scout board where the only rule is don't threaten or curse.

Now, back to the subject at hand, Cincy should be good next year at the 1/2/3 if Shaq Thomas comes in and plays more like a top 100 sophomore but he still has no experience and STJ still has five guys on the roster, 3 at his position, who were ranked above Shaq in in the class of 2011 and played some D1 ball last year. There are only 2 other 4 star recruits on Cincy's entire roster. They are weak at the PF and C position. That said Cronin always has his team playing hard and prepared to play tough defense and win ugly. I think both teams have a chance to be pretty good but neither is going to be great next year.
 
I think fans of every program or team have a lot of people who are delusional including ours which I like. It's not a knock on anyone but lets be honest. When things go wrong we get pissed and a lot of us get too down and when things pick up we get too high.

Just look at any recruit thread. Before a kid commits we are praising them to no end. If they commit forget about it they are bound for the nba and if they commit somewhere else then the kid was overrated. lol

Almost all of us are guilty of that to a certain extent at some point.

But that comes with being a rabid fan. Heck if we lose a game I have trouble sleeping that night ( ok I have trouble sleeping many nights from working in finance but after a loss it's even worse ).

To me there is almost no redeeming quality in going to cincy. I've been there once and it was ok but I travel a lot and that's probably my least favorite place that I've been in the world ( I actually like the bronx more than cincy )

I think they will be good this year but I don't like that Hobbit Cronin. I don't trust hobbits.

That's just me though and maybe I'm biased 
 
One thing that this really points out is how lucky STJ fans are to have so many active, sane, rational posters on both their boards. Messages boards are usually a scary place full of lunatics and hyperfans who drive those looking for good conversation/debate away.
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You've just described Bigeastboards.
 
One thing that this really points out is how lucky STJ fans are to have so many active, sane, rational posters on both their boards. Messages boards are usually a scary place full of lunatics and hyperfans who drive those looking for good conversation/debate away.
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You've just described Bigeastboards.
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No kidding. I see they found someone to take it over and keep it alive. I thought it closed down at the end of April but just went and took a look.
 
 Cincy will never be in the top 10 of big east rivals to me. They are an afterthought. Their fans have really taken the CO new poorly and have shown no class. Some of them seem to realize their recruiting hasn't been all that in the last couple of years. They aren't the new Marquette in terms of success. They had a nice year, but I see them regressing the next couple of years.
 
Cincinnati? No disrespect to them but the only thing that matters is that we recruit well, get the players we need and get them on the court. I don't care who you are in the Big East you better start worrying about St. John's again. Lavin and this staff have people and most importantly recruits believing again. Go St. John's! :)   
 
Just went over to Bearcat Talk to read the STJ thread. Interesting read but they don't take kindly to strangers there. There a few good points from UC fans on the thread. First they are a mature team who should play well as a team, though I've never felt that UC looked very well coached, rather a team that was coached to play tough and ugly and win like that. But there is a lot to be said for continuity especially when you are at a program that doesn't feature a bunch of top rated guys. The other good point is that Bearcat Mick is the Village Idiot. That much was clear from the beginning though.

Now on to the fallacies:
Mick's recruiting strategy is to go find diamonds in the rough. They say this like he eschews top 100 talent on purpose. Um, sure he does. Well you need top 100 talent to be good year in and year out. Cincy can be pretty good somewhat often with their marginal talent especially when the BE is down but your not going to be great without great players, and they only have 1 great player.

Also the prediction that Shaq Thomas is going to be great. They do realize that Jakarr, Dom, Amir and of course Moe were ranked higher than Shaq last year at the same position? That 3 of them are still on STJ and got 2 seasons worth of minutes last year? Yet he's an advantage for them? Diamond in the rough I guess.

I think the teams will be about equal this year but it doesn't matter what we think. It'll all be obvious when they roll out the balls and play.

Funny mini-rivalry though.
 
Just went over to Bearcat Talk to read the STJ thread. Interesting read but they don't take kindly to strangers there. There a few good points from UC fans on the thread. First they are a mature team who should play well as a team, though I've never felt that UC looked very well coached, rather a team that was coached to play tough and ugly and win like that. But there is a lot to be said for continuity especially when you are at a program that doesn't feature a bunch of top rated guys. The other good point is that Bearcat Mick is the Village Idiot. That much was clear from the beginning though.

Now on to the fallacies:
Mick's recruiting strategy is to go find diamonds in the rough. They say this like he eschews top 100 talent on purpose. Um, sure he does. Well you need top 100 talent to be good year in and year out. Cincy can be pretty good somewhat often with their marginal talent especially when the BE is down but your not going to be great without great players, and they only have 1 great player.

Also the prediction that Shaq Thomas is going to be great. They do realize that Jakarr, Dom, Amir and of course Moe were ranked higher than Shaq last year at the same position? That 3 of them are still on STJ and got 2 seasons worth of minutes last year? Yet he's an advantage for them? Diamond in the rough I guess.

I think the teams will be about equal this year but it doesn't matter what we think. It'll all be obvious when they roll out the balls and play.

Funny mini-rivalry though.
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 never trust the hobbit
 
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