Belmont Park Arena , etc

S

SLYFOXX1968

Well-known member
2022 $upporter
A few posts under other topics talked about these subjects ; 1. Getting booted out of the BE . 2. Getting booted out of MSG . 3 CA as a old and outdated Home Court . I don’t live in NY anymore so I’m not up on a lot of inside stuff going on in the school or locally .. I notice a brand new facility is being built for the Islanders near Belmont Park . It ‘s suppose to seat 17-18 ,000 for Hockey . I don’t know if it’s adaptable for BB? While , it would seem the University would not willingly abandon Games at MSG , might it be attractive to transfer CA games to this new venue , if details like finances , etc could be addressed ? I’m sure the price tag for use of the new Arena would be high but , I assume could be dealt with ... of course, we would need to draw more than the 5000 that usually show up at CA . Fan attendance is a ratio between winning BB and fan excitement for the team. Both lacking over the last 20 years , save for the few times we had winning teams and some credibility as more than a has been .. Could we attrack 10,000 fans to Belmont Park Arena if we had a top 25 ranked team and some shot at a BE Championship? Could we play more National Powers if we could get back to playing the UCLA’s, Kansas , Indiana , Duke, etc if we had competitive teams ? Instead of playing some of the Cup Cakes we currently do? I’m just throwing this out as a idea , given the overwhelming dissatisfaction with CA .. it might put some sizzle in a Program that surely needs new Branding to attract better Players , fans , etc . I’m sure anyone could come up with a dozen reasons this isn’t a feasible suggestion but , what’s the risk in doing some basic analysis ? We need to rethink a lot of things about our BB program as it has gone off track for too many years .
 
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St. John's isn't leaving the Big East or MSG or CA. If you need analysis, here is mine. The only way to attract a full house to Belmont is to play the game in the infield the day of the Belmont Stakes. Playing a few times a year, like the games in Brooklyn a few years ago, might be OK. Thanks to one of the fine posters here, I went to CA for the first time since the renovation. I had a ball. I go back to the early years of Alumni Hall, and it felt like I never left. The only thing that seemed different was the scoreboards, sound system, and price of the hot dogs.

I was amazed that there were no handrails at all in the stands, and noticed some people needing help walking down. Where the 25 million went I'm not sure. I thought for certain that the stands would have been demolished during the reno, replaced with comfortable seats with seat backs. This isn't college basketball the way it was in the 70s. There of plenty of high tech, comfortable arenas. St. John's should always have an on campus arena. They just need a better, more modern one.
 
[quote="Ray Morgan" post=378990]St. John's isn't leaving the Big East or MSG or CA. If you need analysis, here is mine. The only way to attract a full house to Belmont is to play the game in the infield the day of the Belmont Stakes. Playing a few times a year, like the games in Brooklyn a few years ago, might be OK. Thanks to one of the fine posters here, I went to CA for the first time since the renovation. I had a ball. I go back to the early years of Alumni Hall, and it felt like I never left. The only thing that seemed different was the scoreboards, sound system, and price of the hot dogs.

I was amazed that there were no handrails at all in the stands, and noticed some people needing help walking down. Where the 25 million went I'm not sure. I thought for certain that the stands would have been demolished during the reno, replaced with comfortable seats with seat backs. This isn't college basketball the way it was in the 70s. There of plenty of high tech, comfortable arenas. St. John's should always have an on campus arena. They just need a better, more modern one.[/quote]

If Cragg can raise the cash, what's the possibility of just blowing out both ends of CA and putting seats in as high up as they are in the middle of the arena? then just round it out at the top in the four corners and you could probably add about another 1,000 or more seats bringing total capacity to about 7,000. That would be fine if it's doable on both sides on the outside of CA. I haven't been to CA in long time but if I'm remembering correctly there is open room on both ends outside the arena.
 
Might be time for the wrecking ball to visit CA.
 
Before we start planning playing at the new Belmont arena or expanding CA you should take this into account. I was a student when CA was built and have attended hundreds of games there. For the past twenty years for games played in Nov and Dec I sit in the upper deck having my choice of between two thousand and twenty five hundred seats. One game vs Darthmouth during the Lavin I walked in to a packed arena and am still shocked. The fellow next to me came with a girls basketball team from Huntington getting tickets from an SJU promotion.
I fully expected Cragg to install some type of promotion to draw fans to these early season games. High school kids tend to be college basketball fans but they need public transportation and cheap tickets and the Belmont arena will provide neither
SJU has to market its basketball program a thousand times better before it starts talking new arenas. I have no idea if SJU has any type of marketing department but they could certainly use one. It is tough to draw fans when you are not winning many games but it is a challenge and to play the OOC games year after year to twenty five hundred empty seats is ridiculous.
 
While I don’t want to give up games at msg they need to fix that dump of a home arena. Put freaking air conditions in somehow reconfigure it put seats in ( I understand that’s impossible under current layout ) build a good team and then sell naming rights even though obviously the $ is gonna be a lot lower than big sports teams. Wait a couple years for the naming rights so you aren’t selling low. Interest rates are so mind boggling my low they can borrow super cheap. I don’t know the current outstanding bonds and if are any potentially callable but they should be refinancing all debt that is refinanceable. Then do a massive fundraising for the arena obviously it will take a couple years but you can borrow now. A 30 year tax free came out yesterday at 2.5 %. Holy crap that’s insane
 
I actually discussed the possibility of a new arena with Cragg directly and he said basically it's just not financially feasible. There are tons of codes for building in NYC limits and it would take tremendous money we do not have right now. The much more possible scenario would be renovating slowly which you've seen already. The seatbacks will not work because they would lose too many spots and because of how expensive it would be. I'm sure if a major alum made a huge donation they could take it more seriously. Concession options are also being looked into according to Cragg.
 
[quote="mjmaherjr" post=379002]While I don’t want to give up games at msg they need to fix that dump of a home arena. Put freaking air conditions in somehow reconfigure it put seats in ( I understand that’s impossible under current layout ) build a good team and then sell naming rights even though obviously the $ is gonna be a lot lower than big sports teams. Wait a couple years for the naming rights so you aren’t selling low. Interest rates are so mind boggling my low they can borrow super cheap. I don’t know the current outstanding bonds and if are any potentially callable but they should be refinancing all debt that is refinanceable. Then do a massive fundraising for the arena obviously it will take a couple years but you can borrow now. A 30 year tax free came out yesterday at 2.5 %. Holy crap that’s insane[/quote]. Good idea , Mike ... maybe you could be the impetus to get Bronx Pale Ale to be sponsor or benefactor too ? But , the refinancing ought to be run past the Administration . Why not let the Students and Faculty of the Tobin School study the feasibility as a Academic project ? It could not hurt .
 
[quote="SLYFOXX1968" post=379014][quote="mjmaherjr" post=379002]While I don’t want to give up games at msg they need to fix that dump of a home arena. Put freaking air conditions in somehow reconfigure it put seats in ( I understand that’s impossible under current layout ) build a good team and then sell naming rights even though obviously the $ is gonna be a lot lower than big sports teams. Wait a couple years for the naming rights so you aren’t selling low. Interest rates are so mind boggling my low they can borrow super cheap. I don’t know the current outstanding bonds and if are any potentially callable but they should be refinancing all debt that is refinanceable. Then do a massive fundraising for the arena obviously it will take a couple years but you can borrow now. A 30 year tax free came out yesterday at 2.5 %. Holy crap that’s insane[/quote]. Good idea , Mike ... maybe you could be the impetus to get Bronx Pale Ale to be sponsor or benefactor too ? But , the refinancing ought to be run past the Administration . Why not let the Students and Faculty of the Tobin School study the feasibility as a Academic project ? It could not hurt .[/quote]

Good idea. It beats forming anything that looks like past SJU coaching committees.
 
[quote="SLYFOXX1968" post=378985]A few posts under other topics talked about these subjects ; 1. Getting booted out of the BE . 2. Getting booted out of MSG . 3 CA as a old and outdated Home Court . I don’t live in NY anymore so I’m not up on a lot of inside stuff going on in the school or locally .. I notice a brand new facility is being built for the Islanders near Belmont Park . It ‘s suppose to seat 17-18 ,000 for Hockey . I don’t know if it’s adaptable for BB? While , it would seem the University would not willingly abandon Games at MSG , might it be attractive to transfer CA games to this new venue , if details like finances , etc could be addressed ? I’m sure the price tag for use of the new Arena would be high but , I assume could be dealt with ... of course, we would need to draw more than the 5000 that usually show up at CA . Fan attendance is a ratio between winning BB and fan excitement for the team. Both lacking over the last 20 years , save for the few times we had winning teams and some credibility as more than a has been .. Could we attrack 10,000 fans to Belmont Park Arena if we had a top 25 ranked team and some shot at a BE Championship? Could we play more National Powers if we could get back to playing the UCLA’s, Kansas , Indiana , Duke, etc if we had competitive teams ? Instead of playing some of the Cup Cakes we currently do? I’m just throwing this out as a idea , given the overwhelming dissatisfaction with CA .. it might put some sizzle in a Program that surely needs new Branding to attract better Players , fans , etc . I’m sure anyone could come up with a dozen reasons this isn’t a feasible suggestion but , what’s the risk in doing some basic analysis ? We need to rethink a lot of things about our BB program as it has gone off track for too many years .[/quote]

I like the idea of playing our CA games at Belmont. CA is dump. If we played at a10k puls seat arena we could 5k seats away to students for free.

Play 6-8 games at MSG and the rest at Belmont and that would be a good start.
 
Wouldn’t the rental costs at the new arena be similar to MSG? For a couple of games the place could make sense but just about all of the OOC only works at CA.
 
[quote="mjmaherjr" post=379002]While I don’t want to give up games at msg they need to fix that dump of a home arena. Put freaking air conditions in somehow reconfigure it put seats in ( I understand that’s impossible under current layout ) build a good team and then sell naming rights even though obviously the $ is gonna be a lot lower than big sports teams. Wait a couple years for the naming rights so you aren’t selling low. Interest rates are so mind boggling my low they can borrow super cheap. I don’t know the current outstanding bonds and if are any potentially callable but they should be refinancing all debt that is refinanceable. Then do a massive fundraising for the arena obviously it will take a couple years but you can borrow now. A 30 year tax free came out yesterday at 2.5 %. Holy crap that’s insane[/quote]

As to air conditioning, I agree that it is hot in CA but I dress accordingly as I expect the conditions. I have even worn shorts to a November game. Is it possibly a home court "advantage"??? Look at the 2 conference games this year. Butler up by 20 struggled down the stretch to win by 2 and the Friars closed to 4 before they faded. Maybe CMA's practices help our guys hold up under the conditions. I went to the open practice in October (in shorts) and it was hot but CMA drilled the team for over 2 hours, after a morning practice.
 
[quote="BrooklynRed" post=379029][quote="mjmaherjr" post=379002]While I don’t want to give up games at msg they need to fix that dump of a home arena. Put freaking air conditions in somehow reconfigure it put seats in ( I understand that’s impossible under current layout ) build a good team and then sell naming rights even though obviously the $ is gonna be a lot lower than big sports teams. Wait a couple years for the naming rights so you aren’t selling low. Interest rates are so mind boggling my low they can borrow super cheap. I don’t know the current outstanding bonds and if are any potentially callable but they should be refinancing all debt that is refinanceable. Then do a massive fundraising for the arena obviously it will take a couple years but you can borrow now. A 30 year tax free came out yesterday at 2.5 %. Holy crap that’s insane[/quote]

As to air conditioning, I agree that it is hot in CA but I dress accordingly as I expect the conditions. I have even worn shorts to a November game. Is it possibly a home court "advantage"??? Look at the 2 conference games this year. Butler up by 20 struggled down the stretch to win by 2 and the Friars closed to 4 before they faded. Maybe CMA's practices help our guys hold up under the conditions. I went to the open practice in October (in shorts) and it was hot but CMA drilled the team for over 2 hours, after a morning practice.[/quote]

I marvel at all the people who sit there in flannel shirts and sweatshirts. Many who I recognize from prior games so I know it’s not their first time. I don’t know how or why they do it.
 
I do not want to go to games at Belmont Park Arena. I like going on campus. As an alum, it helps me reconnect with the school. My wife and I also like going to the Store when I get there early and buying St. John's paraphernalia. Plus, on a very personal note, we have a bench dedicated to our grandson right across from CA and when we come to games on campus we always sit in that bench for a few minutes to visit with our grandson. I don't ever want to lose that.
 
When Cragg was on a twitter conversation some weeks ago, he said (as Zaun mentioned) a rebuild of CA is not feasible. So small modifications seems the way it will go. I think he also teased something about a Starbucks in there. Realize that's not what everyone would want (read: beer), but it's something. The other problem with both CA and Belmont is that when a team comes to NYC, they don't want to go to a dumpy gym in Queens, nor a suburban arena. Look at the attendance for dePaul out in what was called the Rosemont Arena, several miles outside Chicago. OK, they're also a sad team, but still, teams want to be on the main stage. When they come to NYC, teams want to go to Manhattan, MSG. CA and Belmont may be OK for the early-season, non-con schedule but I'd bet the Big East (on behalf of all the teams) would privately have something to say about our games at CA and Belmont. Having said that, CA does give us a great home-court advantage.
 
I hope starbucks sells iced coffee because why anyone would want to buy hot coffee or tea in that hell hot arena is beyond me
 
[quote="SJUFAN2" post=379021][quote="SLYFOXX1968" post=378985]A few posts under other topics talked about these subjects ; 1. Getting booted out of the BE . 2. Getting booted out of MSG . 3 CA as a old and outdated Home Court . I don’t live in NY anymore so I’m not up on a lot of inside stuff going on in the school or locally .. I notice a brand new facility is being built for the Islanders near Belmont Park . It ‘s suppose to seat 17-18 ,000 for Hockey . I don’t know if it’s adaptable for BB? While , it would seem the University would not willingly abandon Games at MSG , might it be attractive to transfer CA games to this new venue , if details like finances , etc could be addressed ? I’m sure the price tag for use of the new Arena would be high but , I assume could be dealt with ... of course, we would need to draw more than the 5000 that usually show up at CA . Fan attendance is a ratio between winning BB and fan excitement for the team. Both lacking over the last 20 years , save for the few times we had winning teams and some credibility as more than a has been .. Could we attrack 10,000 fans to Belmont Park Arena if we had a top 25 ranked team and some shot at a BE Championship? Could we play more National Powers if we could get back to playing the UCLA’s, Kansas , Indiana , Duke, etc if we had competitive teams ? Instead of playing some of the Cup Cakes we currently do? I’m just throwing this out as a idea , given the overwhelming dissatisfaction with CA .. it might put some sizzle in a Program that surely needs new Branding to attract better Players , fans , etc . I’m sure anyone could come up with a dozen reasons this isn’t a feasible suggestion but , what’s the risk in doing some basic analysis ? We need to rethink a lot of things about our BB program as it has gone off track for too many years .[/quote]

I like the idea of playing our CA games at Belmont. CA is dump. If we played at a10k puls seat arena we could 5k seats away to students for free.

Play 6-8 games at MSG and the rest at Belmont and that would be a good start.[/quote]

Or a bad finish. A commuter school with a commuter arena. I just don't like the sound of that.
 
[quote="Ray Morgan" post=379054][quote="SJUFAN2" post=379021][quote="SLYFOXX1968" post=378985]A few posts under other topics talked about these subjects ; 1. Getting booted out of the BE . 2. Getting booted out of MSG . 3 CA as a old and outdated Home Court . I don’t live in NY anymore so I’m not up on a lot of inside stuff going on in the school or locally .. I notice a brand new facility is being built for the Islanders near Belmont Park . It ‘s suppose to seat 17-18 ,000 for Hockey . I don’t know if it’s adaptable for BB? While , it would seem the University would not willingly abandon Games at MSG , might it be attractive to transfer CA games to this new venue , if details like finances , etc could be addressed ? I’m sure the price tag for use of the new Arena would be high but , I assume could be dealt with ... of course, we would need to draw more than the 5000 that usually show up at CA . Fan attendance is a ratio between winning BB and fan excitement for the team. Both lacking over the last 20 years , save for the few times we had winning teams and some credibility as more than a has been .. Could we attrack 10,000 fans to Belmont Park Arena if we had a top 25 ranked team and some shot at a BE Championship? Could we play more National Powers if we could get back to playing the UCLA’s, Kansas , Indiana , Duke, etc if we had competitive teams ? Instead of playing some of the Cup Cakes we currently do? I’m just throwing this out as a idea , given the overwhelming dissatisfaction with CA .. it might put some sizzle in a Program that surely needs new Branding to attract better Players , fans , etc . I’m sure anyone could come up with a dozen reasons this isn’t a feasible suggestion but , what’s the risk in doing some basic analysis ? We need to rethink a lot of things about our BB program as it has gone off track for too many years .[/quote]

I like the idea of playing our CA games at Belmont. CA is dump. If we played at a10k puls seat arena we could 5k seats away to students for free.

Play 6-8 games at MSG and the rest at Belmont and that would be a good start.[/quote]

Or a bad finish. A commuter school with a commuter arena. I just don't like the sound of that.[/quote]

We already have a commuter arena in Manhattan. Should we get rid of that? If MSG approached us tomorrow asking us to play all of our games there at a 50% discount for renting the arena, are you going to pass? Are you going to tell the media, fabase, alum that you prefer to have us play in a 5,500 seat High School gym?
 
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